E* Customer Service Ratings Drop

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Charlie saves money where he can so he can pass the savings on to DISH customers. This is done for several reasons, the least of which is the "America's Lowest Price" is the ace in the hole. There are definate downsides to it, some internal, some not. You need to remember that in order for Charlie to avoid hiking prices to equal that of Comcast or DTV, the savings has to come from somewhere. If you think the website it slow, you should try running a multi-spectrum project using systems which have outgrown their current software.

Things are getting better, but the technology in a 622 is far superior than that used to even maintain the customer base (access terminals.)

So here's the choice you make. Does DISH raise prices to just below (and when I say just I'm talking within 2-3 dollars) of competition versus the 10-20 dollar lead presently being maintained, or do you count your blessing and wait while a solution is worked on that is just as cost effective and allows the price-point to be maintained? Everything costs money. Good service, means good employees. I work hard, and I'll be honest I make good money, not that there isn't room for some increase. But I also frequently pull hours that exceed full-time businesses (retailerships) and although my hours are "9-5" my actual hours worked are minimum usually 7-9.

This isn't a gripe or an axe to grind, it's just a statement to illustrate a point. If you want people willing to sacrifice their time and personal lives (that is what work is, most people just minimize it with 9-5 hours) to service you better, how much more are you willing to pay them? Are you willing to pay them at all? If you're not, why should they be willing to take more of a personal loss for you? Because it's right, because it's the "business smart" thing to do? If your boss asked you to work a double-shift but take the same amount of pay home, would you?

You want bells and whistles, you want the fastest website, faster than all the competition; you want 100% accuracy and development rates, and 1,000% customer service, you want service calls within 12 hours of calling and no more, you want weekend tech support, you want a 24/7 business center to take care of all your business needs...

$20 more per 12.8 million customers will make it possible. Charlie can give that to you. But, "Speed costs. How fast do you want to go?"

Regardless of how you answer this question, I will continue to work hard for you each day. But don't expect miracles on a Sunday confessional budget. Now here's some food for thought:

1. Everytime you tell a customer to abuse their DHPP warranty, that is money away from Charlie.
2. Everytime you tell a customer to threaten a disconnect in order to get an exception on an upgrade they don't qualify for, you take money away from Charlie.
3. Everytime you call in a favor from Retail Services to avoid paying or a replacement or a fee you just don't want to bother with, you take money away from Charlie.
4. Everytime you write disparaging comments about DISH that refers one less customer, it takes away from Charlie.
5. Everytime you use the CEO e-mail address to force DISH to do something that you KNOW is against their set rules, you take money away from Charlie.

Wow. You're taking an awful lot of money from Charlie. If he even had half of these things, he might be able to give you some of what you want much faster.

I'm not saying DISH isn't out to make a profit, at the end of the day it is a business too. I'm saying that people aren't thinking. Choices are made every day. What customers do you qualify, what about that former customer you want to get in under a new cust promo because they won't go in under you otherwise, so you fire off some e-mails. Think of how many corners get cut, and how many exceptions are made for you in order to turn a profit. Now multiple that by 20,000. Now put it into a dollar figure.

You, the retailers, the customers decide how the business continues. Think about this the next time you make a decision that helps you, but "DISH has deep pockets."
 
Last edited:
Every elective decision made by Charlie's people, i.e. your points 2, 3 & 5, is money that Charlie elects to give away. And every time E* bends on one of these, they only invite more people to use them. Every time the CEO email address works for someone, that is because Charlie/E* decided to set it up this way.

If Charlie didn't think it was worth it to do these things, then he would inform CEO office staff to not bend the rules.

One thing that does take away money from Charlie is engaging in behaviors that encourage people to call CSRs, whether this be confusing product information, poor advertising, inadequate web services, poorly trained staff, etc.. And E* is doing a few things poorly because E* customers call CSRs something like 30% more often than D* customers call CSRs.

Call avoidance is perhaps the #1 factor in determining support costs. E* is much worse at this than their competitors.

So E* is driving more calls to their CSRs, and according to recent data, providing less satisfactory service via their CSRs. Sounds to me like Charlie has a serious problem on his hands. And I'm sure he knows it.
 
I'd personally say it's service calls at $100 a round but I'm sure call center pushback is in there. And I won't deny there's concerns there, but Charlie can't be expected in a multi-billion dollar company with millions of customers to have a complete control of all costs and issues and judgments used by agents of his company. People do make decisions on their own volition right or wrong, it happens every day. I think the smart people consider "What would Charlie do in my place." versus "What can I do to keep this issue from reaching Charlie." One usually results in compromise giving up some cost for some support. The other is throwing money at a situation to make it go away.

Customer Service, let's examine what that means to most customers. To most I think (most being the 11.8 that don't call in with issues, sometimes ever) customer service is that there's someone on the other end of the phone should they ever need it.

To the other 1 million, it's all about "Give me what I want, I'm the customer, I'm always right!!!" A bit extreme I'll grant you, but still accurate for showing the two extremes. Charlie COULD put a 100% lockdown on all "negotiative" practices, being the CEO addresses, Retailer Services, etc. But then you have retailers and customers screaming that DISH is unemotional, and cares nothing for service. If you care nothing for service by giving nothing, but you care nothing for service, giving away the farm, where can Charlie win?

The CEO address and some other administrative departments exist for the sole purpose of addressing issues which have exceeded what could be considered "normal" and require personal attention. In EVERY customer's opinion, this is their issue. Their issue is top priority, and noone should come before them. You see it everyday on the forums. Every customer (and pardon the generalization but most retailers) believe they are the single driving entity that keeps a business running. If they cancel, that company is dead in their humble opinion, and I suppose that's a societal flaw but it proves a point. People expect more these days than they're willing to pay for.

You CAN have just about anything you want...if you're willing to pay enough. "Enough" is not a number set by the customer or the retailer. It's set by the person(s) with the desired product or service.

Charlie could buckle down on every single source of loss and cost, and increase profit and his ability to spend... but you're very intelligent, would you accept it if he did? Companies' ability to negotiate keep them in business, the ability with customers and partners. Companies' ability to make money, make them leaders and innovators, and provide desirables customers and partners want in the first place.

Customers are always looking for the bigger better deal, which is fine, everyone does it. They look at companies as numbers and exploit where they can. The same thing happens every day all over America with sales. But when you treat a company like a number, and the people at the company like numbers (CSR #1, CSR #2, hence the term CSR Roulette) how can you act shocked and dismayed when the company looks at your billing and how much you're worth to determine whether spending money on you is in their best interest? How can you be disappointed when they treat you the same as you treat them? It's a service you pay for them to provide you. But it's a service, they paid YOU to sign up for to begin with. No company makes 100% profit the first day or the first sale. It takes time to recover the costs spent on acquiring a customer.
 
Dish has partnered with AT&T to sell there equipment as well. AT&T does everything on the cheap but they at least have call centers in America. But a $7.00 a hour job does not inspire people to stick around. Rushed training and lack of support are all part of the problem with AT&T. There motto seems to be simply to get as many people out on the floor as possible as quickly as possible. No wonder every one quits.

Dish may do it better with there internal CSR's but AT&T policys are a joke.

90 days as a slave to angry AT&T customers was enough. Glad I quit


Bob
 
There has to be a balance of cost of servicing the customer vs. trying to cut costs. Cut costs too much and you start losing more customers. This means that Dish has to balance things to get the best bang for their buck. They want to keep subscriber numbers high. If they are willing to spend more on getting a new customer than keeping their current ones then some may see that as not a good thing. There are two ways of looking at that though. They already offer existing subscriber deals but sometimes that is not all that it takes since there are special circumstances such as service that needs to be dealt with. If too much has to be spent on one customer to keep them then they will see it as a bad investment. With some people it does not matter how much you do for them, there is no way to keep them long enough to make that re-investment worthwhile. In other cases it might just take a little bit of service to keep the customer.
 
My wife is a customer service rep for Dish. All I can say after all the stories of customers
who call in is the following:

1. Read your receivers directions.
2. Read your tv directions.
3. Learn to operate your tv remote.
4. Learn to operate your tv.
5. If you don't know how to operate the system-don't let the installer leave.
6. If you aren't on the account - don't call.
7. Pay your bill- it gets you perks.
8. Rain fade does happen- deal with it.
9. CSR's are people too - "A Kind Word Turneth Away Wrath"
10. Don't assume you know more than the CSR. Explain your problem clearly and try a little patience.
11. Remember while you wait for the next CSR on the phone- those ahead of you didn't read this list and apply it.

Thanks for reading. Hope you can all see this posts intention.
I personally believe that Dish really tries to be the best.
 
Sweepy1 said:
If this mean that I will not have to put up with someone who can barely speak engrish ......Fantastic.....Can we employ a few more Americans please
Click to expand...

:up That's the #1 problem with Dish's CSRs. I call and ask them about adding something like a sports package and they tell me "you already have that sir, you have Fox Sports Net" :rolleyes:
 
zaxxon2000 said:
My wife is a customer service rep for Dish. All I can say after all the stories of customers
who call in is the following:

1. Read your receivers directions.
2. Read your tv directions.
3. Learn to operate your tv remote.
4. Learn to operate your tv.
5. If you don't know how to operate the system-don't let the installer leave.
6. If you aren't on the account - don't call.
7. Pay your bill- it gets you perks.
8. Rain fade does happen- deal with it.
9. CSR's are people too - "A Kind Word Turneth Away Wrath"
10. Don't assume you know more than the CSR. Explain your problem clearly and try a little patience.
11. Remember while you wait for the next CSR on the phone- those ahead of you didn't read this list and apply it.

Thanks for reading. Hope you can all see this posts intention.
I personally believe that Dish really tries to be the best.
Click to expand...

1-5
Answering RTFM questions are just part of CS, that is not going to change. Tell your wife to think of it as job security. ;)

NightRyder
 
They only slipped to second, surprised me as their service has sucked the big one the last year, you call and deal with huge hodl times, then someone half around the world that can barely communicate and has no power to do anything except apologize.
 
zaxxon2000 said:
My wife is a customer service rep for Dish. All I can say after all the stories of customers
who call in is the following:

1. Read your receivers directions.
2. Read your tv directions.
3. Learn to operate your tv remote.
4. Learn to operate your tv.
5. If you don't know how to operate the system-don't let the installer leave.
6. If you aren't on the account - don't call.
7. Pay your bill- it gets you perks.
8. Rain fade does happen- deal with it.
9. CSR's are people too - "A Kind Word Turneth Away Wrath"
10. Don't assume you know more than the CSR. Explain your problem clearly and try a little patience.
11. Remember while you wait for the next CSR on the phone- those ahead of you didn't read this list and apply it.

Thanks for reading. Hope you can all see this posts intention.
I personally believe that Dish really tries to be the best.
Click to expand...

I appreciate your wife's position, but the majority of CSRs are inept and need to recognize when they are dealing with an end user (customer) that does know what they are talking about and then know how to deal with them. You get the typical scripted CSR answers followed by the apologies and then nothing. Additionally E* has not done much lately to show they value their customers nor are going to offer anything of value over the competition, sure the VOOM channles are nice, but not enough new and different programming in HD, I give them $115 a month and honestly the only thing that keeps me with them is the flexibility of dual tuner plus OTA on the 622, I can record virtually anything I want without fear of conflicts, but the HD LILs are horrible here in ATL and that edge is loosing its advantage for me.
 
Read the receiver's directions?

Why would any company expect every customer to read a 70+ page manual?

And the directions about remotes in those manuals are confusing. They make it very complex for the average person to program them.

The key to call avoidance and higher customer sat levels is producing equipment and manuals that are very easy to use by Joe & Jane Consumer. I.e, the "iPod" model.

Personally I find E*'s equipment easy to use. But most of us here are not the average customer.
 
Your average customer knows JUST enough information about their equipment to get by on day-to-day programs and recordings. Most customers beyond that, couldn't find a set of batteries if the Energizer bunny was sitting in their lap. It's not anyone's fault so I don't see why blame is so commonly placed on CSRs.

Here's the reality. A call center atmosphere is VERY undesirable. Essentially, you're getting screamed at for eight hours a day plus. Now everyone has choices and there's others jobs out there, but if all the CSRs that didn't like getting screamed at up and quit, the next post on this board would be whining about CSRs never answering the phones.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. There's only several thousand (not tens of thousands, not hundreds of thousands, just a few thousand) CSRs to service 12.8+ million customers and growing each day. MOST customers, will experience 1-3 issues over the life of their account, whether it be a $1.99 mischarge or something requiring a replacement receiver. And I agree education of customers will always exist (sad isn't it) about basic electronic functions, and equally some CSRs could use higher tier training. But overall, most CSRs, "frontline" CSRs, the ones people come to the forums to insult all day are really there for a few small reasons. To fix billing errors as they come along, to make programming changes at the customer's request, and to add PPV's for customers that opt to lock that feature via remote. Not all CSRs are technically trained (they understand basic receiver function in most cases but don't ask them to troubleshoot.)

And regarding the 70+ page manual, yes and no. If you buy a $600 satellite system, I would think for your investment you would read the "do not place fork in electrical socket" book. If customers CHOOSE not to do so or find it inconvenient, how is that the CSRs fault? The answer's on page three but I'll just make a call, sit on hold for half an hour, make your life hell for the next hour for the half hour I was on hold, and all so you can tell me my TV should be on channel three or four.

Ignorance, willful, paid for or otherwise is not a valid excuse.
 
Zero327 said:
Charlie saves money where he can so he can pass the savings on to DISH customers. This is done for several reasons, the least of which is the "America's Lowest Price" is the ace in the hole. There are definate downsides to it, some internal, some not. You need to remember that in order for Charlie to avoid hiking prices to equal that of Comcast or DTV, the savings has to come from somewhere. If you think the website it slow, you should try running a multi-spectrum project using systems which have outgrown their current software.

Things are getting better, but the technology in a 622 is far superior than that used to even maintain the customer base (access terminals.)

So here's the choice you make. Does DISH raise prices to just below (and when I say just I'm talking within 2-3 dollars) of competition versus the 10-20 dollar lead presently being maintained, or do you count your blessing and wait while a solution is worked on that is just as cost effective and allows the price-point to be maintained? Everything costs money. Good service, means good employees. I work hard, and I'll be honest I make good money, not that there isn't room for some increase. But I also frequently pull hours that exceed full-time businesses (retailerships) and although my hours are "9-5" my actual hours worked are minimum usually 7-9.

This isn't a gripe or an axe to grind, it's just a statement to illustrate a point. If you want people willing to sacrifice their time and personal lives (that is what work is, most people just minimize it with 9-5 hours) to service you better, how much more are you willing to pay them? Are you willing to pay them at all? If you're not, why should they be willing to take more of a personal loss for you? Because it's right, because it's the "business smart" thing to do? If your boss asked you to work a double-shift but take the same amount of pay home, would you?

You want bells and whistles, you want the fastest website, faster than all the competition; you want 100% accuracy and development rates, and 1,000% customer service, you want service calls within 12 hours of calling and no more, you want weekend tech support, you want a 24/7 business center to take care of all your business needs...

$20 more per 12.8 million customers will make it possible. Charlie can give that to you. But, "Speed costs. How fast do you want to go?"

Regardless of how you answer this question, I will continue to work hard for you each day. But don't expect miracles on a Sunday confessional budget. Now here's some food for thought:

1. Everytime you tell a customer to abuse their DHPP warranty, that is money away from Charlie.
2. Everytime you tell a customer to threaten a disconnect in order to get an exception on an upgrade they don't qualify for, you take money away from Charlie.
3. Everytime you call in a favor from Retail Services to avoid paying or a replacement or a fee you just don't want to bother with, you take money away from Charlie.
4. Everytime you write disparaging comments about DISH that refers one less customer, it takes away from Charlie.
5. Everytime you use the CEO e-mail address to force DISH to do something that you KNOW is against their set rules, you take money away from Charlie.

Wow. You're taking an awful lot of money from Charlie. If he even had half of these things, he might be able to give you some of what you want much faster.

I'm not saying DISH isn't out to make a profit, at the end of the day it is a business too. I'm saying that people aren't thinking. Choices are made every day. What customers do you qualify, what about that former customer you want to get in under a new cust promo because they won't go in under you otherwise, so you fire off some e-mails. Think of how many corners get cut, and how many exceptions are made for you in order to turn a profit. Now multiple that by 20,000. Now put it into a dollar figure.

You, the retailers, the customers decide how the business continues. Think about this the next time you make a decision that helps you, but "DISH has deep pockets."
Click to expand...

excellent post!..I agree...You must be a retailer.....
Retail is way better than fulfillment work...
Dish is trying to keep it's rates down..The money has to come form somwhere...Unfortunately is coming form us..The people that install and service..We ar ethe ones facing ever increasing material and miscellaneous expenses. Yet the pay rates do not increase..
Eventually good techs/people will leave the business because the value of the work will exceed the economic reward...
 
Zero327 said:
Ignorance, willful, paid for or otherwise is not a valid excuse.
Click to expand...


Yes it is. If you do not design your entire support system, from the ground up, to deal with ignorant customers, then you are going to pay a heavy price.

If you make the assumption that customers are going to read the manuals, and you build a support center that isn't designed to handle the load of calls that will come in as a result of people not reading the manual, and you don't have your agents trained to give answers that are in the manual, then you are doomed to failure.

That's just the way it is.

The only way you can run on a thin call center is to make your product extremely simply to use.

Right now Dish is not making something about their products easy to use. Whether that is the product, the upgrade options, the installation process, the equipment, whatever, I don't know. What I do know is that Dish is driving their customers to make more calls than their competitors. And because of this, Dish is having more of their revenue eaten up in support cost.

And all of these complexity is making it more difficult for their CSRs to quickly answer questions. This is making Dish customers less satisfied.

Most likely this is due to Dish rolling out too many products, upgrades, services, and equipment changes without taking into account the human support factor. Perhaps the engineers or marketers have had too much power in their decision making.

Look at Dish's product lines. They have D500, D1000, D300, D1000+, SuperDish 105, SuperDish 121 satellite dishes. Satellites at 61.5, 105, 110, 118.7, 119, 121, 129 and 148. More receivers in play than almost anyone can name. Family Pack, AT60, AT120, AT180, AEP, locals, HD-Bronze, HD-Silver, HD-Gold, HD-Platinum, Superstations, Sports packages, PBS, Several premium movie packages & combinations, tons of foreign language channels, public info channels, multiple music channel packs, and more. Then there are several different switches and LNBs. Different service plans. Different lease options. Different trade-in programs. PPVs. Billing problems (and a very unfriendly, hard to interpret billing system). Multiple programmable remotes.

They are trying to provide support on this extemely complex product offering through multiple call centers located around the world. And to top it off, their automated problem resolution solutions are below average.

This is a company in DESPARATE need of a simplified product line. At some point, they are going to have to bite the bullet and start de-supporting older products.

I know a little bit about this because one of the operations I oversee for my employer is a call center. Dish has created a call center nightmare environment.
 
zaxxon2000 said:
My wife is a customer service rep for Dish. All I can say after all the stories of customers
who call in is the following:

1. Read your receivers directions.
2. Read your tv directions.
3. Learn to operate your tv remote.
4. Learn to operate your tv.
5. If you don't know how to operate the system-don't let the installer leave.
6. If you aren't on the account - don't call.
7. Pay your bill- it gets you perks.
8. Rain fade does happen- deal with it.
9. CSR's are people too - "A Kind Word Turneth Away Wrath"
10. Don't assume you know more than the CSR. Explain your problem clearly and try a little patience.
11. Remember while you wait for the next CSR on the phone- those ahead of you didn't read this list and apply it.

Thanks for reading. Hope you can all see this posts intention.
I personally believe that Dish really tries to be the best.
Click to expand...

How very true!

#7 is right on the money. Dish really holds this to you, if you miss payments they do not treat you as well as customers who always pay on time!
 
Dish and especially Direct both have an opportunity to greatly simplify their product line with MPEG-4. When the swapout eventually occurs they can have one type of standard receiver then one type of DVR receiver. They should have one receiver period. With that receiver there can be different upgrades available like a computer. Some may have a hard drive, others may not (for DVR and other functionalities). Some may have one tuner, some two, some four. All can be done on the same baseline of receiver. Different software can be triggered with the to be installed when different hardware for difference functions are put into the receiver.

This would make support better and understanding easier for what is compatible. This would make the products cheaper too because things could be made in bulk more. Instead of upgrading a whole receiver you could only have to upgrade a part if things were done right.
 

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