Court Orders Dish to Drop ALL Distant Networks

[bonipie]

Please read the ruling. As much as I feel for you losing the channels, there is an alternative. If you don't wish to switch providers, then that is your choice.

I have read the ruling. If people didn't cheat, there wouldn't be any house to clean. A universal problem-people not taking responsibility for their own actions. The attitude seems to be that is their right to cheat and Charlies responsibility to catch them. And, if he doesn't catch them, then it is my responsibility to change to another provider as a consequence of the cheaties basically having 'won', and ruining the system.

btw, we did change to "D" (over the OLN issue), but when they came to install the antenna, their antenna is too big (about 36"x24") to reasonably handle in an rv. I do live in an rv, and do have a legitimate rv waiver.

 

[mikew]

Where in the ruling does it spell out the cause was subscribers who lied to E*? It started when E* used a "Red Light"/"Green Light" system that was flawed. In the early stages, E* CSRs were allowed to override the system and allow people to subscribe to distants, even if they didn't qualify. That was when Charlie was brought to court and promised he would re-qualify all distant subs and disconnect those who were not eligible. He didn't do that. Later, Charlie used two different systems to qualify a sub for distants. If one said the sub didn't qualify, he'd use the other service. That didn't set well with the courts either.

There is no reference to "cheaters" or "movers" in the ruling.

 

[Mr Tony]

btw, we did change to "D" (over the OLN issue), but when they came to install the antenna, their antenna is too big (about 36"x24") to reasonably handle in an rv. I do live in an rv, and do have a legitimate rv waiver.

huh? I have a Phase III (the standard DirecTV dish) here at my house sitting in the closet and its 24x22. It isnt 36" across (I have a 36" dish and the Phase III is no where near that size

 

[odbrv]

well said!
With that said, I will admit that I think the ruling is a load of crap and that we should get to chose who we get our locals from. 2006 is much different that 1956. More people move and live in other areas than they did when tv was starting out.

I totally agree. For 22 years I taught in Texas and returned to NH for the summer. I could not get cable nor over the air TV at either place. So I did without locals for 12 years. Then I got service from the Dish and wanted Distants. Even though I could not get a signal due to terrain problems, I was considered to be in a class a area. So I proceeded to get waivers in Texas. I then had distants at both places. I carried the receivers back and forth. Then, the NH area got locals first. So I called E* and asked if I could have the NH locals. The answer was no. My billing address was Texas. For tax and employment reasons I didn't want to change my billing address So now I became an illegal distants viewer while in NH. Now Lubbock can get locals. However, I didn't want to pay for the instalation of another dish. So i kept the distants. By this time I was now retired and sharing the year between the two places. So I have kept the distants.
Now I will lose my networks and will have to pay the price to get locals at one of the places. I will probably get the NH because I can now change my address. The NH locals include all the Boston stations. This way I will get the Boston HD networks. I will still be illegal for the 1/2 year I will be in Lubbock. From what I understand that a good 10% of E* customers have 2nd homes and could be illegal at one of them. There are 23 million senior citizens who winter elsewhere and another 40 million Americans with 2nd homes. None of the laws on television coverage cares about these 25% of the population.

 

[cablewithaview]

I totally agree. For 22 years I taught in Texas and returned to NH for the summer. I could not get cable nor over the air TV at either place. So I did without locals for 12 years. Then I got service from the Dish and wanted Distants. Even though I could not get a signal due to terrain problems, I was considered to be in a class a area. So I proceeded to get waivers in Texas. I then had distants at both places. I carried the receivers back and forth. Then, the NH area got locals first. So I called E* and asked if I could have the NH locals. The answer was no. My billing address was Texas. For tax and employment reasons I didn't want to change my billing address So now I became an illegal distants viewer while in NH. Now Lubbock can get locals. However, I didn't want to pay for the instalation of another dish. So i kept the distants. By this time I was now retired and sharing the year between the two places. So I have kept the distants.
Now I will lose my networks and will have to pay the price to get locals at one of the places. I will probably get the NH because I can now change my address. The NH locals include all the Boston stations. This way I will get the Boston HD networks. I will still be illegal for the 1/2 year I will be in Lubbock. From what I understand that a good 10% of E* customers have 2nd homes and could be illegal at one of them. There are 23 million senior citizens who winter elsewhere and another 40 million Americans with 2nd homes. None of the laws on television coverage cares about these 25% of the population.

Boston will not work in Texas when you return. WSBK is the only one on a national beam, where as Boston locals, and other locals are on spot beams.

 

[cablewithaview]

Atlanta is not national anymore, leaving Denver, LA, NY and Chicago only.
Dish Network also offers UPN affiliates WWOR-TV (New York City) and WSBK-TV (Boston), and WB affiliates WPIX (New York City), KWGN-TV (Denver), and KTLA-TV (Los Angeles) under the "Superstation" brand which is national.

 

[long_time_DNC]

TBS isn't a "Superstation" anymore?

 

[TNGTony]

WTBS 17 Atlanta is the sole broadcast affiliate of TBS Cable Channel now. In a typical week WTBS broadcasts TBS 23 hours a day 6 days a week and 21 hours on Sunday.
http://www.tbs.com/
http://tbs.com/tbs17/

TBS is available on channel 139 on all AT packages and Dish Latino 2 and up.
WTBS is available on channel 8307 on the Atlanta locals package.

WGN Superstation and WGN 9 Chicago are also two different channels with independent schedules which are the same about 40% of the time.
http://wgnsuperstation.trb.com/
http://wgntv.trb.com/

WGN Superstation is available on channel 239 on AT120 and up and Dish Latino Max and up.
WGN 9 Chicago is available on channel 8494 on the Chicago Locals package

See ya
Tony

 

[Mr Tony]

WGN9 airs a newscast in the morning and WB at night whereas the Superstation version shows movies.

ExpressVu in Canada has the Chicago version whereas StarChoice carries the Superstation version (COnverselly SC has WTBS 17 and EVu has TBS Superstation)

 

[bonipie]

huh? I have a Phase III (the standard DirecTV dish) here at my house sitting in the closet and its 24x22. It isnt 36" across (I have a 36" dish and the Phase III is no where near that size

Yeah, surprised us. They said that is what will be used for all HD applications. It has what looks like 3lnb, but is really 5. Picks up 5 sats, weighs 35 lb., and is just too big. And, the installer, who looked like he was suitably intellegent, said it is really difficult to acquire. Since we change locations and set up dish about every 2 weeks, you can see the problem.

 

[mikew]

Yeah, surprised us. They said that is what will be used for all HD applications. It has what looks like 3lnb, but is really 5. Picks up 5 sats, weighs 35 lb., and is just too big. And, the installer, who looked like he was suitably intellegent, said it is really difficult to acquire. Since we change locations and set up dish about every 2 weeks, you can see the problem.

Do you have HD with Dish? Do you really need the 5 sats or would the normal 3 sat solution work for you?

 

[long_time_DNC]

WTBS 17 Atlanta is the sole broadcast affiliate of TBS Cable Channel now. In a typical week WTBS broadcasts TBS 23 hours a day 6 days a week and 21 hours on Sunday.
http://www.tbs.com/
http://tbs.com/tbs17/

TBS is available on channel 139 on all AT packages and Dish Latino 2 and up.
WTBS is available on channel 8307 on the Atlanta locals package.

WGN Superstation and WGN 9 Chicago are also two different channels with independent schedules which are the same about 40% of the time.
http://wgnsuperstation.trb.com/
http://wgntv.trb.com/

WGN Superstation is available on channel 239 on AT120 and up and Dish Latino Max and up.
WGN 9 Chicago is available on channel 8494 on the Chicago Locals package

See ya
Tony

Interesting, Tony. I didn't realize they'd lost/moved away their superstation status...

 

[odbrv]

How to get locals at two homes

Boston will not work in Texas when you return. WSBK is the only one on a national beam, where as Boston locals, and other locals are on spot beams.

If all the locals are on spot beams and we lose distants, what will all the people with two homes do to get networks? I called E* and the CSR I spoke with says they don't have a 2/multiple home program. I would need two accounts. I could put the accounts on standbye by paying $5 per month. So it would cost $60 per year extra to get locals. The CSR was not sure the maximum # of months you could do the standbye for each account. So if you were 9 months in one place and 3 months in the other. He believed the 3 month hold was not a problem. He was not sure of the 9 months. He was not sure of a 6 month standbye for dividing the year. He also was not sure of how to register my equipment to both accounts.

 

[Slamminc11]

the CSR was correct about two accounts. Your second account would be set up so that you can put that one on hold as many times as you want. Your best bet is to call Dish back and ask for the audit team as they are the ones that can set you up correctly with the two accounts without a problem. It does have to be done though the audit team and not through a CSR though.

 

[pastafazoule]

one way to get the distant channels back,is in november vote democratic

 

[Jim5506]

one way to get the distant channels back,is in november vote democratic

non sequitur

 

[TNGTony]

This is not a political discussion. Keep it on the topic at hand and not politics which ultimately are totally irrelevant to the subject matter.

 

[cablewithaview]

If all the locals are on spot beams and we lose distants, what will all the people with two homes do to get networks? I called E* and the CSR I spoke with says they don't have a 2/multiple home program. I would need two accounts. I could put the accounts on standbye by paying $5 per month. So it would cost $60 per year extra to get locals. The CSR was not sure the maximum # of months you could do the standbye for each account. So if you were 9 months in one place and 3 months in the other. He believed the 3 month hold was not a problem. He was not sure of the 9 months. He was not sure of a 6 month standbye for dividing the year. He also was not sure of how to register my equipment to both accounts.

keep in mind, is paying $25 reconnect cheaper then the $5 monthly fee for suspending it? Depending how long in between visits should be a factor if one is cheaper then the other. I think there is a five month limit on the stand by fee, I can't remember, it's been a while since I dealt with that issue.

 

[Judicature]

I don't think Dish can appeal this, can they ? This ruling was already an appellate court upholding a lower courts ruling. The only place they could appeal to would be the U.S. Supreme Court, which surely would not hear the case. I do not think they can appeal.

Dish can seek a rehearing "en banc" - which basically is a rehearing by all of the 11th Circuit judges. The initial opinion was decided (as is almost always the case) by a panel of 3 judges and one of them was sitting by designation, which means that he isn't normally an appellate judge of that Circuit. The 11th Circuit has several other judges who did not participate in this appeal but would participate if rehearing en banc is granted. I can't project Dish's chances on having the rehearing granted (it is not automatic) or, if granted, the likelihood of success. But, having read the opinion, I suspect they (Dish) may focus on whether the 3 judge appellate panel properly applied the legal standard of review in (1) rejecting the findings and relief adopted by the trial court and (2) substituting their own findings as to the nature of Dish's conduct and the appropriate remedy.

Regardless whether Dish attempts the rehearing route (or if the rehearing approach fails), Dish can still appeal to the SCOTUS, but this is very difficult . . . .

 

[Clancy]

Question for Judicature.
In reguard to your statement,
But, having read the opinion, I suspect they (Dish) may focus on whether the 3 judge appellate panel properly applied the legal standard of review in (1) rejecting the findings and relief adopted by the trial court and (2) substituting their own findings as to the nature of Dish's conduct and the appropriate remedy.

What have been the en banc rehearing reversals in this particular Circuit spoken as a percentage ?

Thank you for your time.