Bit Rate Errors - causes and fixes?

[Bahnzo]

Hi. I live in a fringe area, kinda between a couple markets. I occasionally get dropouts on a couple channels, and according to my Roku signal screen, it's being caused by bit-rate errors.

I'm wondering what causes these and what, if anything, I can do to help improve it. Searching doesn't bring up much on HDTV, but it seems it could have something to do with local interference. But again, I don't really know. I can provide more details if needed, but I'm really just curious in general what causes of this might be.

Thanks!

 

[comfortably_numb]

This is a Roku TV with an antenna input?

 

[Bahnzo]

This is a Roku TV with an antenna input?

Yeah. I'm looking at the "secret" menu to see this. The BER goes thru the roof when the dropouts occur.

 

[comfortably_numb]

Probably just signal loss, which can be caused by different kinds of interference. I live 40 miles from my local towers and lightning can cause drop-out's. Trains passing by my house can cause them, too. So, "bitrate errors" is probably just signal loss.

 

[Bahnzo]

Probably just signal loss, which can be caused by different kinds of interference. I live 40 miles from my local towers and lightning can cause drop-out's. Trains passing by my house can cause them, too. So, "bitrate errors" is probably just signal loss.

Sure. I get that with either packs of birds or airplanes. But again, this is just on a couple channels, and other channels which are broadcast from the same tower are usually ok. So I'm kinda scratching my head on if this has something to do with interference on a certain frequency maybe?

They have low signal strength to begin with, so *any* loss absolutely causes problems. But from what I can read, bit rate errors are different from signal strength. But then again, it might be BRE's are caused by low signal.

 

[moonwink]

The signal can bounce off an air plane or helicopter too. When the two signals arrive at different times, it freaks out the tuner and it has to reassemble the picture all over again from one source or the other. I live in a terrible fringe area too and feel your pain.

 

[comfortably_numb]

other channels which are broadcast from the same tower are usually ok

They can be on the same tower but have different power

 

[MartyDe]

You may have to upgrade your antenna. Do you have an amplifier on your antenna?

 

[Bahnzo]

You may have to upgrade your antenna. Do you have an amplifier on your antenna?

I don't have have an amp, the RG6 cable run is 30 feet. The antenna is an Antennas Direct ClearStream 2V, which should be ok. In the end, I think the real issue (besides being 50 miles from the tower) is simply not having good enough LOS. I have this on my apartment patio on a 10' pole, so it's about as good as it's gonna get unless I can lobby them to let me climb on the roof!

 

[comfortably_numb]

(besides being 50 miles from the tower)

If you're 50 miles from the towers, you probably want to integrate a preamp.

This is what I use:

Amplify Adjustable Gain Preamplifier

Official Channel Master Website - Learn more about the Channel Master Amplify (CM-7777HD) and buy direct from the manufacturer.

www.channelmaster.com

 

[Bahnzo]

If you're 50 miles from the towers, you probably want to integrate a preamp.

This is what I use:

Amplify Adjustable Gain Preamplifier

Official Channel Master Website - Learn more about the Channel Master Amplify (CM-7777HD) and buy direct from the manufacturer.

www.channelmaster.com

Preamps don't improve signal at the antenna. They improve signal if you have a long cable run and/or have splitters in the line.

https://support.channelmaster.com/hc/en-us/articles/200383665-Do-I-Need-a-Preamplifier-for-my-Antenna-CM-7777HD-CM-7777v3-CM-7778v3#:~:text=Since%20the%20splitter%20used%20to,be%20used%20with%20Amplified%20Antennas.

"A mast or antenna-mounted preamplifier is used primarily to overcome the loss in the coaxial cable between the antenna and the TV."

 

[comfortably_numb]

Preamps don't improve signal at the antenna

I guess I would have to disagree. In my case, the preamp makes all the difference between receiving some stations and not receiving them at all.

 

[Bahnzo]

I guess I would have to disagree. In my case, the preamp makes all the difference between receiving some stations and not receiving them at all.

Look at my edit. It's a common mistake to think preamps actually make your signal at the antenna stronger. They do not.

 

[comfortably_numb]

I'll let others who are wiser than me chime in here, but I think that's somewhat incorrect. Long run, short run, without the preamp I can't receive half of my stations.

 

[Bahnzo]

I'll let others who are wiser than me chime in here, but I think that's somewhat incorrect. Long run, short run, without the preamp I can't receive half of my stations.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1x3M5rE2U24

This guy explains it as well. An amp doesn't make the signal you get at the antenna stronger, it only boosts the signal for the run to your tv/splitter.

It a common misconception.

 

[primestar31]

I don't have have an amp, the RG6 cable run is 30 feet. The antenna is an Antennas Direct ClearStream 2V, which should be ok. In the end, I think the real issue (besides being 50 miles from the tower) is simply not having good enough LOS. I have this on my apartment patio on a 10' pole, so it's about as good as it's gonna get unless I can lobby them to let me climb on the roof!

Get this antenna, (it's the latest model and version, completely re-engineered) and I'll bet your stations will all lock in nicely. I tested one, and it's the most powerful yet on the smaller side antenna I've ever seen. I had NO issues picking up stations at 50~ miles using it. It'll fit on the same pole you now have your 2V on. 5g/LTE and FM filters built into the dipole preamp.

Televes 148883, ELLIPSE MIX HDTV antenna, Repack Ready! Channels 7-36,

Ellipse Mix Antenna, 148883 (Improved Replacement for 148881) NEAR-FRINGE/FRINGE MID-SIZE ATTIC/OUTDOOR Intelligence taken to the limit Ellipse Mix is an advanced over the air HDTV antenna that automatically adapts its gain in real time to optimize the reception of television signals, ensuring...

www.nesselectronics.com

Specs: Antena Ellipse Mix High-VHF/UHF (Repack Ready)

Installed at my sons house:

 

[comfortably_numb]

Don't need to watch a video. I've done countless experiments myself in various locations, using multiple antennas connected directly to tuners, with and without preamps. My evidence speaks for itself.

 

[Bahnzo]

Don't need to watch a video. I've done countless experiments myself in various locations, using multiple antennas connected directly to tuners, with and without preamps. My evidence speaks for itself.

If it works for you, then ok. But telling people they need to buy a $90 amp is incorrect unless you have a long run and/or splitters. The people who do know more than you (and I) as well as the manufacturer agree.

I mean, here's another discussion which has multiple people saying this as well.


View: https://www.reddit.com/r/cordcutters/comments/16jjykj/when_do_you_need_a_preamp/

 

[FTA4PA]

Don't need to watch a video. I've done countless experiments myself in various location, using multiple antennas connected directly to tuners, with and without preamps. My evidence speaks for itself.

Agreed, the preamp does not create a signal that isn't there but if the signal is there but low it will help get it down the coax cable to your tv (or distribution amp in my case) in still usable condition. Our stations are in the 40 to 50 mile range away and two edge. No preamp at the mast means no signal at the house.

 

[comfortably_numb]

the preamp does not create a signal that isn't there but if the signal is there but low it will help get it down the coax cable to your tv

I agree with this. I think he thought I was implying that the preamp tunes in signals that aren't there; I know it doesn't. But in my case the cable length doesn't matter; I'm 40+ miles from my towers and without the preamp I get almost no channels. That's whether it's rabbit ears connected directly to the TV, or the antenna in the attic.