Signal amplifier

[f1jdm]

Dish network just installed a complete 4 room system, 1 722 and 1 222 recievers. My problem is in my detached shop 80 feet away from residence and 100 feet away from 722 reciever. Picture is fuzzy and remote only works to a max of 5 feet away from tv, I'm taking for granted that the distance is my problem is there anything I can do to help this situation. Like a signal amplifier.

 

[rcdallas]

I'd hate to say it, but see if you can contact the installer directly, if this was done today have them contact the hub and have the installer come back.

This can be corrected.

 

[f1jdm]

The installation was done last Thursday and the installer was the one who told me that I would need an amplifier, that I would have to get and that was the only way to get better reception because of the distance.

 

[RandallA]

"Picture is fuzzy and remote only works to a max of 5 feet away from tv"

I think he's talking about TV2 being somewhere around 180 ft. If that's the case, then yes you'll need a CATV/UHF amplifier for TV2. I assume that TV1 where the receiver is located is just fine.

 

[f1jdm]

Yes TV1 is just fine.

 

[RandallA]

Ok, take a look at this PDF file I posted a while ago so it will help us calculate your dB loss.

http://www.satelliteguys.us/629758-post2.html

The receiver's agile modulator outputs +17dBmV. Let's say the installer left you with a couple of diplexers, that's a loss of -4.0 dBmV. Then we're gonna assume he used RG6 and your TV2 is setup to channel 21, so your loss for 200 ft. is around -9.4 dB. So you're already at -13.4 dB loss and 3.6 dB at TV2.

Dish Network says that Best video is at 3+ dB and Good video is between 0 dB to +3.0 dB. You're at 3.6 dB so something else is wrong.

What channel is TV2 set to? Did the installer use splitters? If he used splitters then that adds -7.0 db loss and you'll get crap at TV2.

 

[f1jdm]

TV2 is set to channel 21 and yes splitters was used.

 

[RandallA]

So there you go, you need an amplifier. You can buy a +10 dB amplifier at Radio Shack. You're getting somewhere around -3.5 dB at TV2 and you want at least 0 to +3dB. A +10 dB amp. will do the trick.

 

[f1jdm]

Lowes had a 12db amp by Phillips, I installed where cabel leaves house about 1/3 down the cabel run. It helped some, all cross lines are gone but picture still not sharp. Do I need to install amp at start of run or do I need a better quality amp, the remote still has to be close to TV to work.

Thanks for your help

 

[RandallA]

I would try setting TV2 to cable 73, I always get the best picture with that channel. If that doesn't help try the amp at the start of the run. In regards to the remote, make sure the little antenna is not touching anything.

 

[Liquidforce88]

I would say that the installer had to put the remote antenna by the 2nd tv to get it to work. So if you have to diplex the TV2 and antenna you would have 2 splitters and 2 diplexors in the line. The installer probably also used cheap splitters.

I would go and get some real good splitters from monster cable. The problem is you have to much loss with the cheap splitters and too long a cable run.

 

[Andrewwski]

I would say that the installer had to put the remote antenna by the 2nd tv to get it to work. So if you have to diplex the TV2 and antenna you would have 2 splitters and 2 diplexors in the line. The installer probably also used cheap splitters.

Wait...I don't get what you're saying. Somehow he's got the little UHF antenna split into the line that's also carrying the backfeed? That could be the problem right there...signal loss and noise entering the line through the antenna.

I would go and get some real good splitters from monster cable. The problem is you have to much loss with the cheap splitters and too long a cable run.

Not gonna help much. Anyone who's done their research knows Monster Cable is a boatload of BS. A splitter is going to incur a 3.5 db loss for each two way split each time, no matter the brand. A Monster splitter is not going to change that.

What you really need to do is get that little remote antenna off that line, then see how it works. And did I mention checking all cable connections?

 

[RandallA]

Wait...I don't get what you're saying. Somehow he's got the little UHF antenna split into the line that's also carrying the backfeed? That could be the problem right there...signal loss and noise entering the line through the antenna.



Not gonna help much. Anyone who's done their research knows Monster Cable is a boatload of BS. A splitter is going to incur a 3.5 db loss for each two way split each time, no matter the brand. A Monster splitter is not going to change that.

What you really need to do is get that little remote antenna off that line, then see how it works. And did I mention checking all cable connections?

I agree with you on the splitters, the most loss you're gonna see is 3.5 db or maybe 4.0 db (I saw a cheap one) per splitter so getting a Monster splitter "ain't" gonna do much.

I don't think the UHF antenna has anything to do here. I have a 625 and a 622 in dual mode and in both I'm using splitters to combine the UHF antenna and the TV2 output without any problems with the picture. Granted, the runs are not as long as the OP.

 

[f1jdm]

SatelliteGuys.US has learned that on November 2nd Dish Network will start a new promotion which will give all new and exisiting customers who own a ViP or 411 High Definiton receiver a special priced off air antenna.

Louisville Tulsa
Memphis

The models and pricing of the antenna are as follows:
Sensar GS-1100 $49.99
Amplified Sensar GS-2200 $69.99
Square Shooter SS-1000 $109.99
Amplified Square Shooter SS-2000 $119.99
Yagi HD - 9095 $79.99
Yagi HD - 7084 $119.99

The costs are one time charges.

Dish has instructed their DNS Installers NOT to install amplifed antennas "in an attempt to increase received signal strength." Instead they should only be installed when there are excessive cable runs between the OTA antenna and the receiver.


Is this something that would help my problem

 

[RandallA]

SatelliteGuys.US has learned that on November 2nd Dish Network will start a new promotion which will give all new and exisiting customers who own a ViP or 411 High Definiton receiver a special priced off air antenna.

Louisville Tulsa
Memphis

The models and pricing of the antenna are as follows:
Sensar GS-1100 $49.99
Amplified Sensar GS-2200 $69.99
Square Shooter SS-1000 $109.99
Amplified Square Shooter SS-2000 $119.99
Yagi HD - 9095 $79.99
Yagi HD - 7084 $119.99

The costs are one time charges.

Dish has instructed their DNS Installers NOT to install amplifed antennas "in an attempt to increase received signal strength." Instead they should only be installed when there are excessive cable runs between the OTA antenna and the receiver.


Is this something that would help my problem

This OTA antenna is for the OTA channels (ATSC tuner). This won't solve your problem.

Is the Philipps amplifier adjustable?

 

[f1jdm]

The Phillips amp is not adjustable

 

[Andrewwski]

First, yes, put the amp at the beginning of the line. Amplifiers should go before long cable runs, but more importantly, before the cable is split at all. Even using a splitter backwards as a combiner still results in a 3.5 db loss. Then, make sure all of your connections are good. Try bypassing some splitters and see what that does (ie take the remote out of the setup temporarily). You could take a small TV down the line, plugging it into each consecutive F-conenctor, until you find the source of the problem.

 

[webbydude]

Another idea is...and I'm sure it's been posted, but I'm too damn lazy to check ...is to try another modulated output. For example, if TV2 is set to channel 73, cable mode, then try using channel 21, antenna mode. Etc, etc....

 

[Liquidforce88]

Not gonna help much. Anyone who's done their research knows Monster Cable is a boatload of BS. A splitter is going to incur a 3.5 db loss for each two way split each time, no matter the brand. A Monster splitter is not going to change that.

What you really need to do is get that little remote antenna off that line, then see how it works. And did I mention checking all cable connections?

Well I hate to disagree but I run into this all the time. The cheap splitters will cause more problems like this. The Monster Cable splitters have solved this problem several times. They all may say 3.5 db loss but I can tell you the cheap ones will cause this problem.

If the TV2 is as far away as described the only way to get the remote to work is to either set it up as I have describred or run another cable from the receiver to a location closer to the TV2, and put the antenna on it there.

Channel 21 and 73 are the lowest two channels in each band and give the best picture every time. These are the only channel settings I use unless the TV will not scan (alot of people have those cheap TV/VCR for their kids and lose the remote). If it is set on either on of these channels and the picture is poor going to another channel will not be better. The only exception to this would be if you have a local channel tower close to you that broadcasts on a channel close to 21. This is something we run into in the Madison Wi. area as they have a local channel that will bleed onto the line.

 

[KKlare]

High channel numbers (73) will be more attenuated though the cable than the lowest available (cable? 21). So that is likely why he used 21 rather than the default OTA channel 60.

For your remote to work you may need a separate cable to the UHF remote input (best) or a short cable of say 6' to raise the "whisker" well above your TV and equipment (easier). This can be diplexed but is less likely to work.

-Ken