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Jimmy Dean

Last reply Oct 30, 2006 · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

EchoStar Statement in Response to Florida Court Ruling

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/061023/20061023006303.html?.v=1

"Over the nine year course of the litigation, EchoStar was able to reach settlements with seven of the eight plaintiffs, representing approximately 90 percent of all television network stations in the United States. We are disappointed the judge concluded that given the statutory language he was required to ignore those settlements and impose the injunction.

EchoStar will continue to do everything possible to prevent consumers from losing their distant network channels. We will ask Congress to clarify the statutory language, and ask the courts to re-consider their decision. In addition, we are taking numerous steps to protect our customers from unnecessarily losing access to those channels.

EchoStar has over 12.46 million subscribers, less than one million of whom subscribe to distant network channels. Federal law prohibits all satellite and cable companies from providing these channels to consumers except in very limited circumstances. EchoStar currently offers local ABC, NBC, CBS and Fox channels by satellite in 170 markets, serving over 96 percent of the U.S. population. These local networks are not part of the court injunction; therefore, a majority of our distant network customers will be able to watch their local network channels without interruption. In the limited areas where local channels are not available by satellite, we also intend to protect our customers by providing free off-air antennas and other alternatives.

Distant network channels are ABC, NBC, CBS and Fox broadcast channels that originate from a market outside the community in which a subscriber lives. The ruling does not involve, and there is no danger, that DISH Network customers will lose their local ABC, NBC, CBS or Fox network channels, or any of the other great programming available from EchoStar's DISH Network."

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Hall

Oct 23, 2006

I recall reading that with D* years ago, people would do the usual "move". The CSRs would normally "forget" to turn off the old locals though.

It seems to me that neither company was very strict about this. It cost them nothing and they in turn got add'l revenue each month for it. I've yet to read a good explanation of why E* is in trouble but D* isn't though. I've read that they used different DMA maps, specifically that E*'s was out of date.

ArtWIS

Oct 23, 2006

hall said:
I recall reading that with D* years ago, people would do the usual "move". The CSRs would normally "forget" to turn off the old locals though.

It seems to me that neither company was very strict about this. It cost them nothing and they in turn got add'l revenue each month for it. I've yet to read a good explanation of why E* is in trouble but D* isn't though. I've read that they used different DMA maps, specifically that E*'s was out of date.

In a "nutshell". Several years ago both D* and E* were in court because of giving out illegal distants. They were given court orders to cease and desist. D* complied with the court order and E* didn't, they just kept giving out DN's to subs who weren't eligible. This whole deal isn't new it's been in the courts for several years overall. The whole story can be found by searching through past threads on this subject.

Juan

Oct 23, 2006

ArtWIS said:
In a "nutshell". Several years ago both D* and E* were in court because of giving out illegal distants. They were given court orders to cease and desist. D* complied with the court order and E* didn't, they just kept giving out DN's to subs who weren't eligible. This whole deal isn't new it's been in the courts for several years overall. The whole story can be found by searching through past threads on this subject.

How can D* be judged to comply with the law when they still allow people to"move" and keep the same billing address. I think what is good for the goose should be good for the gander.

minnow

Oct 29, 2006

According to a reply in another thread by Greg Bimson:

From Multichannel.com, an article relating to the loss of the distant network license, written by Ted Hearn:
Quote:
CBS HD IMPACT

Separately, EchoStar has a deal that allows it to offer the high definition feed of a CBS affiliate to any household within a market that includes a CBS-owned affiliate. But the injunction would doom that in about 20 major markets.

So why would Dish Network pay $100 million to the affiliate boards? In order to keep the license not for the distant networks, but for the others services that are attached to the license:
Quote:
"Among their bouquet of core HDTV services, the CBS [deal] is probably the most viewed, it's the most important," according to Jimmy Schaeffler, senior financial and consulting analyst with The Carmel Group, who has been involved in legal matters for and against EchoStar in the last decade. "If you lose that, then you've lost a core sales tool for a part of your service which you consider the most important going forward and that is the HD channel."

The loss of the distant CBS in HD is important, but now the inability of ever using the distant license for ABC, NBC and Fox in HD is just as important. Dish Network will not get the rural customers network HD any longer. Also...
Quote:
The injunction would prevent EchoStar from providing what are called "significantly viewed" stations. These are popular TV stations seen by viewers who live outside the official boundary of a market, but within range of the stations' signals, according to Seth Davidson, a cable and copyright attorney at Fleischman and Walsh in Washington, D.C.

This public service message was brought to you by the always incorrect Greg Bimson.

So the answer to your question is yes, your going to lose your NY HD CBS feed.

Bob Haller

Oct 29, 2006

minnow said:
According to a reply in another thread by Greg Bimson:

From Multichannel.com, an article relating to the loss of the distant network license, written by Ted Hearn:
Quote:
CBS HD IMPACT

Separately, EchoStar has a deal that allows it to offer the high definition feed of a CBS affiliate to any household within a market that includes a CBS-owned affiliate. But the injunction would doom that in about 20 major markets.

So why would Dish Network pay $100 million to the affiliate boards? In order to keep the license not for the distant networks, but for the others services that are attached to the license:
Quote:
"Among their bouquet of core HDTV services, the CBS [deal] is probably the most viewed, it's the most important," according to Jimmy Schaeffler, senior financial and consulting analyst with The Carmel Group, who has been involved in legal matters for and against EchoStar in the last decade. "If you lose that, then you've lost a core sales tool for a part of your service which you consider the most important going forward and that is the HD channel."

The loss of the distant CBS in HD is important, but now the inability of ever using the distant license for ABC, NBC and Fox in HD is just as important. Dish Network will not get the rural customers network HD any longer. Also...
Quote:
The injunction would prevent EchoStar from providing what are called "significantly viewed" stations. These are popular TV stations seen by viewers who live outside the official boundary of a market, but within range of the stations' signals, according to Seth Davidson, a cable and copyright attorney at Fleischman and Walsh in Washington, D.C.

This public service message was brought to you by the always incorrect Greg Bimson.

So the answer to your question is yes, your going to lose your NY HD CBS feed.

if true charlie will take it to the supreme court, which will likely bring a stay till its heard in 2 or 3 years, when conveniently all stations are up

Claude Greiner

Oct 29, 2006

juan said:
How can D* be judged to comply with the law when they still allow people to"move" and keep the same billing address. I think what is good for the goose should be good for the gander.

But moving is legal, its the customer who bares the responcibility of the lie. Giving customer distants when they don't qualify is illegal and the programming provider bares the responcibility.

Chris Walker

Oct 29, 2006

I don't like E*'s silence on this. Where are the "CALL CONGRESS!!" messages? This is an election year, why not put some heat on these people right before people go vote? Where is any information from E* to the people that this potentially affects? It concerns me that Dish would be replying with such "they will be removed December 1st", while other sources say an appeal can be heard. I assume it's quite possible that E* themselves don't even know what to do? This is a HUGE problem for them, it'd be different if just the analog distants go away(which is a million pissed subs), but losing HD distants, and significantly viewed as well? This is a killer, E* has to go the appeal route.

Greg Bimson

Oct 30, 2006

Bob Haller said:
if true charlie will take it to the supreme court, which will likely bring a stay till its heard in 2 or 3 years, when conveniently all stations are up.

Uh, no.

Dish Network already filed for an emergency stay to the Supreme Court, back in July. It was denied.

Greg Bimson

Oct 30, 2006

Chris Walker said:
This is a HUGE problem for them, it'd be different if just the analog distants go away(which is a million pissed subs), but losing HD distants, and significantly viewed as well? This is a killer, E* has to go the appeal route.

Appeal to whom?

A few people have had this conversation before. The affiliate boards that tentatively settled can now walk away with nothing but the injunction. After all, now that the judge has effectively ended the old settlement, only Dish Network would appeal.

This only leaves the Eleventh Circuit Court of Appeals, which is the court that told the lower court ot issue the injunction, and the Supreme Court. I am certain that the Court of Appeals will not revisit the decision, as the entire judicial bench of the Circuit Court declined to review the decision by the three judges that mandated the injunction be issued.

That leaves the Supreme Court, which already denied a temporary stay back in July. Dish Network has already filed their writ of certoriari with the Supreme Court to review the decision by the Eleventh Circuit Court of Appeals. That is the last appeal in this whole process. And if the Supreme Court refuses to hear this (and I believe they will refuse to hear this), the entire suit is over.

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dfergie

Staff member HERE TO HELP YOU!

Last reply 5 minutes ago · posted in The Chit Chat Club

Gas Price Info With National Gas Temperature Map

Stumbled across this ... http://www.gaspricewatch.com/USGas_ZipSearch.asp
I found no local prices, although it did show stations at my location...
Added these to this post...
USA National Gas Temperature Map
State By State Gasoline Taxes
Gas Buddy

Ethanol Free Stations

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osu1991

Saturday at 11:49 AM

$3.55

reubenray

Saturday at 12:47 PM

$3.45 in Jane, MO.

Bobby

Yesterday at 11:04 AM

Regular$5.299
Premium$5.859
Diesel$7.599
at Costco, Rohnert Park.

harshness

Yesterday at 4:41 PM

Finally! Some big movement in California diesel pricing (and no, there is no such beastie as a diesel "winter formula").

Crude (combined pricing) is around $90/barrel now, so prices should have, at least, fallen in step with the crude futures.

dishstaller

5 minutes ago

harshness said:
Finally! Some big movement in California diesel pricing (and no, there is no such beastie as a diesel "winter formula").

Just curious here.....then why is diesel so much higher out there than it is elsewhere. Bobby just posted $7.59/gal, locally it is $5.59.....that's two bucks difference. :eeek

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Scott Greczkowski

Staff member HERE TO HELP YOU! Cutting Edge

Last reply 18 minutes ago · posted in The Chit Chat Club

Song Name Game Part 3!

Sometimes a thread gets so many posts in it that is can cause issues for the server so that why today we introduce The Song Name Game Part 3!

So let the game continue!

The last song was added by Bobby who posted...

One Meat Ball - Andrews Sisters

CONTINUE ON AND HAVE FUN! WELCOME HOME TO SATELLITEGUYS.US!

Here are the original rules for the game as posted by WebbyDude back in 2006. http://www.satelliteguys.us/threads/68645-Song-Name-Game

Just name a song title and the band who performed it. The next person does the same thing, but needs to list a song title or band name which includes a word from the previous entry. Pick songs from any genre.

Example:

Long Live Rock and Roll -- Rainbow

Rainbow in the Dark -- Dio

Another example:

Ride the Lightning -- Metallica

Lightning Strikes -- Ozzy Osbourne

Get it?

An additional note: we all know that song titles, sometimes, use profane words. Because this is a family friendly website it is advised that you clean up that title up a bit. This is accomplished by using something like sh!t instead of the real word. Thanks....

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EatMyVolts

Yesterday at 7:15 PM

Expressway to Your Heart -- The Soul Survivors

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long_time_Dish

Yesterday at 9:14 PM

Find A Way To My Heart - Phil Collins

hwkn

Today at 2:39 AM

FIND Your Way Back-Jefferson Starship

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ClarkGable

Today at 5:51 AM

Working My Way Back To You - The Four Seasons

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dishstaller

18 minutes ago

Don't Look Back - Boston

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KAB

Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter

55 minutes ago · posted in Movie Talk

James Gunn and Peter Safran lraving DC/WB.

Not a bit surprised.

'Superman' Director James Gunn Steps Down as Co-Lead of DC Studios

'Superman' director James Gunn is stepping down as co-lead of DC Studios with Peter Safran after four years in charge.

www.rollingstone.com

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ewindowman

Lifetime Supporter

Last reply Today at 5:30 AM · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

Dish Bankruptcy - Business as Usual

Looks like dish is Bankrupt. Filling tomorrow Tuesday June 30th

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slow_poke_pete

Yesterday at 6:38 PM

https://www.phonearena.com/news/att-reshoring-customer-care_id184650

Meanwhile att is getting rid of overseas call centers

Reactions: Almighty1, Bobby, HipKat and 1 other person

comfortably_numb

Yesterday at 6:52 PM

slow_poke_pete said:
https://www.phonearena.com/news/att-reshoring-customer-care_id184650

Meanwhile att is getting rid of overseas call centers

Too bad their service is expensive and their coverage sucks compared to the other two of the Big 3

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Juan

Yesterday at 9:50 PM

comfortably_numb said:
Too bad their service is expensive and their coverage sucks compared to the other two of the Big 3

Was that a back door compliment for Verizon?

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dishstaller

Yesterday at 10:00 PM

slow_poke_pete said:
Meanwhile att is getting rid of overseas call centers

Too little too late.

I can actually shed some light on the corp attitude towards call centers.

2015-2017 I was on the Viasat Dealer Council. They would fly us out to CO or CA and wine and dine us. Pretty cool but I was there to give my input because I was a top retailer and I wanted things to improve.
Anyway, at one of the meetings I brought up the fact that customers constantly complained about the overseas call centers. The VP of the company told me that I just didn't understand....those people cost something like 25% of what US employees would cost. Well, as usual when I went out to these meetings, I was loaded for bear....ie facts. I gave them an example of a customer who spent over an hour with one of these call centers and still never got her issue resolved. She called me the next morning after we opened and I had her situation fixed in 2 minutes. I told him "So you guys paid this overseas call center X amount but the customer still wasn't taken care of. I on the other hand, and a US call center probably would have as well because there wouldn't have been the language barrier, had her taken care of in 2 min. so your savings just went right out the door because a US call center would have taken care of her and MANY other customers while your overseas call center did nothing more than PISS off a customer.
Blank stares was all I got.

And THAT was when I realized just how incompetent most of the people are who run these companies. It WAS an enlightening experience.

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Almighty1

Today at 5:30 AM

Even 23 years ago, Verizon was known for having quality customer service. T-Mobile had quality customer service too but just poor mobile service. AT&T when it was still known as AT&T Wireless, Cingular Wireless both had poor customer service. This was when all three were providing customer service from the U.S. so even in the U.S., some companies are still better than others as it still depends on who they hire. That's the same reason AT&T Broadband Inc. which was basically their Cable TV never gotten far and got sold to Comcast.

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TWiT Tech Podcast Network

Today at 3:02 AM · posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

Whisky Pick: Red Bank Premium Blended

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DRv_fCg4cwc

Direct YouTube Link - Whisky Pick: Red Bank Premium Blended
TWIT's Website
TWIT Live Feed

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TWiT Tech Podcast Network

Today at 3:02 AM · posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

Linux Kernel TCP Flaw: Why Ubuntu’s Patch Deployed Later #shorts

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!

View: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/tHgIG14ouZI

Direct YouTube Link - Linux Kernel TCP Flaw: Why Ubuntu's Patch Deployed Later #shorts
TWIT's Website
TWIT Live Feed

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Ramy

Supporting Founder

Last reply Yesterday at 11:03 PM · posted in The Sports Section

2026-27 NCAA College Football

Really excited for this season with Kentucky having a new coach and some really exciting recruits. Probably won't last long, but here's hoping this season is great.

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osu1991

Yesterday at 7:29 PM

View: https://youtu.be/5_DttyI_U7w?is=YoV8IREFjzqWqhkn

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osu1991

Yesterday at 9:28 PM

View: https://x.com/nicoleauerbach/status/2119832833376264473?a=bqtZ2dTNOjpeQ2BLjpQ&s=61

cp2k

Yesterday at 9:56 PM

I like the move to campus sites for the early games. That adds a fun new dimension for fans, and cuts down on some of the travel expenses that would come with having to follow a team all the way through the playoffs at neutral sites.

Jimbo

Yesterday at 10:23 PM

cp2k said:
I like the move to campus sites for the early games. That adds a fun new dimension for fans, and cuts down on some of the travel expenses that would come with having to follow a team all the way through the playoffs at neutral sites.

Agree ... they started doing that a few years ago.

osu1991

Yesterday at 11:03 PM

View: https://x.com/nicoleauerbach/status/2119845930585493534?a=_FCm3YiL1xA3ITXQKks&s=61

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Bruce

Supporting Founder Lifetime Supporter

Last reply Yesterday at 10:48 PM · posted in Internet Television (IPTV) Discussion Forum

Traditional/Streaming Live TV Providers Losses, 3rd Quarter 2026 Edition

Comcast is the first to report, with a massive 274,000 loss in video subscribers.

In the 3Q of 2016, Comcast had 21.42 million video subscribers and was the #1 provider, now at 10.39 million and is the #3 Provider, YTTV is #2 ( who also surpassed DirecTV-8 Million and Dish-under 5 Million), Charter/Spectrum is #1.

Comcast Just Lost 274,000 TV Customers & 144,000 Internet Customers In Just Three Months | Cord Cutters News

Comcast Corporation reported its third-quarter 2026 results on October 22, showing continued erosion in its domestic residential broadband internet and video customer bases as competitive pressures intensified across the connectivity market. The company recorded a net loss of 144,000 domestic...

cordcuttersnews.com

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reubenray

Yesterday at 1:09 PM

In my area Cox (now Spectrum) has run everything underground instead of on poles.

Jimbo

Yesterday at 5:19 PM

reubenray said:
In my area Cox (now Spectrum) has run everything underground instead of on poles.

Thats good, the neighborhood generally look better with buried plant ... until someone puts a shovel into the line planting the Spring Garden.

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Bobby

Yesterday at 6:25 PM

Jimbo said:
Thats good, the neighborhood generally look better with buried plant ... until someone puts a shovel into the line planting the Spring Garden.

In my local area all underground utilities are under the sidewalk. Of course from there, when entering your property, They are at least 18" in your dirt.

Jimbo

Yesterday at 7:25 PM

Bobby said:
In my local area all underground utilities are under the sidewalk. Of course from there, when entering your property, They are at least 18" in your dirt.

I bet MOST of them are NOT 18", they may suppose to be, but I doubt they are .

Edison is definitely deep enough, but thats the only one ...

brice52

Yesterday at 7:39 PM

Jimbo said:
Thats good, the neighborhood generally look better with buried plant ... until someone puts a shovel into the line planting the Spring Garden.

My fiber isp put everything in conduit, except for the drop line to the NID and it it buried 10 inches

reubenray

Yesterday at 7:41 PM

Jimbo said:
Thats good, the neighborhood generally look better with buried plant ... until someone puts a shovel into the line planting the Spring Garden.

My area is very rocky, so there will be no shovels into the lines. Most of the lines were bored and the one's not bored where dug at least 18" deep. Cox had flagged my yard for them to dig up. But the foreman of the crew said he was not going to tear up my grass. He ended up installing the cable across the street at a vacant lot instead and bored the street for my pedestal. The line from the pedestal to my house could be damaged being it is fairly shallow.

Jimbo

Yesterday at 7:42 PM

brice52 said:
My fiber isp put everything in conduit, except for the drop line to the NID and it it buried 10 inches

Really, you Lucky Dog !

Do you Work for that ISP ? :biggrin

Bobby

Yesterday at 8:49 PM

Jimbo said:
I bet MOST of them are NOT 18", they may suppose to be, but I doubt they are .

Edison is definitely deep enough, but thats the only one ...

I did the underground trench utility designs for 9 years. Gas and electric were 24". Telephone and CATV were 18". These were for new construction. Add on construction could be anywhere. All of the utilities went from their terminal points to a common utility point on the house. They were in a single trench.

Jimbo said:
So, if theres a issue with any buried line, the sidewalk needs to be dug up as well ???
That sucks.

Sometimes…. electric and CATV are in conduit so replacement is pretty easy. Telephone, specifically Pacific Telephone, Pacific Bell, SBC, ATT are direct buried and use encap termination directly onto the feed cable. That is always a sidewalk digup.

Jimbo

Yesterday at 10:20 PM

Bobby said:
I did the underground trench utility designs for 9 years. Gas and electric were 24". Telephone and CATV were 18". These were for new construction. Add on construction could be anywhere. All of the utilities went from their terminal points to a common utility point on the house. They were in a single trench.

Sometimes…. electric and CATV are in conduit so replacement is pretty easy. Telephone, specifically Pacific Telephone, Pacific Bell, SBC, ATT are direct buried and use encap termination directly onto the feed cable. That is always a sidewalk digup.

Ok, your talking in the right of way ...
I thought you were talking about from the ped to the houses.

Fortunately you don't usually get Cable cuts Under a sidewalk, usually its when a Construction crew us digging with major equipment.

The drops to the house are not going to be very deep, sometimes barely under the sod. 6" is a godsend.

osu1991

Yesterday at 10:48 PM

I'm fortunate to have 3 fiber providers now.

Cox and T mobile bored and put conduit in before pulling the fiber thru the easement in my neighborhood . Windstream Kinetic I can't remember if they pulled conduit first or not. I remember they didn't have a boring machine when they came thru my yard, they used that for the mainline crossing under the street but had a vibratory plow in my backyard. I remember seeing some blue conduit just don't remember where it was being used. Windstream barely put the fiber run from the pedestal to my house about 2 inches underground. Landscaper hit it while putting landscaping around the pedestal they added to my yard. I made sure they buried it at least 12 inches when they replaced it.

AEP/ PSO the electric company has their main distribution lines running on poles along the back of my property. Cox has their main distribution line hung on those poles before going underground through the neighborhood.

I'm in the middle of a damage claim and about to take them to court as insurance is trying to get out of it claiming the lines were too low. Had an oversized load get lost and try to turn around in an older neighborhood. Pulled down 5 blocks of fiber with separate fiber lines belonging to the city, Cox/Spectrum and ATT.

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Lon.TV

Yesterday at 10:22 PM · posted in Lon.TV

Broadcasters To Encrypt Emergency Messages with DRM..

Time for another AWESOME video from Lon Seidman of LON.TV!

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dViecB76yco

Direct YouTube Link - Broadcasters To Encrypt Emergency Messages with DRM..
The Official LON.TV Website
Lon on Facebook

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Bobby

Supporting Founder Lifetime Supporter

Last reply Yesterday at 9:22 PM · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

4K Events Discussion Thread

This thread is a place to discuss the 4K events that appear on channel 540. We are getting, at this point, one college football game a week. Let's hope there is more coming.

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long_time_Dish

Oct 23, 2026

No NASCAR in 4K on Sunday? Bummer...

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Jim5506

Oct 24, 2026

long_time_Dish said:
No NASCAR in 4K on Sunday? Bummer...

It's on Prime.

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long_time_Dish

Oct 24, 2026

Jim5506 said:
It's on Prime.

Ah, ok, thanks!

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Foxbat

Oct 24, 2026

The World Series Game 1 quality was excellent, the Dolby Surround put us in the seats. Thanks, Dish!

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sasmith

Yesterday at 9:22 PM

Not seeing many 4k games on the 148 channels lately?

Also I do not see the 4KFox channel on 148-01; I also do not subscribed to our Local Houston channels.

Maybe I need to subscribe to locals or add the National Action Pack? Not sure the extra cost is worth it??

thx for any info or suggestions

S

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