Dammit Dish.............

[Hall]

Hopefully we hear some good news at Team Summit next month. I don't watch sports, but I do agree DISH does need full time HD RSN's.

You know when you post something like that, people read between the lines, thinking you know some little secret and are giving a tease.

 

[king3pj]

The only games that aren't in HD are selected Knicks, Rangers, Islanders and Devils games MSG2 and MSG+2 games, which Cablevision offers in HD. That, obviously, doesn't come into play with Dish right now.

Fox Sports Detroit + also comes into mind since I don't know if broadcasts in HD yet. In short, the Dish rep is blowing smoke up our rears. We all get PR speak, but dodging the issue doesn't help, either.

Fox Sports Detroit + is also HD. I used to watch it pretty frequently before I had dish because the Pistons, Redwings, and Tigers are all on Fox Sports Detroit in April. Dish sometimes has the FSN Detroit and FSN Detroit+ both in HD at the same time but it is usually one or the other. There was actually one night this season already where Dish carried the Wings on FSN Detroit+ in HD, but the Tigers who were on FSN Detroit were only carried in SD. I thought it was interesting that they carried the + game over the regular game.

 

[dangue]

hmm...directv this past Sunday had a full slate of MLB games, some NBA games, NHL games and 6 channels of the masters in HD...guess they dont have issues with bandwidth

But I guess folks would rather see 15 premium movie channels, RFD TV and OWN in HD instead

What does Direct's bandwidth allocation have to do with the existence of bandwidth on Dish's system? Oh wait, I know the answer to that... NOTHING!

Dish has decided to offer more national and premium HD channels (as opposed to Direct offering 24/7 RSNs). It's a choice, just like consumers have a choice of which provider to go with.

Ice, just because you don't like premiums of RFD or OWN doesn't mean there is no one who likes or wants them in HD. If the choice was as simple and as laughable as you make it sound, then Dish would have NO HD subs. That's simply not the case.

Would I prefer all my games in HD? Sure. Would I be willing to sacrifice some of the national HD channels I watch regularly to get it? No. Sure, Dish could get rid of some national channel I don't watch to make room, but that just means that the people that watch that channel would be getting the shaft. Either way, someone is not happy.

In an unlimited bandwidth world, I'm sure Dish would carry the RSNs in HD 24/7. This isn't a matter of Charlie being cheap, they're already paying the broadcasters the money for the right to the HD feed (or they wouldn't be able to show the game time HD they currently offer). It's all about allocating space in the way they believe to be the most profitable. Customers are free to disagree with Dish's decision and leave for a provider that meets their needs. Complaining on here rather than to Dish directly is less likely to be effective.

Oh, and since WA consists of three sats, it's disingenuous to simply say that 129 is all mpeg-4 and therefore Dish must not being using the space. The mpeg-2 streams on 110 and 119 are what's causing the bandwidth problems. Pretending that isn't the case doesn't add anything to this discussion.

Sent from my iPhone using SatelliteGuys

 

[TonyT@DISH Network]

sorry Hoss but youre wrong.

Up-converted and playing on an 'HD' channel does not mean it is filmed in HD, and does not make it HD anymore then an up-converting DVD player makes a standard DVD become Bluray, or even HD. And yes, there are still SOME events on SOME sports networks (as I said, not ALL) that are not filmed in HD, and are not displayed as HD. I have seen this happen, even on D* systems recently, which means it is not bandwidth or allocation, but the actual network providing the programming. BB had display TVs and even ESPN HD (on D*) still uses up-conversion on programming for their HD channel. Its easy to discern it in the picture, even when the station AND the receiver do the up-conversion.

I will say that when sports are filmed in HD, in 720P, it looks good. Again, this was is not 100% of the time, and is likely event dependent.

EDIT- Even the 'Official Website' for ROOT does not say 100% HD, nor do any press releases, which is a huge marketing thing in this day and age (and a liability if specific performance is not adhered to). This would make the presumption that the channel(s) are not 100% HD all the time, rather then assuming they are. Even Starz does not claim 100% HD all the time on all of their channels.

 

[Mr Tony]

Fox Sports Detroit + also comes into mind since I don't know if broadcasts in HD yet. In short, the Dish rep is blowing smoke up our rears. We all get PR speak, but dodging the issue doesn't help, either.

FSN Det + is on HD for the pro games....some of the college games arent carried in HD for some reason

 

[Mr Tony]

What does Direct's bandwidth allocation have to do with the existence of bandwidth on Dish's system? Oh wait, I know the answer to that... NOTHING!

DIsh is using the reason "we have no bandwidth" yet the "other provider" has enough bandwidth to provide it in HD

Dish has decided to offer more national and premium HD channels (as opposed to Direct offering 24/7 RSNs). It's a choice, just like consumers have a choice of which provider to go with.

Ice, just because you don't like premiums of RFD or OWN doesn't mean there is no one who likes or wants them in HD. If the choice was as simple and as laughable as you make it sound, then Dish would have NO HD subs. That's simply not the case.

I'm using them as a example. Check the uplink threads for posts. When those 2 were added and Reelz part time people groaned. Again Dish using the "bandwidth isnt there" line is bunk if they are still adding some channels

Oh, and since WA consists of three sats, it's disingenuous to simply say that 129 is all mpeg-4 and therefore Dish must not being using the space. The mpeg-2 streams on 110 and 119 are what's causing the bandwidth problems. Pretending that isn't the case doesn't add anything to this discussion.

I never said Dish wasnt using the space. I'm saying they could probably use it better

 

[Mr Tony]

And yes, there are still SOME events on SOME sports networks (as I said, not ALL) that are not filmed in HD.

yes there are some sports that aren't. I've seen plenty of college hockey/bb/fb games that werent in HD. But as for pro games there are VERY FEW that are not in HD.

 

[TonyT@DISH Network]

The only RSN's that are game only in HD are FS Ohio and FS Cincy. The rest are HD 24/7.
The part time RSN's (Utah, Wisconsin, Houston, Indiana, Tennessee, Carolina) are all in HD

If there are some SportsNets that are not 24/7.....

yes there are some sports that aren't. I've seen plenty of college hockey/bb/fb games that werent in HD. But as for pro games there are VERY FEW that are not in HD.

and you again agree with me, by your own words......

sorry Hoss but youre wrong.

then I am confused....

 

[lparsons21]

DIsh is using the reason "we have no bandwidth" yet the "other provider" has enough bandwidth to provide it in HD


I'm using them as a example. Check the uplink threads for posts. When those 2 were added and Reelz part time people groaned. Again Dish using the "bandwidth isnt there" line is bunk if they are still adding some channels


I never said Dish wasnt using the space. I'm saying they could probably use it better

Dish has made a reasonable explanation. HD channels are HD channels you know. So if you have more national HD with a given amount of bandwidth, then that doesn't leave enough for other things. D* is using bunches of bandwidth for the HD sports and letting the national HD go by the wayside.

As to whether they could use it better or not. Well, imo, I don't think adding more sports in HD is making it better. You love your sports, so you are free to disagree...

 

[Mr Tony]

and you again agree with me, by your own words......

but we're talking about pro-sports...of which almost all are available in HD

 

[TonyT@DISH Network]

but we're talking about pro-sports...of which almost all are available in HD

Almost all = not all, which I guess is my point, and 'not all' leaves room for my original 'official' answer that said 'Officially, some sports networks are not providing the games 100% of the time in HD'. My point is that I am not wrong on that answer.

Dish has made a reasonable explanation. HD channels are HD channels you know. So if you have more national HD with a given amount of bandwidth, then that doesn't leave enough for other things. D* is using bunches of bandwidth for the HD sports and letting the national HD go by the wayside.

As to whether they could use it better or not. Well, imo, I don't think adding more sports in HD is making it better. You love your sports, so you are free to disagree...

I do see a reason why the sports enthusiast would not be happy about the state of affairs, both with HD games available on E* and seemingly constant negotiations with sports channels. Our intention is not to spit on the fan of those teams, its to provide the best value in Pay TV over 14 million customers. There may be a large percentage of sports fans out there, but I would still be hesitant to suggest the majority of our customers are sports fans, or even tune to the channels. Being diplomatic to all customers, and fighting for pricing on programming (and I guess its reasonable to assume profit margin, as any business worth its salt would) does mean that some people get left out.

I am still hopeful that all this shuffling of channels, permissions for new sats (as I saw a thread about 62.15 orbital), and MPEG4 conversion will give us the upper hand on both the movie front AND the sports front.

JUST FOR THE PURPOSE OF HUMOR: I would laugh if E* started buying sports nets, like D* has. It would be interesting to see the silence., the initial reaction from the sports enthusiast, then confusion, and me(Yes, I might even eat popcorn). Who knows what can happen, once the ducks are in a row.

 

[larryf]

Dish has made a reasonable explanation. HD channels are HD channels you know. So if you have more national HD with a given amount of bandwidth, then that doesn't leave enough for other things. D* is using bunches of bandwidth for the HD sports and letting the national HD go by the wayside.

As to whether they could use it better or not. Well, imo, I don't think adding more sports in HD is making it better. You love your sports, so you are free to disagree...

I agree. I think it is much better to show the same movie on two premium channels back to back. That way if I missed the first showing (or the other 40 times it was shown this month ), I can see it again. Come on , the same movie 40 or 50 times a month or live sports action?????? Oh wait I see, some people will pay extra to see movies over and over.

 

[TonyT@DISH Network]

I agree. I think it is much better to show the same movie on two premium channels back to back. That way if I missed the first showing (or the other 40 times it was shown this month ), I can see it again. Come on , the same movie 40 or 50 times a month or live sports action?????? Oh wait I see, some people will pay extra to see movies over and over.

I agree with your sentiment, but the two feeds are based on timezones. It used to be that not all subscribers had access to eastern and western feeds. In fact, I believe there are still some that can't. Still funny to read when put that way!

 

[dangue]

Clearly its important to some people or the D subs wouldn't complain about the lack of premiums in HD over in their forum. I don't see why it is so difficult for some people to accept that others have different tastes, interests or preferences than them. As a provider, Dish has to decide how to best cater to all their subs' needs, not just one sub's personal HD preferences. Dish has decided this is the best way to go about it. If a sub doesn't agree, they have other options.

 

[dangue]

I agree with your sentiment, but the two feeds are based on timezones. It used to be that not all subscribers had access to eastern and western feeds. In fact, I believe there are still some that can't. Still funny to read when put that way!

There's nothing wrong with wanting to watch prime time programming during prime time. DVRs have made this less important, but not everyone has a DVR.

 

[Mr Tony]

Almost all = not all, which I guess is my point, and 'not all' leaves room for my original 'official' answer that said 'Officially, some sports networks are not providing the games 100% of the time in HD'. My point is that I am not wrong on that answer.

the reason I wrote "almost all" is because if I wrote all (which it probably is) someone would say "nah uh"

I do see a reason why the sports enthusiast would not be happy about the state of affairs, both with HD games available on E* and seemingly constant negotiations with sports channels. Our intention is not to spit on the fan of those teams, its to provide the best value in Pay TV over 14 million customers. There may be a large percentage of sports fans out there, but I would still be hesitant to suggest the majority of our customers are sports fans, or even tune to the channels. Being diplomatic to all customers, and fighting for pricing on programming (and I guess its reasonable to assume profit margin, as any business worth its salt would) does mean that some people get left out.

the bolded part sounds like you're reading off a script

But as for the other, I'm not talking about hard core sports fans. The ones who have a out of market sports package to watch every game they can. Its the fans who want to see the local team and wants to see it in HD. Not "maybe", not "Jip'd". I've said a few times if Dish would get off their butt and have the games in HD maybe I'd still be with them. There are lots of folks who were mad when Dish pulled one Twins game (the letters in the paper were interesting to say the least).

JUST FOR THE PURPOSE OF HUMOR: I would laugh if E* started buying sports nets, like D* has. It would be interesting to see the silence., the initial reaction from the sports enthusiast, then confusion, and me(Yes, I might even eat popcorn). Who knows what can happen, once the ducks are in a row.

well Comcast and Directv own some sports net...why not Dish?
Highly unlikely seeing their track record on sports channels but hey if I can date a porn star, Dish can own a sports network

 

[TonyT@DISH Network]

I would be first in line to say "nah uh" on that, mainly because the 'proof is in the pudding' so to speak.

Think about it this way, if a sports net only airs sporting events, and only airs them in HD 100% of the time, I believe you would be able to argue the point legitimately. That being said, they do not only air sporting events, and they are not 100% HD all the time, regardless of what is being aired, so tying up the bandwidth 100% of the time (even when its infomercials and paid programming, as I have seen be present) makes no sense.

 

[Mr Tony]

Think about it this way, if a sports net only airs sporting events, and only airs them in HD 100% of the time, I believe you would be able to argue the point legitimately

which pro sports are broadcast in HD....the feed is available

That being said, they do not only air sporting events, and they are not 100% HD all the time, regardless of what is being aired, so tying up the bandwidth 100% of the time (even when its infomercials and paid programming, as I have seen be present) makes no sense.

But Dish isnt even putting in an effort to show the sporting events in HD all the time. And thats what a lot of folks have gripes with. They want to sit down and watch the game in HD...not "maybe", not "possibly", not "hopefully" and surely not "Jip'd"...they want to watch the game in HD.
The games are there...in HD for folks to see. Other providers its not an issue. Only the Dish subs have to worry if the game is in HD or not

 

[TonyT@DISH Network]

They want to sit down and watch the game in HD...not "maybe", not "possibly", not "hopefully" and surely not "Jip'd"...they want to watch the game in HD.

And yet some do not subscribe to HD programming and watch sports, some do not have HD capable TVs when they do subscribe and watch sports, and not all subscribers watch sports. That is true for both E* and D* customers.

I am not saying I don't see your point though, and I am not saying that I believe DISH should not take action on it, and not provide HD all the time when available. I am hoping to be the first to announce full-time RSNs in HD on DISH (not likely in this forum , information does hit Satguys VERY quick). My only point is that my initial post was correct, under any light.

 

[DodgerKing]

there is..its called the internet

Nope. Blacked out within your own region. You can only watch your local team on their local station through your local provider. All internet feeds (unless replayed) are blacked out for you local team in your local area. Internet broadcast is for out of market games only