Dish crashes. 922 out of control. HELP!!!!

[Desertnight]

Today, I switched out the old Chapparal feed horn and c-band lnb with a Corotor II with c and ku lnbs.

When I went to change satellites from G6 (DSR922) to G4, the dish kept moving on, and on and on past G4 til the dish crashed completely west. :rant: The chain on my Ajak motor mount broke cause of the crash.

A long, long time ago, a satellite technician said I did not need to wire up my dish limit switches (the reason, I do not remember). So, the switches were not hooked up.

The DSR was uncontrollable for any instant emergency stops, went past the limit set on the 922. Even unplugging the 922 did not stop the movement of the dish or the power off to the motor.

I finally figured out a way to stop the dish motor from turning (after the fact).

Is there anything I should have known before hand? I thought that I could switch out the feedhorn and lnbs without any problems.

Before hand, I did not check out whether the "new" c-band lnb is any good (it's used) and did not change the setting in the 922 to say I now have a c band and ku band lnb.

What would be reasons why this happened? I do have an idea now, myself. But I would like your opinions.

After 22 years with this dish, I feel like I did something really dumb.

 

[JAS]

A long, long time ago, a satellite technician said I did not need to wire up my dish limit switches (the reason, I do not remember). So, the switches were not hooked up.

After 22 years with this dish, I feel like I did something really dumb.

I know you now know this. Limit switches hooked up and working on the Ajak would prevented this. I don't know why the 922 did not stop at your West limit unless they had changes. Limits on my 922 have changed two times in the last 5 or 6 years. I don't know if they changed by them self or someone sat on the remote and the right sequences were hit to change them.

 

[Hermitman]

I don't think the 922 is the problem. Swapping out the feedhorn or lnb would have no effect on dish movement. When you unplugged the 922, power is no longer being sent to the dish motor and the motor should stop spinning, stopping the movement of the dish. It sounds like the chain or something else in the dish mover broke first, allowing the weigh of the dish to spin the gears freely without having the motor as a brake, until the dish mount hit a mechanical stop. Just an opinion.

 

[tvropro]

When You pull the plug on the 922 there is NO voltage going to the motor. There's no way power can continue. Something funky happened in the AJax like Hermitman said.

 

[Desertnight]

I agree...there is no way that electricity could continue to power the motor. Sure is weird though.

I thought the same way, Hermitman. Swapping out the feedhorn and lnbs should not have made a difference.

Ya know, I should have never listened to the satellite technician. I agree that if the mechanical limits were hooked up, the dish would never have crashed. I called him a few months back to ask him something about FTA. He did not know what I was talking about. He got out of c-band and is now a pizza pan dealer. That should tell you something.

Here's more information about the situation:

The Ajak has three chained sprockets. The chain, closest to the dish, broke after the dish traveled as far as it could on the pole. I do not know, yet, if anything internally (like the shaft that runs through the three sprockets) is broken or spun. I sincerely hope not. But so far, from doing some checks, those chains/sprockets do move. I have no idea what the purpose of those two other sprockets/chains are. The one that broke is obvious.

I took off the Coroter II feedhorn, etc. and put the old feedhorn and cband lnb back on. Since the dish could be moved by hand with that chain broken, I sighted in G4 99W with the Sonicview 360. I knew that lnb works. The 922 is also on G4.

One thing I noticed when I had told the 922 to change to the G4 satellite from G6 (as the dish was about to crash), was the normal check mark showing the satellites the 922 was going past was not showing the progress. The check mark went directly from G6 to G4.

So, until tomorrow, the dish mount is clamped in position with a wood block to keep the dish in place. I also put the broken chain around its sprocket and tied the links together with a twist tie. It's so clamped together now that I don't think the wind will move it.

By the way, Ku is not hooked up on the 922 or the FTA.....yet.

Part of my thoughts are: 1. The c-band lnb (it's a Norsat Gold) on the Coroter II may not be any good. I'll switch out lnbs and see if the Norsat is working. 2. The 922 needed to be told that a C & Ku was being used. The 922 may not have recognized the c-band lnb for that reason.
3. Therefore, the 922 could not recognize any signal coming in from the lnb and kept searching for the signal thus crashing.

Is there a way for an Emergency Stop to be done quicker? I know that on my old analog IRD that if the dish is moving and I happened to just push the wrong button, it would flash a big red screen saying EMERGENCY STOP and the dish would quit moving immediately.

Your input is appreciated. :up The more I get, the more I can figure out what happened and how to make it all work better.

On a happy note....the dish set up is on ground level. The pole is encased three feet down in concrete. No roof tops or ladders for me.

 

[JAS]

Is there a way for an Emergency Stop to be done quicker? I know that on my old analog IRD that if the dish is moving and I happened to just push the wrong button, it would flash a big red screen saying EMERGENCY STOP and the dish would quit moving immediately.

I must have a different model Ajak, model 180. It only has two sprockets and a worm gear. When the chain on mine is disconnected the dish will not move even in very strong winds unless you turn the big gear by hand.

Hitting the sat button on the remote stops my dish immediately.

Just an after thought. From memory-- I think the worm gear on mine is held to the shaft by a roll pin. Now if that pin was to break or work it's way out then the dish would be free to move.

 

[Desertnight]

Dish fixed.

With the broken chain removed, I used the 922 to go to different satellites to check the dish position number. I found that all but G4 were positioned where they are supposed to be at. (I had a list of all the satellites and dish position numbers already from a previous master reset).

G4 thought it was G6 for some reason. So I removed G4 from the satellite list and reprogrammed it back in. I knew where the dish would be located for G4 without the chain being on and sighted it in with the FTA. Put the chain back on with a new master link. Perfect!! I then checked to make sure the dish would go to the other satellites. Perfect.

I'm back in business.

One added note--I have to add a correction -- in the frantic moments when the dish was crashing, I turned OFF the 922. That's why the power was still going to the motor (since 922's are always on even when off). So unplugging it worked, of course.

But I did discover that an ER stop could be done by pushing the right arrow twice, then either the up or down arrow whichever way was opposite the direction of the dish movement. The dish will then stop.

But, in my belated wisdom, I have decided that because I did not change the lnb type in my installation menu from "C-band lnb" to the "C-band lnb and Ku-band lnb", that was the cause of the crash. The receiver could not recognize any signals being sent from the different feedhorn and lnbs.

Oh......duh!

 

[Hermitman]

I will have to respectfully disagree with your conclusion that the lnb selection and signal reception has anything to do with dish position. The dish position is based on the pulse count from the dish mover (actuator). That pulse count signal comes from the sensor wires connected to the back of the receiver. You can also see the pulse count when you move the dish from one satellite to another satellite. In the upper right hand corner of the satellite selection menu is the pulse count indicator and you can see it increase or decrease as the dish moves east or west. To verify that the lnb/signal has nothing to do with dish position, I totally disconnected my coax from the back of my receiver and then moved my dish to different satellite positions without problems. I reconnected the coax and things were back to normal. Something else caused your problem. Just my opinion. Good luck.

 

[Desertnight]

Hermitman: I will have to respectfully disagree with your opinion.

The 922 will find the satellite positions since the positions ("pulses") were programmed into its little brain prior to having the coaxial removed.

The 922 needs to be told what "type" of feedhorn it will be working with. Says so in Options 6-4-2. Line 2 on the Dish Setting screen asks what type of lnbs will be used. Since lnbs are attached to a feedhorn and though I am not familiar with the technical aspect of the inter-workings of feedhorns, I can only say the the guts of the c/ku lnb feedhorn is different than a regular "c-band" only feedhorn. I could change out c-band lnbs all day long on a regular c-band only feedhorn without any repercussions.

So, therefore, when the 922 saw that I put a different feedhorn on the dish without telling it, the 922 went berzerk. The bits and bytes in the brain became confused and could not understand what to do. It said "I know you have a c-band lnb hooked up, but what have you hooked it up to, and what is that other thing? You did not tell me."

That's the explanation of my opinion.

I certainly do appreciate your opinion. Your opinion adds to the flavor of the hobby.:up

 

[crackt]

Hermitman: I will have to respectfully disagree with your opinion.

The 922 will find the satellite positions since the positions ("pulses") were programmed into its little brain prior to having the coaxial removed.

The 922 needs to be told what "type" of feedhorn it will be working with. Says so in Options 6-4-2. Line 2 on the Dish Setting screen asks what type of lnbs will be used. Since lnbs are attached to a feedhorn and though I am not familiar with the technical aspect of the inter-workings of feedhorns, I can only say the the guts of the c/ku lnb feedhorn is different than a regular "c-band" only feedhorn. I could change out c-band lnbs all day long on a regular c-band only feedhorn without any repercussions.

So, therefore, when the 922 saw that I put a different feedhorn on the dish without telling it, the 922 went berzerk. The bits and bytes in the brain became confused and could not understand what to do. It said "I know you have a c-band lnb hooked up, but what have you hooked it up to, and what is that other thing? You did not tell me."

That's the explanation of my opinion.

I certainly do appreciate your opinion. Your opinion adds to the flavor of the hobby.:up

i have swapped out lnbfs on my 920 without changing settings. only gave me no signal. ive also stored sat positions without an lnbf hooked up to the 920. it also gave me no signal but stored the proper position. im curious to know what exactly you did to produce the result you obtained. it be something to watch out for in the future.

crackt out,.

 

[tvropro]

Changing LNB's or LNB settings will not cause a receiver's actuator to go out of control. Something else happened that was not related to the LNB.

 

[Comptech]

Changing LNB's or LNB settings will not cause a receiver's actuator to go out of control. Something else happened that was not related to the LNB.

Agreed,changing the lnb would not make the 'bits and bytes' go nuts.Something on the OP's actions did.My best bet would be no limits set and the motor went to far causing the dreaded FLOP.

 

[14karat]

There is another possible diagnosis.
The actuator is controlled via relay, correct?

Ever had a relay stick?

Not that I know that's what caused this, but it is possible, and that's just my $0.02.

 

[crackt]

There is another possible diagnosis.
The actuator is controlled via relay, correct?

Ever had a relay stick?

Not that I know that's what caused this, but it is possible, and that's just my $0.02.

the power source was removed. sounds like chain broke somehow.

crackt out,.

 

[14karat]

One added note--I have to add a correction -- in the frantic moments when the dish was crashing, I turned OFF the 922. That's why the power was still going to the motor (since 922's are always on even when off). So unplugging it worked, of course.

I was basing my thought on this.
Power wasn't disconnected, just the unit turned off, which wouldn't, necessarily, power down the actuator.

 

[Desertnight]

Agreed,changing the lnb would not make the 'bits and bytes' go nuts.Something on the OP's actions did.My best bet would be no limits set and the motor went to far causing the dreaded FLOP.

Limits were set on the 922, but the mechanical limits at the dish were not due to the fact that a so-called satellite technician said don't do it for whatever reason that was several years ago.

the power source was removed. sounds like chain broke somehow.

The chain broke when the dish crashed into the pole mount. The actuator/motor kept pulling and pushing til the chain snapped....ping!

Power wasn't disconnected, just the unit turned off, which wouldn't, necessarily, power down the actuator.

True. Unit had to be unplugged from the wall to stop the monster.

I ended up having to do a master reset because the dish positions were off by about 18 numbers on almost every satellite. I did not call NPS for a hit. The clock set the correct time on its own.