Why do techs always use Perfect Vision and PPC EXXL?

[miguelaqui]

First of all…I want to say that I was never a tech for Dish Network, but I did work in cable.

I have seen several techs use perfect Vision rg6 and PPC EXXL connectors. First of all, Perfect Vision is made in China. The jacket is harder than Commscope’s and Times Fiber’s cable; I used a lot of both of those brands in cable. The techs also will put the non-flooded cable in the ground; something I would never do in cable.

The PPC EXXL connecters seem to be more difficult to install than many other connectors because the metal on the inside is longer than many others, even longer than their own EX. However, although I have seen 2 techs use cigarette lighters to heat the cable before installing the EXXL onto Perfect Vision cable so that the connector will go on all the way, everybody seems to say that both are excellent.

The PPC EX seems to be a connector than the EXXL. The PPC EX has less plastic, a longer nut, and the metal that goes down into the cable is shorter, making the install easier. I once read here that the PPC EXXL has an extra O-ring that the EX did not have…..Please, take your cutters and cut one of each type open, you will find that they are the same.

Also, one tech told me that the “Snap-N-Seals are frowned on by Dish Network.” Is this true or are those PPC’s just cheaper?

I also saw, for the first time, what I has heard from several techs…..Perfect Vision cable with a bad spot. I had heard, from a contractor who did both satellite and cable, that Perfect Vision would get bad spots, where the cable will look fine on the outside, but will not carry signal very well in one spot. I saw that happen with my own eyes yesterday on a DP installation.

I was just curious if anybody had the same opinion on which connectors are the easiest to push onto the cable; I know that it matters on which brand of cable you happen to be using, but, I remember that the PPC blue crimp connectors were always easier, for me, to push on than the compression ones. The Raychems were the best, but they are gone. I was just wondering if anyone has found one to be easier than others.

 

[webbydude]

Ya know...you pretty much hit every complaint that I have about Perfect Vision and the XL fittings RIGHT ON THE HEAD!

And yes, I've used Commscope and have found it easier to deal with than Perfect Vision. And yes, the EX is easier to install than a EXXL fitting.

Maybe some other techs can chime in with their own viewpoints, but my own theories are this. The harder jacketing on the Perfect Vision is more ideally suited for the higher frequencies that you'll run into with satellite versus cable. It's a shame it's not flooded and otherwise better suited for burial.

The EX vs. EXXL debate is one I side with the EX crowd on. Numerous of techs I work with claim it's more weather resistant than the standard EX. Not so sure about that one. A recent training session I had with a PPC vendor shed some light on the subject. His view was that both afforded equal protection. So why do things differently? Kickbacks perhaps. But I digress...

 

[FantasyChannel]

Also, one tech told me that the “Snap-N-Seals are frowned on by Dish Network.”

Only because they cost more I'm sure. DISH did supply DNSC's with snap-n-seals at one time. I haven't seen any in a couple of years. I think someone goofed and had orders from the two different vendors being snap-n-seal & PPC. Long Long ago DISH used digicons at one time as well.

 

[Claude Greiner]

First of all Perfect Vision Cable is manufactured by Perfect 10. Perfect 10 is a major Directv distributor, so if a dealer like myself is getting their Directv hardware from Perfect10, they are more than likely going to save on freight and get their cable from them also.

Its a matter of cost, last time I checked Perfect10 was offering Free Freight, which I think makes their cable about $5-$7 cheaper than anyone else. As far as PPC's its probably the connector that Perfect 10 has the best deal on.

Don't take this the wrong way, but when I started out I used to spend the extra $20 per roll for Premimum quality Comscope Cable. I used to use the best connectors, and would actually invest an extra $10-$13 in better installation supplies per Job. The problem is that customers don't appreciate us, all they care about these days is Free Free Free. When your doing Free Free Free to make the customer happy, Dish and Directv are cutting your commission, and you get charged back when these customers cancel or don't pay their bill you got to cut costs somewhere.

Now granted if im doing a home pre-wire or the customer specifically requests better quality installation matterials and is willing to pay for them, then I have no problem using them. The stuff we are using meets the minimum requirements by Dish and Directv. Spend the extra $10-$14 and it will exceed specifications.

As far as installers not using flooded cable, I agree with what your saying. The issue is getting flooded cable on the trucks. The issue is not necessrly the cost, but the fact that if you leave it on a technicians truck they will use it when they run out of standard RG6 and then they don't have it when they need it.

Its like at my office I always keep a roll of Quad Shield cable in the back room for custom Jobs. I got to fricken hide it because when my techs run out of cable, they end up using the roll of Quad Shield. The same holds true for Dual and Single Messenger Cable.

The only thing my techs do not touch is my RG11, because they do not know where I keep the ends which cost $5 Each and my RG11 Compression Crimp tool

 

[Claude Greiner]

Only because they cost more I'm sure. DISH did supply DNSC's with snap-n-seals at one time. I haven't seen any in a couple of years. I think someone goofed and had orders from the two different vendors being snap-n-seal & PPC. Long Long ago DISH used digicons at one time as well.

Too Expensive, I think Snap and Seal runs about $.10-$.15 Cents more per connector, and I don't think they are on DISH Networks approved accessory list.

 

[miguelaqui]

I keep the ends which cost $5 Each

You need to start getting them from somewhere else! Like online auctions! I saw some sell for as little as $.75/each; PPC EX11.

 

[device manager]

I use Perfect Vision dual shield copper clad and solid copper cable, then terminate the ends with Digicon DS6 (blue ones) connectors. I have never had a problem pushing them onto the cable. In fact they slide on with very little pressure.

 

[miguelaqui]

One more thing about that Perfect Vision....I have seen 2 differenet types ....one has a very tough jacket, similar to the jacket Commscope puts on their flooded cable, the other is very flexible, like regular Commscope RG6.

Are there 2 different kinds or does it just vary from spool to spool? I was wondering if the UL rated just had a softer jacket; that might have been a coincidence.

 

[miguelaqui]

I use Perfect Vision dual shield copper clad and solid copper cable, then terminate the ends with Digicon DS6 (blue ones) connectors. I have never had a problem pushing them onto the cable. In fact they slide on with very little pressure.

Somebody must have some money to afford those Digicons!!!! I have never used those....I was out of cable by 1998.

I was also wondering if anyone had tried Gilbert Ultraease or those Digion Multi-Fit. ?

 

[boba]

I just counted cables in my Perfect 10 catalog and came up with 22 different stock numbers for their Perfect Vision cables. If you looked at Commscope you would probably find a similar variety of cables.

 

[Van]

I agrea with Claude, no use in spending extra money on people that care more for tv than they do theyr own kids. DIsh has used a few diferent types, digicons and sterlings and now the snap and seals by ppc.

 

[chadzx11]

I use Perfect Vision Single with ground because I prefer it to the summit cable I can source locally. They cost the same, but P10 has done away with free shipping (unless you order $350+). Shipping on a reel of single w/ground cost $12 from little rock to tunica this week. I'll pay the extra because of the issues noted buy the OP. Both the summit and the PV are UL listed, but the connectors I use (PPC CMP6's) do not like that summit cable. I even bought a bo dickey, but it is still a pain in the ass to get them on, whereas the CMP6s go right on the PV cable, no fuss.

My personal preference for a connector is the blue digicon, however due to the issues mentioned previously, I go with the cheapest materials. Lots of techs around here get the stuff from cable guys. 5 finger discount cheaters. Our lead tech is one of them. I hate that shitbird.

 

[bweiteka]

I can't stand perfect vision cable. The dual w/ ground unrolls off the spool with kinks sometimes, and it's hard to put fittings on it in the winter! Even when using the blue digicons. I really like cable from skywalker, I've used that stuff all winter long with no problems. No need to use the pocket torch on it when it's 20 degrees. Although, I must say perfect vision cable is not nearly as bad as eagle aspen...anyone ever have the misfortune of using that crap? I think it's more popular with directv installers.

 

[miguelaqui]

As far as installers not using flooded cable, I agree with what your saying. The issue is getting flooded cable on the trucks. The issue is not necessrly the cost, but the fact that if you leave it on a technicians truck they will use it when they run out of standard RG6 and then they don't have it when they need it.

I know that you have to be careful about that! A tech from Adelphia told me that someone was suing them for using the flooded cable in his house; the gel ran out out the connector and into the TV. It was just as easy for the techs to use those blue gel-filled connectors with the flooded cable, not knowing the gel would leak out!

He said that was why the only flooded cable they were using was the underground.
When I worked in cable, we used flooded messenger as well.

 

[miguelaqui]

I tried the Digicon on some cable I had onto which it was very hard to install connectors, Coleman. I wouldn't use PPC connectors on it because they were too difficult to push on the cable. I just used some Raychem connecotrs I had left over from a few years ago.

Well, I decided to try Digicon. I used the multi-fit becuase I found them for a good price. The Digicons were a lot easier to install than PPC!!

The Digicons actually seem to be the easiest ones I used out of the compression connectors of today.The only multi-fit connectors I previouly were the PPC crimps, those blue ones, and the Raychem EZF; I don't think either one of those connectors are still in production.

Has anyone tried Gilbert Ultraease?

 

[webbydude]

Just to reopen an old thread, thought I'd give an update to the OP. Looks like Ohio's RSP is going the way that DNS in Michigan went and starting to use PPC CMP6s. Not quite sure if I like these or not. Just testing things out today showed me that it's a really bitch to get them on quad-shielded cable.

 

[SummitAdvantageRetailer]

Just to reopen an old thread, thought I'd give an update to the OP. Looks like Ohio's RSP is going the way that DNS in Michigan went and starting to use PPC CMP6s. Not quite sure if I like these or not. Just testing things out today showed me that it's a really bitch to get them on quad-shielded cable.

Why are they using CMP6's on quad-shield cables? These fittings are for tri-shield cables or less. Do those fittings have a blue collar or black collar? You'd want CMP6Q's or better, which have a black collar, for quad-shield cables.

 

[webbydude]

ROFL!! Thank-you!
That was my EXACT rant today when it was announced we would be doing away with the PPC EX-XL fittings.

Hmm...not able to do quad shielding. IMO, not as weather resistant. Oh yeah...feel cheaper too. But as Claude stated earlier, the financial bottom line is showing it's ugly side.

EDIT: yes...it's the blue-collar ones

 

[miguelaqui]

ROFL!! Thank-you!
That was my EXACT rant today when it was announced we would be doing away with the PPC EX-XL fittings.

Hmm...not able to do quad shielding. IMO, not as weather resistant. Oh yeah...feel cheaper too. But as Claude stated earlier, the financial bottom line is showing it's ugly side.

EDIT: yes...it's the blue-collar ones

I would do the following.....sell the connectors on EBay...then buy some decent ones!!

I am shocked that they have you using quad shielded cable!!!! What good does quad-shielding do for satellite signal? I just know, from cable work, it just seems to help in big cities with lots of broadcast stations.

Those CMPs are the ones that look like the SNS? Can you pull the plastic off, put it on the cable, then push the connector on?....that was a trick I would use with SNS one piece.

By the way ...my Eagle Aspens had a patent no. on the pack,,I looked it up...it's PPC's! I thought PPC and SNS were the only ones who had "patented" connectors. I guess it's cheaper for Eagle Aspen to make them in China and just pay PPC a percentage.

 

[webbydude]

No...sorry. Didn't make myself clear enough. The RSP I work for doesn't use quad shielded cable, but I happened to have a bit from an old install to try out. There are going to be instances where quad shielded cable is gonna show up in a prewired home.

As to quad shielding, my opinion is this. Its a bit pricey for the quality you receiver. Would rather see a customer spend the $$ on a better TV. LOL