DISH and 4K

[bigjohnok]

I just had a customer tell me that she can't tell the difference between HD and SD in her house. I couldn't help but chuckle a little but maybe it's not noticeable for her. She said it's a 47" TV but maybe she sits 15 feet away from it.

Was she elderly or had eye sight problems??
I have had elderly customers tell me this that they dont care about hd because they can barely see to begin with.

 

[jerryez]

I brought my mother in law a 50" HDTV and hooked it up to her Cox cable box. I showed her that Cox has their HD in the 1,000 numbers like 1003 for the HD version of channel 3, but she can watch the SD version on the regular channel 3. I have showed her this several times, but she continues to watch the SD version of all her programs. She(and most people) can't tell the difference in SD and HD. The new flat screen tv pictures are such an improvement over the old CRT, that they think the SD picture is great.

 

[KAB]

Rarely does SD not look worse on an HDTV.

 

[dare2be]

Rarely does SD not look worse on an HDTV.

Partially right. SD on my 32" HD CRT looks better than SD on my 47" HD LED. It's more of a function of CRT vs. LCD/LED/Plasma.

 

[TheKrell]

Partially right. SD on my 32" HD CRT looks better than SD on my 47" HD LED. It's more of a function of CRT vs. LCD/LED/Plasma.

And most importantly, the quality of the scaler inside. I bought a Sylvania and attached it to my old 501 and it was so bad I took it back and bought a Vizio, which was petty good.

Also note that DVDs are SD, but they look pretty damn good on all my sets (though my biggest is "only" 42").

 

[whatchel1]

I brought my mother in law a 50" HDTV and hooked it up to her Cox cable box. I showed her that Cox has their HD in the 1,000 numbers like 1003 for the HD version of channel 3, but she can watch the SD version on the regular channel 3. I have showed her this several times, but she continues to watch the SD version of all her programs. She(and most people) can't tell the difference in SD and HD. The new flat screen tv pictures are such an improvement over the old CRT, that they think the SD picture is great.

Can't you reprogram it so the HD channels replace the SD channels?

 

[whatchel1]

mpeg-5?

No such thing.

 

[bigjohnok]

Can't you reprogram it so the HD channels replace the SD channels?

not every channel that is out there is in hd.
like with dish receivers you can toggle the guide button to show only hd channels but then to you dont see the sd channels in your guide.

 

[MikeD-C05]

No such thing.

True ,but I bet DISH is working on some kind of mpeg 8 right now, to make room for more hd or even 4k channels on the satellites. They definitely need another compression technique for the near future . Especially if the industry continues to push the market towards 4k.

 

[mike123abc]

True ,but I bet DISH is working on some kind of mpeg 8 right now, to make room for more hd or even 4k channels on the satellites. They definitely need another compression technique for the near future . Especially if the industry continues to push the market towards 4k.

There is HEVC http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Efficiency_Video_Coding or H.265

The Motion Pictures Expert Group (the MPEG in MPEG) joint developed it. It does not have an MPEG #, but maybe they will give it one for convenience.

 

[navychop]

I'll bet Dish/Echostar don't spend a dime on compression techniques. Let others do the work and pay the royalties.


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[navychop]

No such thing.

I'm sure he meant HEVC. We all just need to learn the new terminology. It's "next," whether called MPEG-5, HEVC or Tommy's CODEC.


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[whatchel1]

There is HEVC http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High_Efficiency_Video_Coding or H.265

The Motion Pictures Expert Group (the MPEG in MPEG) joint developed it. It does not have an MPEG #, but maybe they will give it one for convenience.

That is part of the MPEG 4 standard.

 

[whatchel1]

The whole problem with the 4k push is that it will not be delivered to anyone at the PQ potential it is capable. Look at today's HD. It has been a long time since I've seen anything from Dish that compares to what HD should be or has been. Most of all HD delivered today is no better than what DVDs were delivering 12 years ago. Some shows are intentionally "derezing" to protect the onscreen folks from looking imperfect. Bit rates allocated to shows are minimized directly causing poorer PQ. Non of this is going to change because they are now putting out "4kTV". If they won't show HD to its potential, what makes you thing 4k with result in improved PQ?

Now that is a pure load of bull.

 

[whatchel1]

Everyone talking about older CRT type TVs, answer this: How many "threw away" a perfectly working CRT after getting a flat-panel ?

We did - I had (2) in the garage thinking we'd use them for something, give them to someone, or sell them in a garage sale/Craigslist. In the end, one went to Goodwill and the other to a homeless shelter. Our 57" rear-projection HDTV is still working and in our son's room.

On Craigslist, some silly people still try to sell them (you know damn well they're thinking "I paid $700 for this 15 years ago!) while most know better and list them for free. I also see them out by the curb for either the scrappers to take (they don't) or garbage to pick up (they won't take anything over 27" or maybe it's 30-something).

I gave mine to local Catholic Family services reseller like Goodwill. They came and picked up my working 32" Panny 1st gen CRT HDTV set. It was work horse and I was the 1st in my broadcast engineer classes to have HDTV. Some the teachers had them but not the students.

 

[whatchel1]

IMO, line conditioners are waste of money, most electronics have power regulation circuits built in the power supply board.

Moving on, 4k is NOT a fad.

Calling 4k a fad would be like calling 1080p a fad. It's an increase in picture quality.

Creating a disc player is easy, but creating any type of broadcast TV will be difficult.

Consider that dish and directvs dishes have 3 sats, and not everything is in HD yet!

So that makes one wonder how they will go 4k without adding more satellites. I don't know much about satellite broadcasting, but I think they will have to launch sats that can transmit data at a faster speed for 4ktv.

Either that or have a 6 LNB dish,that wont look pretty.

Also, your gonna need a much bigger hard drive. Current one in the hopper is two terrabytes, were talking 10-15 TB, and that does not even exist yet.

It will be done via new compression techniques. The new standards are being worked on now for it. Now we are on a standard often called MPEG 47. It's a combo of MPEG 4 and MPEG 7. There is also some standard call MPEG 21 that will be used but I don't know much about it. Just read a little about it this morn. MPEG standards aren't really clear cut like this is MPEG 4 and next we will go to MPEG 8. There are several deviations that have been added to MPEG 4 since it first came out that is how the combo of 4 & 7 are being married now.

 

[gpflepsen]

Now that is a pure load of bull.

Your position is stated quite eloquently...


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[KAB]

Your position is stated quite eloquently...


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I thought so.

 

[MikeD-C05]

By the time they do get 4k up on the sat , I'm sure that whatever compression technique they choose to use, the picture will not look as good as real 4k. Kind of like when DISH went mpeg4 and put 8 hd channels up on one transponder and the pq dropped down a bit. I can remember when there were few hd channels and the picture really popped , when DISH first added VOOM channels. Then they dropped the resolution down and the channels never looked as good again. Of course there was so little new content on the VOOM channels by then , no one was really watching them much anymore . Either way I guess we will learn to accept what ever we are given and we too won't notice any real difference.

 

[bigjohnok]

I dont think satellite transmitted tv will ever look as good as a terrestrial based system, due to transmit power limitations placed by regulations.