Got a 4K TV. Do I need to replace everything else now?

Pepper

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An update.

(Just because I said "thanks for participating" in the previous post, didn't mean I was finished with this project)

I got some "certified premium" cables and the 1x4 splitter from Monoprice. The splitter has a two-position EDID switch on it. STD means replicate the EDID from the device on port 1 to all ports, TV means an EDID of 1080p@60Hz with LPCM 2CH audio on all ports. With my 4K TV on port 1, either setting gives the same results of normal operation of the port 1 TV, and a black screen with audio on the 1080 TVs. I'll be contacting Monoprice for help, most likely a refund, or an exchange if they have something else that will work.

I found a device that seems available only overseas http://www.cypeurope.com/store/stor...l-outputs-&-HDCP-Converter-4K-HDCP2.2-HDMI2.0 which looks like it would do exactly what I need of taking a 4k signal and splitting to two outputs, one pass thru and the other scaled down, but the price is ridiculous.

Seems I'm stuck for now with using my old 1x4 splitter for 1080 everywhere, and swapping to a dedicated cable when 4k is needed.
 
lparsons21

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Pepper, thanks for the update. I suspected that what you found would be the case.
 
harshness

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With my 4K TV on port 1, either setting gives the same results of normal operation of the port 1 TV, and a black screen with audio on the 1080 TVs.
You need to very carefully detail exactly what "normal operation" means.

I'm not sure there should be a situation where HD content should make it to the UHD without also hitting the HD TVs. The one exception might be if the HD TVs aren't capable of the negotiated frame rate. In this instance alone, the splitter failed to correctly negotiate the greatest common feature set. Does your UHD TV have a feature that shows the format of content?
 
Pepper

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You need to very carefully detail exactly what "normal operation" means.

I'm not sure there should be a situation where HD content should make it to the UHD without also hitting the HD TVs. The one exception might be if the HD TVs aren't capable of the negotiated frame rate. In this instance alone, the splitter failed to correctly negotiate the greatest common feature set. Does your UHD TV have a feature that shows the format of content?
By "normal operation" I meant that it shows video.

If there's a way to get this new TV to tell me the resolution and framerate coming to its input, I haven't found it yet. This in itself is a frustration.
 
harshness

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By "normal operation" I meant that it shows video.
There are many kinds of video in terms of resolution, interlacing, frame rate and even DRM. Understanding what the source device is can help provide insights into what you're dealing with.

It kind of sounds like the UHDTV might be negotiating an HDCP 2.2 session that the HDTVs can't participate in and I'm not sure HDCP 1.x fallback is described as a mode.
 
Pepper

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Interesting theory. So if I could find a setting on the UHD TV or the Hopper 3 for "legacy hdcp" or some such, it might work?
 
harshness

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Interesting theory. So if I could find a setting on the UHD TV or the Hopper 3 for "legacy hdcp" or some such, it might work?
If the LG has any ports that don't support HDCP 2.x, it just might, but you'd need to be switching ports to view UHD from the H3 or any other HDMI 2.x source devices you're splitting.

In the grand scheme, it may be easier to do a Joey for the HDTVs versus having to fiddle with switches and suffering the attendant discipline of using a mixed system.
 
Pepper

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Unfortunately (?) all the ports support HDCP 2.2

I am considering adding a Joey but it's a last resort.
 
harshness

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Unfortunately (?) all the ports support HDCP 2.2
Got any HDMI 1.x splitters around?
I am considering adding a Joey but it's a last resort.
Did you try this before the H3? My experience with splitting HDMI was that all of the TVs had to be "on" in order for the handshake to be successful.
 
Pepper

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Got any HDMI 1.x splitters around?Did you try this before the H3? My experience with splitting HDMI was that all of the TVs had to be "on" in order for the handshake to be successful.
yes, I have the older monoproce 1x4 splitter for about three years. It works great, every time I turn on a tv, it renegotiates in 2-5 seconds.
 
harshness

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A box to convert the Hopper's Component outputs to HDMI, add that to the distribution and plug the Hopper's HDMI directly to the 4K TV.
My understanding is that protected content is supposed to either be downgraded to DVD quality or blacked out entirely and there's quite a bit of protected content. These are a lot of hoops to jump through and a tidy sum of money to hopefully get SD quality.
 
Pepper

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Well until I learn something new, I guess things will stay as they are: Old splitter providing 1080 throughout the house, and swap to a direct cable from source to TV when I want to watch something 4K. I just don't see any feasible alternative at this point.
 
harshness

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I just don't see any feasible alternative at this point.
The question becomes whether not having to switch cables (and any associated protocols for others who might use the system) is "cheaper" than a Joey. I'm confident your time and has some non-negligible value.

Not making HDCP at least somewhat backwards compatible is a modern tragedy.
 
budda

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The splitter won't pass 4K properly, it lacks current HDCP support. Everything in the chain must support the current HDCP level. I'm not aware of any HDMI splitters that do yet.

The easiest way to get 4K from the Hopper 3 if you don't have an AV Receiver that supports the latest HDCP is to run the HDMI straight to the TV. Then run an optical cable from the Hopper 3 to the AV Receiver. Since the Hopper 3 only outputs DD5.1 sound, optical is more than good enough.

Blackbird 4K Pro HDCP Converter, 2.2 to 1.4 also the
HDFury 4K Integral HDCP Revision inkl. 2x2 Matrix Audio Extractor HDMI Splitter

I got the Blackbird only $30. 4K UHD blueray players need HDCP 2.2. Other components surly will follow. IMO
 
king3pj

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I know this is an old thread but since I got my first 4K TV this week and still have an Onkyo TX-NR609 that doesn't pass 4K/HDR I thought I would check in witch my experience. First I bought this TCL 55P607 TV for $600 at my local Best Buy. I know this is dirt cheap compared to what you enthusiasts spend on your TVs but this is one of the few budget sets that supports Dolby Vision and has 72 local dimming zones.

I read a couple professional reviews that said it had great picture for the price and one of the lowest response times, which is important for me as someone who plays video games. I have been wanting to get something bigger than my 8-year-old 46" 1080p set for quite a while now and this seemed like one of the better budget options. The built in Roku is much better than any of the other smart TV systems I have seen too.

When I watch Netflix or other streaming services on the TV's built in Roku I get Dolby Digital Plus 5.1 on my Onkyo over ARC just like I do when watching Netflix from my Tivo. This was a surprise to me because I read in this thread, and other places that ARC only supported standard DD and DTS. According to a very long thread I read at AVS Forums, ARC would also pass DD+ 7.1 and even DD+ Atmos from Vudu if I had a setup that would support that.

I have my PS4 Pro hooked directly to one of the TV's HDMI inputs since that is the only way I can get 4K and HDR from it. The PS4 has the ability to encode game audio to DD 5.1 or DTS 5.1 on the fly. I picked the DD option and as soon as I did my Onkyo lit up to indicate that it was receiving DD+ 5.1. This was another surprise for me. Even though the TV is receiving standard DD 5.1 from my PS4, it is outputting DD+ 5.1 to my Onkyo. I have confirmed in game that my surrounds are working properly.

It looks like I am going to be able to make the transition to 4K without having to give up my trusty Onkyo. I'm still not completely out of the woods because I don't have a UHD blu-ray player yet. I'll be getting the Xbox One X this fall but it only has 1 HDMI out and I'm not giving up my lossless audio.

My plan is to get a standalone blu-ray player with 2 HDMI outputs that supports Dolby Vision. As of now, I think the only player that fits all of these requirements is the Oppo UDP 203. I'll be holding off until some of the more mainstream level players start getting DV support. This should be quite a bit cheaper than trying to replace my Onkyo TX-NR609 with something that has equivalent sound quality and features.
 
tigerfan33

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I know this is an old thread but since I got my first 4K TV this week and still have an Onkyo TX-NR609 that doesn't pass 4K/HDR I thought I would check in witch my experience. First I bought this TCL 55P607 TV for $600 at my local Best Buy. I know this is dirt cheap compared to what you enthusiasts spend on your TVs but this is one of the few budget sets that supports Dolby Vision and has 72 local dimming zones.

I read a couple professional reviews that said it had great picture for the price and one of the lowest response times, which is important for me as someone who plays video games. I have been wanting to get something bigger than my 8-year-old 46" 1080p set for quite a while now and this seemed like one of the better budget options. The built in Roku is much better than any of the other smart TV systems I have seen too.

When I watch Netflix or other streaming services on the TV's built in Roku I get Dolby Digital Plus 5.1 on my Onkyo over ARC just like I do when watching Netflix from my Tivo. This was a surprise to me because I read in this thread, and other places that ARC only supported standard DD and DTS. According to a very long thread I read at AVS Forums, ARC would also pass DD+ 7.1 and even DD+ Atmos from Vudu if I had a setup that would support that.

I have my PS4 Pro hooked directly to one of the TV's HDMI inputs since that is the only way I can get 4K and HDR from it. The PS4 has the ability to encode game audio to DD 5.1 or DTS 5.1 on the fly. I picked the DD option and as soon as I did my Onkyo lit up to indicate that it was receiving DD+ 5.1. This was another surprise for me. Even though the TV is receiving standard DD 5.1 from my PS4, it is outputting DD+ 5.1 to my Onkyo. I have confirmed in game that my surrounds are working properly.

It looks like I am going to be able to make the transition to 4K without having to give up my trusty Onkyo. I'm still not completely out of the woods because I don't have a UHD blu-ray player yet. I'll be getting the Xbox One X this fall but it only has 1 HDMI out and I'm not giving up my lossless audio.

My plan is to get a standalone blu-ray player with 2 HDMI outputs that supports Dolby Vision. As of now, I think the only player that fits all of these requirements is the Oppo UDP 203. I'll be holding off until some of the more mainstream level players start getting DV support. This should be quite a bit cheaper than trying to replace my Onkyo TX-NR609 with something that has equivalent sound quality and features.

You may want to look into one of these.
Should be out in a few months.
Home | HDFury.com | Connect and Fix everything in HDMI
 
king3pj

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I'll have to look into that when I have more time to research. From a quick glance I'm not exactly sure what it does.

Edit: That thing is $349.99. For that price I'd rather just spend a little more and get a nice AVR that supports HDMI 2.0a 4K HDR 10 and Dolby Vision. Either that or a high end blu-ray player with 2 HDMI outputs that supports everything I want like the Oppo 203.
 
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harshness

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I note that the latest version of HDMI is currently 2.0b and 2.1 is due to be out at any time.

Another thing to look for in the HDR landscape is Hybrid Log-Gamma as that's what ATSC 3.0 (and probably some other schemes) will be using (assuming that the receiver has anything significant to do with HDR).
 
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king3pj

king3pj

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I note that the latest version of HDMI is currently 2.0b and 2.1 is due to be out at any time.

Another thing to look for in the HDR landscape is Hybrid Log-Gamma as that's what ATSC 3.0 (and probably some other schemes) will be using (assuming that the receiver has anything significant to do with HDR).

I have been looking at lots of AVRs since making my 4K TV purchase. At least in the case of Dolby Vision HDR, the AVR has to support DV passthrough or you don't get it. From my searching, it looks like only the newest AVR's from the major brands support DV at this time. Most AVRs don't currently support it even if they support HDR 10, HDMI 2.0a, and HDCP 2.2. This is true even for higher end models.

Most of the manufactures have said that Dolby Vision updates will be coming to their newer AVRs but many of these same companies have already released newer models that do support it while the older ones still haven't received updates. I'm not saying it won't come eventually. I just have a hard time spending that kind of money on the promise that they will go back and update my receiver at some unknown date.

This is a big part of the reason I chose to wait on buying a new AVR. If you want an AVR that already has DV support the pickings are pretty slim. I also really like my Onkyo 609. Besides the fact that it's HDMI 1.4 there is absolutely nothing wrong with it. I would basically be shelling out $550 for the equivalent model just to get the current HDMI ports. I know there are new features like Dolby Atmos support but since I have a standard 5.1 speaker setup that does nothing for me.

For now I'll just plug my 4K HDR devices directly into the TV and settle for DD+ audio over ARC. Eventually I'll get a UHD blu-ray player with 2 HDMI outs that supports DV once somebody besides Oppo makes one. This seems like a better way to go than buying a new AVR for me.
 
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