Timers recording Non-New episodes

CubsWin

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Dec 17, 2005
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Many of my timers, which are set to record New episodes and were previously working fine, are showing that they will record re-runs this week. My 622 is showing that it will record 2 episodes of The Office on Thursday, Saturday Night Live on Saturday, and a bunch of episodes of The Hills (not mine!) over the weekend. Is anyone else seeing this or is there something wrong with my receiver?
 
CYA

Many of my timers, which are set to record New episodes and were previously working fine, are showing that they will record re-runs this week. My 622 is showing that it will record 2 episodes of The Office on Thursday, Saturday Night Live on Saturday, and a bunch of episodes of The Hills (not mine!) over the weekend. Is anyone else seeing this or is there something wrong with my receiver?

This is know as covering your assets. If the guide doesn't state a date in the description then it will record it to be on the safe side. This has always been that way. So that they would rather see you record something that you don't need than to miss something that you do.
 
I've noticed this. Every week there's at least one episode of Clone Wars that it thinks is "new" and my new episodes timer for Doctor Who has recorded the same episode several times, after I archived the original airing.
 
This is know as covering your assets. If the guide doesn't state a date in the description then it will record it to be on the safe side. This has always been that way. So that they would rather see you record something that you don't need than to miss something that you do.
Yeah, I've seen this before, but never so many timers at one time as what suddenly appeared this week. Maybe the problem is with Tribune's guide data then, which would be a huge shocker.
 
It will record AGAIN even if all the data (info data) is clearly a REPEAT. A few years ago on a Tech Forum, Dan admitted that they had changed the software to record some repeats because too many customers had complained that their "New" episodes were not recording at all. So, Dish decided to err on the side of being certain that the DVR would record the new show. Dan's response was " . . . if it's a repeat, then you can just go ahead and delete the recording, but we would rather it record the repeat than miss a new episode, to be safe, but all you have to do is just delete the repeat recording from your DVR."

Gee, thanks, Dan! Please. This is far too common a problem as I do spend way too much time either manually SKIPPING repeat events on the Schedule screen (MTV is heartbreaking, even though the guide date clearly indicates it is a repeat--with an old air date) or deleting recorded programs taking up room on my DVR that are repeats, and that did not allow other timers to fire that were new episodes.

Dish, fix this proper!
 
That would be good

It will record AGAIN even if all the data (info data) is clearly a REPEAT. A few years ago on a Tech Forum, Dan admitted that they had changed the software to record some repeats because too many customers had complained that their "New" episodes were not recording at all. So, Dish decided to err on the side of being certain that the DVR would record the new show. Dan's response was " . . . if it's a repeat, then you can just go ahead and delete the recording, but we would rather it record the repeat than miss a new episode, to be safe, but all you have to do is just delete the repeat recording from your DVR."

Gee, thanks, Dan! Please. This is far too common a problem as I do spend way too much time either manually SKIPPING repeat events on the Schedule screen (MTV is heartbreaking, even though the guide date clearly indicates it is a repeat--with an old air date) or deleting recorded programs taking up room on my DVR that are repeats, and that did not allow other timers to fire that were new episodes.

Dish, fix this proper!

I would like to see this happen. What I think it will take is for them to go to a different schedule provider than sucky Tribune. But that would mean that both E* & the new provider would have to work together to do something better.
 
This is at least partly, if not largely, a guide issue. The OP is showing two upcoming recordings for the Office. My DVR shows the same two recordings and did so last week as well. The problem is the guide simply shows a generic description of the upcoming episodes without an episode number. Last week, shortly before the episode aired, the guide was updated with the actual episodes to be shown including episode numbers and at that time the DVR removed the scheduled recordings because the episodes to be aired were then identified as repeats. I expect the same to happen this week.
 
I find the whole thing totally confusing. For instance, if there is a conflict so the first showing of a new episode is skipped, will it record on the next showing - or is it considered not to be new then and will be skipped. If I really want to see all episodes, I just set the DVR to record all, and spend several minutes of my life weeding out the repeats.

What would really help is for every episode of a show to be assigned some unique identifier that would never change. The that could be used to flag episodes. I notice descriptions and even original air dates in the guide can sometimes be different for the same episode. Stuff that aired originally a year or two ago can be listed as first airing in 2010.

This was also a problem on my old cable box, so it's not just a Dish problem.

There must be a better way...
 
... For instance, if there is a conflict so the first showing of a new episode is skipped, will it record on the next showing - or is it considered not to be new then and will be skipped. If I really want to see all episodes, I just set the DVR to record all, and spend several minutes of my life weeding out the repeats....

My VIP722 does do that. When set to record new episodes, if there is a priority conflict and the skipped show is shown again, the receiver does record it even though it is no longer 'new'.
 
...What would really help is for every episode of a show to be assigned some unique identifier that would never change. The that could be used to flag episodes....

I think Dish does try to do that with the 'episode number'. They are supposedly unique but I have noticed that the episode numbers are not always in chronological sequence. However, none of that matters when the guide lists the wrong data.
 
When I have a problem show like that, I set a timer for the specific day of the week and time, then set it to weekly.

The Viacom channels and HGTV are horrible about not flagging correct episode #'s... Or maybe Tribune is at fault. Either way, the weekly timer takes care of it.
 
To those (really one poster) not listening: This is beyond the "generic guide" data info. I'm telling you, time after time the DVR wants to record repeats. Here is just one example:

I'll have New Episodes timer for say America Story of US with complete guide data and air date and episode #. According to My Schedule, the very first airing will record, but so will the repeat broadcast 3 hours later, and so will subsequent airing all that week. I have to manually skip them. And even if I do manually skip the subsequent recordings, the DVR will sometimes UNskip them later in the week, and I have 2 or 3 unwanted repeat recordings (the same episode) on my DVR list of recordings. This will happen on several shows on various channels with CLEAR COMPLETE GUIDE DATA INCLUDING CORRECT EPISODE # and AIR DATE. Are you getting the situation now? Remember there are SEVERAL timers like that.

Dan M. did confirm on a past Tech Forum that Dish did, in fact, alter the software to cause this intentionally (someone called in to complain about my situation) so that we would be certain to NOT miss a New Episode recording--even if it wasn't supposed to record as per New Episode function. Dan's response to Dish DVR's not always working as advertised and our inconvenience at having a timer for another show NOT fire (and sometimes completely missing a show) because it was recording an event already in the DVR recordings list was to " . . . just delete the [additional or unwanted repeat] recording."

Now, on some shows, it will work perfectly. For example, my Modern Marvels New Episodes timer works flawlessly, as do several other of my New Episode timers including P&T B.S. This is a known flaw (not recording New Episodes when it should with all clear indication guide data) and Dish "fixed it" by forcing the DVR's to record subsequent repeat episodes of a program episode that has already been recorded and in your DVR recordings list. However, for some timers all works well and the "Event Exists in the DVR List" message is clear in the Schedule and no repeats will record.

Again, please fix this right, Dish.
 
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When I have a problem show like that, I set a timer for the specific day of the week and time, then set it to weekly.

The Viacom channels and HGTV are horrible about not flagging correct episode #'s... Or maybe Tribune is at fault. Either way, the weekly timer takes care of it.

I would add sir, that the "Weekly" timer too often does not "take care of it." Here are 2 examples:

1. America the Story of US was airing each Sunday Night, but then the final episode was moved to Memorial Day MONDAY. Thankfully, my New Episode DVR caught that and I was able to see the conclusion. Your solution would have recorded a repeat of last week and missed the final episode.

2. KNBC News Conference airs each Sunday morning. The host announced that they would be preempted by sports for the next 2 MONTHS! See ya then, he said. However, the week after next, they began airing new shows on SATURDAYS instead, and I hadn't seen one ad or announcement of this good change. Thankfully, my New Episodes timer caught all the new shows on Saturday, not to mention the fact that Sunday news shows often move around from morning to late afternoon, etc.

Yes, in some cases a Weekly or Daily timer (I used a daily for Match Game) can be a successful work around, but far too often it is not.

The point is Dish makes it a point that the DVR can record New Episodes and not have to suffer repeat episodes, but, far too often, that is not the case, and that was admitted by Dan M. on the Tech Forum. It is not unreasonable for Dish to attempt a proper fix, as it is rather annoying to have to manually skip a large number of events because the DVR is, far too often, not functioning as promised.
 
I find the whole thing totally confusing. For instance, if there is a conflict so the first showing of a new episode is skipped, will it record on the next showing - or is it considered not to be new then and will be skipped. If I really want to see all episodes, I just set the DVR to record all, and spend several minutes of my life weeding out the repeats.

What would really help is for every episode of a show to be assigned some unique identifier that would never change. The that could be used to flag episodes. I notice descriptions and even original air dates in the guide can sometimes be different for the same episode. Stuff that aired originally a year or two ago can be listed as first airing in 2010.

This was also a problem on my old cable box, so it's not just a Dish problem.

There must be a better way...

If a New Episode must be skipped due to priority or even you manually skipping that event, the subsequent airing of that episode--if not skipped for priority or manual skipping--WILL, indeed, be recorded. That is one great thing I do love about the DVR. In other words, the DVR isn't going to give up attempting recording that New Episode until it either has priority or opportunity to do so. Then subsequent repeats of that already recorded episode will (should) NOT be recorded.

As a tip, always put your OTA or Local into Local broadcast recordings at the highest priority because they often do not have repeat airings any time soon. Then have the "cable" channels like History, Science, etc. at lower priority because they always repeat 3 hours later and often a few times later in the week. Sometimes the new episode has 3 airings in one night.

I like your suggestions about improving Dish DVR reliability for New Episode timers. And I do live the nightmare of having to manually skip a very high number of unnecessary repeat recordings--with all guide data and air date clear--and it is very time consuming, but if I don't do it, my other times won't fire for one-time or subsequent airings of other shows because the DVR want to record all 7 airings, 3 that night, plus the other 4 later in the week instead of other critical timers. The 722K skips instantly, and I admit it can be a fast task there, but the 722 has a very long delay (I have nearly 75 timers) after pressing "Skip" and when it finally clears the memory. It is is a tedious nightmare.

Yes, you are correct about the ambiguity of episode original air date. This can sometimes be a HUGE problem on BBC America or other channels that air non-US content as the original air date is sometimes the UK original air date and the Dish DVR will NOT record this "NEW" premier episode for us Yanks. However, sometimes BBC America does use the US premiere date and the Dish DVR will record as it should. However, it is still hit and miss on BBC America. Showtime and IFC seem to be a bit better about the US premiere date.

I recall that "That Mitchell and Webb Look" on BBC America was using the US premiere date so that I was able to use "New Episodes" to successfully record the show. Then after all 6 episodes had aired and a few weeks had passed, they repeated all 6 episodes again, but this time the air date was the UK original air date. HUH? What is going on there? First US, now UK original air date.

What I don't like is "NEW" at the end of the description for Star Trek TNG on BBC America. No, the 20 year old episode is not new, but I suppose "new" to BBC America.

Yes, too often even the episode number is WRONG. This must be Tribune's fault. I happen to already know the episode numbers of some shows and know without a doubt that Tribune got it WRONG. However, there are some times when the channel will air episodes out of the intended order. Episode 1 will not be the premier episode, but the channel chooses to air episode 3 as the first premier episode. I know this from prior knowledge of the forth coming new show and you would be surprised to see how often a channel will intentionally air later episode first (often for reasons of more compelling episode) if it won't ruin a story arc.
 
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Mine has been doing this a lot lately.
I have it set to record only the new episodes of The Soup, but it will record every single time it airs. I have like 20 of them on there now in the last week, because E rebroadcasts it so often.

It's annoying, and just started doing this within the last month or so. So there really is nothing we can do to only get the new episodes anymore?
 
I think Dish does try to do that with the 'episode number'. They are supposedly unique but I have noticed that the episode numbers are not always in chronological sequence. However, none of that matters when the guide lists the wrong data.

As a poster just wished, each episode can and does have a unique identifier that the receiver can use to determine if the episode is, in fact, new. It is not the episode number, it is not the word New, it is not the date in First Aired Date, and it is not displayed on the info screen.

When you see a generic description of a show up there it is very likely that the guide provider does not know the unique identifier. Also, they simply make errors some times.
 
The problem is the guide simply shows a generic description of the upcoming episodes without an episode number.
This is not always the case. My ViP622 records pretty much schedules every episode of Eureka that comes along and the guide data includes first air date and episode number. The same is true of Glee and Big Bang Theory.

I haven't confirmed that the guide data is consistent, but the critical data is all there.
 
As a poster just wished, each episode can and does have a unique identifier that the receiver can use to determine if the episode is, in fact, new. It is not the episode number, it is not the word New, it is not the date in First Aired Date, and it is not displayed on the info screen.

When you see a generic description of a show up there it is very likely that the guide provider does not know the unique identifier. Also, they simply make errors some times.

OK, let's presume you are correct (but unless you have specific knowledge of your claim because you know this for a fact, your theory, is, at best, apocryphal), but that identifier that you claim exists (from the ether, apparently) is based on the air date. How do I know this? Because this is exactly what Dan said in a past Tech Forum, that the DVR uses the air date to determain if a show is NEW episode to record or not. Before that, when NBR was first rolled out, Dan and Mark stated that the DVR uses, according to my memory, the word New in the info, but they said that they plan to use the air date in a future update so it would be more reliable because there wasn't always room for the word New, or it simply wasn't in the info.

Since you seem to have special knowledge, perhaps you can share it with us and educate us so we understand. Please explain what this "unique identifier" is and upon what data is it based and how it works.
 
DishSubLA;2263563 ... Sarcastic dribble redacted. [/QUOTE said:
I have no 'secret' knowledge on the unique identifier used to determine whether an episode is new or not, nor do I have knowledge of how the DVR algorithm uses this data.

That said, it is not the episode number, it is not the words, "New Episode," and it is not the date first aired.

So you tell the rest of the readers what is it that identifies the shpw as "New," in other words what unique identifier is used? (I'll not be seeing your post, but I'm sure you'll be a big help. lol :rolleyes: )

PS The timer does not use the "Name" of the event to do Name Based Recordings. (Anyone that recorded the TV Series "Terminator" a couple of years ago would likely remember that the series changed its name at the end of a season and there was no need to create a new or different timer.) But of course the events in a series have their "names" included in that "unique identifier."
 
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OK, let's presume you are correct (but unless you have specific knowledge of your claim because you know this for a fact, your theory, is, at best, apocryphal), but that identifier that you claim exists (from the ether, apparently) is based on the air date. How do I know this? Because this is exactly what Dan said in a past Tech Forum, that the DVR uses the air date to determain if a show is NEW episode to record or not. Before that, when NBR was first rolled out, Dan and Mark stated that the DVR uses, according to my memory, the word New in the info, but they said that they plan to use the air date in a future update so it would be more reliable because there wasn't always room for the word New, or it simply wasn't in the info.

Since you seem to have special knowledge, perhaps you can share it with us and educate us so we understand. Please explain what this "unique identifier" is and upon what data is it based and how it works.

I don't know what imaginary Tech chat you were watching but the ones I saw Dan said they do/did NOT use the word "NEW" they used hidden meta data that we the users do not ever see to determine if the programing is new and if any of that hidden data is missing they will by default consider the programing to be new so that you won't miss recording a new show.
 
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