Ku SD-Only stations (Ku Orphans)

[Tom Speer]

This report is a regular output of our weekly data collection. It doesn't change significantly from week to week, so I post updates now and then. It is a tabulation of all Stations on DirecTV that are mpeg2/SD, without a corresponding HD version elsewhere.

Updated 4/26/2023

 

[modefan63]

This report is a regular output of our weekly data collection. It doesn't change significantly from week to week, so I post updates now and then. It is a tabulation of all Stations on DirecTV that are mpeg2/SD, without a corresponding HD version elsewhere.

Updated 4/26/2023

hi how much longer is Directv going to carry the sd i have had a sd dish since 1998

 

[Tom Speer]

hi how much longer is Directv going to carry the sd i have had a sd dish since 1998

If you still get SD versions of your local stations you are lucky, and on borrowed time. DirecTV has set a goal to eliminate all SD duplicates of HD stations. The thing that is holding them back is commercial customers with SD only equipment and MDUs (Multiple Dwelling Units - apartment buildings, etc.) with SD distribution systems. Mobile customers, including truckers are also a problem. I expect most SD duplicates of local stations to go away by the end of 2023, but that is only my prediction). If you call DirecTV, I believe they will gladly replace your dish and receivers with HD capable units at no charge. But Los Angeles may be one of the last markets to support SD.

 

[lordodogg]

DirecTV has set a goal to eliminate all SD duplicates of HD stations

Including the ones on 119W/T8? Cause you've said before no human incentive because it has a lot of life left.

 

[Tom Speer]

The SD spot beams on 101 would have priority for shutdown, because there is an economic advantage to reuse those frequencies for national mpeg4 transmissions. But I wouldn't count on any SD locals on 119 long term. If they are still available a year from now, I would be surprised.

 

[lordodogg]

They would probably have to wait until disputes are over for the shutdowns. Like the STILL ongoing Mission dispute is ONLY affecting SD locals tha are on 119:
the ones with SD on 119 being affected are:
KASY Albuquerque (MNT)
KWBQ Albuquerque (CW)
WYOU Scranton (CBS, this is one of my stations)
KASN Little Rock (CW)
KLRT Little Rock (Fox)
KMSS Shreveport (Fox)

 

[Tom Speer]

They would probably have to wait until disputes are over for the shutdowns. Like the STILL ongoing Mission dispute is ONLY affecting SD locals tha are on 119:

Why? The dispute affects both the mpeg2 and mpeg4 versions of those channels. They are not currently being carried on 119. If they shutdown the 119 feeds for the SD version of your locals, it wouldn't make any difference. If they still haven't resolved the dispute until after 119 is shutdown, and they resolve the dispute, the stations will be carried on the same Ka band spot beam transponder as all of the rest of your HD locals.

 

[Tom Speer]

BTW, that dispute affects my local Fox station in the Albany, NY DMA. They shutdown our spotbeam feeds from 119 a long time ago. I only know that from our data collections. The loss of SD duplicates was a non-event.

 

[lordodogg]

Why? The dispute affects both the mpeg2 and mpeg4 versions of those channels. They are not currently being carried on 119.

I know that. I just think they should be consistent and wait until all locals have been restored to shut them all down. If the dispute started -> shutdown happened -> dispute still ongoing, then that is practically an early shutdown.

If they still haven't resolved the dispute until after 119 is shutdown, and they resolve the dispute, the stations will be carried on the same Ka band spot beam transponder as all of the rest of your HD locals.

I know that too. I remember when they still used the same spotbeam transponder to put up the dispute messages. Examples are the Nexstar and Tegna disputes in respectively 2019 and 2020.

BTW, that dispute affects my local Fox station in the Albany, NY DMA. They shutdown our spotbeam feeds from 119 a long time ago. I only know that from our data collections. The loss of SD duplicates was a non-event.

The only NY DMA I've been to since I subscribed to DirecTV is Binghamton, and they are as far as I know a born-as-MPEG4 DMA.

 

[Tom Speer]

Let me clarify, I said thaey shut down my SD locals "a long time ago". It actually was about 2 1/2 years ago, when they were preparing to dispose of the T7S satellite and its spotbeams. They could have shut them down long before that as far as I was concerned, once they had all of our channels on Ka band spot beams.

 

[lordodogg]

Per old TPN maps, it was October 27, 2020 that they shut your locals down.
The 119 SD locals for:
Des Moines, IA
Duluth, MN
Fargo, ND
Jackson, MS
Reno, NV
Savannah, GA
Tucson, AZ
Tyler, TX
were also all shut down on that date.

 

[Tom Speer]

This properly should be called the mpeg2 orphans report. It's been a while, but very little has changed. Here is the latest Ku orphans report from 7/19/23. This only includes mpeg2 SD stations, not the Mpeg4 HD channels currently on TPN 24. It excludes any channel that has an Mpeg4 duplicate (HD or SD) available.

 

[lordodogg]

I have been to the Norfolk DMA, which is on that report with 4 Virtual channels from Raleigh listed as orphans. I initially guessed customers on the NC side of the DMA got those channels and the other Raleigh virtuals in HD (WRAL, WTVD, WNCN, WRAZ, WLFL). However they are not listed when I select the Norfolk DMA on the Neighboring Locals site. I have never been anywhere in the NC side of the Norfolk DMA though (just the VA side) but I have been to the Raleigh DMA (specifically Wilson County, which has WITN and WNCT listed as sig. viewed locals in that county on the sig. viewed FCC document, they are even carried on Spectrum in addition to Raleigh's locals, but not DirecTV, even though Raleigh and one of New Bern's locals, WEPX 38, share a beam)

 

[Tom Speer]

I have been to the Norfolk DMA, which is on that report with 4 Virtual channels from Raleigh listed as orphans. I initially guessed customers on the NC side of the DMA got those channels and the other Raleigh virtuals in HD (WRAL, WTVD, WNCN, WRAZ, WLFL). However they are not listed when I select the Norfolk DMA on the Neighboring Locals site. I have never been anywhere in the NC side of the Norfolk DMA though (just the VA side) but I have been to the Raleigh DMA (specifically Wilson County, which has WITN and WNCT listed as sig. viewed locals in that county on the sig. viewed FCC document, they are even carried on Spectrum in addition to Raleigh's locals, but not DirecTV, even though Raleigh and one of New Bern's locals, WEPX 38, share a beam.

This analysis comes directly from the data that Gary uses to create the TPN maps. I haven't researched it, and I won't, but I suspect from the Neilson DMA maps that some customers in Hertford County, NC, or Southhampton County, VA may be the ones that get Raleigh locals, and may lose them when SD duplicates are eliminated. The beams are irrelevant. They only show what could be received, not what is allowed. I technically could receive Syracuse, Burlington and Hartford stations from the DIRECTV satellites, but I can't by policy

 

[lordodogg]

I thought Northampton Co. as well, based on this presentation of the Norfolk DMA counties, which has the county in white and not red like all the other ones including Southampton Co.
The only portion of the Norfolk DMA I've been to is Williamsburg, which is between James City and York counties, the Richmond locals WRIC, WTVR, and WWBT are considered significantly viewed stations in that area, but Cox in the area only carried WWBT and replaced the channel space with Evine/ShopHQ sometime ago.

Just noticed you edited your post to mention Hertford County. I thought that as well as it borders a Raleigh DMA county (Northampton) to the west, and it's the same one in white on the map attached.

 

[lordodogg]

I haven't researched it, and I won't, but I suspect from the Neilson DMA maps that some customers in Hertford County, NC, or Southhampton County, VA may be the ones that get Raleigh locals, and may lose them when SD duplicates are eliminated.

The Neighboring locals page has a “Norfolk-Newport News VA - HD Only Locals” option to select as the market you’re in. That definitely sounds like the market DirecTV considered anyone who was in the Norfolk DMA, yet not within the 119 spot beam for the Norfolk locals, to be in.
Looking at that spot beam on Google Earth with also a U.S. County outline kmz file, I noticed that most of the VA side of the Norfolk DMA (aside from the southern portions of Southampton and Isle of Wight counties, as well as Suffolk, Chesapeake, and VA Beach) isn’t within the 62.5 dBW white beam. However, most of these areas don’t even border NC, and even then they are now delivering 119 SD locals via a nationwide beam. I am definitely guessing Hertford County, NC (since Southampton County, VA only partially borders the Raleigh DMA and the little reporters Raleigh’s stations have for VA, if they have any at all, would likely cover the “orphaned” Mecklenburg County) gets Raleigh’s locals, since it borders the Raleigh DMA to the west, while the other NC Norfolk DMA counties border the Greenville/Washington/New Bern DMA.

 

[lordodogg]

Okay, here’s another update. I entered ZIP Codes for the county seat (Jackson, 27845) and largest town (Gaston, 27832) in Northampton County, NC on TVPromise, and got statements about the removal of WAVY and WVBT (Norfolk stations) instead of WNCN (Raleigh station). It looks like DirecTV considers the county to be in the Norfolk DMA. I haven’t found a 2022-23 DMA map, but the 2018-19 DMA Map shows Northampton Co. as being in the Raleigh DMA. It seems like they get both Norfolk and Raleigh because of the county constantly changing between the Norfolk and Raleigh DMAs every season. I know of a similar situation in PA where customers in Franklin County (which per maps has also constantly changed between the Harrisburg and DC DMAs) got both Harrisburg and DC locals until the DC locals were dropped in April 2022.