Dishnetwork blasting its Contractors

[Stargazer]

Dish just keeps testing the waters dont they? These B.S. fees, chargebacks on retailers, cut health benefits, now this. The company is not hurting so they had no need for cutting those health benefits and doing all this other than to get profits higher and higher and higher. They keep pushing things to see how far they can go. As they get bigger they will get worse. THANK GOODNESS A MERGER WAS NOT APPROVED! Can you imagine how bad it would be if the companies were merged? Eventually they will take things too far if they haven't already. What will be next? The loss of retailers which means the loss of their longterm experience along with it.

 

[dishcomm]

Dish just keeps testing the waters dont they? These B.S. fees, chargebacks on retailers, cut health benefits, now this. The company is not hurting so they had no need for cutting those health benefits and doing all this other than to get profits higher and higher and higher. They keep pushing things to see how far they can go. As they get bigger they will get worse. THANK GOODNESS A MERGER WAS NOT APPROVED! Can you imagine how bad it would be if the companies were merged? Eventually they will take things too far if they haven't already. What will be next? The loss of retailers which means the loss of their longterm experience along with it.

Looks like your mixing issues here...The chargebacks and all the other issues discussed here are typical of what takes place with contractors..Health bennies and such would most likely pertain to DNS itself.
Howevwe yes, the chargebacks to reatilers by E* are unreasonable..For example..If a retail customer still within their 18 month commit moves to a new home, orders a mover and it is discovered that there is no line of sight, the customer cancels and the retailer is hit a with a full backcharge. That to me is unconsionable.

 

[dishcomm]

Oh yea I couldnt agrea more that alot does rest on the companies starting at the very top and sometimes I really wonder if Charlie knows what his yes men are really doing or not. I know that Charlie is not a favorite of many people but if you look at how the company is now as compared to when I first started with them in 00 you would see that back then the installers were treated much better if not payed as well as they are now and the workload was half to 2/3 less of what it is now.


Hmmm, if any dish dnsc is still paying a starting wage of $11 an hour then they are pulling some fast ones over the techs, the starting wage when I left had been bumped up from $10.50 to $12.50 wich puts it right inline with all of the cable companies in the area.

As much as I dont like what is going on it is still a company that I would work for directly as the insurance was much better than what I have now and the pay rate is better and I had the freedom of not being stuck in some cubicle or building like I am now.

On the note of bushings.

Ok I am a bit torn on these things, they do tend to clean up the visual aspects of the cable running in and do protect the casing from damage related to movement on aluminum siding but they absolutely do not stop water from coming in wich is why you should always add a dab of silicone to the coax prior to pushing in the last inch or so and putting another dab under the cap of the bushing prior to pushing it in to.

$11/hr is the number..Two years ago, it was $10...DNS has different rates in higher cost of living areas. This is the Charlotte ,NC area. Salaries have not kept up with eht cost of living here...This is a booming area in residential and economic growth..but the kicker is with all this growth, taxes go up, the cost of housing is way up..Ten years ago the average price of any sold home was around $110,000..That figure is up to about $150,000..Now get this.....The average price of a NEW home is $280,000!....
Anyway, the best techs are steering clear of DNS. No experienced tech would work ther..DNS does not mkae consideration for experiance..You start at their starting wage and work up to a max of $14.50/hr...At least that is the last number I heard of..It may be more..I do not know..BTW i saw a DNS tech heading down the road at 9pm this past Monday...I know he was working cause the DNS techs DO NOT have take home vans. 9pm! Can you believe that?!!!!! no friggin way...Every once in a blue moon I'll get stuck on a job and get home real late....

 

[Todd Humphrey]

As promised. My new web page on using bushings on exterior walls. I need to clean a few of the graphics up, and add a few pictures, but the text is all there.


http://www.dbsinstall.com/imo/bushings.asp

 

[joshua721]

I just recently ended my job with a company doing dish and direct. What a screwed up business it is. I spent 4 years in the AirForce doing wideband and satcom, mobile comm non of his fixed site garbage. The company i worked for lost their dish network contract a 2 months ago due to bad numbers. we weren't getting enough installs in or something i was told. I was also told that no LOS and where the customer canceled or wasn't home for their appointment counted against our numbers. if thats true its ridicules. some of the customers drove me nuts. i don't want to sound like some half ass installer, my main job right now is contruction which i enjoy and take pride in. I felt the same way installing in someones home. but some of these expectations the customers had were amazing. i would get to these houses and get things like,
you can't get a wire up through two floors in the wall?
there is a charge for....... the csr told me it was all free.
i didn't know my crawlspace/basement was filled with a foot of water and mud (always the first job of the day two)
im sure most of you have heard them all too.

all in all i don't miss it its an extremely shady feeling job, and it shouldn't be direct and dish promise the world on the phone and in the adds and its all left on the installers to give the people what they want. when i always went out of my way to help people out, fixing stuff over the phone after they freaked out when they changed the channel and even kept a cheerful tone after the 10 min long voicemail where they yelled at me saying it was all broke. (no matter how many times you explain it or write it down for each TV HD is the worst)

 

[botman]

As promised. My new web page on using bushings on exterior walls. I need to clean a few of the graphics up, and add a few pictures, but the text is all there.


http://www.dbsinstall.com/imo/bushings.asp

What are you on drugs? you make my point on CRAZY out there installers, you have a website to explain when to use a bushing AMG of coaurse you caulk a cable running from the outside (WEATHER SIDE) to the inside of a house (INTERIOR SIDE) and yes please do use a bushing to protect your cable when going thru, let's say aluminum siding AND SUCH Einstein OR LETS GO REALLY SUPER DUPER DEEP USE A BUSHING TO SAVE ON CAULK AS WELL! MAN! is this your first job in the real world or somthing GROW UP!

 

[rcdallas]

What are you on drugs? you make my point on CRAZY out there installers, you have a website to explain when to use a bushing AMG of coaurse you caulk a cable running from the outside (WEATHER SIDE) to the inside of a house (INTERIOR SIDE) and yes please do use a bushing to protect your cable when going thru, let's say aluminum siding AND SUCH Einstein OR LETS GO REALLY SUPER DUPER DEEP USE A BUSHING TO SAVE ON CAULK AS WELL! MAN! is this your first job in the real world or somthing GROW UP!

Did I miss something? Why are you after Todd Humphrey for having a website that pretty much covers down to the nitty gritty of how a satellite install is supposed to be installed?

Crazy out there installers is installing a dish 60' in a tree for LOS. Having a website that is a valuble tool to newbie installers is beneficial considering companies seem to push and shove new techs out the door on to the first job - meaning weren't properly trained then customer ends up coming on web forums complaining about their lousy install.

 

[webbydude]

What are you on drugs? you make my point on CRAZY out there installers, you have a website to explain when to use a bushing AMG of coaurse you caulk a cable running from the outside (WEATHER SIDE) to the inside of a house (INTERIOR SIDE) and yes please do use a bushing to protect your cable when going thru, let's say aluminum siding AND SUCH Einstein OR LETS GO REALLY SUPER DUPER DEEP USE A BUSHING TO SAVE ON CAULK AS WELL! MAN! is this your first job in the real world or somthing GROW UP!

Did I miss something? Why are you after Todd Humphrey for having a website that pretty much covers down to the nitty gritty of how a satellite install is supposed to be installed?

Crazy out there installers is installing a dish 60' in a tree for LOS. Having a website that is a valuble tool to newbie installers is beneficial considering companies seem to push and shove new techs out the door on to the first job - meaning weren't properly trained then customer ends up coming on web forums complaining about their lousy install.

LOL!! Good point. Umm..."crazy" is not having the fortitude to use somewhat proper punctuation. Other than the initial question mark, I had an incredibly difficult time reading his run-on sentence post.

 

[botman]

Did I miss something? Why are you after Todd Humphrey for having a website that pretty much covers down to the nitty gritty of how a satellite install is supposed to be installed?

Crazy out there installers is installing a dish 60' in a tree for LOS. Having a website that is a valuble tool to newbie installers is beneficial considering companies seem to push and shove new techs out the door on to the first job - meaning weren't properly trained then customer ends up coming on web forums complaining about their lousy install.

-------------------------------------------

That is a nice thing to do, and I applaud him for that
Because some people do not have the money, whiles others can not wait
for service, and others just do not want anyone touching there house .

Most NEW Dish sytems come with free installation that is mandatory,
and it would be great if people could mark out a spot they know is ideal in
advance, or at least know, if the problem is related to a poorly located Dish
to start with because the determining factor should always be what's the best
location for Dish reception "NOT WHAT IS THE EASIEST TO MOUNT THE DISH"

His section on bushings does more to make things seem more technical
and confusing then necessary, and has the potential to turn people off from
Repairing their own setup, that bushing info should be a sentence or two
max in some kind of basic common sense running a cable section.

Could I have explained myself better and have been more diplomatic
about things MAYBE

PS look, I could give you a confusing how to, on changing a flat or checking the mail if that turns you on?

 

[botman]

LOL!! Good point. Umm..."crazy" is not having the fortitude to use somewhat proper punctuation. Other than the initial question mark, I had an incredibly difficult time reading his run-on sentence post.

-------------------------------

NO crazy is not having a life, and the time to nit pick at hastly typed replys

You are no more an English Major then those two I mention are real installers

Please keep your (20 minute Office 2007) assisted reply's to your self
Because Unfortunately for you and us, there’s no common sense wizard to use

 

[Pepper]

So... where do I apply to be one of these QC inspectors? Since (depending on your point of view) the job is either making sure everything is done right and the customers are happy or punishing the people who did the work, the pay must be good?

 

[webbydude]

-------------------------------

NO crazy is not having a life, and the time to nit pick at hastly typed replys

You are no more an English Major then those two I mention are real installers

Please keep your (20 minute Office 2007) assisted reply's to your self
Because Unfortunately for you and us, there’s no common sense wizard to use

I believe you are misunderstanding the gist of what I was trying to convey. Your post was more confusing than anything Todd has ever posted on his website (if anything, I've found it to be a good tool and wonderful point of reference).

Regardless of whether I'm using Office (I'm not...I'm just using basic grammar and "common sense" when posting...not to mention there is such a thing as spellcheck during those moments when the word "hastily" seems a bit out of your grasp), the insulting tone and assumption that all installers are either (a) cheap or (b) should know this information he has posted is what irked me. And then furthermore you go off on the deep end and imply I'm not an installer. Good grief dude, if/when you get a chance, you can actually read my SatGuys profile and see that is not the case.

"....assisted replies...." !! That's a good one

 

[dishcomm]

I just recently ended my job with a company doing dish and direct. What a screwed up business it is. I spent 4 years in the AirForce doing wideband and satcom, mobile comm non of his fixed site garbage. The company i worked for lost their dish network contract a 2 months ago due to bad numbers. we weren't getting enough installs in or something i was told. I was also told that no LOS and where the customer canceled or wasn't home for their appointment counted against our numbers. if thats true its ridicules. some of the customers drove me nuts. i don't want to sound like some half ass installer, my main job right now is contruction which i enjoy and take pride in. I felt the same way installing in someones home. but some of these expectations the customers had were amazing. i would get to these houses and get things like,
you can't get a wire up through two floors in the wall?
there is a charge for....... the csr told me it was all free.
i didn't know my crawlspace/basement was filled with a foot of water and mud (always the first job of the day two)
im sure most of you have heard them all too.

all in all i don't miss it its an extremely shady feeling job, and it shouldn't be direct and dish promise the world on the phone and in the adds and its all left on the installers to give the people what they want. when i always went out of my way to help people out, fixing stuff over the phone after they freaked out when they changed the channel and even kept a cheerful tone after the 10 min long voicemail where they yelled at me saying it was all broke. (no matter how many times you explain it or write it down for each TV HD is the worst)

You are preaching to the choir..Getting out was the best thing you could do. Today was anopther example of how sales partner ineptitude and deceit costs me time and aggrevation....The customer wigged when he found out he woould have to pay the $5 A/O fee on his 625.....This was after I completed and closed the w/o..So now it's my respnsibilty to smooth this sh*t out so I can get the guy to sign so I can leave...I am so sick and tired of having to cover for lousy sales people..I hope they all rot in hell. The sales partners make our lives a living hell..They leave out important details pertinent to the install. They make mistakes such as putting the wrong EQ on thw /wo....Not telling customers about additional fees or charges for custom work..all kinds of crap..I am sick of it.I am tired of cutomers who try to order me to do stuff that's not on the w/o and expect the tasks be done free of charge. I am tired of Dish asking us to do more, spend more and pay less..Imagine that, a multi billoin dollar corp quibbling over a few bucks .When I get out of this business as a DNS contractor I am not looking back....

 

[Stargazer]

Thats where those darn monthly B.S. fees come in, when the customers do not have those fees explained to them good enough and the service ends up costing them more than they thought it would. They keep penny pinching on both ends, on the retailer/installer end and on the customer end to maximize their profits more and more. They will reach their limits if they havent already surpassed them already in some aspects and when the competition beats their prices they will look for areas to penny pinch even more to make up for their loss (if thats not what they are doing already as well).

 

[dishcomm]

Thats where those darn monthly B.S. fees come in, when the customers do not have those fees explained to them good enough and the service ends up costing them more than they thought it would. They keep penny pinching on both ends, on the retailer/installer end and on the customer end to maximize their profits more and more. They will reach their limits if they havent already surpassed them already in some aspects and when the competition beats their prices they will look for areas to penny pinch even more to make up for their loss (if thats not what they are doing already as well).

Oh the plot thickens..Now the GM in the Charlotte DNS office is about to institute a "post call" directive...This was reserved for techs that lousy TC rates..Now the policy may appply everyone. That's ok for the hourly paid DNS techs. They ar estill on the clock..Calling these people is opn MY CLOCK..That's just out of bounds...I said to my supervisor, that would be fine but now I have to spend 30 mins on the phone every night running up my cell minutes and doing another item of Dish Network's bidding without compensation...The job is getting larger and larger and Dish is trying to squeeze every nickel out of it.. We are being solicited by techs of other contractors who are looking to get out of just doing DNS work..
IMO the whole thing is falling apart at the seams..Even the GM at DNS thinks the system is the problem. I hear the grumbling at out shop..I see the complaints form techs on here...The future of things as they are now is at best tenuous

 

[chadzx11]

So... where do I apply to be one of these QC inspectors? Since (depending on your point of view) the job is either making sure everything is done right and the customers are happy or punishing the people who did the work, the pay must be good?

I don't punish anybody. I don't know, nor do I care who installed what. What I care about it accurately reporting and showing what I see to the client (distributors and platform providers alike) in an unbiased fashion. If I ding somebody for something, there will be photographic proof. The minimum I have turned in on a job is 9 pictures. I show everything, down the the branding on the cable. About the only thing I won't do is physically touch the dish.

The company I work with is in my sig. If you are down, I look foward to seeing how you bring it. They've got doing some management and training type (and yes, some people are not ready for prime time to do a QC) stuff as well, so I get to see. This summer is going to be a blast. I gots to take me a working vacation to florida for sure!

The hardest part a lot of times is having to refrain from telling the customer to "go call DirecTv right now, and tell them to get this fixed!" When their installer has screwed them over.

The only thing we are authorized to change on an install is if someone grounded to a gas pipe. I've never run across that, so NBD.

 

[dishcomm]

I don't punish anybody. I don't know, nor do I care who installed what. What I care about it accurately reporting and showing what I see to the client (distributors and platform providers alike) in an unbiased fashion. If I ding somebody for something, there will be photographic proof. The minimum I have turned in on a job is 9 pictures. I show everything, down the the branding on the cable. About the only thing I won't do is physically touch the dish.

The company I work with is in my sig. If you are down, I look foward to seeing how you bring it. They've got doing some management and training type (and yes, some people are not ready for prime time to do a QC) stuff as well, so I get to see. This summer is going to be a blast. I gots to take me a working vacation to florida for sure!

The hardest part a lot of times is having to refrain from telling the customer to "go call DirecTv right now, and tell them to get this fixed!" When their installer has screwed them over.

The only thing we are authorized to change on an install is if someone grounded to a gas pipe. I've never run across that, so NBD.

IO have dealt with sh!tty QC guy that play favorites. Qc guys that let the real bad stuff go like no ground, they blow it off. And there are the QC guys that will screw a job over a drip loop...
Back in my Primesatr days, we had a QC guy that was a real bastard..We called him "by the book Charlie"..This SOB would go around measureing the space between flex clips. Primestar did have a rule(Actually they had rules for their rules) madating a maximum of 18"between flex clips..Everyone knew this was overkill. But this asswipe enforced..It got so bad that he was "promoted" out of that position..The reason..All the contractors were threatening to stop taking jobs. That included the RSP in our region..It was miserable....When I did QC's I had it this way...If the job looked good and wwas to specs, I passed it..If ther was a litle thing wrong, I would take a photo to remoind the tech and I would fix it..If it was major, I gave notice to the tech to go and bring the installl to specs. On his own time..or he could take a back charge....
Bu tthis ireaaly isn't the issue...The problems are within the managemants of the contractor companies..The rip offs of techs are so outrageous it is a wonder no one running these companies hasn't been sued yet.
There is another contractor in our area that is losing techs every day because of the chargebacks..Stupid stuff..Like not putting the company sticker on the front of the receivers..They charge back the entire job...My employer does business the correct way..They treat us well No playng favorites. No ridiculous criminal chargebacks..Non of that crap..The word is out. That's why techs are coming ot us looking for work....BTW there are plenty of guys out there doing crappy work that they deserve to get no compensation for....In those cases the chargebacks are legit....
Anyway, what is going on is the business is being destroyed by these fly by night contractors..I predict that many of the good honest hard working techs will eventually leave the business..Then Dish can sing mammy in Macy's window. Because all that will be left are a bunch of techs that know nothing and don't care about the job....Or the customers.

 

[keeletronix]

Installers are overload and are forced to do bad installs' because they will miss their next install. They will get yelled at if they do. also grounds do not prevent lighting stricks. I have thousands of dtv and dish systems out there. In fact most lighting damage comes in through the phone lines. The only other lighting damage comes in through ground blocks.

 

[blockisle9]

This is why Im a big fan of company employees and against out sourcing. Ive worked for a local municipality as a E-1 Electrician for 18 years, almost every time we out source work we get shabby work and we end up fixing the problems are selfs. They have no vested interest on workmanship or quality, get in get out and make a buck. Im sure there are many good installers but unfortunately the bad ones are killing the good ones.
If I did shabby work at my job I would be disciplined by my supervisor (warning letters, un-paid suspensions or even termination)
Maybe Dish should hire more inspectors (Who know about installs) and checkout some of the complaints as well as random inspections. This could be a way of banning bad installers installing for Dish.

 

[webbydude]

This is why Im a big fan of company employees and against out sourcing. Ive worked for a local municipality as a E-1 Electrician for 18 years, almost every time we out source work we get shabby work and we end up fixing the problems are selfs. They have no vested interest on workmanship or quality, get in get out and make a buck. Im sure there are many good installers but unfortunately the bad ones are killing the good ones.
If I did shabby work at my job I would be disciplined by my supervisor (warning letters, un-paid suspensions or even termination)
Maybe Dish should hire more inspectors (Who know about installs) and checkout some of the complaints as well as random inspections. This could be a way of banning bad installers installing for Dish.

In a lot of ways, Dish has brought this upon themselves. Promising customers anything and everything in the world and then forcing the installer to be the one to break the customer's heart by turning the job down; or worse, succumbing to the pressure and doing the install.

Case in point....read this thread...http://www.satelliteguys.us/showthread.php?p=857074#post857074