Comcast offers out of market locals, why not D*? (1 Viewer)

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VTRob

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Jul 12, 2007
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I recently moved to York Co., Pennsylvania, about 2 miles over the MD border. My neighbor has Comcast and he gets all of the local Baltimore stations and the York PA stations. When I lived in Baltimore, I got all of the Baltimore and Washington, DC stations with cable. Fios also offers DC and Baltimore stations in MD. So why doesn't D* do this?

I guess I have a few questions:
- How does cable/Fios get away with providing more than 1 local market?
- Other than "moving" my service address, how can I get D* to offer the local Baltimore channels where I am in PA? I am just out of range of using an OTA, plus I don't want a big ugly thing on my roof.
- What determines your local market area? Are there set boundry lines that cannot be changed?

I hate cable and I don't want to switch, but it would be nice to have the Baltimore local channels. And no, this is not because of sports, (although it would be nice to get the Ravens games). I still work in MD and am actually closer to Baltimore than I am to York. Local weather and news is the main reason.
 
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mbg620

Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Aug 21, 2007
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These are set up by borders. The MD, PA border is the line between Harrisburg locals and Baltimore locals and you can't change that. The reason cable can do it is because of something called "Significantly Viewed" channels which satellite can't offer. Satellite, for the most part, is limited to offering you the local channels in the DMA you reside in. I had this same problem when I moved from Baltimore to Lancaster.
 

raoul5788

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These are set up by borders. The MD, PA border is the line between Harrisburg locals and Baltimore locals and you can't change that. The reason cable can do it is because of something called "Significantly Viewed" channels which satellite can't offer. Satellite, for the most part, is limited to offering you the local channels in the DMA you reside in. I had this same problem when I moved from Baltimore to Lancaster.

Actually, some areas have significantly viewed channels. Here in New Haven county in CT we get three of the NY locals.
 

raoul5788

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I recently moved to York Co., Pennsylvania, about 2 miles over the MD border. My neighbor has Comcast and he gets all of the local Baltimore stations and the York PA stations. When I lived in Baltimore, I got all of the Baltimore and Washington, DC stations with cable. Fios also offers DC and Baltimore stations in MD. So why doesn't D* do this?

I guess I have a few questions:
- How does cable/Fios get away with providing more than 1 local market?
- Other than "moving" my service address, how can I get D* to offer the local Baltimore channels where I am in PA? I am just out of range of using an OTA, plus I don't want a big ugly thing on my roof.
- What determines your local market area? Are there set boundry lines that cannot be changed?

I hate cable and I don't want to switch, but it would be nice to have the Baltimore local channels. And no, this is not because of sports, (although it would be nice to get the Ravens games). I still work in MD and am actually closer to Baltimore than I am to York. Local weather and news is the main reason.

Ask the FCC. They are the ones that make the rules that favor cable over satellite.
 

mbg620

Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Aug 21, 2007
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Actually, some areas have significantly viewed channels. Here in New Haven county in CT we get three of the NY locals.

That's why I said "for the most part." But I did know that they have it in a few select areas. I have some friends in Howard County, MD that get both DC and Baltimore locals off of Satellite.
 

VTRob

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Jul 12, 2007
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So is there any way to get these "significantly viewed channels" by satellite? What determines the few markets that can get extra local channels? It seems that D* should be able to offer this in all markets that cable can.
 

mbg620

Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Aug 21, 2007
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So is there any way to get these "significantly viewed channels" by satellite? What determines the few markets that can get extra local channels? It seems that D* should be able to offer this in all markets that cable can.

The government said that D* and E* could offer them in select areas and even came out with a list. The only reason I can think of that they wouldn't be doing it everywhere they can is because the spot beams that locals are on don't always cover the other DMA that they can offer them in. Anyway, I pretty sure significantly viewed is not going to come anytime soon to most areas.
 

jtn

SatelliteGuys Pro
Nov 12, 2007
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Springfield, MA
Ask the FCC. They are the ones that make the rules that favor cable over satellite.

I cannot fathom the FCC discriminating on a carrier. Or showing favoritism, it's the job of the FCC to insure fairness in the market place. I think DirecTV can offer the locals but the attorneys at DirecTV are not competent enough to realize this and insure the happiness and fairness to customers.

Why should a cable company be able to dictate DirecTV and tell them what they can or cannot do? They don't own DirecTV they are a business, and government wants competition, the locals want their shows watched for advertising, so somebody is asleep at the wheel on the regulations.
 

iwc5893

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Feb 1, 2007
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I cannot fathom the FCC discriminating on a carrier. Or showing favoritism, it's the job of the FCC to insure fairness in the market place. I think DirecTV can offer the locals but the attorneys at DirecTV are not competent enough to realize this and insure the happiness and fairness to customers.

Why should a cable company be able to dictate DirecTV and tell them what they can or cannot do? They don't own DirecTV they are a business, and government wants competition, the locals want their shows watched for advertising, so somebody is asleep at the wheel on the regulations.

Because the NAB whined and cried to the FCC that satellite companies had an unfair advantage over cable. The FCC did, in fact, discriminate against the satco's in favor of the cable companies with these rules. And the lawyers from D* and E* repeatedly challenge this ruling without success.

Also, consider this. If it wasn't an FCC rule, then why did E* lose their court case earlier this year and was forced to discontinue DNS for quite a few customers?
 

Greg Bimson

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Jan 21, 2004
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Also, consider this. If it wasn't an FCC rule, then why did E* lose their court case earlier this year and was forced to discontinue DNS for quite a few customers?
Because it still wasn't an FCC rule. It was a LAW, passed by Congress and signed by a President.

It is the LAW which doesn't put the satellite companies on equal footing with the cablecos. In order for significantly-viewed to be allowed on satellite, the station must give its consent. This in turn means that a carriage contract be allowed. Many stations just aren't so willing to invade another's market.

Trust me, if the stations (especially the network affiliates) had their way, not many people at all would have significantly-viewed stations. In many cases, it is not in the best interest of the local affiliate.
 

rondon600

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Aug 3, 2004
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DTV open your eyes and realize Baltimore/Washington is one market area.

Seriously, who watches the commercials anyway? If I see a DC commercial for a Ford Dealer do you think Im going to hit that supid beltway... hell no Im heading to Annapolis 1st cause its closer.

Dont forget you can always grab those locals OTA. I know its a pain but once you set it up its OK with one exception... The F...ING AIRPLANES at BWI interrupt the signal. AARRRGGGGHHHH!!!! Ive been trying to get DTV to give me an exception because I cant receive my locals OTA due to the airport!!!! It hasnt worked yet.
 

iwc5893

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Feb 1, 2007
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DTV open your eyes and realize Baltimore/Washington is one market area.

Seriously, who watches the commercials anyway? If I see a DC commercial for a Ford Dealer do you think Im going to hit that supid beltway... hell no Im heading to Annapolis 1st cause its closer.

Dont forget you can always grab those locals OTA. I know its a pain but once you set it up its OK with one exception... The F...ING AIRPLANES at BWI interrupt the signal. AARRRGGGGHHHH!!!! Ive been trying to get DTV to give me an exception because I cant receive my locals OTA due to the airport!!!! It hasnt worked yet.

The locals waiver is NOT up to DirecTV...it is up to the local stations, each of which could say yes or no.
 

jcrandall

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Apr 3, 2005
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Locals are an advantage to cable, they can air more without near as many restrictions.

Franchise fees are also exclusive to cable - and I'm happy about that. Money they pay local governements for the privledge to serve that area. Last I looked at my dad's cable bill it tacked on another $6 in local fees.
 

charper1

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May 18, 2004
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DTV open your eyes and realize Baltimore/Washington is one market area.

Seriously, who watches the commercials anyway? If I see a DC commercial for a Ford Dealer do you think Im going to hit that supid beltway... hell no Im heading to Annapolis 1st cause its closer.

Dont forget you can always grab those locals OTA. I know its a pain but once you set it up its OK with one exception... The F...ING AIRPLANES at BWI interrupt the signal. AARRRGGGGHHHH!!!! Ive been trying to get DTV to give me an exception because I cant receive my locals OTA due to the airport!!!! It hasnt worked yet.


DITTO what everyone else said about your misplaced gripes with DBS AND.... have you ever once read up on the subject you are bashing? If you had you might read that if you REALLY know you can't get an acceptable signal, then you should apply for a signal test (assuming they still do this); if you are correct then your problems will be solved.
 

Questioner

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Mar 27, 2006
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I'm going to have to add another section to my chart. Just another advantage for local providers over directv in terms of hd locals.
 

FlyingJ

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Mar 19, 2005
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I'm going to have to add another section to my chart. Just another advantage for local providers over directv in terms of hd locals.


Oh yes, by all means do...and then post that freakin chart, just another shot at D* hugh Questioner. Boy, someone at D* must have hurt your feelings bad. Pathetic.
 

raoul5788

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I'm going to have to add another section to my chart. Just another advantage for local providers over directv in terms of hd locals.

Would that be the chart that you said you would post three weeks ago? I haven't seen it yet.
 

dishcomm

SatelliteGuys Master
Nov 29, 2005
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suburbia
Ask the FCC. They are the ones that make the rules that favor cable over satellite.
not favoringat all. Cable is under "must carry" laws ....Here is the text from the FC website ..
Pursuant to Section 614 of the Communications Act of 1934, as amended by
the Television Consumer Protection and Competition Act of 1992 ("1992 Cable Act"), and
implementing rules adopted by the Commission in its Report and Order in MM Docket 92-
259, commercial television broadcast stations are entitled to assert mandatory carriage rights
on cable systems located within the station's market. A station's market for this purpose is its
"area of dominant influence" or ADI as defined by the Arbitron audience research
organization. An ADI is a geographic market designation that defines each television market
exclusive of others, based on measured viewing patterns. Essentially, each county in the
United States is allocated to a market based on which home-market stations receive a
preponderance of total viewing hours in the county. For purposes of this calculation, both
over-the-air and cable television viewing are included.
...This means that if an area which a cable system operates is within the area of dominant infleunce of two markets the cable systems in that area "must carry" those stations. The tv stations are "entitled" to be carried.
Now, this of course takes up bandwidth. I would imagine cable companies would rather not have to carry the stations of two DMA's . This would make room for other more profitable channels.
Appaently satellite companies are not subject to these rules and only have to carry the stations of the DMA in which a subscriber resides.
 

dishcomm

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Nov 29, 2005
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DTV open your eyes and realize Baltimore/Washington is one market area.

Seriously, who watches the commercials anyway? If I see a DC commercial for a Ford Dealer do you think Im going to hit that supid beltway... hell no Im heading to Annapolis 1st cause its closer.

Dont forget you can always grab those locals OTA. I know its a pain but once you set it up its OK with one exception... The F...ING AIRPLANES at BWI interrupt the signal. AARRRGGGGHHHH!!!! Ive been trying to get DTV to give me an exception because I cant receive my locals OTA due to the airport!!!! It hasnt worked yet.

Um,, Those are two distinct cities and each has their own tv stations. They are indeed seperate markets.
I don't believe for a second that aircraft flying overhead interferes with your OTA recpetion. Unless those planes are a few hundred feet and directly over your home.
If this was occuring then many other residents in the area woulkd also complan and that would cause authorites to investigate.
You live in the Baltimore DMA ,correct? That is where you chose to live, correct? Then Directv offers your locals on their as part of their channel lineup.
I don't want you to think I am being hostile here but it sounds to me like there is mopre to this story than meets the eye.
 
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