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RTCDude

Last reply Apr 22, 2025 · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

How does DPH work?

Also we haven't explained what block downconversion (the 'B' in LNBF) exactly is. An LNA (either standalone or as the front section of an LNB/F) simply amplifies the satellite signal without altering its frequencies. On early C-band systems, the LNA was connected to a downconverter, usually via a short length of large-dia. coax using the large 'N' connectors. Couldn't send the signal on regular coax or very far on any coax as it's the microwave-frequency sat signal. The downconverter was typically strapped to the dish pole or to the feed assembly (LNA & feedhorn) and controlled by the rx via wire to select individual xpdrs, which the downconverter then sent in to the rx on regular coax using a much lower-frequency "intermediate" (IF) carrier, typically 70 mhz (this could be called "single downconversion").

With block downconversion, all xpdrs are downconverted simultaneously to individual IFs (a "block" of frequencies), either with a standalone BDC connected to LNA or by using an LNB (which combines LNA and BDC). On C-band, either all 12 xpdrs as V (vertical polarization) would be sent in at once, with the rx then tuning the desired 1 of the 12, or if then selecting a ch. on an H (horizontal) polarization, the rx would command the feed to switch from V to H, and then the same 12 xpdrs as H-polarized would be sent in, on the same IF carriers, to pick from. The limitation was that any 2nd receiver in the home would only be able to select from odd #'d ch's if the 1st rx was on odd, or only even #'d ch's if the 1st was on even. And of course, comparing with DBS, you couldn't view from 2 different sat positions at once. Later C-band options included using a feed with 2 LNB's, one mounted horizontally and the other vertically, to allow for independent odd-even selection (but still limited to same sat).

When DBS came out it continued this same block downconversion for Single LNBFs, adding H/V switching by the device power (on the coax) being toggled between 13 and 18v. Dual LNBFs then allowed the use of added in-line switches to do the toggling to serve multiple rx's, but you had to run 4 coaxes in from the dish (for the initial 500, 2 for 300). The initial 500 Twin had built-in switching and still used 13/18 to switch. DP (DishPro) Twin (and Single) then "stacked" both the H & V signals into 2 differentiated blocks of IFs that all went down the coax together, so you could go straight from LNBF to 2 dual-tuner rx's with no switch in-line (just those HF splitters at the rx's). The freq. stacking resulted in higher-ranging IFs (intermediate block freq's) that sometimes exposed weaknesses in coax runs. DPP (DishPro Plus) merely added an input to the DP Twin/Triple that could combine in the output from a DP Single on a separate dish with no need for a combiner/switch. DP & DPP are exactly the same to rx's save for this added input connection.

Now somebody gets to explain how the DPH works, as I have no idea...

Ok, I'll start. On another thread telstar_1 posted the above about the early days of LNA, LNBA, LNB, LNBF development progression. And at the end asking about how DPH works; I'd like to know that too. Can anyone give a detailed description on how DPH works?

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HipKat

Apr 19, 2025

DPH (DISH Pro Hybrid) technology is a versatile satellite reception system that can switch between multiple DISH technologies depending on the receiver connected to it. Here are the key features:

Compatible Technologies:

DP (DISH Pro)
DPP (DISH Pro Plus)
DPX (DISH Pro Extreme)
DPZ (DISH Pro Zip)

Key Capabilities:

Supports band stacking (2 tuners) or FSK channel stacking (16 tuners)
When in DPZ mode, only port 1 outputs DPZ signal and port 2 is disabled
Internal switching capability that can be disabled when connected to external switches
Compatible with various receiver configurations:
- 2 ViP Single tuners
- 2 ViP Dual tuners
- 2 Hopper 2000's or Hopper With Slings
- 1 Hopper 3 (Port 2 turns off when connected)
- Up to 8 Wallys in dual tuner mode with DPZ Channel Stack Splitters
- Up to 16 Wallys in single tuner mode with DPZ Channel Stack Splitters

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RTCDude

Apr 19, 2025

HipKat said:
DPH (DISH Pro Hybrid) technology is a versatile satellite reception system that can switch between multiple DISH technologies depending on the receiver connected to it. Here are the key features:

Compatible Technologies:

DP (DISH Pro)

DPP (DISH Pro Plus)

DPX (DISH Pro Extreme)

DPZ (DISH Pro Zip)

Key Capabilities:

Supports band stacking (2 tuners) or FSK channel stacking (16 tuners)

When in DPZ mode, only port 1 outputs DPZ signal and port 2 is disabled

Internal switching capability that can be disabled when connected to external switches

Compatible with various receiver configurations:

2 ViP Single tuners

2 ViP Dual tuners

2 Hopper 2000's or Hopper With Slings

1 Hopper 3 (Port 2 turns off when connected)

Up to 8 Wallys in dual tuner mode with DPZ Channel Stack Splitters

Up to 16 Wallys in single tuner mode with DPZ Channel Stack Splitters

I've not heard of DPX and DPZ before. Can you explain them in more detail please?

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HipKat

Apr 20, 2025

RTCDude said:
I've not heard of DPX and DPZ before. Can you explain them in more detail please?

This is what I found. The Frequency ranges are confusing to me since I thought ALL Hoppers use up 3000 Mhz

DPZ is older legacy equipment

DPZ Frequency Range:
- 500MHz - 2150MHz
- Minimum 3GHz rated RG6 and components required from LNBF to Receiver
- Note: Tight bends in cable reduces the frequency rating
Communication:
- FSK
  - Includes all the advances from DiSEqC
  - A new protocol was needed for the channel stacking technology
    - Each CSS Channel is set to the desired satellite transponder
  - Support 16 tuners simultaneously over one cable for the Hopper 3
  - Only ZiP equipment is compatible with FSK
    - Dish Pro Hybrid LNBs are backwards compatible with DP/DPP/XiP receivers using DiSEqC
- Channel Stack Switching
  - Full Transponders are split out (rather than odd and evens)
- MoCA
  - MoCA stands for Multimedia over Coaxial Alliance and is the standard protocol for transmitting Internet data over coaxial wiring, or Ethernet over coax
  - Clients (Joeys) in DISH systems use data transmission instead of video signals to function
Tuners Supported Per Coax:
- 18, 16 for receiver use
Diplexer Support:
- None
- Note: OTA and TV2 feeds cannot be diplexed on DPX systems as they run on the same frequencies as MoCA and will interfere with each other
Splitter Support:
- Spitter use is designed to split Client feeds (MoCA)
- Client feeds require at minimum 900MHz rated RG59
Channel Stack Splitter Support:
- In commercial installations Channel Stack Splitter use is designed to split the CSS band for multiple receiver use
- Up to 8 Wallys in dual tuner mode
- Up to 16 Wallys in single tuner mode
- Channel Stack feeds require at minimum 3GHz rated RG6
- Note: a power inserter or switch is required
Check Switch:
- 1-5 steps depending on equipment attached

DPX, I believe is the Hoppers

DPX Frequency Range:
- 650MHz - 30000MHz
- Minimum 3GHz rated RG6 and components required from LNBF to Receiver
- Note: Tight bends in cable reduces the frequency rating
Communication:
- Two way
- DiSEqC
  - Two way signals over the coaxial cable to select and control the appropriate satellite from the set-top box
    - This is the first protocol DISH used that allowed for two-way communication
    - It requires compatibility from both the receiver and the outdoor equipment
  - This allows the set top box to easily switch signals from one LNB to another LNB directly from the set-top box
  - Allows the receiver to determine what kind of switch gear is connected
  - Allows the switches and LNBs in the install to identify what they are and what satellite signal is being carried
- Band Stacking
  - Three satellite frequency bands are created
  - Odd and even transponders share a frequency band
  - Each frequency band has two way communication
- MoCA
  - MoCA stands for Multimedia over Coaxial Alliance and is the standard protocol for transmitting Internet data over coaxial wiring, or Ethernet over coax
  - Clients (Joeys) in DISH systems use data transmission instead of video signals to function
Tuners Supported Per Coax:
- 3
Splitter Support:
- Spitter use is designed to split Client feeds (MoCA)
- Client feeds require at minimum 900MHz rated RG59
Diplexer Support:
- None
- Note: OTA and TV2 feeds cannot be diplexed on DPX systems as they run on the same frequencies as MoCA and will interfere with each other
Check Switch:
- 1-5 steps depending on equipment attached

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telstar_1

Apr 20, 2025

All I can make of this is that they switched to a different stacking scheme (as above) for the hopper given its extended # of tuners, named it DPX, and then renamed or redesignated the (old) DP/DPP scheme as DPZ (evidently to distinguish from DPX). The DPX scheme operates by FSK (what's this?) switching under DiSEqC 2-way comms protocol.

Also they've designated a chunk of freq's for IP comms (MoCA) between set-top boxes, compatible both with DPX and the older DPZ.

What I make of this is that this hopper (DPX) system was designed not as much for systems versatility (support more tuners, etc.) as to keep a tight leash on cx's. They have to put a box at every set where they want to independently view, and those "client" boxes are tied to and communicate via IP with a hopper rx. A design to thwart "stacking" use of rx's by forcing all boxes to register systemic connection to one another to operate. But to my mind they could also have accomplished that by designing "whole house" rx's where you wouldn't need all of these "joeys" to begin with.

Also, and maybe a current dealer can chime in, this MoCA IP comms scheme has the "client" boxes receiving A/V from already-tuned ch's from a hopper and don't have any tuners themselves. They command the hopper as to which ch's to tune. Because MoCA takes up freq's used by broadcast this has further effect of knocking out the ability to diplex offair OR TV2 (again requiring another box rather than just using RF remote and not needing another box) over sat box coax, so you'd have to revert to running separate coax everywhere just for adding offair.

Buried within the callout for DPZ is this definition of DPH- new components (like LNBF) that work with current DPX as well as being "backward compatible" with "DP, DPP, XiP rx's using DiSEqC." OK, now what's an "XiP" rx? Or for that matter a DP rx? A 722 (ViP) doesn't need DP, it can run from an old original non-dp Twin over 2 coaxes. Would a "DP rx" be like one that can take a DP input directly for multi-tuner without having to split it for like the 2 inputs on 722/322? So with this XiP (as well as DP & DPP) rx's are we talking hopper-era only and not ViP?

Also I don't get how a single LNBF (this DPH) could be compatible with both DP and DPX given that the 2 use different bandstacking schemes that overlap one another.

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RTCDude

Apr 20, 2025

telstar_1 said:
The DPX scheme operates by FSK (what's this?)

FSK stands for Frequency Shift Keying. This is where the carrier frequency is shifted slightly up or down to indicate a "bit" of information. This scheme is more immune radio propagation and fading issues than CW (Continuous Wave) transmissions where the carrier is turned on and off to denote "bit" information.

FSK was first used in wireless telegraph systems to denote the "dits" and "dahs" for Morse Code. FSK is now used routinely in wireless digital systems to indicate digital 1 and 0 "bits" of information. Some systems use multiple shift levels to "compress" information (say 8 shift levels for values 0 to 7) into the same bandwidth.

A similar scheme, PSK, changes the phase of carrier instead of the frequency, and can use multiple phase shift levels for similar compression.

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RTCDude

Apr 20, 2025

HipKat said:
This is what I found. The Frequency ranges are confusing to me since I thought ALL Hoppers use up 3000 Mhz

DPZ is older legacy equipment
View attachment 180834

DPZ Frequency Range:

500MHz - 2150MHz

Minimum 3GHz rated RG6 and components required from LNBF to Receiver

Note: Tight bends in cable reduces the frequency rating

Communication:

FSK

Includes all the advances from DiSEqC

A new protocol was needed for the channel stacking technology

Each CSS Channel is set to the desired satellite transponder

Support 16 tuners simultaneously over one cable for the Hopper 3

Only ZiP equipment is compatible with FSK

Dish Pro Hybrid LNBs are backwards compatible with DP/DPP/XiP receivers using DiSEqC

Channel Stack Switching

Full Transponders are split out (rather than odd and evens)

MoCA

MoCA stands for Multimedia over Coaxial Alliance and is the standard protocol for transmitting Internet data over coaxial wiring, or Ethernet over coax

Clients (Joeys) in DISH systems use data transmission instead of video signals to function

Tuners Supported Per Coax:

18, 16 for receiver use

Diplexer Support:

None

Note: OTA and TV2 feeds cannot be diplexed on DPX systems as they run on the same frequencies as MoCA and will interfere with each other

Splitter Support:

Spitter use is designed to split Client feeds (MoCA)

Client feeds require at minimum 900MHz rated RG59

Channel Stack Splitter Support:

In commercial installations Channel Stack Splitter use is designed to split the CSS band for multiple receiver use

Up to 8 Wallys in dual tuner mode

Up to 16 Wallys in single tuner mode

Channel Stack feeds require at minimum 3GHz rated RG6

Note: a power inserter or switch is required

Check Switch:

1-5 steps depending on equipment attached

DPX, I believe is the Hoppers
View attachment 180833

DPX Frequency Range:

650MHz - 30000MHz

Minimum 3GHz rated RG6 and components required from LNBF to Receiver

Note: Tight bends in cable reduces the frequency rating

Communication:

Two way

DiSEqC

Two way signals over the coaxial cable to select and control the appropriate satellite from the set-top box

This is the first protocol DISH used that allowed for two-way communication

It requires compatibility from both the receiver and the outdoor equipment

This allows the set top box to easily switch signals from one LNB to another LNB directly from the set-top box

Allows the receiver to determine what kind of switch gear is connected

Allows the switches and LNBs in the install to identify what they are and what satellite signal is being carried

Band Stacking

Three satellite frequency bands are created

Odd and even transponders share a frequency band

Each frequency band has two way communication

MoCA

MoCA stands for Multimedia over Coaxial Alliance and is the standard protocol for transmitting Internet data over coaxial wiring, or Ethernet over coax

Clients (Joeys) in DISH systems use data transmission instead of video signals to function

Tuners Supported Per Coax:

3

Splitter Support:

Spitter use is designed to split Client feeds (MoCA)

Client feeds require at minimum 900MHz rated RG59

Diplexer Support:

None

Note: OTA and TV2 feeds cannot be diplexed on DPX systems as they run on the same frequencies as MoCA and will interfere with each other

Check Switch:

1-5 steps depending on equipment attached

Fantastic information. Thanks a lot.

However, I think you got your DPZ/DPX group labels backwards. DPZ appears to be for Hopper3s (owning to the 16 (18) simultaneous channels), DPX appears to be for the earlier Hopper1s, Wallys (single tuner), and Hopper2s (three tuners). Is that correct?

Also, from what I understand, DiSEqC is the communication protocol that is used in the MoCA band to do all the switch configuration inquiries and receiver identification. And DiSEqC commands are used to select which channels are in the group of 16 in DPZ, correct?

Where do ViP receivers fit in these schemes?

Lastly, just to clarify, in DPZ there is only one group of 16 stacked channels, correct?

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telstar_1

Apr 20, 2025

RTCDude said:
FSK stands for Frequency Shift Keying. This is where the carrier frequency is shifted slightly up or down to indicate a "bit" of information. This scheme is more immune radio propagation and fading issues than CW (Continuous Wave) transmissions where the carrier is turned on and off to denote "bit" information.

FSK was first used in wireless telegraph systems to denote the "dits" and "dahs" for Morse Code. FSK is now used routinely in wireless digital systems to indicate digital 1 and 0 "bits" of information. Some systems use multiple shift levels to "compress" information (say 8 shift levels for values 0 to 7) into the same bandwidth.

A similar scheme, PSK, changes the phase of carrier instead of the frequency, and can use multiple phase shift levels for similar compression.

So this is at the sat transmission level? Which rx's use it? Everything hopper-forward?

tjboston5676 said:
Dpz was dpp with a solo node or duo node.
Dpx is hybrid

Now I'm even more confused. The info says that DPH, which we've previously established to mean DishPro Hybrid, is backward-compatible with all rx's that can use DP & DiSEqC- how far back in rx's would that go? Thus "Dpx is hybrid" would seem to contradict that statement by DiSH. My understanding from that information is that all the new stuff needs something more advanced than simply the old DP stuff, but that they're now putting out LNBFs and the like (Hybrid) that can be used on both new-rx installs and older (possibly) pre-hopper rx's. So has there been a DPX-only LNBF?

What are solo and dual nodes and what rx's used with (not mentioned in the explainers)?

Finally, what is an XiP receiver? It looks like a ZiP receiver would be something at the hopper level but using the DP(Z) scheme rather than DPX. Is it like ViP, then ZiP and then Xip? Never heard of this.

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RTCDude

Apr 20, 2025

telstar_1 said:
So this is at the sat transmission level? Which rx's use it? Everything hopper-forward?

Now I'm even more confused. The info says that DPH, which we've previously established to mean DishPro Hybrid, is backward-compatible with all rx's that can use DP & DiSEqC- how far back in rx's would that go? Thus "Dpx is hybrid" would seem to contradict that statement by DiSH. My understanding from that information is that all the new stuff needs something more advanced than simply the old DP stuff, but that they're now putting out LNBFs and the like (Hybrid) that can be used on both new-rx installs and older (possibly) pre-hopper rx's. So has there been a DPX-only LNBF?

What are solo and dual nodes and what rx's used with (not mentioned in the explainers)?

Finally, what is an XiP receiver? It looks like a ZiP receiver would be something at the hopper level but using the DP(Z) scheme rather than DPX. Is it like ViP, then ZiP and then Xip? Never heard of this.

FSK is only used in MoCA communications between devices on the local coax, and has nothing to do with the satellite signals.

I think I'm beginning to understand DPH now, it's all in the acronym of "hybrid". It appears a DPH LNBF is a configurable LNBF as four LNBFs in one, DP, DPP, DPX, and DPZ. Once the device configuration on the coax network is identified, the DPH LNBF is told (via MoCA commands) which LNBF to act like for each of it coax output ports. Then, with all of the appropriate nodes, diplexers, and switchs the correct LNBF style information is steered to the proper group of receivers.

Have I got this correct?

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telstar_1

Apr 22, 2025

RTCDude said:
FSK is only used in MoCA communications between devices on the local coax, and has nothing to do with the satellite signals.

I think I'm beginning to understand DPH now, it's all in the acronym of "hybrid". It appears a DPH LNBF is a configurable LNBF as four LNBFs in one, DP, DPP, DPX, and DPZ. Once the device configuration on the coax network is identified, the DPH LNBF is told (via MoCA commands) which LNBF to act like for each of it coax output ports. Then, with all of the appropriate nodes, diplexers, and switchs the correct LNBF style information is steered to the proper group of receivers.

Have I got this correct?

Sounds reasonable. DiSH was always big & strong on coming out with ever-advancing technologies- it just wasn't so big & strong on serving cx's

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Scott Greczkowski

Staff member HERE TO HELP YOU! Cutting Edge

Last reply 5 minutes ago · posted in The Chit Chat Club

Song Name Game Part 3!

Sometimes a thread gets so many posts in it that is can cause issues for the server so that why today we introduce The Song Name Game Part 3!

So let the game continue!

The last song was added by Bobby who posted...

One Meat Ball - Andrews Sisters

CONTINUE ON AND HAVE FUN! WELCOME HOME TO SATELLITEGUYS.US!

Here are the original rules for the game as posted by WebbyDude back in 2006. http://www.satelliteguys.us/threads/68645-Song-Name-Game

Just name a song title and the band who performed it. The next person does the same thing, but needs to list a song title or band name which includes a word from the previous entry. Pick songs from any genre.

Example:

Long Live Rock and Roll -- Rainbow

Rainbow in the Dark -- Dio

Another example:

Ride the Lightning -- Metallica

Lightning Strikes -- Ozzy Osbourne

Get it?

An additional note: we all know that song titles, sometimes, use profane words. Because this is a family friendly website it is advised that you clean up that title up a bit. This is accomplished by using something like sh!t instead of the real word. Thanks....

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Bobby

Today at 11:48 AM

This Should Go On Forever - Rod Bernard

long_time_Dish

34 minutes ago

Go On Cry - Heart

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dishstaller

32 minutes ago

Let Her Cry - Hootie & the Blowfish

harshness

24 minutes ago

Let Her In - Vince Gill

sdfntx

5 minutes ago

Devil in Her Heart - The Beatles

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Bobby

Supporting Founder Lifetime Supporter

Last reply 9 minutes ago · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

4K Events Discussion Thread

This thread is a place to discuss the 4K events that appear on channel 540. We are getting, at this point, one college football game a week. Let's hope there is more coming.

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Bobby

Oct 13, 2026

MLB, Brewers at Dodgers, Thursday 10-15, 6PM PDT, Channel 148-02.

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Foxbat

Oct 15, 2026

Bobby said:
MLB, Brewers at Dodgers, Thursday 10-15, 6PM PDT, Channel 148-02.

Bobby said:
CFB, Notre Dame at BYU, Saturday 10-27, 4:30PM PDT, Channel 148-03.

Bobby said:
CFB, Ohio State at Indiana, Saturday 10-17, 9AM PDT, Channel 148-01.
CFB, Arizona State at Texas Tech, Saturday 10-17, 12:30PM PDT, Channel 148-01.

Hmmm, I'm not seeing anything like those events in our Hopper 3 guide for tonight or Saturday.

I went into the Tools menu and requested a Guide Update. I'll try looking at it after the update completes.

edit — I now have the 148-01 4KFox events for Saturday, but not anything for 148-02 or 148-03 which don't even show as available channels. I do have 148-04 4KUSA.

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Bobby

Oct 15, 2026

Foxbat said:
Hmmm, I'm not seeing anything like those events in our Hopper 3 guide for tonight or Saturday.

I went into the Tools menu and requested a Guide Update. I'll try looking at it after the update completes.

edit — I now have the 148-01 4KFox events for Saturday, but not anything for 148-02 or 148-03 which don't even show as available channels. I do have 148-04 4KUSA.

As I recall you have the Flex package. Do you sub to multisport? -02 is FS1 and -03 is ESPN. -01 is Fox so you would get that if you sub to locals.

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Bobby

Oct 15, 2026

Bobby said:
As I recall you have the Flex package. Do you sub to multisport? -02 is FS1 and -03 is ESPN. -01 is Fox so you would get that if you sub to locals.

As an edit, you need to sub to the National Action Pack at $12 a month to receive those channels.

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Foxbat

Oct 15, 2026

Which is what is interesting, I see the 4KFox channel on 148-01 but we're not subscribed to our Locals. So why it's coming in is puzzling. I thought that maybe it was a perk for Dish subscribers for the MLB Postseason.

I set a Timer for the Indiana - Ohio State game on Saturday. I'll take advantage of it while I can.

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Foxbat

9 minutes ago

Foxbat said:
I set a Timer for the Indiana - Ohio State game on Saturday. I'll take advantage of it while I can.

Even though it didn't work out for the Hoosiers, this event recorded and I was able to watch it in full 4K HDR.

Bobby said:
MLB, Rays at Brewers, Friday 10-23, 5PM PDT, Channel 148-01.

Timer is set to Record the Series. Thanks, Bobby!

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dishstaller

Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter

Last reply 15 minutes ago · posted in The Chit Chat Club

You can't even trust the cost per ounce info in grocery stores anymore

I'm surprised Walmart hasn't banned this guy from all of their stores. He has been on their CASE the past few months.

View: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/f3zr37ekgKM?feature=share

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Juan

Wednesday at 11:17 AM

dishstaller said:
I'm surprised Walmart hasn't banned this guy from all of their stores. He has been on their CASE the past few months.

View: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/f3zr37ekgKM?feature=share

When walmart set a price...they weigh the container and the product...the product label only shows the weight of the product...I am sure if you brought your own plastic baggies to bring the product home you could get the cheaper price

dishstaller

Wednesday at 11:47 AM

Juan said:
When walmart set a price...they weigh the container and the product...

Then they are stupid. Everyone knows that the price per ounce should be the price per ounce of actual product.

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Juan

Wednesday at 1:38 PM

dishstaller said:
Then they are stupid. Everyone knows that the price per ounce should be the price per ounce of actual product.

You are paying for the whole thing

telstar_1

Wednesday at 2:22 PM

Juan said:
You are paying for the whole thing

Well, the bag can't weigh that much, right? But by law food product packaging must display the actual net weight of the product, i.e., the contents of the container, so by any logic, if not law, a store's stated per-ounce cost should reflect that figure. But since there's not any law regulating shelf statements, a store can say whatever it wants without violating any rules. So I guess the answer is more consumer legislation. Or simply caveat emptor.

Juan

Wednesday at 3:07 PM

telstar_1 said:
Well, the bag can't weigh that much, right? But by law food product packaging must display the actual net weight of the product, i.e., the contents of the container, so by any logic, if not law, a store's stated per-ounce cost should reflect that figure. But since there's not any law regulating shelf statements, a store can say whatever it wants without violating any rules. So I guess the answer is more consumer legislation. Or simply caveat emptor.

But a box can weigh more than an ounce..maybe 2...a can might weigh 5 ounces..a bag...not much

dishstaller

Wednesday at 3:13 PM

Juan said:
.a bag...not much

Well, according to the price per ounce on that first bag of coffee he mentions, that would mean the bag weighed over 6 ounces. That bag does NOT weigh 6 ounces. According to Google, an empty bag weighs half an ounce.

Juan

Yesterday at 7:13 AM

dishstaller said:
Well, according to the price per ounce on that first bag of coffee he mentions, that would mean the bag weighed over 6 ounces. That bag does NOT weigh 6 ounces. According to Google, an empty bag weighs half an ounce.

You need to weigh the actual bag...a deli bag weighs less than that but a thick coffee bag is gonna weigh around an ounce...an empty tin can has some weight

NYDutch

Yesterday at 7:44 AM

Juan said:
You need to weigh the actual bag...a deli bag weighs less than that but a thick coffee bag is gonna weigh around an ounce...an empty tin can has some weight

Products sold by the ounce, pound, etc, should always be priced for the product only. Only the shipping weight should include the packaging.

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harshness

Yesterday at 9:21 AM

NYDutch said:
Products sold by the ounce, pound, etc, should always be priced for the product only.

Unless the specific product or its packaging is known at the time of weighing, estimating the tare weight for a PoS system is a tall order.

I'm pretty sure that produce bags can't get any thinner.

You certainly don't want to put unbagged produce on a belt, scale, or in a clerk's hands (gloved or not).

Jimbo

Yesterday at 9:27 AM

harshness said:
Unless the specific product or its packaging is known at the time of weighing, estimating the tare weight for a PoS system is a tall order.

I'm pretty sure that produce bags can't get any thinner.

You certainly don't want to put unbagged produce on a belt, scale, or in a clerk's hands (gloved or not).

I would think that all the packaging would already be accounted for ... they weigh the container, subtract that from the scale, then add the product , so its weighing the Product only

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dishstaller

Yesterday at 10:09 AM

Juan said:
but a thick coffee bag is gonna weigh around an ounce...

Obviously you didn't read my post.....google says a coffee bag weighs half an ounce. But let's say you are correct and it DOES weigh a full ounce, that would still fall 5 ounces shy for Walmart's numbers to match.
You wouldn't happen to be kin to Bernie would you

Juan

Yesterday at 1:31 PM

dishstaller said:
Obviously you didn't read my post.....google says a coffee bag weighs half an ounce. But let's say you are correct and it DOES weigh a full ounce, that would still fall 5 ounces shy for Walmart's numbers to match.
You wouldn't happen to be kin to Bernie would you

None of it means a hill of coffee beans...the price is the price...its not going to get any lower...as long as you pay the price on the shelf at the register..there is no crime

dishstaller

Yesterday at 1:55 PM

Juan said:
None of it means a hill of coffee beans...the price is the price...its not going to get any lower...as long as you pay the price on the shelf at the register..there is no crime

I can't BELIEVE this is being such a difficult subject. The issue isn't the price....it's the advertised price per ounce. A lot of shoppers, myself included, use the price per ounce in determining which is the better value....with that number being inaccurate, it can trick someone into thinking that one product cost less per ounce than a competing product. Is this a crime?...above my pay grade. Is it dishonest? Yes.

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Juan

Yesterday at 2:31 PM

dishstaller said:
I can't BELIEVE this is being such a difficult subject. The issue isn't the price....it's the advertised price per ounce. A lot of shoppers, myself included, use the price per ounce in determining which is the better value....with that number being inaccurate, it can trick someone into thinking that one product cost less per ounce than a competing product. Is this a crime?...above my pay grade. Is it dishonest? Yes.

Again it makes no difference...call the ftc and file a complaint...maybe your lawyer can file a class action lawsuit and you can collect your 25 cents

harshness

15 minutes ago

Jimbo said:
I would think that all the packaging would already be accounted for ... they weigh the container, subtract that from the scale, then add the product , so its weighing the Product only.

You would be thinking wrong when it comes to goods that are sold by weight (meat, produce, nails). Those items typically go on the scale wrapped without an associated tare. The weight only excludes the sticker because it hasn't been printed yet.

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SatZach

Last reply 27 minutes ago · posted in The Chit Chat Club

Hello again

I haven't posted in almost 17 years. Over the air, sat, offline, anything-but-the-internet is still one of my avid pursuits. Been playing with offline tv viewing and offline web browsing. I have great appreciations for this site still being here. It's so hard to find public communities that haven't sold out to social media company.

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dishstaller

Today at 3:11 PM

Got to admit, I had to look up "offline web browsing". I had never heard of it.

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Scott Greczkowski

Today at 3:12 PM

Welcome back, as you can see we branched off into a bunch of things since Satellite is what it is now, so lots to talk about here.

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Jimbo

Today at 3:16 PM

dishstaller said:
Got to admit, I had to look up "offline web browsing". I had never heard of it.

From what I understand, it's just saving a article or whatever, to Save it so you can read it later ....
Unless he's talking something entirely different ... the way I am looking at it, you Still need the Internet to load it originally.

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dishstaller

27 minutes ago

Jimbo said:
the way I am looking at it, you Still need the Internet to load it originally.

That was kinda the way I understood it as well.

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SuperDish_Fan23

Last reply 33 minutes ago · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

Its crazy how the ViP922 is so rare for no reason.

Why are ViP922s So rare? like its crazy how ebay has none, i checked everywhere, also, i got a ViP222k now, which is actually activated!

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dishstaller

Yesterday at 3:14 PM

My Wife was recently in an antique store and saw a rotary desk phone and it had one of those sticker overlays that had a business listed with phone number under each number on the dial. She looked closer and it had my old Radio Shack listed under the 8...she bought it. Pretty cool keepsake. Back then I rented vhs movies as well so I had it listed as Radio Shack / Movie Gallery and then the phone number.

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Almighty1

Yesterday at 8:53 PM

I remember this in the news too...

$14,000 spent on rented rotary phone

A widow rented a rotary dial telephone for 42 years, paying what her family calculates as more than $14,000 for a now- outdated phone.

www.nbcnews.com

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Bobby

Yesterday at 9:21 PM

Almighty1 said:
I remember this in the news too...

$14,000 spent on rented rotary phone

A widow rented a rotary dial telephone for 42 years, paying what her family calculates as more than $14,000 for a now- outdated phone.

www.nbcnews.com

That is a misnomer. In the old days you subscribed to telephone service. That included the telephone line and one telephone. An extension cost $1 a month extra. So that $14,000 over 42 years was for the service not the leased telephone. There is no way they paid $28 a month for 42 years for a leased telephone.

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HIFI

Today at 12:44 AM

anybody remember this disaster ?

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SuperDish_Fan23

33 minutes ago

SuperDish_Fan23 said:
Why are ViP922s So rare? like its crazy how ebay has none, i checked everywhere, also, i got a ViP222k now, which is actually activated!

Whoever still has their 922, please let me know i just wanna see photos of the ui and other stuff

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Gary Toma

Staff member Pub Member / Supporter Cutting Edge

Last reply 41 minutes ago · posted in DIRECTV Technical Resources Forum

DIRECTV Transponder Map ~ Data 10/21/2026

The TPN Map Excel Presents all DIRECTV Channels:

National (50-States or wide/NAT+PR beams)
Local (Local-Into-Local or narrow/Spot beams)

Additional tabs provide:

OTA the (Over-The-Air) Database
VOD (Video On_Demand) Records
Offline Records
Engr Records
Net Decoder a graphic presentation of all satellites and transponders

Domestic Satellites
@99W...... D11, D14
@101W.... D16
@103W.... D12, D15
@110W.... D5
@119W.... D8

Understanding the TPN Map

Making Sense of the TPN Map Display Conventions

DIRECTV_TPN_Map_261021.xlsx 1,876 KB

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jamieh1

Wednesday at 8:24 PM

Now in the Hornets and Hurricanes markets we just get the TV promise screen. But Directv still charges sports fee I am assuming.
Luckily my DTV stream package doesn't have a rsn fee. Figure DTV that always says is the leader in sports would have come to an agreement by now.

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KyL416

Wednesday at 9:33 PM

jamieh1 said:
Now in the Hornets and Hurricanes markets we just get the TV promise screen. But Directv still charges sports fee I am assuming.

Greenville-New Bern is $11.99 for MASN (Orioles) and Nationals
Raleigh is $11.99 for MASN and Nationals
Charlotte is $12.99 for BravesVision, MASN, Nationals and Reds

The fee in NC also includes the higher in state rate they have to pay for ACCN. Down in SC the fee is $15.99 as they are also a SEC state.
I'm not sure if they're doing it with those teams, but in some markets they also use the fee to cover the additional cost they have to pay for independents and MyNet stations that picked up full season NHL and NBA rights.

If you go to the TVPromise site, you'll likely be able to get a credit for not getting the Hurricanes and additional Hornets games that air on WITN-D2

jamieh1 said:
Figure DTV that always says is the leader in sports would have come to an agreement by now.

Part of the hold out might be the packaging and price for outer areas like how the Thunder needs sports pack for other states. Hopefully they are also pushing for a guarantee from the teams that they would require whoever wins their local broadcasting rights in 2028 to negotiate with MVPDs. Commercial distribution rights are probably a factor too.

I'm guessing they got a deep discount for the Clippers based on how long it took them to officially announce ClipperVision and their KTLA simulcasts after they were basically handed a multi-year draft death penalty.

The Predators and Pistons channels are using feeds supplied by Scripps Sports

The Heat likely depends on whoever they sign for the Fort Myers DMA, as there's no point in paying a high price for the Heat just for that DMA when WPLG is streaming it for free on their app and website for viewers in the Miami DMA, and they already carry the West Palm Beach station.

Reactions: Mr Tony

cp2k

Yesterday at 10:02 AM

KyL416 said:
If you go to the TVPromise site, you'll likely be able to get a credit for not getting the Hurricanes and additional Hornets games that air on WITN-D2

I tried this with both the Hurricanes and Hornets since I'm in upstate SC, and wasn't offered any kind of credit by the site. It's not a huge deal to me as I can pick up WSOC/WAXN over the air at my location even though I'm outside the Charlotte market.

TheRatPatrol

Yesterday at 12:39 PM

I thought the NBA TV contracts were short term as the NBA is trying to get all of the teams into in an all in one streaming app?

KyL416

Yesterday at 3:13 PM

649 GRZLLIES and 671 PACERS are now available.

The rest are still pointing to the TV Promise slate

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KyL416

Today at 3:20 PM

660 CAVLIERS, 668 TWOLVES and 680 SPURS are now available

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coolman302003

41 minutes ago

KyL416 said:
649 GRZLLIES and 671 PACERS are now available.

KyL416 said:
660 CAVLIERS, 668 TWOLVES and 680 SPURS are now available

One thing in common among these 5 teams is they all signed exclusive local streaming rights with DAZN (replacing traditional regional sports networks previously).

I know the Spurs are going to have 22 games OTA on (KMYS-TV CW35) in SA market but they will also still be on DAZN so a simulcast not exclusive to CW35 but in addition. So we should get all the Spurs feeds on NBA LP via the channel 680 remap.

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Tom Speer

Staff member Pub Member / Supporter Cutting Edge

Last reply 55 minutes ago · posted in DIRECTV Cutting Edge Information

DIRECTV Cutting Edge Non Disclosure Agreement

In order to participate in any Cutting Edge testing, you must sign a Non Disclosure Agreement (NDA). Attached are a .docx (Microsoft Word) and PDF version of the latest DirecTV NDA. I found it easiest to complete the .docx version then paste a photo or scan image of my signature, cropped closely to just the signature into it as a picture. Then set Word to wrap text around the picture so that the picture follows the text "Signature".

People who have better PDF tools than I do may prefer that version.

When you apply for any Cutting Edge testing, you will be told how to send the signed copy.

NONDISCLOSURE AGREEMENT (testers v2).docx 19 KB NONDISCLOSURE AGREEMENT (testers v2).pdf 95 KB

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Tom Speer

55 minutes ago

Any NDA you have signed before is still valid for the testing you have been and hopefull still are doing. The new NDA forms are ror new CE testers and new categories of CE testing. They have been placed here so that people who volunteer for any CE testing have access to them.

dishstaller

Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter

Last reply Today at 3:31 PM · posted in The Chit Chat Club

Been putting off buying a front/rear dashcam. This Civil Rights Lawyer video now has me moving forward

This was actually one of the more disturbing videos I've seen on this channel. IF this guy hadn't been driving a Tesla which has 360 degree cams, he would probably become a felon and had his life ruined.....all because of a lying cop. The other officers in this video didn't impress me too much either, their whole mentality was how can we nail this guy.
This is a perfect example of why I'm always a bit nervous when I get below Perry, FL. There is a huge difference between north and south Florida and everyone who lives here knows this.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4Q8q0KQQ14

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Bruce

Today at 3:31 PM

dishstaller said:
This was actually one of the more disturbing videos I've seen on this channel. IF this guy hadn't been driving a Tesla which has 360 degree cams, he would probably become a felon and had his life ruined.....all because of a lying cop. The other officers in this video didn't impress me too much either, their whole mentality was how can we nail this guy.
This is a perfect example of why I'm always a bit nervous when I get below Perry, FL. There is a huge difference between north and south Florida and everyone who lives here knows this.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4Q8q0KQQ14

Central is not any better, Polk County still does not have body cams.

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Bruce

Supporting Founder Lifetime Supporter

Last reply Today at 3:30 PM · posted in Internet Television (IPTV) Discussion Forum

How things have changed

I was reading this article

Cable TV ‘cord-cutters’ became the majority in 2022

The steady decline of cable and broadcast television, and the rise of streaming services, reached a sort of inflection point over the past year. Last summer, for the first time, streaming ser…

thehill.com

That said this-
Last summer, for the first time, streaming services like Netflix and Amazon Prime claimed the largest share of the television viewing audience, surpassing both cable and broadcast TV. Streaming captured 34.8 percent of July viewers, according to Nielsen data, compared to 34.4 percent for cable and 21.6 percent for broadcast.

And then, sometime in the second half of 2022, cord-cutters became the majority. The share of cable and satellite television subscribers dipped to 48 percent, according to a report from Samba TV, a television technology company.

Now I do not consider those with YTTV and the likes, Cord Cutters, but they still do not have Traditional Cable/Satellite delivered Live TV, so I decided to do the math.

There are, now, 129 Million Households in the United States.

In 2015, there were 100 Million Cable/Sat Subscribers , no streaming Live TV Service.

Today, there are 66 Million Live TV subscribers, including Cable, Satellite and Streaming.

Roughly, Streaming Live TV has 14 Million subs including all of them.

So that means, Cable/Satellite now has, roughly, 51 Million Households

So in just 8 years, lost 49% of their subscribers and by the end of this year, expected sub count to be, roughly, 45 million households.

That means a total loss of 55% since 2015 at the end of 2023.

But out of 129 Million households, 45 million will mean only 35% will get Cable/Satellite Delivered Live TV by the end of 2023.

Imagine what 2024 will be like.

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Jimbo

Today at 1:16 PM

But they ARE Streaming as well, so they Should be counted as both, which would make the Streaming numbers even More prominate.

Q.
Who does the Counting for Streaming ?

Neilson does the Broadcast/Cable ...

b4pjoe

Today at 1:25 PM

Jimbo said:
But they ARE Streaming as well, so they Should be counted as both, which would make the Streaming numbers even More prominate.

Q.
Who does the Counting for Streaming ?

Neilson does the Broadcast/Cable ...

But they are basically airing a number of live channels just like Broadcast, Cable, and Others so that is why they are counted that way.

Bruce

Today at 1:31 PM

Jimbo said:
But they ARE Streaming as well, so they Should be counted as both, which would make the Streaming numbers even More prominate.

Q.
Who does the Counting for Streaming ?

Neilson does the Broadcast/Cable ...

Same.

Ratings for streaming content is extremely accurate, since the service knows who is watching what and when, when we hit ok on our remotes.

Ratings for Broadcast/Cable shows has always been a estimate.

Jimbo

Today at 3:11 PM

Bruce said:
Same.

Ratings for streaming content is extremely accurate, since the service knows who is watching what and when, when we hit ok on our remotes.

Ratings for Broadcast/Cable shows has always been a estimate.

If I flip thru shows on an app, 3-4 in a few minutes, does that still show that I watched the whole episode ?

If I watch the Super Bowl for 5 minutes, does that count as watching the Super Bowl ?
Is it the same if I just watched the Commercials.

Bruce

Today at 3:30 PM

Jimbo said:
If I flip thru shows on an app, 3-4 in a few minutes, does that still show that I watched the whole episode ?

If I watch the Super Bowl for 5 minutes, does that count as watching the Super Bowl ?
Is it the same if I just watched the Commercials.

Nielsen Streaming Ratings: Third-party measurement firm Nielsen tracks U.S. streaming viewership, releasing weekly reports that measure total minutes viewed across major television sets, broken down by program (such as original, acquired, and movie content) rather than minute-by-minute audience retention curves.

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Bobby

Supporting Founder Lifetime Supporter

Last reply Today at 2:59 PM · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

Dish 4K Event Listings (No Discussion)

This is a thread that will keep you apprised of 4K events that will be showing on Dish channel 540. Keep looking here for information.

As of today, 9-27-17, there are no scheduled events posted for the next 2 weeks. That is subject to change on a daily basis.

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Bobby

Tuesday at 1:54 PM

CFB, Indiana at Michigan, Saturday 10-24, 9AM PDT, Channel 148-01.
CFB, BYU at UCF, Saturday 10-24, 12:30PM PDT, Channel 148-01.

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Bobby

Today at 2:54 PM

MLB, Rays at Brewers, Friday 10-23, 5PM PDT, Channel 148-01.

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Bobby

Today at 2:55 PM

MLB, Rays at Brewers, Saturday 10-24, 5PM PDT, Channel 148-01.

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Bobby

Today at 2:57 PM

MLB, Brewers at Rays, Monday 10-26, 5PM PDT, Channel 148-01.

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Bobby

Today at 2:59 PM

MLB, Brewers at Rays, Tuesday 10-27, 5PM PDT, Channel 148-01.

Reactions: charlesrshell

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How does DPH work?

Song Name Game Part 3!

4K Events Discussion Thread

You can't even trust the cost per ounce info in grocery stores anymore

Hello again

Its crazy how the ViP922 is so rare for no reason.

$14,000 spent on rented rotary phone

$14,000 spent on rented rotary phone

DIRECTV Transponder Map ~ Data 10/21/2026

DIRECTV Cutting Edge Non Disclosure Agreement

Been putting off buying a front/rear dashcam. This Civil Rights Lawyer video now has me moving forward

How things have changed

Cable TV ‘cord-cutters’ became the majority in 2022

Dish 4K Event Listings (No Discussion)