CSN Philadelphia On Satellites

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erichepler

Thread Starter
Active SatelliteGuys Member
Oct 5, 2007
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It's official! DirecTV to start carr... JUST KIDDING. You already knew that though.

Has anyone ever discussed a class-action lawsuit over this issue? The cable companies in neighboring counties, from small size-very local up to the major players, all have CSN Philly as part of their programming. I've followed the saga forever now over the terrestrial loophole and the recent closure of it. I guess my point or question would be, if there seems to be a market value on the channel that cable companies are already paying, I can't imagine DirecTV isn't willing (or any carrier) to pay in the neighborhood of that value, if not more. I even notice I'm paying a regional sports fee to Directv these days as a separate line item. So I guess what I'm asking, is Comcast really witholding service over a true carriage rate disagreement? I'd like to give both companies the benefit of the doubt, but I'm not that naive. I know there are politics. At what point as the consumer do I have enough and band together with everyone else in the same situation and file a lawsuit for unfair practices? I don't know the legal grounds, but I have to think there is something that applies here.

This probably goes for many in the same situation, but I'd be willing to buy the Comcast Philly as an add-on channel/service anyway, almost up to the cost of having a tandem Comcast cable service and DirecTV concurrent subscriptions. Well maybe not that much, but I'd be more inclined to pay $10/mo for CSN-P instead of the usual $39.99/mo for 4 months for NHL Center Ice to watch the flyers game. I have Comcast for cable modem in my home anyway which comes with basic TV for free. It conveniently stops at Channel 30 which in my area is CSN-Philly. Have to subscribe for another $50/month for that. Maybe next FULL hockey season I'll forgo the NHL Center Ice, and upgrade my comcast basic cable tv service and just eat the difference during hockey season, but it just seems like it should not have taken the 12 years I've been waiting (and I'm sure others are waiting longer) since I moved away from home to get the channel that people around me can get, from Ma&Paa cable companies.

The most aggravating part is the blackouts on the free "NHL Network" I get because I subscribe to NHL Center Ice. I'm given the channel for free with my subscription, then CENTER ICE doesn't air the game because it is "nationally" broadcast, then I get blacked out because of my zip code.
 
R

robjlevin

SatelliteGuys Pro
Sep 23, 2005
624
148
New Jersey
Class action law suit? For what?

Look, I get it. If I lived in Philly, I'd either fake the service address or go with FiOS or Comcast. But there is zero basis for any kind of law suit.

This is about money. Comcast wants too much of it for CSN Philly and DTV isn't willing to pay.
 
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erichepler

Thread Starter
Active SatelliteGuys Member
Oct 5, 2007
20
0
I don't agree this is about money. Plus I'm saying class action suit for the purpose of fair trade not taking place. I'm not looking for compensation, I'm looking for fair trade practices to take place.

I could understand if there was a limitation by either organization that physically prevented one from providing or receiving the service. This isn't the case. Sure you could easily say Comcast wants too much money and DirecTV isn't willing to pay. What I'm saying is this feels more like an executive at Comcast/NBC saying "I'll show you FCC, closing the loophole! We'll just demand $50/subscriber instead making it impossible for DirecTV to commit.". The 9 year old's equivalent of "I'm not sharing. I'm taking my ball and going home so no one can play.". You can't tell me that the smaller business cable company that services 10,000 homes can pay inflated costs for CSN-P, but DirecTV can't. So I'm saying why does Ma&Pa Cable get CSN-P for $1/subscriber but DirecTV has to pay $50/subscriber. Obviously I don't know what the real asking prices are, if it has even reached that point of negotiating, I'm just stating as example. I wouldn't be surprised if it wasn't that far along to be honest.

This isn't a dispute that has just been going on for the last few months either. It has been going on as long as I could remember. The FCC took a step forward, closed the excuse-hole that CSN was using to get away with it, but they are still just skating the spirit of the closure.

Comcast/NBC has even come out and said they'd negotiate if NFL Sunday Ticket was in play, but we're talking apples and oranges here. Sunday Ticket is a DirecTV service through NFL contract and isn't redistributed to any carrier. CSN is a regional sports network that IS redistributed to other carriers. Although I could see how someone could easily be duped into thinking its not fair for DirecTV to cry foul about CSN when it won't deal Sunday Ticket. But I don't see it as the same issue. Comcast/NBC can create their own Sunday Ticket-like service through license arrangements with the NFL. That is between Comcast and the NFL though. If Sunday Ticket WAS the issue for Comcast, then Dish Network and Comcast should have already reached a deal for CSN-P.

It's not going to ever get anywhere without legal action, and again, I'm not looking for money at this point, I'm looking to keep my right to chose my provider of television, but not be punished because of spoiled or spiteful executives. Who is suffering? Not DirecTV, Not Dish, not Comcast. Just us, the subscribers.
 
J

Joe The Dragon

SatelliteGuys Pro
Sep 19, 2008
564
49
It's also TCN Philly only market where Comcast forces other systems to pick up a other channel to get the over flow games.

Now does comcast have the room for Sunday Ticket. They are lacking most of the GAME HD and TEAM HD channels. No goal line HD, no pac 12 HD (most areas), Poor HBO, MAX, stars, show HD. And they made there talk of the swapping CSN-P for ST they had less room. Now maybe that why they dumped most of the premium HD to make room but having 10-15 HD channels in a off air loop most of the year is a very poor way to run a system. Maybe if comcast had SDV and / or MPEG4. AND SD room as well guide space will also be needed.

Kind of a hard sell to a bar to say we have NFT ST HD but only 1-4 games a day for NHL CI / MLB EI in HD. Maybe they can pick up the full load of the team HD and game HD now that analog is gone or dump iN DEMAND and feed in the games on there own.

Also can the cable system handle a bar with 8-15+ boxes what about on a SDV system that kind of load of part time channels can mess up other uses on the same node (like home uses who are not in to the out of market stuff)
 
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robjlevin

SatelliteGuys Pro
Sep 23, 2005
624
148
New Jersey
It would be a violation for Comcast to ask for pricing that is out of line with the industry, but satellite distribution is far different than terrestrial. For starters satellite is national and therefore the pricing and what tiers it would be in would have to be decided. It is clear that Comcast and DTV have agreed to disagree on this and have no interest in cutting a deal. No different than Dish and MSG or Dish and SNY. All of the legal reasons that Comcast had to withhold the channel are gone. The fact that DTV has made no complaints to the FCC on this should tell you that they know whatever Comcast is asking for now is perfectly legal and they have decided it would not be in their best interests to make that deal.

And for the love all things, why bring up Sunday Ticket? The NFL has no interest in cable distribution or non-exclusive arrangements. Too wide a distribution would make the network affiliates very unhappy.
 
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Mr Tony

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Supporting Founder
Nov 17, 2003
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Mankato, MN
The FCC closed the loophole so Crapcast is asking for a bunch of money. Directv told them to go screw themseleves...its that simple

Until they can reach an agreement we wont see CSN Philly on D* (or DIsh for that matter)
 
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Ryley

New Member
Feb 17, 2013
2
0
NJ
Finally, someone else bothered by this. I live in north Jersey, smack in the middle of Devils / Rangers/ Islanders hockey. I've been able to see almost all Flyers games with Center Ice and the NY sports channels, until the NHL channel started broadcasting games. Any Flyer game they show is blacked out to me. I'd hoped when I'd heard something was settled in the courts between Comcast and DTV last year, that things might change. Guess not.
Also, has anyone noticed that Center Ice broadcasts both teams feeds for most games. But, never the Flyers, unless there is no other feed available. Another effect of the DTV / Comcast feud?
I've come to hate the NHL channel and Comcast, it means a blackout for me.
 
dishcomm

dishcomm

SatelliteGuys Master
Nov 29, 2005
10,388
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suburbia
Finally, someone else bothered by this. I live in north Jersey, smack in the middle of Devils / Rangers/ Islanders hockey. I've been able to see almost all Flyers games with Center Ice and the NY sports channels, until the NHL channel started broadcasting games. Any Flyer game they show is blacked out to me. I'd hoped when I'd heard something was settled in the courts between Comcast and DTV last year, that things might change. Guess not.
Also, has anyone noticed that Center Ice broadcasts both teams feeds for most games. But, never the Flyers, unless there is no other feed available. Another effect of the DTV / Comcast feud?
I've come to hate the NHL channel and Comcast, it means a blackout for me.

Ok..You live in the Northern half of NJ. Clearly, you are located within the boundaries of the NY DMA and the local sports team's territories. That would mean you are outside the territory claimed by the Flyers. So the games shown on NHL Network are blacked out if the Flyers are one of the teams? How is this possible? If the Flyers do not claim your zip code as part of their territory, then someone is in error. It's not the fault of the NHL. More than likely it is your provider that is blacking out the games.
 
Juan

Juan

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Sep 14, 2003
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The FCC closed the loophole so Crapcast is asking for a bunch of money. Directv told them to go screw themseleves...its that simple

Until they can reach an agreement we wont see CSN Philly on D* (or DIsh for that matter)
I think YES has better chance of being seen on Dish (FOX just bought a piece of YES)
 
Least

Least

aka. Dr. Fat Man
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Oct 2, 2010
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It's the one and maybe only place that Comcast has Satellite by the nay nays. I take it back, that and On Demand. But, streaming is killing off the On Demand issue. Back to CSN Philly, there will be a time when a second Philly RSN is created, because one team will get greedy. When that happens, and Satellite gets that RSN, Comcast will start singing a different tune.
 
dishcomm

dishcomm

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Nov 29, 2005
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suburbia
It's the one and maybe only place that Comcast has Satellite by the nay nays. I take it back, that and On Demand. But, streaming is killing off the On Demand issue. Back to CSN Philly, there will be a time when a second Philly RSN is created, because one team will get greedy. When that happens, and Satellite gets that RSN, Comcast will start singing a different tune.
Thing is Comcast owns The Sixers and Flyers. Will the Phillies set up their own gig? Who knows.
 
Voyager6

Voyager6

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Nov 30, 2005
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Thing is Comcast owns The Sixers and Flyers. Will the Phillies set up their own gig? Who knows.
The Phillies TV contract with Comcast is up in 2015. http://thatballsouttahere.com/2012/11/26/phillies-look-at-dodgers-tv-deal-giggle-excitedly/
You know that luxury tax that is supposedly hamstringing the Phillies from spending over a trillion dollars on players and other cool stuff?

Yeah, they might not need to worry about that much longer.
The Los Angeles Dodgers and Fox Sports are reportedly talking about a new TV deal that could be worth $6 billion to the team. This applies to the Phillies because their TV deal with Comcast SportsNet expires in 2015. Their current deal earns them a reported $24 million a season, chump change to what could ultimately be a mega landfall that would render the luxury tax nothing more than a minor nuisance.

Some, including the Inquirer’s Matt Gelb, believed the Phils’ future TV deal with Comcast could approach $5 billion. However, if the ratings for Phillies broadcasts really are higher than the Dodgers’, the Phillies could argue they should have a deal that would rival that of L.A.’s at around $6-7 billion.
Yes, that’s BILLION with a B.
 
fireponcoal

fireponcoal

SatelliteGuys Guru
Jun 4, 2011
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24
I think that some here tend to get all bent out of shape about Comcast when the reality is that most in the region aren't that disgusted by it. Those that are end up switching to Fios if at all possible. Last time I looked Direct TV still isn't offering a quality Internet solution for a bundle. That trumps all in the heart of the average consumer.
 
dishcomm

dishcomm

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Nov 29, 2005
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I think that some here tend to get all bent out of shape about Comcast when the reality is that most in the region aren't that disgusted by it. Those that are end up switching to Fios if at all possible. Last time I looked Direct TV still isn't offering a quality Internet solution for a bundle. That trumps all in the heart of the average consumer.

I contend that Comcast customers are resigned to the perception that nothing can be done to affect any changes, so they remain with that provider.
Given an option of a competitor(s) on an equal footing, people will churn to other providers.
 
fireponcoal

fireponcoal

SatelliteGuys Guru
Jun 4, 2011
132
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I contend that Comcast customers are resigned to the perception that nothing can be done to affect any changes, so they remain with that provider.
Given an option of a competitor(s) on an equal footing, people will churn to other providers.

Or they simply don't give a fugg like the power users that post on this and other msgboards. Most Comcast customers I know aren't completely in love with Comcast perhaps but they would also never switch to DirecTV because of the CSN Philly+Internet situation. Plus, Philly is not Wisconsin and most do not live in the middle of farmland. DirecTV is an option of course but we are not limited in our options. Fios will be in every corner of the region shortly and that is the service I hear coming from the lips of friends and family who want to churn from the big C.

I've just always heard from D* fans that Philly residents would jump to be able to have a DBS system if it had CSN Philly. Perhaps that was the case in the past but I'm not hearing it much any longer.
 
dishcomm

dishcomm

SatelliteGuys Master
Nov 29, 2005
10,388
554
suburbia
Or they simply don't give a fugg like the power users that post on this and other msgboards. Most Comcast customers I know aren't completely in love with Comcast perhaps but they would also never switch to DirecTV because of the CSN Philly+Internet situation. Plus, Philly is not Wisconsin and most do not live in the middle of farmland. DirecTV is an option of course but we are not limited in our options. Fios will be in every corner of the region shortly and that is the service I hear coming from the lips of friends and family who want to churn from the big C.

I've just always heard from D* fans that Philly residents would jump to be able to have a DBS system if it had CSN Philly. Perhaps that was the case in the past but I'm not hearing it much any longer.
Comcast has beaten back every challenge to their monoploy on CSN PHilly. It's a tough deal for those in that market.
 
A

Adamv2

Member
Mar 1, 2013
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0
Philadelphia
Hello everyone. Long time lurker, first time poster. Figured I would use this topic to finnally create a username & post something.

Seems to me, comcast holds all the cards because directv lets them. That if directv really wanted a fair price they could play a little hardball themselves.

1. Doesn't directv own the Root sports RSN's? Couldn't they do the same thing to various comcast markets?
2. The Phillies tv contract is coming up soon. Comcast really has no legit competition, as its doubtful fox will start a Philly FSN, but directv sure has an intert in started a root sports Philly. Directv could either try to start a Philly RSN, and charge comcast a arm & a leg to carry it, or they could goto comcast and say listen we can get into a bidding war with you & drive up the price of that next tv contract, or we can back off & we get a carriage deal inked today.

On a related note, I would be happy enough if i could simply just watch Phillies games. Regardless if directv didn't have CSN. As it stands i can't watch them on extra innings or mlbtv, because of MLB's excising blackout rules. However that policy is currently going to court. Does anyone think there's any legit chance MLB will change their blackout rules in a way that will allow satellite customers in Philadelphia to watch Phillies games?
 
Least

Least

aka. Dr. Fat Man
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Oct 2, 2010
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If I was Directv, which I think still owns Root Sports (at least Liberty does) I would price all the Root RSNs off Comcast systems and let them have a taste of their own medicane.
 
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