DISH and Sinclair extend contract talks (Update 8/25 Stations Removed)

[king3pj]

TV is a domain of the feds.

I get that, but why? Let each state decide what is appropriate and handle that. There is no real reason it should be a domain of the Feds.

These are all national companies. How does it make more sense for them to deal with 50 individual states than the federal government?

You think that instead of the FCC we should have the MCC (Michigan Communications Commission) and 49 other state run communication commissions? Then we would have different laws for what is allowed to be broadcast on network TV in each state. Before a CBS show could air their legal department would have to make sure it was legal in all 50 states or selectively block their programming in some states.

I can somewhat understand the republican ideal of a smaller national government and more powerful state governments but I don't think that should be applied as blanket policy. It just doesn't make sense in all cases. TV is one of those cases.

 

[Mr Tony]

I realize that DISH is just copying the guide data on the satellite feed for the OTA feed but do they HAVE to do that. IS there any technical reason they could not give us the proper guide data for OTA in cases like this.

nope. Directv does it properly, even when a station is pulled. The -1 number shows twice. Once with the info about the channel being pulled and then the OTA version with guide info

 

[RONZ]

If communications ceased transmitting across a state border, there would be a case for the States to do so. But because over-air communications cross state borders, it becomes a Federal domain.

Two items ,civil defense is not controlled state to state. Neither is weather issues. This is why this industry is controlled on a national level

 

[Hall]

I realize that DISH is just copying the guide data on the satellite feed for the OTA feed but do they HAVE to do that. IS there any technical reason they could not give us the proper guide data for OTA in cases like this.

It's simply easier for Dish to do it this way. I don't blame them either and the reality is, until there's a contract dispute, it's a non-issue or concern.

 

[Hall]

Still no uplink report. Time to kick the uplink computer?

Do you need an after the fact report to tell you what has obviously already happened?

The uplink report will show nothing. The channels are still there, nothing changed other than Dish blocking the audio/video and changing the guide information.

 

[Mr Tony]

I think Voyager was referring to the uplink report in general....not just the one with the Sinclair changes

The channels are still there, nothing changed other than Dish blocking the audio/video and changing the guide information.

I could get real anal here (like some people do) and say well in Zanesville they changed the ABC & FOX back to Columbus (from Cleveland and Youngstown) (per the uplink that did go when the stations were brought back)

 

[Peter Parker]

It's simply easier for Dish to do it this way. I don't blame them either and the reality is, until there's a contract dispute, it's a non-issue or concern.

Agreed the situation I was referring to is where there is a dispute.

 

[Peter Parker]

Different states are involved all the time. Look at WDS TV for an example. It is licensed in Delaware but the transmitter is in Maryland and the studio and offices are in DC. TV is a clear case of interstate commerce.

And what state would regulate satellite TV?

 

[MikeD-C05]

I realize that DISH is just copying the guide data on the satellite feed for the OTA feed but do they HAVE to do that. IS there any technical reason they could not give us the proper guide data for OTA in cases like this.

We are lucky to get even that on ota channels. They don't want to do sub channels and the only ota channels that they seem to want to support for guide data is exactly the same ones already uplinked on the satellites and the same ones they carry in their local packs.

 

[Peter Parker]

True that Mike. But by giving us the already available third party guide data for the OTA (in the case of a dispute) they forestall some customer complaints. That is the only reason they could or should consider doing it.

 

[david_jr]

This one ended before I could even get to the end of this thread! The only damage here is my wife missed one repeat of Kelly and Michael.

 

[Hall]

True that Mike. But by giving us the already available third party guide data for the OTA (in the case of a dispute) they forestall some customer complaints. That is the only reason they could or should consider doing it.

Two reasons they don't even temporarily "fix" this are a) the small # of people who use the OTA add-on and b) they lose that much more leverage if that group isn't impacted. They want as many people as possible to be affected by this.

 

[king3pj]

Two reasons they don't even temporarily "fix" this are a) the small # of people who use the OTA add-on and b) they lose that much more leverage if that group isn't impacted. They want as many people as possible to be affected by this.

Wait, why does Dish want people to be affected by disputes? That seems like the opposite of what they would want. The way it is now, people call in to demand credits or cancel when there is a dispute. If Dish could somehow get everyone to be okay with watching their locals OTA it would be much easier for them. They wouldn't have to worry about customer complaints and they could hold out on negotiations as long as they wanted.

Providing the guide info during a dispute would make this easier. That still doesn't fix the problem of people needing to buy OTA adapters and an antenna though.

 

[dvrexpander]

Aww I was going to get on chat and raise hell today to get some discounts and our channel 13 is back on. The only things I would have hurt for were football games but I could have gotten it OTA if need be. I wanted that discount and free showtime and cinemax channels

 

[Hall]

Same reason Dish puts the phone # of the local station up -- they want us to call the station and complain and ideally, the station management to tell the people above them that "viewers are mad, they're pointing the finger at us, not Dish" (<< that's what I saw on my local ABC and FOX Facebook pages too). Granted, it's a 50/50 chance. Some will blame Dish, some will blame the station.

The number of people who call in specifically to get credits is minuscule, that I'm quite certain of. Also, Dish isn't going to try and convince people to go OTA too much. If you carry that out far enough, some people might decide "I don't need Dish at all". One reason people moved to cable or satellite is because antennae isn't convenient. Sure, in the 60s it was easy - lots of houses had big antennae on towers or on roofs/chimneys plus they only had (1) TV. How many of those towers haven't rusted to pieces and either fallen down or been taken down ?

For the record, I have an antenna (it's outdoor too) as well.

 

[king3pj]

Same reason Dish puts the phone # of the local station up -- they want us to call the station and complain and ideally, the station management to tell the people above them that "viewers are mad, they're pointing the finger at us, not Dish" (<< that's what I saw on my local ABC and FOX Facebook pages too). Granted, it's a 50/50 chance. Some will blame Dish, some will blame the station.

The number of people who call in specifically to get credits is minuscule, that I'm quite certain of. Also, Dish isn't going to try and convince people to go OTA too much. If you carry that out far enough, some people might decide "I don't need Dish at all". One reason people moved to cable or satellite is because antennae isn't convenient. Sure, in the 60s it was easy - lots of houses had big antennae on towers or on roofs/chimneys plus they only had (1) TV. How many of those towers haven't rusted to pieces and either fallen down or been taken down ?

For the record, I have an antenna (it's outdoor too) as well.

I think most people are far more likely to call Dish when they lose a channel than the channel owner. Most people don't understand why any of this stuff is happening. They just know a channel is gone. I would argue that if Dish didn't change the guide info to "WSMH has removed this channel" many people wouldn't even notice it's gone.

If Dish could make it so people weren't negatively affected by these disputes they would have way more negotiating power. How is a channel going to get the extra money they are asking for if customers aren't calling to complain? Instead of credits when a channel is pulled they should be sending out free OTA adapters and continuing to provide guide info.

I'm with you on the fact that people don't use antennas anymore. My parents would have switched providers if this wasn't resolved quickly long before they would ever think of putting up an antenna. I just don't buy the idea that Dish benefits from people being affected by disputes.

 

[Hall]

I think most people are far more likely to call Dish when they lose a channel than the channel provider. Most people don't understand why any of this stuff is happening. They just know a channel is gone. I would argue that if Dish didn't change the guide info to "WSMH has removed this channel" many people wouldn't even notice it's gone.

Just thought of this.... During a channel dispute like this, Dish should change their menu prompts to ask "Are you calling about the loss of your local network channel ? Press 1 if yes", then ask to confirm the zip code, and re-route the call to the local station !!

 

[Tampa8]

It should be noted that it isn't necessarily over yet.

The parties had an agreement in principal before the blackout .

I'm not sure that is correct. They agreed to extend negotiations, not that there was any agreement in principle. This isn't being portrayed as an extension, it's more that the actual agreement will be completed and signed within two weeks. To the extent the agreement isn't signed yet it's not over, but there is an agreement, there wasn't when the first contract extension was made.

 

[sam_gordon]

It's simply easier for Dish to do it this way. I don't blame them either and the reality is, until there's a contract dispute, it's a non-issue or concern.

I disagree. What about subchannels being picked up OTA but not carried by Dish? In my market, Dish still shows the guide data for those channels. I understand that's not the case everywhere. But if Dish isn't going to supply guide data, they should allow the use of PSIP information. And no, there's no technical reason they can't ("they don't want to" isn't a technical reason).

 

[RONZ]

Today I wrote Dish about the loss of WWTV & WFQX. Both stations say Dish is not negotiating at all. I copied the info from the respected station and asked Dish what was going on. I received no response from Dish