Poor OTA reception on ViP receiver

dishdude

dishdude

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I have a 612 with a Channel Master Stealthtenna 50 that is mounted on the roof connected to it. No diplexer or splitters and the run is approx 75 feet of RG-6. I'm about 11 miles from the towers and they're all mounted at the same location. I'm getting low 70s and some dropouts in signal, yet when I connect the antenna directly to the TV I have no problems with dropouts.

I've concluded the tuner in the ViP receivers is weak, what can I do to fix this? A bigger antenna? Preamp?
 
primestar31

primestar31

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I have a 612 with a Channel Master Stealthtenna 50 that is mounted on the roof connected to it. No diplexer or splitters and the run is approx 75 feet of RG-6. I'm about 11 miles from the towers and they're all mounted at the same location. I'm getting low 70s and some dropouts in signal, yet when I connect the antenna directly to the TV I have no problems with dropouts.

I've concluded the tuner in the ViP receivers is weak, what can I do to fix this? A bigger antenna? Preamp?

There is NO fix for that, those tuners just aren't that good.
 
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boba

boba

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There is NO fix for that, those tuners just aren't that good.
The best and possibly cheapest cure will be to improve the antenna. I upgraded from a VIP 612 to a Wally with dual tuner dongle. The reception on the dongle was no better and maybe not as good as the 612.. I've got 5 Tivos all have better tuners than the DISH receivers that I have used. The best I could suggest is use the TV tuner for live watching of OTA or switch to a different DVR. The Wally with dual tuner dongle is the same as a Hopper 3 and DISH just hasn't improved their reception.
 
MikeD-C05

MikeD-C05

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There is NO fix for that, those tuners just aren't that good.
My old Vip 722k at my parents house couldn't pick up the channel 6 CBS station that I could at my house 5 miles down the road. It would come in at 74 and drop out. All the ota channels would fluctuate in signal strength. I changed out the Vip receiver for a Wally and the newer ota dongle that gives you two ota channels at the same time, and guess what? They can now pick up channel 6 and doesn't lose the signal. The signals come in at 100 percent and channel 6 will go from 100 green , down to 82 yellow and it doesn't drop out anymore and I am using the same antenna as before. So I agree the older vip ota modules are not as good as the newer ota dongles.
 
navychop

navychop

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I get “bouncy” signal levels thru my CM DVR+ and Sammy TV. Nature of the beast in some areas.
 
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Tampa8

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The tuners on my VIP's are weaker than on my TIVO or the TV itself. However all three VIP's do pick up even the weaker channels but if the signal drops I will lose the picture on the VIP first. One suggestion make sure the copper center wire sticks out enough. The coax connector on devices are not all the same and sometimes what is long enough for one device isn't for another.

(That's what she said)
 
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dare2be

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I get “bouncy” signal levels thru my CM DVR+ and Sammy TV. Nature of the beast in some areas.
Yep, mutlipath. Your location is getting bounced signals off a mountain or building that creates an out-of-phase "echo".
 
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mwdxer1

mwdxer1

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The tuner in my 211k is pretty decent. Only one other tuner I have is better. I guess I ended up with a good one. I live 12 miles from 5 translators running from 6200 down to 536 watts. Using a 91XG yagi at 14 feet, I get 100% on all of the 5 translators. KOIN 6 CBS (34) is the one that runs only 536 watts, and if there is any signal loss, it will be the first one to drop as it barely hits 100%. The others KPTV/KPDX (21) 1800 watts, KATU (26) 5,000 watts, KGW (17) 5,000 watts and KOPB (23) 6200 watts ERP all pretty much peg the meter. I also use a Channel Master 7777 amp on the mast, which is over kill, but I do not get any overload. One other TV meter I have runs up to 100%, but is not as sensitive and on that one only KATU (26) pegs the meter. The others are 75-95%.
 
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TheKrell

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I'm about 11 miles from the towers and they're all mounted at the same location. I'm getting low 70s and some dropouts in signal, yet when I connect the antenna directly to the TV I have no problems with dropouts.

Remember that the so-called signal strength is no such thing; it's more like an inverse error rate. The error rate can go up (and your VIP receiver number will go down) with either too little, or too much signal. 11 miles away is rather close. Is it possible you have an amp already in there? The amp or the tuner might be overloading.
 
dishdude

dishdude

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Not what I was hoping to hear...

I am sure there are no amps in the line. I relocated the antenna from the attic to the roof and it didn't even make an impact, most channels are still hovering in the low 70's.
 
C

Cypresstree

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Not what I was hoping to hear...

I am sure there are no amps in the line. I relocated the antenna from the attic to the roof and it didn't even make an impact, most channels are still hovering in the low 70's.

I’d go the preamp route. Relatively easy implementation.

I am 34 miles away from the Stafford texas farm and implement a preamp as well as 25 d gain distribution amp.

For me - on KTRK 13 is the pain in the a$$

I use an antennasdirect older Clearstream 4 with a VHF kit.


Sent from my iPhone using SatelliteGuys mobile app
 
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kc1ih

kc1ih

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You may want to try using an LTE filter, particularly if you are near a major road where lots of people are using there cell phones or if there is a nearby cell tower in the same direction as your stations. These can be found online an eBay or Amazon.
 
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D

DishSubLA

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FWIW, both TiVo Seires 3 (which has superior OTA reception compared to all subsequent generations of TiVo) and Dish's built in (although perhaps NOT 612; that was a buggy odd bird of a box), or modules had the same VERY GOOD performance. I have both Dish and TiVo connected to the same OTA antenna. No question that all my TV's perform BETTER than any of the TiVo's or Dish products, but that is generally the rule, probably because TV makers/brands see the OTA tuner performance being more critical and among core functions, even if majority of TV owners never use the OTA tuner built in the HDTV.

I believe TiVo and Dish (Echostar) used the same manufacturer for their OTA tuners.

TiVo Premieres (S4) OTA tuners became legendary for its VERY poor performance, certainly when compared to the previous version S3 TiVo's. Subsequent Roamio (S5) TiVo's OTA tuners IMPROVED from the horrid S4, but still NOT AS GOOD as the old S3 TiVo's. I do not own any TiVo Bolts (S6), but from what I gather on the TCF (TiVo Forum), while the Bolt seems adequate, it is still inferior to the now 12 year old TiVo S3 models.

My TiVo S3's get the most channels with very strong to good signal strength, and over the years and still today, all Dish OTA's performed nearly IDENTICAL to the lauded S3 TiVo tuners. Only the TV's manage to pull in a few Low Power stations that neither TiVo S3 nor Dish can do. However, all TiVo models OTA tuners later than the S3 perform worse to varying degrees, while all the Dish OTA tuners I've used over the years have performed equally as the TiVo S3.

As of today, TiVo S3 OTA and Dish OTA (including single and dual tuner dongles) perform just as great as the TiVo S3 OTA tuners. Overall, the dish OTA tuners are very good--HOWEVER, I believe most of the problems people are having that I've observed have to do with multi-path, and while some OTA tuners can deal with it a little better than other, mulit-path is a well documented MASSIVE flaw of ATSC with alternatives of the day, including DVB-T, being far less susceptible to multi-path. Anything less than very good OTA tuners are not going to perform nearly as well, and only the TV makers/brands are willing to spend the most money for what are probably the BEST OTA tuners out there. Our OTA TV system should be (should have been designed to be) able to allow "very good" and "good" OTA tuners to work "very well" (not quite the level of Excellent for the best OTA tuners), not the situation we have today with ATSC 1.0.
 
dishdude

dishdude

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You may want to try using an LTE filter, particularly if you are near a major road where lots of people are using there cell phones or if there is a nearby cell tower in the same direction as your stations. These can be found online an eBay or Amazon.

Thank you for this post - after some research I think you might be on to something. I am in the city and there are a ton of cell towers nearby. I usually watch recorded shows so I don't get to see the signal meter, but last night I was watching live TV and the signal meter was bouncing around like crazy! 78-81-80-39-error back to 80. It was a clear night and the antenna is mounted securely so there is no explanation for this other than outside interference.

I just ordered the Channel Master LTE filter and will report back.
 
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Bobby

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Thank you for this post - after some research I think you might be on to something. I am in the city and there are a ton of cell towers nearby. I usually watch recorded shows so I don't get to see the signal meter, but last night I was watching live TV and the signal meter was bouncing around like crazy! 78-81-80-39-error back to 80. It was a clear night and the antenna is mounted securely so there is no explanation for this other than outside interference.

I just ordered the Channel Master LTE filter and will report back.
If it isn't LTE interference, it sure looks like multipath interference...
 
MikeD-C05

MikeD-C05

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Thank you for this post - after some research I think you might be on to something. I am in the city and there are a ton of cell towers nearby. I usually watch recorded shows so I don't get to see the signal meter, but last night I was watching live TV and the signal meter was bouncing around like crazy! 78-81-80-39-error back to 80. It was a clear night and the antenna is mounted securely so there is no explanation for this other than outside interference.

I just ordered the Channel Master LTE filter and will report back.
I put one on my Mom and Dad's ota connection and it seemed to help with the bouncing signal on their ota channels. They live right down the road from a cell tower.
 
zippyfrog

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If LTE interference was the problem, would it impact all channels that are received? I live in the western suburbs of Chicago, and I tend to have issues with just our ABC station. All other stations being transmitted from the same tower have no issue. I am wondering if that could be the reason my ABC channel has such low signal and goes out from time to time.
 
dishdude

dishdude

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I added in the LTE filter and a preamp, things are marginally better. I originally had the antenna in the attic and it seemed to perform better there. :what
 
C

cruiser83

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Feb 21, 2008
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I added in the LTE filter and a preamp, things are marginally better. I originally had the antenna in the attic and it seemed to perform better there. :what

I've been chasing my own issues similar to yours. What I found with the antenna is literally the smallest movement can impact signal and signal strength, so it could very well be you were just aimed in a very specific way in the attic and you have not yet found that same sweet spot in the outdoor location. I can have a signal strength in the 90's, tweak the antenna a 1/2" in any given direction and have signal strength drop to 70's or depending on direction of move, lose signal altogether.

Edit to add - This is using a supposed "omni-directional" antenna, yea right....marketing mumbo jumbo.
 

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