Broadband in a Box INTRO

[broadbandinabox]

I respectfully request that you move on. You are nitpicking everything I say, taking things entirely the wrong way, twisting them due to me NOT being knowledgeable on 2way terminology + you don't answer my questions. Add all of that up, this conversation is WAY past the point of salvaging anything positive from it.

I'm not here to do what ever you're doing. We had a conversation, you made your points - several times, I learned a thing or 2. DONE.

Nice chatting with you. Have a great day.

 

[broadbandinabox]

Transmitter/LNB is that better?

 

[grohgreg]

Transmitter/LNB is that better?

Absolutely not. One last attempt at possible penetration: a LNB is a receive-only device. Your one-way system uses the phone line to transmit. I don't know how you can expect to publicly promote a product or service, if you don't even know how they work.

And please repeat any legitimate question you feel I haven't answered. Hint: there is no such thing as a S/R LNB (or Transmitter/LNB either), so that's not a legitimate question.

//greg//

 

[digiblur]

Interesting conversation. I haven't seen a one-way system in a long time, everyone I knew who had one upgraded to two-way and were so happy they did. I know in this area you would have a hard time selling one-way systems especially with all the families going to cell phone only.

 

[broadbandinabox]

I have no idea why you keep insisting I get out of the business. I do not know what you call the whole assembly. IF I WAS A 2WAY GUY I'D KNOW BUT I AM NOT, GET IT YET? I asked what a typical S/R LNB costs. S = Send (transmitter). GET IT? Did I correctly ask?

Call me lazy for not writing it out if it will make you feel better, keep at it, I have thick skin. I don't really care what you THINK. Talk facts and this conversation might go somewhere.

I respectfully treat complete strangers' opinions, esp. on MB as what they are, opinions Greg.

Now can you answer my questions? What does an LNB/Transmitter cost to replace on a unit that is out of warranty, lease, maintenance agreement?

How many times is that? 3?

 

[broadbandinabox]

digiblur, for folks looking for a low cost high speed Internet solution the $29-$39 retail price is right up their alley. +$29 is only a few bucks more than AOL Dialup yet up to 10X faster!

AOL is selling for $27 these days?

 

[grohgreg]

I respectfully treat complete strangers' opinions, esp. on MB as what they are, opinions Greg.

Other than unsupportable statements why you don't like 2way (which you've admitted several times knowing nothing about), and pure hype parroted fromm a SkyWay brochure - I haven't seen anything that reasonably resembles an opinion. Oh, except that maybe it's your opinion that my criticism of your knowledge base is "nitpicking".

Now can you answer my questions? What does an LNB/Transmitter cost to replace on a unit that is out of warranty, lease, maintenance agreement?
How many times is that? 3?

You're hopeless, and yes - it's actually more like 4 times that you've asked a question that doesn't have an answer. A LNB simply doesn't transmit. It's like asking how a big mule makes little mules. It friggin' can't !!

Are you perhaps trying to find out how much a TRIA costs? Since it's clear this acronym is foreign to you, it stands for Transmit/Receive Integrated Assembly - consisting of a transmitter, LNB, waveguide, OMT filter, and feedhorn. Since it's a collection of components, a complete swapout is almost never necessary. You just replace whichever component went bad. The last LNB I bought for example, was $25. A 1w transmitter can be had for under $50. Feedhorns vary by design. Don't know of anybody who's ever had cause to replace a waveguide or an OMT.

//greg//

 

[bajadudes]

All Starband 2 way VSAT consumer accounts come with 10 hours per month of included dial up access as a just in case.

We allow customer self installs and work with them closley to insure a quality install

Most rural POTs lines barely support 19 to 24 kbps let alone 50+ kbps

IMHO you HAVE to include the cost of a 2nd telco line for an accurate and honest comparison.

Rain Fade is Rain Fade any satellite dish is subject to it. To say there is no Rain Fade is a misrepresentation and pointing this out is not nitpicking. It would be more accurate to say that when rain fade occurs the system reverts to dial up.

On a Starband 2 way VSAT system it would be very easy to configure your browser to revert to dialup when weather knocks you down temporarily.

In rural areas it is not uncommon for Telco lines to be knocked out of commission for hours/days or even weeks at a time after a weather event. 2 way VSAT is still there serving a possibly critical communication need.

Once you make a realistic comparison there is very little benefit to using an older technology like 1 way with dialup.

Broadbandinabox what is the noise figure on a skyway LNB? it is usually expressed as a decimal ie: NF .6

Just my 2 cents and no disrespect intended.

 

[Jared Twomey]

I respectfully request that you move on. You are nitpicking everything I say, taking things entirely the wrong way, twisting them due to me NOT being knowledgeable on 2way terminology + you don't answer my questions. Add all of that up, this conversation is WAY past the point of salvaging anything positive from it.

I'm not here to do what ever you're doing. We had a conversation, you made your points - several times, I learned a thing or 2. DONE.

Nice chatting with you. Have a great day.

I'm not trying to be mean or disrespectful, but seriously, he isn't nit-picking, he is trying to get to the truth about such services.

You have come onto this board as a promoter of 1-way satellite internet, yet you don't seem to know how they work. You have come to a board full of satellite geeks that know this stuff inside and out, and expect them to let you say nonsense without calling you out on it.

Guys here will "nit-pick" your comments to death until the truth is told. We don't want someone stumbling upon the site, reading your posts and believing that skyway is the magical internet service they have been looking for. That's just not the case.

There are limitations to the service, and those need to be talked about. We try to be honest about the good and bad points about products here.

For example, your comment about no rain fade, come on... seriously, its a satellite, unless you have a very large dish, they all can have rain fade. If you would have said it will kick you down to dial-up when the satellite loses a connection, that would have been ok.

And I get your confusion on the LNB- Transmitter thing, in fact on skyway's own site they talk about the 2-way companies "lnbf" problems. So their terminology is incorrect, no reason to keep pushing that incorrect information.

There are some very smart people on this board that live and breathe this stuff, don't get so defensive about everything, listen to some of the other's arguements, and you may learn something here.

And just FYI, some of us here have either sold or installed Skyway, either in the past or currently (myself included), and we know how the service works and its limitations.

I refuse to sell the service as I don't believe it is a good deal for anyone, but I have installed quite a few for people that order the system directly through skyway. I figure they have already bought the system, I may as well install it the best way possible and give them a fighting chance. Every system I have installed has came back to us, some within months, some after their contract expires, to have either Wildblue or Hughesnet put in.

Its an ok system for checking your email, but do much more than that and you will see it's limitations. Also, another big limitation people need to be aware of is the low FAP or what they like to call their Reasonable Use Policy.
Satellite Internet Service Provider | SkyWay USA | $29.95/mo.

If I was on the service, I would never get over 64k as I would constantly be running over their RUP. I'm not a heavy user, but I do download quite a few podcasts, watch a few shows on hulu, maybe stream a movie now and then over Netflix. My daily use wouldn't work on skyway. Heck, my podcast downloads alone would run me over their RUP. So again, decent service for checking your email, but it has its limitations.

 

[broadbandinabox]

Busy day, just winding down with this monster of a thread.

Thanks for twisting this thread into what its become folks. A bunch of your opinions and not many facts. If we can get to the facts maye this discussion may be productive.

Jared we've never met, are you listening to Greg's opinion here?

I asked a simple question and it took Greg 20+ posts to FINALLY answer it, I think?

I get it. This is a tough crowd.

Have a great evening.

 

[bajadudes]

You know how the saying goes.....if ya can't take the heat......stay outta the kitchen.

It's just that many of us after decades of sat comm experience have a low tolerance for marketing hype.....even when offered innocently enough.

I think the thread has stuck to the facts....and there in lies the rub.

I personally do not wish you any ill will...just a desire to keep to the facts.

BTW you mention above that most telcos will give you a 2nd line for free if you ask for one....you are kidding right?...never in my life and I am 51 years old and have been in one form or another of comm work since 1981 have I heard of a telcom giving a 2nd line free to a residential customer...I dunno maybe I am wrong on that one...just never heard of it.

 

[broadbandinabox]

Thanks for the advice Baja. Its irritating that my shorthand gets twisted into a FACT. I never said our LNB transmits. Now Greg has Jared thinking I did.

2nd phone line. I have asked many Incumbents. They all have marketing dollars to offer 2nd lines discounted or even FREE. With churn the way its getting, I guess they'd rather keep a copper customer with 2 lines than no lines at all.

Once again thanks for your civil post sir.

 

[grohgreg]

BTW you mention above that most telcos will give you a 2nd line for free if you ask for one....you are kidding right?...never in my life and I am 51 years old and have been in one form or another of comm work since 1981 have I heard of a telcom giving a 2nd line free to a residential customer...I dunno maybe I am wrong on that one...just never heard of it.

Same in my neck of the woods, and I been around 10 years longer than you. Last time I participated in a "one-way" topic, I checked what it would cost me for a 2nd BellSouth line. Much to my surprise, they wanted more for the 2nd line than for the first. Go figure.

BBIAB appears to have charged into this particular china shop with his eyes wide shut.

//greg//

 

[broadbandinabox]

BBIAB appears to have charged into this particular china shop with his eyes wide shut. //greg//

I would ask you what you mean here but I'm not in the mood to go around and around for 20+ posts to get an answer.

 

[Jared Twomey]

Thanks for the advice Baja. Its irritating that my shorthand gets twisted into a FACT. I never said our LNB transmits. Now Greg has Jared thinking I did.

He never said that you claimed your lnb's transmit. You asked how much a 2-way lnb cost to replace. He was pointing out that there is no such thing as a 2-way "lnb"... its a TRIA.

He was trying to correct your terminology, and you didn't seem to catch that.

 

[HCI]

All I got to say "and someone may have said this". For a 1 way satellite service you are really paying 2 different companies for internet service. No matter if you have 1 or 2 telephone lines either way you have to PAY the TELEPHONE company then you have to pay the satellite company. From what I remember last time I had a wired telephone line the minimum monthly charges were $45/50, so if the one way service is $30 and the phone is even as low as $40 that's still $70 you are paying for internet service not just the $30 the "Broadband in a Box" marketing is saying. Now most everyone today has cell phones and cutting the home phones off. I don't have a family member or friend I can think of who has a home phone line unless they use it for DSL and even then they don't have a phone attached.

So by the time you pay the $70 for the two services you could get something like Hughes Pro plan at speeds of, 1.2 Mbps down and 200 Kbps which blows this system out the water.

 

[broadbandinabox]

Sorry Tate that is completely misleading a prospect IMO. When someone gets a 2way system they suddenly don't need phone service anymore?

 

[HCI]

Sorry Tate that is completely misleading a prospect IMO. When someone gets a 2way system they suddenly don't need phone service anymore?

Not misleading at all. More and More people are turning there home phones off and going to only wireless service. Cell phones are peoples life lines now days. When you have a product like this that 50% of it is based on a technology that is over 10 years old you are cutting out a large portion of your target base. Sorry that's just the way it is.

 

[broadbandinabox]

IMO, its at least skewing the numbers Does the Hughes Pro plan include a cellular account? I don't think so. Spending $70.00/mo. and then adding a cellular account which will be spotty in many rural communities is so out of a lot of people's price range for Internet access.

If they are already paying $15-27 for dial-up adding an additional $3-15 to speed up their surfing experience is more obtainable.

Jared mentioned the RUP. Opinions once again. I have never seen, heard or experienced anyone complain the past 2 years. I can safely say that because of the growth opportunities that working with EchoStar allows, there won't be any in the future either. Our IP Routing and Bandwidth shaping methodologies were perfected throughout the rest of the world and the folks on the system are the one's who benefit. This isn't anything new or in-design.

This technology, DVB, has been the International Standard since 1993. When I first started out in 2001, it wasn't anywhere near as perfected as it is today. Now DVB-S2 has opened up so many options while the SW-20 modem eliminates all tech support issues, mostly Windows networking. It's as perfect as I have ever seen it. Now anyone can install a system themselves or have a handyman relative help out. Tech support calls average 15 minutes and are usually firewall related. The system just works well. I often offer a challenge to my partners when they get their first system activated...Now try to break it

Most importantly, the service as I mentioned above is extremely affordable as is the long term maintenance. The solution is a longterm solution not a 1-2 year then let the customer hang out to dry when the lightening rod in their yard, I mean the 2way dish in their yard gets hit and their out of warranty.

Have a great day SatCommers..

 

[digiblur]

IMO, its at least skewing the numbers Does the Hughes Pro plan include a cellular account? I don't think so. Spending $70.00/mo. and then adding a cellular account which will be spotty in many rural communities is so out of a lot of people's price range for Internet access.

Thing is people already have cell phones. I can't think of anyone I know that doesn't have a cell phone. I guess things are quite different in my area. I have a couple of friends that don't even have a land line on their property since it was too much for the phone company to run a line to their property. So they went with cell phones instead. I guess you can say cell phone coverage has exceeded the coverage of land line in some areas around here.

What we are all trying to get across to you is 1 way satellite internet has been dead for years in our eyes and area. It's not coming back...people love the 2 way too much. Most of them can care less if it works during the 5-10 minutes it is out during the down pour, just as long as it doesn't require a phone line. And also from what I can remember playing with a Wildblue system it would exceed the upload speed of a v92 connection anyways. But as many pointed out if you can get a clean connection of v92 up to 53/44k then you wouldn't have satellite anyways, you'd have DSL with a line like that. Most rural areas are lucky to see 24k dialup connections.