Frustrated by 97W

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Welcome to digital satellite signals. Back in the day analog was a lot easier when it came to finding a satellite. 97W was my first satellite I received. It took me hours to get then I found this site and found out that getting digital signals without a meter is a pain so I bought and meter and have not looked back.

Good luck with your setup.

Folks I finally picked 97W up!

This bird has an extremely narrow margin for errors. I picked up 103W with relative ease and tried to backtrack from there moving the dish to the left just a smidge. The instant I noticed the signal jump up by 1 or 2 I started moving slightly up and noticed a sudden burst in quality from 0 to 30. Played around with it and the skew until I peaked it. From what I noticed this bird seems a lot more sensitive to skew than for example 103, 74 or 93. I was able to peak the quality from 30 to around 46 on a weak TP just by rotating the LNB a few degrees.

I wanted to thank everyone for all the helpful replies. I am certain I would not have been able to finish the job without your support. :D
 
97W has a huge range of signal strength between transponders for some reason. (Most birds do, but most birds don't have full-time broadcast programming on all their transponders, so they have an excuse!) The two that are often cited as being the strongest, 12152 and 12177, are a lot weaker than one other one, I think it's 11836, for me, and most of the rest are a lot weaker than the first two. I have no idea why there's such a ridiculous variation, since the satellite was just launched last year. At the time, I saw some people say that it didn't seem like much of a difference from the old satellite that it replaced.

You're right on chief! 12177 gives me only about 46 quality and I have a few TPs that don't even lock on to the signal, probably inactive I guess. 11836 is I think the strongest TP for me as well and I'm getting S: 76 Q: 78 which is quiet passable. I think I could have peaked it by at least another 1 or 2 in signal on the weaker TPs but I was just tired of messing around with this bird for a few days straight. I'll see how it all holds up with heavy snow/rain and might try to readjust if necessary later.

I didn't risk anything though and let the receiver do a through blindscan to pull whatever was there in.
 
Welcome to digital satellite signals. Back in the day analog was a lot easier when it came to finding a satellite. 97W was my first satellite I received. It took me hours to get then I found this site and found out that getting digital signals without a meter is a pain so I bought and meter and have not looked back.

Good luck with your setup.

Absolutely right! Analogues were so much easier, I used to set them up when I was around 16 with relative ease and only by using a few landmarks (we lived in a high rise with a huge balcony). Digital signals are much more difficult and a meter does help, so does a good receiver that can lock and identify the bird even with a weaker signal.
 
Congratulations!

Thank you sir.

Good going! If you think that was hard, wait 'til you get a motor!

Thank you. I don't think after the traumatizing experience with this bird I will go even near the dish for a while. I do wanna set another one up in the summer to pull 103W mainly for the Pentagon channel (former USAF officer :)) and 125W for all the PBS stuff.
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iceberg
glad to hear it

Thanks Iceberg, I've used a lot of the resources you've provided on this fantastic site.

Agree! Iceberg is a great help on SatelliteGuys! Can't say it enough. :up

Glad you got the signal locked it. Enjoy your Persian TV my friend :D
 
Thank you. I don't think after the traumatizing experience with this bird I will go even near the dish for a while. I do wanna set another one up in the summer to pull 103W mainly for the Pentagon channel (former USAF officer :)) and 125W for all the PBS stuff.

I have 103 on a 30" dish that's centered on 97. You just have to figure out how to mount an LNB in the right position. (I used a commercially-produced bracket, but it turns out that it wasn't intended for my model of dish so I had to be creative in attaching it. I should post pictures sometime.)
 
Agree! Iceberg is a great help on SatelliteGuys! Can't say it enough. :up

Glad you got the signal locked it. Enjoy your Persian TV my friend :D

:D Thanks, it's actually my ma who enjoys the Persian dramas. I rarely watch any TV other than stuff I play on my WDTV.
 
I have 103 on a 30" dish that's centered on 97. You just have to figure out how to mount an LNB in the right position. (I used a commercially-produced bracket, but it turns out that it wasn't intended for my model of dish so I had to be creative in attaching it. I should post pictures sometime.)

Dude! If you can show pictures of your setup it would be highly appreciated! I assume the 103 LNB goes to the left of 97? How's your signal with a 30"? I don't think I could even pick it up with that small a dish up here. With my 36" I'm struggling to pull 76 in the most powerful TPs with quality around the same level.
 
The pictures will have to wait til tomorrow. :) The 103 LNB goes to the right of 97 if you're looking from the front of the dish, and also higher than 97. I'm getting as good of a signal on 103 as I am on 97.
 
Payam,

I am glad to hear that you have finally dialed 97.0 W in on your system. That is good work and congratulations! :)

I assume that you have it all figured out now, at least to your acceptance anyways.

I just happened upon your thread just now and read it over. You have this issue resolved, so there is little that I need to offer to you in this regard, but maybe I can point out a few helpful hints to others for their endeavors. These points are going to be quite redundant to many here, so for those who are already aware of these items and tips, you can just ignore me for now. Once you get it, you got it!

Gordy's Tips:

01] Set mast for dish and motor in a location that provides the best possible coverage for a particular satellite or for the full coverage of the arc of all satellites. Beware of hills and buildings and trees and even power poles. You don't want any interference, even if it is slight it you can avoid it.

02] Set the mast that the dish (or motor and dish) is to attach to or rest upon to the most precise vertical plumb angle that you can possibly achieve. The mast or post must be perfectly upright and plumb in all cardinal directions as all the other angles depend upon this as a reference.

03] Utilize a well known angle calculator to provide you with at least ball-park angles for each sat that you are attempting to detect.

04] Utilize the LATITUDE scale on your motor (if you are using a motor) and set that scale to the same degree as your site's LATITUDE degree. Once this LATITUDE angle is set, don't adjust it. Most motors are sufficiently accurate in this regard, so unless you suspect that there is an obvious discrepancy, don't mess with this setting once you have set it initially. It is 99% correct.

05] Set your DISH elevation to the degree angle that the manual instructs you to use or that an online calculator provides. Most of these are just as accurate as you will ever need to start with. You can and probably will readjust slightly to peak the signal for the optimum reading later on in the process. Don't get too carried away with perfection just yet.

06] Obtain a cheapo old TV and a legit FTA receiver that has been recommended as a USER FRIENDLY model for detecting and scanning channels and TPS and take each of these out to you installation site. Use this equipment to "fine tune" your dish and motor alignments to provide the best possible signal QUALITY reading that you can.

07] Begin with your true south satellite first. Fine tune the signal from that satellite first and then make your way across the sat arc, a little bit at a time and fine tune as you go. Motor the assembly a little east and or a little west and tweak for best signal, then return to the true south sat and repeak it, then start over. Keep making your way across the horizon and improving your signal on each sat as you proceed.

08] Always use and rely upon satellites and TPs and channels which are KNOWN to be consistently broadcasting a signal to your area. Ignore intermittent FEED channels while setting up yuou equipment and aligning it.

09] Utilize one of the lesser expensive or less "high-tech" receivers to experiment with at first. Such as a Coolsat 4, 5 or 6K or the Fortec Dynamic receiver models. These are your best tools all around, even though they do not receive HD MPEG-4 or other fancy signals. They are user friendly and will provide you with the ultimate seek and tune assistance. You cannot go wrong with these inexpensive tuners, I guarantee it and many others will vouch for my opinion on this.

10] Do a lot of research and take a great deal of notes as you go along. Make a notebook if you will and record all of your findings and experiences as you proceed.

11] Read everything you can possibly read along the way, even if it doesn't seem important to you and your objective, you may and probably will use the information you find down the road somewhere.

12] Ensure that you use a portable TV and receiver out in the field for making adjustments. You really will desire to have that immediate feedback from the signal meter to get a true notion of what you are doing in the alignment process.

13] Enjoy what you are doing... Don't allow yourself to become frustrated with this endeavor. This is for fun and the earning of knowledge and experience so treat it as such. If you find yourself becoming frustrated, then simply back-off for a while and let things settle in your mind. Come back to the project later and start over with a clear and calm mindset. Make it FUN! If it isn't fun and enjoyable to you, then quit and return when it is.

I hope that everyone who reads this understands me. It is quite simple and all that is required is the proper attitude and a sense of comfort so that you continue to enjoy it all.

Now, go out there and "DO IT"! :)

RADAR
 
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Good pointers RADAR! I specially like #13! It seems like when something just does not want to happen it simply won't. I spent 2-3 days out there for hours with no luck. The last day though it only took me about 20 minutes before I had it locked, and that includes the time to hit 103 and do two blind scans, 5 minutes each!
 
Here's a picture of my bracket setup for 91, 97, and 103. The 97 LNB, in the center, is mounted on the holder that came with the dish. The brackets that were provided with the multi-bracket kit for this purpose would put the LNB holder too high up on this model of dish and not point toward the center of the dish. Instead, one of them is bolted upside-down to the bottom of the LNB arm as an aid to keeping the crossbar straight, although in retrospect I don't think it's doing anything and probably doesn't need to be there. (I had to find another bolt for this configuration by the way; neither the ones that came with the dish nor the ones that came with the brackets were long enough, since the crossbar is meant to be mounted completely differently as you can see in the advertising pictures for these brackets.)

The 103 LNB is mounted to the right on one of the posts provided. The 91 LNB on the left has its holder mounted directly to the fitting meant to hold another post, because if I put it on a post it can't get close enough to the crossbar to be in the proper location. This is all geography-dependent by the way. At another location, and/or centered on a different satellite, the LNBs will be at a different angle to one another, and so it may be possible to mount them all on the posts. Or, it may not be possible to mount on both sides of the center, as I barely was able to find an acceptable location to hit 91. It actually sits a bit further back from the dish than I would like, but if I mount it in front of the crossbar it sits too close to be in the focal point at all.
 

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actually if you are standing in front of the dish, it goes to the RIGHT....when working with multiple sats they go opposite how they are in the sky

Here is my old 36" dish setup with 89/93/97/103 (from left to right)
 

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Thank you Jim and Iceberg for the photos! I'm gonna try to experiement with each setup and see what I can pull. 103 is my main target and it seems like it must be an easy enough mod to get that bird.

Once again thanks for taking the time to take the photo and upload it!
 
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