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cparker
cparker
Pub Member / Supporter
Last reply · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

I'm probably obsessing (again) ..winter install?

Ok, I am admittedly probably overthinking this, but that's what I do. :)

I am preparing house#2 to move into and then will sell house #1 (and THEN I'll move into house #2).
House #2 currently has no dish install, but I will want it when I move in. At this time it appears likely that we won't be moving in before December.

From an installer's perspective how hard is it to install in December in western NY?
This is almost certainly going to be an eave install on a ranch home (single story)

If I want the dishes on the END of the house at the gable end (eaves about 18") then I need to get up there and trim back a maple tree a little bit. OR I could move the dish location to about 12 feet from the gable end, still on the eaves (about 2 feet eaves here) and not have to trim anything. These locations satisfy my wife's "I don't want to see them from the street" request and provide good LOS to both the 110/119 and the 61.5 orbitals.

I hate that the last time they did an eaves install (on House #1) they ran the coax over the gutter. Black coax on white siding. Lovely.

Would it be worth it to me to put a couple of commdeck mounts up there and just say, "Put them there" when it comes time for an install? Or should I trim back the maple, go for the eaves install, and then just have the coax entering the gable end of the garage. I have my RG6 runs for the house already run into the garage for this.

I would love to NOT have them on the roof, but my wife doesn't want them as part of the landscaping when she looks out the window in the back yard.

Photos might help.... I'll see if I can find my wife's house pictures...

Ok... http://picasaweb.google.com/slms1989/GriffinStreet#5221812821240719442 is the front of the house for general orientation. If you stand on the driveway, facing the garage doors, you're facing east. You can see that the south side of the house has a line of pine trees. I am confident that I've got enough elevation to the 110/119 orbital to look over those trees without a problem.

http://picasaweb.google.com/slms1989/GriffinStreet#5214359586456534610 is the gable end of the garage. Tree cover in this photo looks much worse than it actually is. To put a dish on this eave almost to the back corner of the house, would require me to trim off one branch on the maple and it's not that big. Most of what you see as tree cover in this photo is actually behind the house and would not interfere with LOS.

http://picasaweb.google.com/slms1989/GriffinStreet#5214359109715164578 is the back wall of the house. The soffits here are not only vinyl clad, but also slanted so I don't think a soffit mount would work here. If you see that little light on the back of the house, there's a people-door into the garage there. If I mount 2 dishes above that door, I wouldn't have to trim any trees, but they'd probably run the coax over the gutter and that just looks ugly. Unless they carry white coax with them.

Or should I consider something like this
http://www.dishmountproducts.com/wm-200.html
and hope that no part of it is low enough for someone to whack their head on?
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Liquidforce88
Liquidforce88
Couple things for you to consider. I don't know about your area, but in Michigan this applies.

1. If you have the cable enter the house above the garage, it has to be grounded to the house electric with in 5' of entry into the house. Most of the time there is not a spot to ground in the garage rafters, so we can't enter the building unless we run cables to the ground then back.

2. That fancy mount you posted a link to, will not pass Dish code. We are not allowed to mount to a wall or brick. Even if you put the mount up we could not use it. If we goto service calls and find a Dish mounted to the wall of a house we have to remove it.

3. White cable is not allowed to be used outdoors, as it is not UV rated.

Our only mounting allowed locations are on the roof over the eves not over the living space unless we have no other line of site, or on a pole.
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dishcomm
dishcomm
Liquidforce88 said:
Couple things for you to consider. I don't know about your area, but in Michigan this applies.

1. If you have the cable enter the house above the garage, it has to be grounded to the house electric with in 5' of entry into the house. Most of the time there is not a spot to ground in the garage rafters, so we can't enter the building unless we run cables to the ground then back.

2. That fancy mount you posted a link to, will not pass Dish code. We are not allowed to mount to a wall or brick. Even if you put the mount up we could not use it. If we goto service calls and find a Dish mounted to the wall of a house we have to remove it.

3. White cable is not allowed to be used outdoors, as it is not UV rated.

Our only mounting allowed locations are on the roof over the eves not over the living space unless we have no other line of site, or on a pole.
Click to expand...
on grounding..... so if you run the cables form the dish into an attic for example and ground to an electrical fixture or other acceptable ground ,you cannot do the job unless that ground is feet or less from the cable penetration?....What do you do with these jobs that must be resched or canceled due to these restrictions?...Ho do you do business with these restrictions?
I also have never seen restrictions barring white cable.....I just don't buy white cable. It adds another possibility of playing 20 questions with a high maintenence individual who wants home decorating expertise as well as a satellite tv
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Liquidforce88
Liquidforce88
dishcomm said:
on grounding..... so if you run the cables form the dish into an attic for example and ground to an electrical fixture or other acceptable ground ,you cannot do the job unless that ground is feet or less from the cable penetration?....What do you do with these jobs that must be resched or canceled due to these restrictions?...Ho do you do business with these restrictions?
I also have never seen restrictions barring white cable.....I just don't buy white cable. It adds another possibility of playing 20 questions with a high maintenence individual who wants home decorating expertise as well as a satellite tv
Click to expand...

You do the job with in the restrictions.

You don't run the wires from the Dish into the attic and ground there, because in our area there is never an acceptable ground in the attic.

You plan your cable entry into the residence so that you can be with in the 5' rule.

I have very few customers that just refuse to allow the work to be done within the rules, so it's not an issue.
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dishcomm
dishcomm
Liquidforce88 said:
You do the job with in the restrictions.

You don't run the wires from the Dish into the attic and ground there, because in our area there is never an acceptable ground in the attic.

You plan your cable entry into the residence so that you can be with in the 5' rule.

I have very few customers that just refuse to allow the work to be done within the rules, so it's not an issue.
Click to expand...

That's wonderful.. So for example,if I have a 2 story slab built house where the dish has to go on the opposite side from the d-mark and there is a structured wiring panel in the laundry room upstair(electrical outlet in panel) in your jurisdiction I'd have run the cables to the d-mark and then back to the attic entry point, then to the wiring panel?. This is instead of going from the dish directly to th epanel which is an acceptable NEC ground point because the outlet within the panel is obviously grounded?...That's like three/four times as much cable. I have to pay for that cable. Hopefully you don't have the expenses I do. If you do, how can you make any money?...This job I am using as an example, would take at least 300 feet of cable. It's 2100 SF house. 300 feet of cable as opposed to the 75 ft I used. Sorry but I could not justify those inds of nonsensical rules and accpet that revenue loss.
Someone out where you work is pulling your chain... Seems like they are doing thsat just be an a$$hole.
BTW if you are going ot ask if I could go from the dish to the d-mark on the other end of the house then stright up to the attic and ot that panel ,the answer is now. The LR has a two story vaulted ceiling right to the rafters. So there's no attic on that side of the house until you get over the front bedroom over the garage.
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Q
Quantum
You 'heard' about this one Dish installer... ?

Ya, I went to a high-rise a while back where in the cable/sat closet there were no labels on any of the cables, whatsoever. The manager told me that a while back either the cable or sat guy got so pissed at the other he cut them all off. Well, that just makes it hard for everyone.

Although, 'redeploying' the cable drop sometimes makes sense.
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cparker
cparker
Ok, well... problem solved, I think. Saturday evening my son and I sunk a new 8 foot ground rod right below where the dishes should mount. Sunday morning I dug 125 feet of (shallow) trench to bury a #6 copper line and bonded that new ground rod to the house electrical service ground rod. I had to put it on the other side of that darn sidewalk I mentioned, but the sidewalk is coming out in the spring. So I also ran a piece of #6 in a big crack in the sidewalk (at a control joint... the sidewalk is pitched and heaved so the crack was big enough) and brought that to the house where any ground wires from the dish install could be attached.

This was a lot of work, but I think this satisfies code (I did a TON of reading on how to properly add additional ground rods), gives the dish installer a valid ground point, and it makes me feel better. :)
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mikethedishguy
mikethedishguy
Quantum said:
You 'heard' about this one Dish installer... ?

Ya, I went to a high-rise a while back where in the cable/sat closet there were no labels on any of the cables, whatsoever. The manager told me that a while back either the cable or sat guy got so pissed at the other he cut them all off. Well, that just makes it hard for everyone.

Although, 'redeploying' the cable drop sometimes makes sense.
Click to expand...

Went to customer that I had Installed about 1yr ago for a service call. When I arrived I found the customer a little upset at the cable company. It seems that they had had cut the lines to the upstairs rooms. When the customer confronted the cable guy he said the wire on the house belonged to the cable company. The wire in question was Gray with DISH Network printed on the casing every 3".
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Liquidforce88
Liquidforce88
dishcomm said:
That's wonderful.. So for example,if I have a 2 story slab built house where the dish has to go on the opposite side from the d-mark and there is a structured wiring panel in the laundry room upstair(electrical outlet in panel) in your jurisdiction I'd have run the cables to the d-mark and then back to the attic entry point, then to the wiring panel?. This is instead of going from the dish directly to the panel which is an acceptable NEC ground point because the outlet within the panel is obviously grounded?.
Click to expand...

Ok the QAS in our area says: You are not an electrician so you can not modify the electrical ground, another words I am not allowed to open up the outlet and tie to the ground wire. You also can not prove that the outlet in that panel is grounded back to the D-mark. Thus that outlet is not an NEC approved ground point.


dishcomm said:
...That's like three/four times as much cable. I have to pay for that cable. Hopefully you don't have the expenses I do. If you do, how can you make any money?...This job I am using as an example, would take at least 300 feet of cable. It's 2100 SF house. 300 feet of cable as opposed to the 75 ft I used. Sorry but I could not justify those kinds of nonsensical rules and accpet that revenue loss.
Click to expand...

Ok Dish has an allowed amount of cable for an install. In this situation you would exceed the allowed amount and be allowed to collect monies from the customer. I work for a company that provides all the install materials so I personally don't worry about the amount of cable used.

Also thankfully in our area slab houses are very rare, and when you run into them they are almost always very small houses. The houses around here are basement, or crawl space built. The electrical panel is either in the basement, the crawl space if it is a 4'er, or on a power pole next to the building. Most of the houses are single story ranches, modulars, trailers, or old farm house colonial types. We don't have the crazy houses that you seem to deal with.

dishcomm said:
...Someone out where you work is pulling your chain... Seems like they are doing that just be an a$$hole..
Click to expand...

Nope it's code, and everybody interprets it differently.

dishcomm said:
...
BTW if you are going to ask if I could go from the dish to the d-mark on the other end of the house then stright up to the attic and to that panel ,the answer is no. The LR has a two story vaulted ceiling right to the rafters. So there's no attic on that side of the house until you get over the front bedroom over the garage.
Click to expand...

That would be a suck job to do.
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dishcomm
dishcomm
Liquidforce88 said:
Ok the QAS in our area says: You are not an electrician so you can not modify the electrical ground, another words I am not allowed to open up the outlet and tie to the ground wire. You also can not prove that the outlet in that panel is grounded back to the D-mark. Thus that outlet is not an NEC approved ground point.




Ok Dish has an allowed amount of cable for an install. In this situation you would exceed the allowed amount and be allowed to collect monies from the customer. I work for a company that provides all the install materials so I personally don't worry about the amount of cable used.

Also thankfully in our area slab houses are very rare, and when you run into them they are almost always very small houses. The houses around here are basement, or crawl space built. The electrical panel is either in the basement, the crawl space if it is a 4'er, or on a power pole next to the building. Most of the houses are single story ranches, modulars, trailers, or old farm house colonial types. We don't have the crazy houses that you seem to deal with.



Nope it's code, and everybody interprets it differently.



That would be a suck job to do.
Click to expand...
You most ceratinly can determine whether or not an outlet is grounded. First, it's code. Second all you have to do is look for the ground screw. If it's got a bare wire attached to it, it's grounded. And in order to be grounded, it must be grounded to the d-mark. Attaching to the ground screw in an outlet is not modifying the electrical system in any way. In fact we're encouraged to do this if there is not another place to go.
Yes the limit of cable is 200 ft. We charge for more than that. But the added tme and then having to buy more is a PITA. Especially if it's not necessary to run that much cable. Which in this area, thankfully it is not.
The two story slab built house with trus system roof is very popular here. We have lots of new construction here And that is the way hopuses are built. I'd say 75% of all homes less than ten yrs old are built on slabsha includes homes as large as 4,000 SF..No kidding. there are two story homes here with walkout basements. Essentially that is a three story slab built home. Roof pitches here are very steep ..It's not only an architectural issue. It's a prestige thing. The higher end homes have 14-12 or 16-12 pitches... Just to give a point o freference a 12-12 pitch is 45 degrees..14-12 is about 54 degrees..In other words there are very few roofs one can walk without safety harnesses or other devices.
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TWiT Tech Podcast Network
· posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

This Week in Tech 1107

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lHoCBzfrdmQ


Direct YouTube Link - This Week in Tech 1107
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TWiT Tech Podcast Network
· posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

This Week in Tech 1107

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYRNrj5MQzw


Direct YouTube Link - This Week in Tech 1107
TWIT's Website
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TWiT Tech Podcast Network
· posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

This Week in Tech 1107

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=41qc5p2NdN4


Direct YouTube Link - This Week in Tech 1107
TWIT's Website
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TWiT Tech Podcast Network
· posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

Club TWiT: Unpacking 'You Can See Everything' - Deception, Empathy, and the Art of the Documentary

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gPXZ_k6ld-g


Direct YouTube Link - Club TWiT: Unpacking 'You Can See Everything' - Deception, Empathy, and the Art of the Documentary
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TWiT Tech Podcast Network
· posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

This Week in Tech 1107

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WvJmUuXvDHI


Direct YouTube Link - This Week in Tech 1107
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Ham Radio 2.0
· posted in Ham Radio 2.0

200,000 Subscriber Livestream - Let's Giveaway some RADIOS!

Time for another AWESOME video from Ham Radio 2.0!


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9sqK9KJAt7E


Direct YouTube Link - 200,000 Subscriber Livestream - Let's Giveaway some RADIOS!
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dishstaller
dishstaller
Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter
Last reply · posted in TV Shows

Brutal review of Netflix's series Below

Don't know if any of you have watched this series yet, it would be interesting to see if you feel this review was accurate. It was very humorous to listen to however.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tsDO3y8I2c
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KAB
KAB
What a "pile of slop" review! I liked the show.
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Yespage
KAB said:
What a "pile of slop" review! I liked the show.
Click to expand...
If the review is like the article, oi! Eighteen paragraphs into the review and... all they've done is not really talk at all about the actual thing they are reviewing.

Halfway into the "written" review, I know more about how the writer "thinks" than I do about what they are writing about. I understand their politics, their self-overestimated understanding of film, their inability to be funny.

Takes about 22 paragraphs to get to one that starts "Anyway, the story kicks off...". Talk about Slop! 😂
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K
klang
Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter
Last reply · posted in TV Shows

Star Trek: Starfleet Academy - Paramount+

Season 2 order already in hand:

'Star Trek: Starfleet Academy' Renewed for Season 2, Tatiana Maslany to Guest Star in Season 1

I've not been optimistic about this show based on what I've read so far. Seems to be aimed at a younger audience. Interesting though that Tatiana Maslany will have some sort of role.
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K
klang
klang said:
I'm sure I will watch at least the first episode but I am not optimistic.
Click to expand...
Here i am over a year later and just finished season 1. Not great but not as bad as I was expecting. Did not care for the barefoot captain stuff but overall ok. Actually looking forward to see what they did for season 2.
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MikeD-C05
MikeD-C05
klang said:
Here i am over a year later and just finished season 1. Not great but not as bad as I was expecting. Did not care for the barefoot captain stuff but overall ok. Actually looking forward to see what they did for season 2.
Click to expand...
Yeah, the foot stuff was just nasty. I kept thinking of how dirty her feet would get traipsing around shoe-less. Funny, I love being shoe less at home and never wear shoes indoors in my home for long, but seeing her laying on all her furniture with her bare feet hanging out just kind of grossed me out.
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harshness
harshness
MikeD-C05 said:
I kept thinking of how dirty her feet would get traipsing around shoe-less.
Click to expand...
Where would this "dirt" come from? Dead skin and dandruff?
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MikeD-C05
MikeD-C05
harshness said:
Where would this "dirt" come from? Dead skin and dandruff?
Click to expand...
There would still be dirt ,dust in the future I am sure. So walking around the station like she did she would get stuff on her feet. I am sure the robot vacuum is still going to miss stuff, with all those different alien species running around there.
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harshness
harshness
MikeD-C05 said:
There would still be dirt ,dust in the future I am sure.
Click to expand...
Where is it going to come from -- specifically?

Why do you think cleaning technology won't improve in the next few hundred years? HEPA filtration was invented as part of the Manhattan Project.
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MikeD-C05
MikeD-C05
harshness said:
Where is it going to come from -- specifically?

Why do you think cleaning technology won't improve in the next few hundred years? HEPA filtration was invented as part of the Manhattan Project.
Click to expand...
I don't know, but I still don't like her walking through the station or the academy with out her shoes. It looks unprofessional and very "hippy like" for someone of her status and I personally don't get off to feet, so there is that. ;)
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osu1991
osu1991
MikeD-C05 said:
I don't know, but I still don't like her walking through the station or the academy with out her shoes. It looks unprofessional and very "hippy like" for someone of her status and I personally don't get off to feet, so there is that. ;)
Click to expand...
Stay out of my office. I rarely have shoes or socks on in the office. My office and business is at home though :clapping
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MikeD-C05
MikeD-C05
osu1991 said:
Stay out of my office. I rarely have shoes or socks on in the office. My office and business is at home though :clapping
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Say, I don't wear socks or shoes in my house either. But for a captain in Star Fleet it looks bad to be walking around the academy with no shoes. Gives off 1960 Hippie vibes.
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Jimbo
Jimbo
MikeD-C05 said:
Gives off 1960 Hippie vibes.
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You say that like it's a Bad thing or something ... :biggrin
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long_time_Dish
long_time_Dish
Well, look at the way she sat in the Captain's Chair. I didn't say the show should have been called "Captain Chair-Whore" for nothing...
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primestar31
primestar31
MikeD-C05 said:
Say, I don't wear socks or shoes in my house either. But for a captain in Star Fleet it looks bad to be walking around the academy with no shoes. Gives off 1960 Hippie vibes.
Click to expand...
star trek GIF by HULU


Just sayin...
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MikeD-C05
MikeD-C05
Jimbo said:
You say that like it's a Bad thing or something ... :biggrin
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For a whole generation of adults it was in the 1960s and 1970s.

All In The Family Nostalgia GIF by Sony Pictures Television
All In The Family Singing GIF by Sony Pictures Television
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harshness
harshness
Females wearing any clothing is unthinkable on Ferenginar.
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long_time_Dish
long_time_Dish
harshness said:
Females wearing any clothing is unthinkable on Ferenginar.
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Was never a huge of the Ferengi-centric episodes in Trek...
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Scott Greczkowski
Scott Greczkowski
Staff member HERE TO HELP YOU! Cutting Edge
Last reply · posted in The Chit Chat Club

Song Name Game Part 3!

Sometimes a thread gets so many posts in it that is can cause issues for the server so that why today we introduce The Song Name Game Part 3!

So let the game continue!

The last song was added by Bobby who posted...

One Meat Ball - Andrews Sisters

CONTINUE ON AND HAVE FUN! WELCOME HOME TO SATELLITEGUYS.US!

Here are the original rules for the game as posted by WebbyDude back in 2006. http://www.satelliteguys.us/threads/68645-Song-Name-Game

Just name a song title and the band who performed it. The next person does the same thing, but needs to list a song title or band name which includes a word from the previous entry. Pick songs from any genre.

Example:

Long Live Rock and Roll -- Rainbow

Rainbow in the Dark -- Dio

Another example:

Ride the Lightning -- Metallica

Lightning Strikes -- Ozzy Osbourne


Get it?


An additional note: we all know that song titles, sometimes, use profane words. Because this is a family friendly website it is advised that you clean up that title up a bit. This is accomplished by using something like sh!t instead of the real word. Thanks....
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sdfntx
Gondoliers, Shakespeares, Overseers, Playboys and Bums - Norman Greenbaum
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Bobby
Bobby
I Wish I Was Eighteen Again - George Burns
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harshness
harshness
I Wish - Stevie Wonder
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EatMyVolts
EatMyVolts
Lonesome Road -- The Wonder Who?
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long_time_Dish
long_time_Dish
Lonesome Loser - Little River Band
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TWiT Tech Podcast Network
· posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

Meta Muse AI Privacy Flaw - What Your Shared Data Can Reveal #shorts

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!


View: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/7k8cgHXwIjQ


Direct YouTube Link - Meta Muse AI Privacy Flaw - What Your Shared Data Can Reveal #shorts
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