Uplink Activity Report - 8/27/2008 12:42pm - 86 changes

[scots]

Actually Winston-Salem. NC

Why would they rename WUNC to WUNL? WUNC hasn't gone away or changed its name. I don't guess it really matters though. All the PBS stations in the state (with the exception of one in Charlotte) are run by the University of North Carolina and all show the same stuff.

 

[Jim S.]

Bozo -

Less FEC on a transopnder means more bandwidth on the transponder.

You are talking as if " 1 transponder " is always the same bandwidth.

Whoa there. Is the increase in bandwidth enough to accomodate another channel at a decent bitrate? Especially if some people don't think that the existing channels have a high enough bitrate?

 

[digiblur]

Didn't there used to be " Lists " sorted by transponder and so forth that were linked on this site ?

I think that the links vanished - I only see the FTA List...

PS This is the one that is different and separate from Tony's Channel Chart.

Click on The List! tab at the top of your screen and choose the subscription section. It is automatically updated by the uplink tool when things change. You can sort the list by TP, etc.

 

[mike123abc]

Right now Dish is running HD at FEC 2/3 or 2 parts data 1 part error correction. So, they lose 1/3 their bandwidth of a TP to error correction on HD.

If they were able to reduce the FEC to 3/4 they would gain about 5 megabits. If they go to 5/6 they would gain 9 megabits. The high power of E11 at 110 might be able to get them to 5/6 with the same raid fade characteristics of 2/3 on E8.

 

[kstuart]

Click on The List! tab at the top of your screen and choose the subscription section. It is automatically updated by the uplink tool when things change. You can sort the list by TP, etc.

That's just it - I don't have such a tab at all.

But the link in your signature works.

 

[kstuart]

jesus they are testing 8 MPEG 4 HD channels on 1 transponder???? F*** NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

There are 45 MPEG4 SD channels on that transponder, and 8 of those were changed to HD.

... I get increasingly dismayed by the number of people who can't add and nevertheless think they are qualified to be digital video engineers, and to decide that a particular statistical multiplexing setup is "wrong".

 

[Mr Tony]

Tech Question for the uplink guru's:

Is 5/6 FEC better or worse than 7/8 FEC?

(I.E. what does it mean for the bandwidth on the TP?)?

(pointer to a reference source is fine....)

Thanks!

I dont think it means much difference in DBS but in KU or C-Band the higher the number the more signal you need due to correcting errors

7/8 is a bugger to tune KU or C-Band. I've had 75 quality and still have pixeling
3/4 is most common and has room for error
5/6 the DBS slots use and seems to be good
1/2 is pretty good. Can have almost no signal and still have a clean picture

 

[kstuart]

Just to clarify...

I think every subscriber has a clear right to look at the actual picture on their TV and decide that the picture quality is not good enough. And they have every right to call Dish Network and complain about it.

But, I don't think people have a right to complain about numbers describing the bitstream.

A 1920x1080 digital video can look worse than providing the same content in 1440x1080.

Six HD channels on a transponder can look worse than seven HD channels that are on a different transponder.

It all depends on a number of other quite complicated factors.

So, feel free to judge the picture quality on your TV, but don't judge and criticize the numbers.

Give the guys who are spending 60 hours a week doing the engineering the benefit of the doubt that they might actually know something about digital satellite video.

 

[andyb2]

I know and have worked with many an engineer's and they go by what thier book told them and not by what maybe right.In thier opinion the book is right and the workers that deal with it are just not doing it right.

Had the same scenario doing dewatering.Engineer sends out pumps to pump water out of a pit.The pumps as he allready knows and has been told only draw to a max of 25 feet.This pit is 50' below.According to him I'm,as the installer dumb again for not following orders. (hello).I quit and went to work where the engineer's are not any better but I don't need to drive parts back and forth a 100 miles twice a day.

 

[primetimeguy]

An engineer often time knows what is best, but it is the business people higher up saying what they think is best from a business point of view and making decisions.

Engineering is the balance between quality, time and money. So the best performing or highest quality product often times does not win out.

 

[photoman76]

There are 45 MPEG4 SD channels on that transponder, and 8 of those were changed to HD.

There are no MPEG4 SD channels on that transponder at this time. There are eight MPEG4 HD channels, all 1440 X 1080i, running from 3 to 6 Mbps. FEC is 2/3.

 

[vegassatellite]

I know and have worked with many an engineer's and they go by what thier book told them and not by what maybe right.In thier opinion the book is right and the workers that deal with it are just not doing it right.

Had the same scenario doing dewatering.Engineer sends out pumps to pump water out of a pit.The pumps as he allready knows and has been told only draw to a max of 25 feet.This pit is 50' below.According to him I'm,as the installer dumb again for not following orders. (hello).I quit and went to work where the engineer's are not any better but I don't need to drive parts back and forth a 100 miles twice a day.

So use a pump at the bottom to get the water to a cistern halfway up. Use a second pump to pull water from that cistern to the surface.

 

[Fitzie]

So use a pump at the bottom to get the water to a cistern halfway up. Use a second pump to pull water from that cistern to the surface.

That would work if you could build the cistern on the side of a pit. Or you might get a more powerful pump...

 

[HDRoberts]

I know and have worked with many an engineer's and they go by what thier book told them and not by what maybe right.In thier opinion the book is right and the workers that deal with it are just not doing it right.

Had the same scenario doing dewatering.Engineer sends out pumps to pump water out of a pit.The pumps as he allready knows and has been told only draw to a max of 25 feet.This pit is 50' below.According to him I'm,as the installer dumb again for not following orders. (hello).I quit and went to work where the engineer's are not any better but I don't need to drive parts back and forth a 100 miles twice a day.

As an engineer (civil), let me say engineers can be idiots , but so can anyone. I doubt there is a book telling them to use a pump with maximum dynamic head of 25' to bring up water 50' below. If that was the case, he was being an idiot, but being an engineer did not contribute to that. In reality, the equation is much more complicated. Perhaps the pump runs most efficenly at 25', but can do at 50'. That's why they publish pump curves.

Our crazy book learnin' is why we have roads, bridges, skyscrapers, public water systems, and basic sanitation, just to name a few things.

But to get on topic, Dish engineers know better than almost of of us when it comes to DBS broacasting. Also, they have a lot more to balance than we do. Most people who complain about PQ can only offer the solution to bump up the bitrate. That doesn't work when there are other channels to consider. Others worse yet think only the channels they want atr worth any bandwidth, ad just want Dish to offer "their" channels at peak PQ, well sacraficing everyone else's choices.

 

[mike123abc]

I dont think it means much difference in DBS but in KU or C-Band the higher the number the more signal you need due to correcting errors

7/8 is a bugger to tune KU or C-Band. I've had 75 quality and still have pixeling
3/4 is most common and has room for error
5/6 the DBS slots use and seems to be good
1/2 is pretty good. Can have almost no signal and still have a clean picture

Of course most of the Ku non DBS band is low power. DBS runs 2-3x the power. DIRECTV tends to be more agressive than Dish and runs 6/7. If the full power of E11 is let lose I bet Dish could do 3/4 8PSK turbo encoded (does the chipset do 5/6 in 8PSK?) and not cause issues, and QPSK at 7/8 without issues.

 

[pwcheatham]

spike hd fx hd

when will dish get them

 

[Voyager6]

when will dish get them

There are many threads regarding these channels but here is one of the latest. http://www.satelliteguys.us/dish-network-forum/143839-fox-news-hd-where-you.html

 

[kstuart]

when will dish get them

When people stop asking for channels in the Uplink Report threads...

 

[Smith P.]

Of course most of the Ku non DBS band is low power. DBS runs 2-3x the power. DIRECTV tends to be more agressive than Dish and runs 6/7. If the full power of E11 is let lose I bet Dish could do 3/4 8PSK turbo encoded (does the chipset do 5/6 in 8PSK?) and not cause issues, and QPSK at 7/8 without issues.

There is a working limit for BCM4500 ( because of internal bug, blame Broadcom ) - 30 Mbps.

 

[digiblur]

There is a working limit for BCM4500 ( because of internal bug, blame Broadcom ) - 30 Mbps.

You're thinking of the 30000 SR limit.

Of course most of the Ku non DBS band is low power. DBS runs 2-3x the power. DIRECTV tends to be more agressive than Dish and runs 6/7. If the full power of E11 is let lose I bet Dish could do 3/4 8PSK turbo encoded (does the chipset do 5/6 in 8PSK?) and not cause issues, and QPSK at 7/8 without issues.

The chipset states it can do 8PSK in 2/3, 3/4, 5/6, and 8/9 FEC rates. And don't forget about 16QAM