So, you want to install Dish

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souredinstaller

New Member
Original poster
Jul 13, 2004
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I answered an ad in our local paper about becoming a dish network installer. This is a little summary of my experience and why I decided not to do this business after a week of training. The company is doing superdish
installs and upgrades almost exclusively. First, I was told how much money I could make. (lots) This was interesting because of course, everyone wants to make lots of money. The General Manager told me I would be
paid $50 a day for training, up to 7 days. I was told to report the next day for a week of training. The next day, I was assigned to work with a two man crew who were splitting the money they made. On the first job, I found
out that these guys were not grounding their dishes. I asked the General Manager about proper grounding and he said ground the Superdish with the messenger wire on the RG6, connect it to the "34" switch, then to the ground
block. Then run a wire from the ground block to a proper grounding location. I know the messenger wire isn't a sufficient ground for a dish. But the boys who were "training" me were just cutting about 6" of the messenger
wire off to get it out of their way so they could hook up to the LNB's. No ground on the dish. They could only get 119 on that install, the leader of the two went back twice and still hadn't resolved it. We worked together a
couple of days, and I noticed that a lot of Superdish upgrades were being hooked up to the existing rg59 cable instead of replacing the cable with rg6. This was because replacing the cable would be time consuming and the guy
training me would not make any extra money for it. The pay sheet says $70.00 for a Superdish upgrade, $100.for a Superdish install, and states "ALL CUSTOM WORK IS PART OF THE INSTALL". You know how difficult
it can be to fish cable. Anyway, every night I did my homework on the Internet about this business and found out a lot. One day we went on a trouble call (pays $25.to the subcontractor/installer if it's not his own mistake) and the customer stated he didn't have his even numbered channels coming off his Superdish. My trainer diagnosed the problem by checking the wire, finding it was rg59, and said "I don't want to replace that ____ing wire". My trainer then hooked up a receiver he had with him, which did the exact same thing of not picking up the even channels. Then he called Dish, told them the customer needed a new Receiver, and we left for the next job. I was beginning to see clearly how money could be made at this business, and it was starting to stink. Most of the time when I asked him a technical question, my trainer would say I don't ____ing know. They really liked him at the shop, because he got a lot done and filled out his paperwork neatly and correctly. The last day was the clincher for me. We went out to install a Superdish, and it was a $500,000. house, with rg59 installed throughout it's
beautifully finished interior. No sign of a way to run new rg6 cable. So my Installer/Trainer hooked the Superdish to the rg59, as usual. One of the wires that was running from the Receiver poked me and shocked me. I figured it must be pretty hot so I stuck my meter on it and measured 48 volts. I informed my trainer of how much voltage there was and he snapped "how am I supposed to know how much voltage there is?" I said "well, you'ld
better know" These wires carry enough voltage to spark plenty. After the Install, the owner was asking the "trainer" how he had gotten it to work, since three other people had told him his wiring was incompatible with
superdish. "Trainer" just shruggs it off. So after work I call the General Manager and ask him if we connect Superdish equipment to rg 59 will it fail Q.C. ? he says "Yes". Then he says "If they catch it" (he does Q.C.) He
said that rg59 would last a while, then go bad. Then he said "well, you could get them to sign a waiver that your'e hooking up to the wrong kind of wire, if they want it done" I said "Where on the paperwork is there a place for a waiver?" he said "There isn't one" I said "Could this be a fire
hazard?" Then he said, "I guess you'ld better not be messing with getting them to sign a waiver, there's too much liability" "You need to discuss these things with your Manager, I've turned it over to him now" I went home that
night and discussed it with my Wife. I came to the conclusion that if I were to start this business, I couldn't make much money doing it the right way, since most of the work in this area is done in homes with existing rg59
that was installed for cable tv, and I would only consider doing it the right way with all new rg6 wire. I just don't want to burn anyone's house down, or even cause them to lose their tv signal due to shoddy work. and since "ALL
CUSTOM WORK IS PART OF THE INSTALL", I would say Dish Network is either going to wise up or replace a lot of receivers, and have a lot of trouble calls.
Too bad, it could have been a fun business.
 
Most generally it costs extra for every wall fish that is done and the installer would inform the customer that the install is more complicated therefore there would be an extra charge for this type of install or there would be a new wire installed that does not involve a wall fish. Dish Network had a retail price of $59.00 per wall fish a good while back. Since you would be forced to do custom work as part of the install without extra pay that would not give you full control of the install in that you would not be given enough choices as to whether you could charge the customer extra or not.

The business more than likely does not want to put much money into each install and figures many people would not want to pay extra for the install (especially if it says installation included).

I do not think the installs should be even attempted if they are going to try to use the RG-59 wire because that is just a waste of time.
 
The only way to solve the RG-59 problem is to have the sat boxes centrally located somewhere where they can use RG-6 and have them RF modulated and use the RG-59 as a private cable system.
 
A REAL eye opener, I have had a few jobs like that and left for the same reasons, people like this are crooks and nothing else! I don't suppose you will tell us the name of this outfit? Its shocking that these people are out "installing" low voltage systems in customers homes, its just not good enough..........the only good thing to come out of this story is your honesty and sharing your experience's for us all to better understand what a good install should be, and what a dangerous and blatant disregard for peoples property and safety this company is showing............if I were you I would log each and every job that was not done to code and stick them in, there are MANY great install companies out there but alas most that I have come across are playing the same numbers game! Well done on this expose. And feel good that you are a better person that these scumbag, CROOKS!
 
He should probably notify Dish Corporate, and let them know about this contractor/subcontractor, and the shoddy work they do.

Also, I wonder how much Dish pays them for these jobs that they pay $75/$100 to share between two people?
 
Pitiful.. downright pitiful.

I agree with Gary.. report the hell out of these people.

There's money to be made in this buisness if you're honest and thourough. People who short each job like that usually last a few months and then the service calls pile up on them before they quit.
 
Anytime I see RG-59 wire I replace it with RG-6 when possible. On a rare occassion I may use RG-59 if it is preinstalled in the home and the customer refuses to have me replace the wire (and there are no other point of entries for the wire into the home) if there are no switches being used and if it is a legacy lnbf.
 
There seems to be a lot of good and a lot of real bad installers.
Dish should do like the phone company's and go with union employees, weed out the bad, pay the good a decent salary. They should charge for all installs but offer free self installs with telephone help. This would guaranty a good job and more happier costumers. Dish would probably save a bit of money in the long run because of less call backs.
Just my 2 cents
Lenny
 
www.acinstalls.com
Own your own business. A storefront is not needed. Free Equipment, No Chargebacks, Free shipping!!! We currently have over 80 sales agents, both dealers and installers, selling nationwide and growing daily.
 
blovkisle9 said:
There seems to be a lot of good and a lot of real bad installers.
Dish should do like the phone company's and go with union employees, weed out the bad, pay the good a decent salary. They should charge for all installs but offer free self installs with telephone help. This would guaranty a good job and more happier costumers. Dish would probably save a bit of money in the long run because of less call backs.
Just my 2 cents
Lenny

if Dish keeps bending their installers and installation companies over like they are, they will soon be facing a union employee situation. Dish doesn't lose money on call backs, they screw over the retailer/install company with the cost of the callback.

Cable companies are dealing with unions... because they tried the same tactics... DBS should learn from cable's past mistakes.
 
Re: blovkisle9
CT requires a V-7 for contractors doing cable or satellite installation work of any kind not to mention ham radio, off-air, or other antennas. They DO NOT make it easy to get and getting them to allow you to sit for the test requires X years of work and Y number of former employers vouching for your Z amount of experience. It is almost entirely unenforced. Similar to that "de minimus" thing mentioned in another similar thread.

A V-7 only covers employees IF they are employees. If they receive a 1099 and are treated as contractors, then they need their own V-7.

Telephone wire running requires a T-1 or a T-2 while under a T-1 holding principal. A T-1 DOES NOT cover an UNLICENSED employee and contractors are not covered at all. They require a T-1. This one is far more often enforced given the heavy regulation of telephony and the union nature of the very turf-protective phone company.

So it is of course PURE IDIOCY for ANY DBS company to allow their guys to install phone wire during an SBC Dish install. They're asking to have their contract yanked.

Re:souredinstaller
Welcome to reality. Men are dragged in, dazzled with ideas of making huge amounts of money, and then either turned away by way of their ethics getting in the way or turned into lying cheating scumbags who in the end fairly guarantee that company losing all work.

Right now, there's a large number of installers from Eastern Europe coming in who are the latest crop of immigrants to be chicken-hawked by these shysters into the DBS Hackerdom and any kid who can't function competently at McDonald's is a huge target for them.

Remember people, grounding, proper cabling, etc., are not optional. They are mandatory. Immediately report to Dish Network or DirecTV any installation house which encourages or orders you to violate grounding regulations, safety laws, etc.

BTW, were you aware that fall protection iequipment is REQUIRED on rooftops? How many outfits bother telling you this?
 
Ive worked in peoples homes and the costumer asked to see my E-1 Card, I have also been on jobs were the inspector actually tossed people off the job for to many apprentices vs number of journeymen E-2.
I really think its a good idea to be sure people doing the work have the proper licence.
Its also the law
 

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