KU band reception without a dish

Discussion in 'Free To Air (FTA) Discussion' started by N6BY, Dec 27, 2017.

  1. N6BY

    N6BY Topic Starter Geek
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    The KU band LNBF shown below is pointed at 89W and is successfully receiving a very narrow band 30 kbps signal. Outernet is switching from L-Band back to KU band (where they first began a few years ago). The full story is here: Outernet 3.0: 30kbps now, 100kbps eventually - even smaller antenna

    I am wondering what DVB-S2 hardware is on this board, and if it can be repurposed to satellite TV and radio (with a dish). If so, it could be a very flexible, programmable receiving platform.

    Any thoughts?

    [​IMG]
     
  2. Titanium

    Titanium AI6US
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    Have been in touch with Syed regarding the recent testing and LNB stability requirements. The reception of the Outernet data from a FSS low power bird without a reflector is primarily due to the low data rate of the stream. The higher data rates of audio and video services would require a much better SNR using reflectors or an optimized feed.

    No discussion on the additional capabilities of the new version PCB, but it is DVB protocol and handling demux for the transport streams. I suspect that it will mirror the SDR products with low bandwidth processing and would not be capable of processing the wider bandwidth required for a TV / Radio mux.
     
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  3. Magic Static

    Magic Static FTA Geek
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    I've seen a long narrow funnel as a direct feed pulling down a Ku video signal. They had the funnel propped up in a chair. About the size and shape of an old manual megaphone. Other craziness was using a lid from a can of chew as a reflector.
     
  4. harshness

    harshness SatelliteGuys Master

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    Under ideal conditions, many things are possible that aren't so in less than ideal conditions.
     
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  5. Trust

    Trust SatelliteGuys Family

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    Tried it looooong time ago (analog time) with only the feedhorn of a FIBO gregorian dish pointed at ASTRA 19.2º E
    Got me picture with a lot of (colored) sparks .

    analog-no-dish.jpg Dasding TV.jpg
     
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  6. Cham

    Cham VE4GLS
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    Got an update from Syed today (Outernet). Looks like they are using a TP on G28 Ku, and what looks like a GeosatPro LNBF connected directly to a receiver board, not using a reflector. Likely a narrow band (low symbol rate and bitrate) transponder with DVBS, 1/2 FEC or similar. Will have to find that TP now... :)
     
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  7. Brct203

    Brct203 SatelliteGuys Pro

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    Very cool!

    I wonder what it would have been like with the early European DBS satellites such as TDF1/2 and TV-SAT2. Those things could almost cook a steak if you put it in front of the dish!
     
  8. KE4EST

    KE4EST SatelliteGuys Is My Second Home
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    That is one of the Mavericks I sale, but a GEOSATpro would work though. :)
     
    #8 KE4EST, Jan 2, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 2, 2018
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  9. N6BY

    N6BY Topic Starter Geek
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    Yesterday from Syed on the Outernet discussion board: "No, the old Lighthouse receivers won't work, as we are not using DVB-S."

    Anyone have any guesses on what modulation type they will be using?
     
  10. Titanium

    Titanium AI6US
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    Chatted with Syed last Friday and gave him a heads-up to this and other site's discussions on the Outernet transition announcements. I am sure that he will make the hardware specifics public as the board build is complete and nears release. While I had my doubts about feasibility of the previous L-band distribution plan, I am encouraged with the new direction that the project has taken. A much more sustainable model with FSS KU distribution and simplified but feature enhanced hardware. The next gen hardware is way outside the box and I am impressed!

    Am hard pressed to understand (and somewhat amused) how the company's past development and technology stumbles (or path zig zags... LOL) are perceived by some satellite hobbyists as a money grab on equipment sales. While the project did jump between a few platforms, the uplink costs and R&D investments certainly were not even close to being covered by the few hobbyists purchasing a few low priced components directly from Outernet over the past two years. :coco

    Excited to see the roll-out of the next phase over the next few months and hope to see a viable data distribution platform to fulfill their vision. :)
     
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  11. N6BY

    N6BY Topic Starter Geek
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    I understand that virtually all technology becomes obsolete eventually, but it frustrates customers when something they recently bought becomes useless for its original purpose. Usually there are longer transition periods, giving customers time to at least get some use out of what they bought.

    After buying two generations of equipment over a relatively short period of time, how much useful life could you expect out of the 3rd iteration?
     
  12. Titanium

    Titanium AI6US
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    Definitely not defending the haphazard start-up. Frustrating? Yep... one of the reasons I've rarely been an early adopter for new technology. With that said, I'm still waiting on delivery of my crowdfunded Outernet receiver... Hope my early funding results in a hardware delivery in 2018...

    You bought a first gen? That was just free operating os, DVBS tuner and a RSPi... most of us used stuff we already had as it wasn't proprietary. Wasn't interested in "L" band gear, but wasn't it inexpensive? No subscription cost...
     
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  13. N6BY

    N6BY Topic Starter Geek
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    I really do hope they get it right with this 3rd attempt and finally deliver receivers to the backers.

    And I thank Outernet for being the first to make me aware of L-Band, which I have enjoyed doing a lot of interesting projects with.

    But I admit that I was disappointed when I found out that the new Outernet circuit board is not DVB-S or S2 compatible. An open platform for DVB-S2 development would have kept me busy for many months. :hungry
     
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  14. N6BY

    N6BY Topic Starter Geek
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    No, I didn't buy any of the receiver boards. I just bought their L-Band patch antenna, LNA/Filter, and SDR dongle. The patch antenna was pretty cool, but the SDR isn't that great. If anyone wants it, I will mail it to them for free (US only).
     
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  15. Garyd

    Garyd Retired C-Band dealer
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    I have even done that with a feed aimed at aluminum siding of a house
     
  16. N6BY

    N6BY Topic Starter Geek
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    An update yesterday from Syed:
    "New test signal is up. This will be signed for this week. It is pretty close to G28. Blog post to come tomorrow or Friday."

    I would think that he would need a frequency not in use on any satellite within several degrees -- either at the very high or low end of the KU band. Anyone seeing his narrow band signal yet? (Its not DVB, so it would be visible only on a tuner card spectrum graph.)
     
  17. Alexander Olar

    Alexander Olar SatelliteGuys Pro

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    When did you try it? What year
     
  18. Titanium

    Titanium AI6US
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    From my understanding, the test signal is near the noise threshold and ultimately be embedded within other data streams. Not sure we would be able to detect the signal without knowing the approx parameters.
     
  19. N6BY

    N6BY Topic Starter Geek
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    I checked the Outernet forum just now and Syed still has not yet announced which frequency or satellite the test signal is on. So all we know is its near 89W and its KU. I'll do some scans and look for a narrowband signal.

    Syed also said the signal in not in the usual DVB format. If all the existing data streams are DVB, then how could Outernet be integrated within an existing mux? He must have come up with a very creative solution.
     
  20. wallyhts

    wallyhts SatelliteGuys Pro
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    But why pay double the price.
     

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