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[comfortably_numb]

Maybe we need a TicTok account. That's where the kids are these days.

Hard pass.

 

[savarese04]

what i'm not understanding is why the site is so costly to operate beyond what the pub members contribute. Maybe I am naive, but if we moved to xenforo's cloud hosted option, that's $2700/year. Now, I know that's not going to be as feature rich and we have a lot of cool and custom plugins here we lose. Plus, this is Scott's labor of love; he truly does love tinkering and making this site hum.

On the flipside though, $2700 divided by $50/pp/year.....we don't have 50 pub members? At that point, no ads and completely self sustaining.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

I don't think Xenforo's self hosting lets you have Plugins. The Plugins are a major cost some of them cost as much as the forum software does (some more!) which is crazy! So that licensing (much of it needs to be renewed every year)

We also have CDN hosting charge which helps with the speed of the site.

We have our domains, we have our security software, which is monthly charge, as is Cpanel. I also pay Matt for working on the server when we need it. He does an awesome job and has kept this server running at amazing speeds.

Of the top of my head I would guess costs around $5000 a year now, and I am not making a cent on it at all.

Of course this is a LOT better then what we use to pay.. we had 3 servers, and it was over $1,200 a month for them alone. Of course that that time ad revenue was great so paying that much was not a problem. And if you remember to those times the extra money we made we use to throw huge online Holiday parties where we gave away some amazing gifts and I also gave our all volunteer staff gift cards each year as well to say thanks to them. I still wish we could do those.

So thats where we are.

I would like to convince the Pub Members to move the Electric Vehicle forum into the general forums. People really do seem to like talking about that topic.

 

[charlesrshell]

I don't think Xenforo's self hosting lets you have Plugins. The Plugins are a major cost some of them cost as much as the forum software does (some more!) which is crazy! So that licensing (much of it needs to be renewed every year)

We also have CDN hosting charge which helps with the speed of the site.

We have our domains, we have our security software, which is monthly charge, as is Cpanel. I also pay Matt for working on the server when we need it. He does an awesome job and has kept this server running at amazing speeds.

Of the top of my head I would guess costs around $5000 a year now, and I am not making a cent on it at all.

Of course this is a LOT better then what we use to pay.. we had 3 servers, and it was over $1,200 a month for them alone. Of course that that time ad revenue was great so paying that much was not a problem. And if you remember to those times the extra money we made we use to throw huge online Holiday parties where we gave away some amazing gifts and I also gave our all volunteer staff gift cards each year as well to say thanks to them. I still wish we could do those.

So thats where we are.

I would like to convince the Pub Members to move the Electric Vehicle forum into the general forums. People really do seem to like talking about that topic.

If it's good for the survival of SatGuys, just move it Scott. You are the boss. At least it's worth a try.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

No... not yet... I need to keep our members happy. I always value everyone feedback.

 

[navychop]

I favor the move out of the Pub. But it seems it would be best to close the old and start anew, so information meant to be kept "quiet" remains so.

To quote Shakespeare, "'T'was best done quickly."

 

[Jimbo]

Like some one else mentioned, how about a Non Pub EV section ... then those In the Pub can still keep thier section ... I read it alot, sometimes comment or ask questions.

Btw, where's the Non EV car section ???

One draw back to 2 EV sections is, keeping info in one and not the other and duplicate questions.

 

[navychop]

That's why I suggest closing / locking the Pub EV forum.

 

[Jimbo]

That's why I suggest closing / locking the Pub EV forum.

IF you Close the Pub EV, then all the info shared is gone and can't be further commented on.

You guys have your own forum and it's a good one, I vote to keep it there.

However, if you go with a Non Pub EV, I'd place it up towards the top.

Under the PUB and Site Service issues ...

 

[b4pjoe]

I don't think Xenforo's self hosting lets you have Plugins. The Plugins are a major cost some of them cost as much as the forum software does (some more!) which is crazy! So that licensing (much of it needs to be renewed every year)

We also have CDN hosting charge which helps with the speed of the site.

We have our domains, we have our security software, which is monthly charge, as is Cpanel. I also pay Matt for working on the server when we need it. He does an awesome job and has kept this server running at amazing speeds.

Of the top of my head I would guess costs around $5000 a year now, and I am not making a cent on it at all.

Of course this is a LOT better then what we use to pay.. we had 3 servers, and it was over $1,200 a month for them alone. Of course that that time ad revenue was great so paying that much was not a problem. And if you remember to those times the extra money we made we use to throw huge online Holiday parties where we gave away some amazing gifts and I also gave our all volunteer staff gift cards each year as well to say thanks to them. I still wish we could do those.

So thats where we are.

I intend no offense here...for a forum for posting words and images isn't a lot of the above stuff overkill for such a website? When revenue drops the logical thing to do is cutback on expenses. Do you really need the CDN hosting, paid security software, paid cPanel, a lot of paid plugins and paid forum software. $5,000 per year is a lot of money for a forum. Not that what you are using is not great software just that forums have declined so much in the last 10 years it could be done for far less using Open Source software than what you are currently paying. I have had a forum for 18 years and I am down to using Simple Machines forum software and my hosting is via Crocweb and I pay $178 for 3 years of hosting (cheapest plan). You probably use a lot more resources than mine is but they have other hosting plans that might cover what you need. Their most expensive plan in something like this that is under $250 per year:

I know it would be a major PITA to move over to something different but I don't think forum software is going to make a comeback that would warrant the setup you are currently using. Just a thought...not criticizing what you are doing here.

 

[navychop]

I get the shivers thinking about dropping paid (or any) Security Software.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

Moving to different software would be a challenge due to the fact that this software is so modified. And then we would lose many of the features many of our users use daily.

Removing Cpanel is not an option, as the drive would need to be formatted, and we would lose most of the way I manage the site and server. We were using CSF as our firewall which was free but they discontinued it so we are now using Immunify to keep the site protected.

A few weeks ago I posted about the site maybe being slow while I was doing something for KE4EST. While I was doing that after that completed, I did another test and that was turning off the security software. Within an hour the site was brought down to a crawl with DOS attacks from China, and other places. When I turned the security back on the problem immediately went away and the speed was back. So unfortunately that software is needed. (I wish someone would pick up the CSF project again.. that was so much better... and free.

If I need to slow down the site or limit thing which would ultimately slow down the site, I would rather turn it off, as I couldn't handle the complaints from people about missing features or the speed of the site.

I could possibly get rid of the CDN server, but since moving to this new server our CDN is also hosting our DNS now, since I found out the hard way of hosting DNS on the same server as the site was an issue and was actually causing problems.

 

[Ronnie-]

That's why I suggest closing / locking the Pub EV forum.

I agree. Start similar threads there, and the ones that participate will still be able to do so the same way they are now, while drawing in more active participation (hopefully).

 

[charlesrshell]

However, if you go with a Non Pub EV, I'd place it up towards the top.

Under the PUB and Site Service issues ...

Good idea Jimbo. What do you think, Scott?

 

[b4pjoe]

I get the shivers thinking about dropping paid (or any) Security Software.

Not dropping security software but looking into Open Source options.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

Not dropping security software but looking into Open Source options.

CSF was the best. Unfortunately nothing close to it.

 

[b4pjoe]

CSF was the best. Unfortunately nothing close to it.

Just a thought as costs are not going to get any cheaper and forums will continue their decline.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

Just a thought as costs are not going to get any cheaper and forums will continue their decline.

CSF was free. I don't know of anything freeware like CSF, if you do I am all ears.

And as far as decline goes, our traffic is still amazing with a few million page views a month. But it appears most are researching things, not posting new questions.