Date for 721 Software Release? (1 Viewer)

BillH

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Sep 16, 2003
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Does anyone have a date that the 721 software release will be available?

Thanks.
 

Stargazer

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Sep 7, 2003
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Western WV
Can you just imagine the complaints and talk from people on the boards there will be if the software does not come out by the end of the month? A lot of people may lose faith in the company if it is held back again.
 

Scott Greczkowski

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Sep 7, 2003
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Stargazer, unfortunatly that is nothing new when it comes to Dish Software upgrades. :)

Have faith it WILL come, the question is WHEN. :D
 

aperry

SatelliteGuys Pro
Sep 26, 2003
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Yep, unfortunately it would be business as usual for Dish if we did not get the upgrade. They have been saying "the end of the month" for a while now...
 

Stargazer

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Sep 7, 2003
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Western WV
Its not a matter of ''IF'' but "WHEN"

This seems to be one of the most awaited software that I can think of where people were really looking forward to the software upgrade. I remember one other software upgrade where people were really looking forward to it in which was for the 501's when those extra features such as slo-motion, frame advance, etc. came.
 

aperry

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Sep 26, 2003
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I agree... We all really want this upgrade, especially after hearing how stable it is supposed to be.

That's what makes it worse when they (seem to) delay the release again and again. :D
 

Stargazer

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Sep 7, 2003
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Would you rather them release it with bugs? I personally would have thought that they would have released different features one or a few at a time instead of waiting to release them all. I think that would have made some people less grouchy about releasting ANY software upgrade at all rather than waiting to release all of them at once.
 

Pete38

Member
Sep 8, 2003
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Folks,

I'll tell you the exact date that they'll release the 721 update. I will be the same day they release the code to manufacturing for the 921. It's the same code folks. They're just getting both receivers on the same code base so they don't have to do dual maintenance, which is a very good idea from their point of view. We're not waiting not because the 721 code is not stable. It probably is after all this time. We're waiting on the stability of the 921 hardware and stability of the code that supports all the new features that aren't in the 721.

Pete
 

Bill R

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Supporting Founder
Sep 8, 2003
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Pete,

The release on the 921 is NOT holding up the release of the 721 software. The 721 software release was delayed becuase they found a "service effecting" bug.

As Scott noted, there is a new Beta that they are testing and if it "passes" it will be released to the public.
 

Stargazer

Supporting Founder
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Sep 7, 2003
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Western WV
I seriously doubt that this new beta will take nearly as long to beta test as the previous beta since there was only a minor change in it. They HAVE TO get this rolling in a few weeks or they are going to tick off a lot of 721 owners that want their locals.
 

Pete38

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Sep 8, 2003
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Bill R said:
Pete,

The release on the 921 is NOT holding up the release of the 721 software. The 721 software release was delayed becuase they found a "service effecting" bug.

As Scott noted, there is a new Beta that they are testing and if it "passes" it will be released to the public.

Hi Bill,

As I long time cross-platform OS and application coder I would have to disagree. It's been stated on this forum and others from "insiders" that the 721 and the 921 will run the same code. Put simply: the 721 beta = the 921 beta. Two receivers, one code.

They are probably now running beta testing on the final release candidate. No one is going to release two versions several weeks apart and then have all those extra support issues to deal with until they get the releases back in sync. It makes no sense for a lot of reasons, the main one being that no sane person goes out of their way to make extra work for themselves. Surely after several months of not releasing new 721 code, their attitude is: "These users have been waiting months. What is another couple of weeks? Anyone in this room who wants to support two different releases instead on one please raise your hand."

With all due respect to Scott, who works hard and runs a wonderful forum, and is a great source of knowledge on all things satellite, we've seen in the past that E* personnel have occasionally passed misinformation, whether intentional or not (such as the August Charlie Chat content). And taking from your quote, the source does not indicate what the bug is or what it affects; it's only couched in the most general of terms. I'm still betting the bug(s) is only on the 921 side of things. When they're happy with the code running on both the 721 and the 921, then we 721 owners will get it.

My 2 cents,

Pete
 

JosephF

SatelliteGuys Family
Sep 8, 2003
38
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Same code-base, not the same code. The 921 is an HD receiver, the 721 is not. The 921 supports 8VSB, the 721 does not.

The 921 may be built of the 721 code-base, clearly these have different code sets.
 

Bill R

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Supporting Founder
Sep 8, 2003
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Pete,

As JosephF said, "same code-base, not the same code". The 721 and 921 share some common code but they will not be running the same version of the software. The 921 will have additional code for the HD stuff that will not be in the 721 software.

The bug that caused the software not to be release was in the switch test code.
 

Danbo

Member
Oct 1, 2003
8
0
I'm waiting for a dual tuner HD DVR or Tivo, plain and simple. Will I go with the 921 when it comes out? Doubtful. With the way Dish is handling the 721, and using the same code base for the 921, it really worries me that the 921 will suffer the same fate, being a piece of crap.

Don't get me wrong. I can't live without my 721. It sucks when there are only so many satellite companies out there, offering only so much. And either choice sucks. Which is worse? DirecTV sucks for their service and support. But Dish does too. The "advanced" tech support folks at Dish, at least 66% of the time, are outright clueless.

I could tolerate a DVR or PVR like the 721, even without name based recording, and without some bug fixes, if Dish would take the time to hire and train people with a brain. AND if they communicated with their customers, fessing up to the fact that they know they have problems. Is that going to happen? Unfortunately not. It's just a matter of deciding who of the service providers is of the lesser evil.
 

Pete38

Member
Sep 8, 2003
12
0
Bill R said:
Pete,

The 921 will have additional code for the HD stuff that will not be in the 721 software.

Hi all,

I respectfully disagree. The code will be the same - all the code for the 921 will be in the 721 code, it will just not be used on the 721. This is very common in setting up any kind of computer - all the hardware drivers are there for both hardware platforms, they are just not loaded at install time (on one or either platform) because those particular hardware bits are not found during the installer's exploration phase. I've been writing OS and app code for many different platforms since the 1980s, and this is the industry standard approach. It's much more practical for a lot of reasons. If you support two different versions of the code you either double your support staff for a particular project, or the quality of your support is decreased 50 percent. Having seen how Charlie pinches every penny twice, it would appear that having a reduced head count without denigrating support (such as it is) would be his choice every time.

If you have a better explanation for the long delay of the 721 code and it's seemingly coincidental release date with the 921, I'd love to hear it. Sure, my thoughts are just a theory, but so are everyone else's, and mine are supported by what evidence we have seen. It's just that mine are a bit more informed than some because I'm more aware of the development process than the average guy on the street.

My 2 cents (I'm up to 4 now :) ),

Pete
 

JosephF

SatelliteGuys Family
Sep 8, 2003
38
0
Please look at E* software on other receivers. For example, the 3900 and 4900. While extremely similar products (much more so than the 721 & 921), they have completely different code sets.

Or how about the 301 & 501/508/510. The 301 software is clearly a subset of the 510. Yet they absolutely have completely separate code sets. Once again, there is certainly a common code base, but there are uniquely compiled versions of software for each of them.

Yes, they utilize the same code base. But they are both uniquely complied, given unique software versions and given unique download streams.

E* does not waste memory space on functions they do not use in a given product.

You clearly do not understand E*, if you think they do anything with an industry standard approach. In fact they clearly do quite the opposite.
 

Pete38

Member
Sep 8, 2003
12
0
JosephF said:
Yes, they utilize the same code base. But they are both uniquely complied, given unique software versions and given unique download streams.

Hi Joe,

Thanks for taking the time to reply. You speak very authoritatively on this matter. Are you a member of the E* development team? I would hope they scan the forums, but are probably prohibited from identifying themselves as such. If you are, or any E* developer for that matter, send me a PM as I would be very interested in further discussion on-line.

Just because the screens do or do not resemble each other has absolutely nothing to do with the underlying code. Heck, I can make a pc look like a mac or vice versa using stupid pc trick tools I can download from the internet, let alone doing it by low level programming. Code bloat is evil, but everyone does it. Just because certain screens don't appear on your set doesn't mean the code to present and execute them isn't on your hard drive.

Look at the time the download takes for the 721 updates. Look at the hard drive space available to store it on. I don't think E* really cares a whole lot about the economies or efficiencies of the code. They care about how much it costs to their bottom line. So I do think I understand, in general, how E* works. They'll do whatever is cheapest that works reasonably well. That dictates the same code on the 721 and 921. It just takes fewer resources all around, which costs them less $$$, and puts more in Charlie's pocket.

Regards,

Pete
 

rsicard

Member
Sep 24, 2003
8
0
13 Days to go until Super Dish Release Day...will they release the software in time...or will we get the same answer...by the end of the month...
 

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