How are my locals Received?

[Mister B]

Does anyone know details on how and where local channels are received? For instance, here in El Paso, DISH has a large call center (press 2 for Spanish) and I am fairly certain that most of the locals are picked up from antennas on the top of their building. Also, I have heard a couple of our locals warn that their transmitter would be off for a while and that they would also not be available on DISH but are on DTV.
However, my favorite channel, KRWG from New Mexico (see my avatar) could not possibly be reliably received at the DISH call center. I suspect they have a digital connection of some sort. I also find KRWG's picture quality to be better than the rest of the locals.
So, I am just curious if there is on-line information on this subject and it would probably be of interest to other members also. I tried "search" but the terms are too common.

 

[boba]

Try a phone call to the local stations or an email. Some stations are received OTA and some are linked by fiber.

 

[Hall]

and I am fairly certain that most of the locals are picked up from antennas on the top of their building.

Locals are typically combined at a TV station and then distributed to the satellite provider. In the Dayton OH market, this is done at the local CBS station for both Dish and Directv. I doubt that this is an unusual arrangement.

 

[ChadT41]

Likely they are not atop the call center as almost every call center is leased, and they would need a permanent fixture. We have one of the largest Dish call centers here in PhoeniI think Denver and El Paso are as big as well), and we did not have them on our call center. There was an uplink about 5 miles away, and then in Gilbert about 10 or 15 miles away there is the Echostsr uplink facility. So it could come from the stations tower, then sent through the Gilbert uplink facility, and on to Spot Beams. That's just my impression, the only thing I know for sure is it is not on the call center.

 

[Mr Tony]

some are done via fibre. Minneapolis has 2 PBS stations in the DMA that there is no way they can get OTA from Minneapolis as they are 150+ miles away. One of them even had some info on it

http://www.pioneer.org/news/pioneer-now-on-dish-network-in-twin-cities-directv-coming-soon

some smaller markets where there may be one or two stations total they get a direct line. Mankato, MN is a one station market (CBS main/FOX sub) that still signs off nightly. I know on Directv when the OTA feed signed off (I could pick it up OTA) then there was just color bars and "KEYC" on the screen. Recently (a couple years ago) they went to showing paid programs during the overnight (from one of those 24/7 paid programming type channels)

 

[Mister B]

The above link about Pioneer PBS is interesting. I plan on attending the next KRWG member's coffee shop hour in Las Cruces and will ask them then. I would also like to encourage them to find a way to get their OTA signal into east El Paso. Back in the analog days they used a tall tower between Las Cruces and Deming, NM and it could be received in most of El Paso with a little effort. When they went digital they just broadcast off of a small mountain near campus and it is only available on the west side of El Paso.

 

[Jim5506]

Unfortunately, KRWG is probably not that interested in covering more area.

Being a PBS station they serve the Las Cruces area mainly and the expenditure to install a repeater or large tower out to the west is just not there.

 

[KAB]

The above link about Pioneer PBS is interesting. I plan on attending the next KRWG member's coffee shop hour in Las Cruces and will ask them then. I would also like to encourage them to find a way to get their OTA signal into east El Paso. Back in the analog days they used a tall tower between Las Cruces and Deming, NM and it could be received in most of El Paso with a little effort. When they went digital they just broadcast off of a small mountain near campus and it is only available on the west side of El Paso.

Must have relinquished their tower lease.

 

[Tampa8]

and then in Gilbert about 10 or 15 miles away there is the Echostsr uplink facility.

On North Dish Drive, I have seen it on our many trips to Scottsdale/Chandler area..

 

[cpalmer2k]

It really depends on the market & stations. All the rules say is to get carriage a station must provide a strong signal that is receivable at the Dish or DirecTV Local Receive Facilities. DirecTV wants any major market station that they pay retransmission for to be delivered by fiber (but they want the station to pay for it). Ones that operate under "must carry" are usually received over the air. Dish seems to rely more on over the air reception from my experiences, unless a station cannot be received. I remember many occasions where towers have gone down and knocked Dish viewers offline, but DirecTV viewers still had their feed. In this case your PBS station operates under "Must Carry", but if they can't be received OTA they must be footing the bill for a fiber link. That unfortunately is why so many lower tier stations look so bad on satellite. We have two in my market that are small "must carry" stations with multiple subchannels. It looks like garbage on DirecTV because they won't pay the fiber fees, and their signal is so compressed because of the subs

 

[ChadT41]

On North Dish Drive, I have seen it on our many trips to Scottsdale/Chandler area..

I didn't know that was the name of it, but back when i was in high school, my friends mom was the security guard there so we went walking around regularly. My first experience with satellite tech and I was hooked.

 

[ChadT41]

Now I just live right down the road from there. Drive past it almost daily.

 

[Mister B]

Must have relinquished their tower lease.

Actually, KRWG-FM still transmits from the tower out west and I can pick it up easily here in far eastern El Paso County.

Unfortunately, KRWG is probably not that interested in covering more area.

Yes, I am sure the New Mexico legislators are not interested in footing the bill to provide service into Texas. This was one of my deciding factors in getting satellite TV.

 

[sam_gordon]

DirecTV wants any major market station that they pay retransmission for to be delivered by fiber (but they want the station to pay for it).

In my market, Direct gets one channel via fiber. The rest are all picked up OTA. Dish gets all of them OTA. Dish & Direct receive sites are at two different locations in town.

I like the suggestion of the PP who said call your local station. However, ask directly for the engineering department.

 

[Hall]

Some stations won't admit how it's done as if it's some sort of "security" thing. I had actually spoke to the head engineer at the local Time Warner once and he told me that they get the local channels by fiber, antenna, and one other method that I don't recall (microwave maybe ?). I asked which use what method and he said he "shouldn't say".

 

[sam_gordon]

Some stations won't admit how it's done as if it's some sort of "security" thing. I had actually spoke to the head engineer at the local Time Warner once and he told me that they get the local channels by fiber, antenna, and one other method that I don't recall (microwave maybe ?). I asked which use what method and he said he "shouldn't say".

Right. That's why you call the affiliate itself, not the MVPD. Our TW has fiber connectivity to all stations (but they have fiber throughout the county), with OTA as a backup.

The station engineers should know if they have fiber gear to feed an MVPD.

Also, a fiber feed (with possibly rare exception) is going to have the same bandwidth as an OTA signal. The feed going to the fiber link is going to be the same feed going to the OTA transmitter (and limited to ~19mbs).

 

[DishSubLA]

FWIW, a few years ago, when we had one of our many fires, one was raging on and threatening to overtake Mt. Wilson, where 95% of TV and radio transmitters are located, just about all the locals (at least the 7 channels including the big 4 I was watching for live coverage) had stated on the air during live coverage of the fire that if the fire reached the peak of Mt. Wilson and damaged or destroyed their transmitters, viewers would continue to view their station if they were subscribed to a cable or satellite service.

Clearly, Dish and DirecTV and all the MSO's in Los Angeles must be getting the locals signals via fiber. I don't know (I should ask around), but I would guess that the all MSO's and both DBS services quite likely have equipment at AT&T Switching Center (Madison Complex Tandem Office) in downtown Los Angeles where fiber from every TV station broadcast center (including big 4 network operations), countless production studios, movie studio lots (they produce TV, as well) and venue (Staples, Nokia now Microsoft, Dolby theater, Rose Bowl, Coliseum, and you name it), converge, along with phone and internet hubs. That would be the most efficient way to capture it all and would explain how seemingly EVERY local station would remain "on the air" to cable and sat subscribers even if their OTA transmitters were destroyed. I would imagine fiber from Madison Complex all the way up to Washington State, were I remember some time ago was where LA locals were up-linked on the spot beam. That is a only a guess. That's one advantage of having a subscription to an MVPD .