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Scott Greczkowski said:

ERSanders,

I went from AEP down to just AT250 because of the new fees. My wife even asked me if we should look at DIRECTV again...

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I am not being nosy, or trying to change the subject, but what is the main reason that you have decided to stay with Dish Network? Is the equipment?

bobvick said:

I am not being nosy, or trying to change the subject, but what is the main reason that you have decided to stay with Dish Network? Is the equipment?

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Yes its the equipment. I had both DIRECTV and DISH and my wife didn't like the DIRECTV equipment at all.

For me he programming between the two is the same as I only watch 4 channels... Science Channel, Discovery Channel, USA Network and Food Network.

Scott Greczkowski said:

Yes its the equipment. I had both DIRECTV and DISH and my wife didn't like the DIRECTV equipment at all.

For me he programming between the two is the same as I only watch 4 channels... Science Channel, Discovery Channel, USA Network and Food Network.

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Now that Ive had an HR 24 for a few weeks, I have to say, I'm really impressed with D*'s equipment. If you get an HR24 you will have zero issues. This puppy is very quick. I just wish they would redesign the UI a bit to polish it up like dish's but over all its good.

I'm glad that people are starting to notice what I noticed about two months ago! I too was surprised at the subloss for last quarter. We all can agree that dish needs to change. Its times like these that I wish I could just jump in and steer the ship back on chorse. I know what its like to be the sub behind the tv (Mr. Couch Potato) and be very frusterated when you cant watch a game in HD becuase dish doesnt want to air it. Or the sub who's pissed because charlie cant stop a lawsuite to save his life. I know what I would do, and given 6 months to a year, I could have dish the number one pay tv satellite provider, given an open check book. But that wouldnt be charlie to do that so, It will never happen!

goaliebob99 said:

Or the sub who's pissed because charlie cant stop a lawsuite to save his life.

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If you look at the laundry list of DISH Network lawsuits in the latest SEC filing, you'll see that DIRECTV was also named as a co-defendant in several of them.

harshness said:

If you look at the laundry list of DISH Network lawsuits in the latest SEC filing, you'll see that DIRECTV was also named as a co-defendant in several of them.

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What say you about this? I find it funny that you turned a DirecTV net growth into a negative spin, yet have nothing to say about this.

Remember when I challenged you before Dish's Q2 report. I stated:

DodgerKing said:

Why?

Did you say the same when Dish had a net loss for two consecutive quarters last year? Will you say the opposite when Direct gains even more subs over the next two quarters? Will you say the same of Dish when they get yet another net loss by quarter 3?

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I was only wrong about which quarter, but I was correct about predicting the net loss.

This still does answer the questions I raised in the Direct Q2 thread. I guess you will not say the same of Dish

DodgerKing said:

I find it funny that you turned a DirecTV net growth into a negative spin, yet have nothing to say about this.

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I didn't speak to the DIRECTV US net growth other than it needed to be considered apart from that of DIRECTV LA, but since you mentioned it, they tied a record for lowest growth in recent history set in Q1.

If you must see a positive spin before you will relent on your DIRECTV campaign, DISH Network has had greater subscriber losses in recent history.

Just take a look at the replies column.

Currently they have 37 replies and we have 87. Most of the 37 replies there are from the same people who enjoy talking to themselves.

But if you look at the number of replies from Bob Haller which say the same thing over and over again we might be even.

Scott Greczkowski said:

Just take a look at the replies column.

Currently they have 37 replies and we have 87. Most of the 37 replies there are from the same people who enjoy talking to themselves.

But if you look at the number of replies from Bob Haller which say the same thing over and over again we might be even.

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And they are not a gambling site either.

Don Landis said:

AS an investor, I understand that the market these days is very fickle. Dish stock took a tumble and news reporters claim it is due to loss of 19,000 subs. Heck the way this market has been ( Bear Market) any bad news even in the presence of far greater good news will cause a negative spike in the stock.

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Ah, but you know the essence of the stock market: buy on rumor sell on news.

I know the metrics per se aren't bad, but keep in mind that DISH stock was being purchased over the past few months with projections that subscriber growth was still positive.

Now trend the future. Is this subscriber growth (or should I say contraction) for one quarter simply an anomoly (and no one believes in anomolies) or is this a company that will no longer grow the subscriber base much for the foreseeable future? Don't get me wrong; the rest of the financials look pretty solid, but are investors freaking out about churn, simply because the amount of subscribers that bolt exponentially affects the revenue line?

And of course, that is well in line with most of the concerns of the people in this post. Dish Network appears to be going after the value subscriber. After all, the current markeing plan is geared towards "cheaper" TV: join us and you will pay less. The receiver fees instituted at the beginning of the year also point that direction. If you are a power user with a bunch of HD or DVR's or both, Dish Network wants you to pay.

So it is relatively easy to see why the stock was hammered yesterday. It can be summed up with this:

What type of subscriber does Dish Network want? Because it certainly appears they no longer want multi-receiver subscribers unless they pay through the nose for their equipment, and they want the value subscriber.

Greg Bimson said:

What type of subscriber does Dish Network want? Because it certainly appears they no longer want multi-receiver subscribers unless they pay through the nose for their equipment, and they want the value subscriber.

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Dish needs a large number of subs to cover the base operating costs. Satellites are expensive and a couple bucks a month/sub helps cover those costs. The problem of course is that the Whale customers bring in the big profits, but the cheap subs with lots of receivers hurt profits. Perhaps an interesting strategy would be receiver fees based on package:

1. 1 free receiver with any package (as is the case now), receiver fees the same as is now

2. AT200 25% discount on receiver fees

3. AT250 35% discount on receiver fees

4. AEP 50% discount on receiver fees - Even with this discount Dish still gets a price increase. Dual DVR $17/2 or $8.50 vs old price of $7/month. Plus they still collect the $6/10 per month DVR service fee.

This way Dish could cater to both sets of customers. The cheapest possible customers get TV on the cheap, the whales get every channel and lots of recievers at a reasonable price.

I think you are right that they are charging so much for receivers because they cater to the value customer. They cannot recoup expensive DVRs and such from these value customers at $5/month. DIRECTV has the advantage because of the higher price packages covers the extra equipment costs as far as the company is concerned, so it looks better to the higher end sub.

Also Dish has done discounting like this in the past with AEP getting "free" DVR service.

harshness said:

I didn't speak to the DIRECTV US net growth other than it needed to be considered apart from that of DIRECTV LA, but since you mentioned it, they tied a record for lowest growth in recent history set in Q1.

If you must see a positive spin before you will relent on your DIRECTV campaign, DISH Network has had greater subscriber losses in recent history.

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DK on a *D campaign?? Sorry, but I don't see it. DodgerKing is one of the most fair, open-minded, objective, and helpful people on these boards. I'm a *E sub and while DK might call out Dish on their many issues, he's always fair, and even posts things where *E has an advantage. He also calls out *D on their issues.

He likes his service from *D and says so, that doesn't make one a fanboy.

Just my opinion....

one or two of the analysts claimed that dish was trying to cut loose some of the cheap subs.

Except the only problem with that logic is that the receiver price changes and the international price increases directly target the expensive subs...

a lot of the analysts comments seem out of touch with what Dish is actually doing

DodgerKing said:

And they are not a gambling site either.

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I read that somewhere.

Dish dropped the cheaper packages that they have. They should allow the cheaper packages only to those that want to pay for their own hardware and install and at least still make them available. Or perhaps a seperate plan for those that do not take any promotions to allow them to get programming cheaper if they do not have to ever be subsidized.