Where does an installer draw the line?

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PaulieORF

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I had installed my own AT9 dish over the weekend and get signal around 80'ish on 101, 110, and near 100 on 99 and 103. However, 119 peaks out at 55. I had a tech come out yesterday (while I was at work, my sister was at the house) and he left my house telling her that he couldn't get any better signal than I could because of a tree. He didn't try to move the dish, try a pole, or even mention which tree he thought it was. He just left me with that aweful signal on 119. Am I expecting too much from the guy, or should he have at least offered me some advice?
 
gross67

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I would have at least expected him to ask some questions and attempt to move the dish's location. Just hearing "This is something you might try" would have helped. Or, "I can move it but it will cost "X" amount. Good luck getting a stronger signal.
 
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PaulieORF

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gross67 said:
I would have at least expected him to ask some questions and attempt to move the dish's location. Just hearing "This is something you might try" would have helped. Or, "I can move it but it will cost "X" amount. Good luck getting a stronger signal.
Should I try getting someone else to come out here and check it out?
 
raoul5788

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PaulieORF said:
Should I try getting someone else to come out here and check it out?

You can check the line of sight yourself. The 119 sat is at 252 degrees. Get a compass, stand behind the dish and line it up with 252 degrees. Is there anything even remotely in the way at about 20 degrees elevation? It sounds more like an alignment problem, though. If it was a tree in the way, you would likely get no signal.
 
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PaulieORF

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raoul5788 said:
You can check the line of sight yourself. The 119 sat is at 252 degrees. Get a compass, stand behind the dish and line it up with 252 degrees. Is there anything even remotely in the way at about 20 degrees elevation? It sounds more like an alignment problem, though. If it was a tree in the way, you would likely get no signal.
I think it's more like the leaves from the tree. A few years ago I had the triple LNB dish, and received 119, 110, and 101 with about a 100 reading from all sats. Now, a few years later, with the AT9 in the exact spot on my roof, I'm getting near 80 on 101 and 110, and around 50 on 119. I'll try your method and see which tree gets it's top chopped off.
 
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igator99

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PaulieORF said:
I had installed my own AT9 dish over the weekend and get signal around 80'ish on 101, 110, and near 100 on 99 and 103. However, 119 peaks out at 55. I had a tech come out yesterday (while I was at work, my sister was at the house) and he left my house telling her that he couldn't get any better signal than I could because of a tree. He didn't try to move the dish, try a pole, or even mention which tree he thought it was. He just left me with that aweful signal on 119. Am I expecting too much from the guy, or should he have at least offered me some advice?


Yep that has been my experience with most installers. Forgive me if you already know this but they are paid by the job and will book it for the most part if it is difficult. You can't hardly blame them when they are getting paid by the job and not the hour. This situation needs to come to an end. The only one that benifits from the current setup is the company owner. Typically how much is an installer paid for a job? I figured out the other day that DirecTV has made over 9,000 off of me in the last ten years. Surely they can afford to treat their people better than what they do.
 
Optical Serenity

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I agree, they should treat the installers better, in which case, they'd get better installers. I've went through many bad ones to get a decent one.
 
Beavis

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I guess the 110/119 LNB is in the correct zone....
 
grydlok

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PaulieORF said:
I had installed my own AT9 dish over the weekend and get signal around 80'ish on 101, 110, and near 100 on 99 and 103. However, 119 peaks out at 55. I had a tech come out yesterday (while I was at work, my sister was at the house) and he left my house telling her that he couldn't get any better signal than I could because of a tree. He didn't try to move the dish, try a pole, or even mention which tree he thought it was. He just left me with that aweful signal on 119. Am I expecting too much from the guy, or should he have at least offered me some advice?


what makes you think he didn't do his job?.
 
jpn

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PaulieORF said:
I had installed my own AT9 dish over the weekend and get signal around 80'ish on 101, 110, and near 100 on 99 and 103. However, 119 peaks out at 55. I had a tech come out yesterday (while I was at work, my sister was at the house) and he left my house telling her that he couldn't get any better signal than I could because of a tree. He didn't try to move the dish, try a pole, or even mention which tree he thought it was. He just left me with that aweful signal on 119. Am I expecting too much from the guy, or should he have at least offered me some advice?

Before I start, I am NOT an installer. And I had a terrible installation experience in February that resulted in D* giving me a significant amount of programming credits.


Taken from his (potential) viewpoint:
It's entirely possible that his dispatch told him to aim your dish and get 6 more installs done that day.

If I were him, I definitely would not move the dish of my own accord and definitely would NOT have done it without the HOMEOWNER present. Assuming the dish is screwed into your roof (or siding), you could hold him responsible for filling the holes and any leaks that might happen if not done properly. Some homeowners are picky about the location of the dish... not saying you are, but many are, and just having it put somewhere other than its starting point angers many people.


Now, for your part,: you might have left a note with your sister to hand to him. It might have been explicit, or might just have had your work phone number for him to call for further instructions. You don't mention any of that, so I assume you didn't.

I sympathize with your poor signal issue, but there's a lot here you just don't know... making it unfair to criticize somebody you didn't even meet.
 
Jimbo

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raoul5788 said:
You can check the line of sight yourself. The 119 sat is at 252 degrees. Get a compass, stand behind the dish and line it up with 252 degrees. Is there anything even remotely in the way at about 20 degrees elevation? It sounds more like an alignment problem, though. If it was a tree in the way, you would likely get no signal.


Who says that the 119 is at 252 degrees ?

It may be there where you are located, but without knowing where PaulieORF lives there is no way you can say that.

That said, if he goes to the sat set up section, and put into the receiver his zip code, it will tell him where the 119 is located.

Jimbo
 
Doctor Bob

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PaulieORF said:
I had installed my own AT9 dish over the weekend and get signal around 80'ish on 101, 110, and near 100 on 99 and 103. However, 119 peaks out at 55. I had a tech come out yesterday (while I was at work, my sister was at the house) and he left my house telling her that he couldn't get any better signal than I could because of a tree. He didn't try to move the dish, try a pole, or even mention which tree he thought it was. He just left me with that aweful signal on 119. Am I expecting too much from the guy, or should he have at least offered me some advice?

You should have been there!!! Why would anybody have any service technician come to their home or office, without being there, to assure satisfaction with the service call???

You goofed, and now you will have to make some arrangements to make sure you are there next time...
 
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PaulieORF

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May 19, 2005
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jpn said:
Before I start, I am NOT an installer. And I had a terrible installation experience in February that resulted in D* giving me a significant amount of programming credits.


Taken from his (potential) viewpoint:
It's entirely possible that his dispatch told him to aim your dish and get 6 more installs done that day.

If I were him, I definitely would not move the dish of my own accord and definitely would NOT have done it without the HOMEOWNER present. Assuming the dish is screwed into your roof (or siding), you could hold him responsible for filling the holes and any leaks that might happen if not done properly. Some homeowners are picky about the location of the dish... not saying you are, but many are, and just having it put somewhere other than its starting point angers many people.


Now, for your part,: you might have left a note with your sister to hand to him. It might have been explicit, or might just have had your work phone number for him to call for further instructions. You don't mention any of that, so I assume you didn't.

I sympathize with your poor signal issue, but there's a lot here you just don't know... making it unfair to criticize somebody you didn't even meet.
I did not criticize anyone in my original post. My whole reason for posting this was exactly as the title states. And you said there's a lot I don't know here, and you're right, and once again I point towoards the title of the thread. I am simply asking a question. Some who are not as wise as myself would just say "Okay, the installer said I'm stuck with this signal, so I'm just going to cancel service." I know the individual installer doesn't really care if I stay a customer or not. He probably did what he was told, which was fine. The ultimate result is that I want to be able to get a good signal on all satellites, that's the whole meaning behind this post, and I want to know what I have to do to get that. Also, I did leave him a detailed note with what my signal strenghts were, what I was able to with the dish, and left my cell phone number for him to call if he wanted to speak to me.

I don't know why you people seem to think I'm attacking the installers on this one...
 
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PaulieORF

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May 19, 2005
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Southington, CT
Doctor Bob said:
You should have been there!!! Why would anybody have any service technician come to their home or office, without being there, to assure satisfaction with the service call???

You goofed, and now you will have to make some arrangements to make sure you are there next time...
Some of us have important jobs and can't be home between the hours of 8 and 12 on any weekday. Better to have him come out and give it a shot, rather than just sitting back and doing nothing, don't you think?
 
Doctor Bob

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PaulieORF said:
Some of us have important jobs and can't be home between the hours of 8 and 12 on any weekday. Better to have him come out and give it a shot, rather than just sitting back and doing nothing, don't you think?

No, I don't think so!!! It's your responsibility, to be at your home, when a service technician is there... If it is that important to you, then be there, so that you can get a full explanation from that person. You have to communicate fully with people, so that they can know what you expect. If you thought that moving the dish assy. would have improved the signal, then you should have been there to authorize the move and to pay for that service.

The normal procedure, is not to do anything unless the customer is on site, or we have specific instructions, with payment arrangements made ahead of time...

If your job is that important, then make arrangements to have the tech out on a Saturday, and be there next time...
 
uboatcmdr

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PaulieORF said:
Some of us have important jobs and can't be home between the hours of 8 and 12 on any weekday. Better to have him come out and give it a shot, rather than just sitting back and doing nothing, don't you think?

I don't know of too many HSP's that don't have someone doing installs, upgrades or sercive calls 7 days a week these days. Heck they will even come out on almost any holiday (except maybe Thanksgiving & Christmas day). When I was a an HSP tech we worked six days a week with some techs' rotations putting them on the job even Sunday. We also had to work rotating holidays. If the HSP in your are (I don't know where you are as you have not said) is anything like the one I worked for you could have been there at least one day of a 7 day week, correct?
 
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PaulieORF

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May 19, 2005
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Southington, CT
Doctor Bob said:
No, I don't think so!!! It's your responsibility, to be at your home, when a service technician is there... If it is that important to you, then be there, so that you can get a full explanation from that person. You have to communicate fully with people, so that they can know what you expect. If you thought that moving the dish assy. would have improved the signal, then you should have been there to authorize the move and to pay for that service.

The normal procedure, is not to do anything unless the customer is on site, or we have specific instructions, with payment arrangements made ahead of time...

If your job is that important, then make arrangements to have the tech out on a Saturday, and be there next time...
Thank you very much for the slap on the wrist. I did leave a detailed note and left my number for him to call me if he felt he waned to speak to me. But he never called, he just left a note saying he couldn't improve signal because of trees, rather than calling me to discuss options. Let me stress, I have no problem with what he did.

What I'm going to do is call and see if I can get someone here on Saturday. If not, I will make an attempt to try it out myself.

So we can end this thread, since all it's turning out to be is pepole taking this as me flaming the installer, and then you guys reprimanding me. Let's move on.
 
uboatcmdr

uboatcmdr

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igator99 said:
Yep that has been my experience with most installers. Forgive me if you already know this but they are paid by the job and will book it for the most part if it is difficult. You can't hardly blame them when they are getting paid by the job and not the hour. This situation needs to come to an end. The only one that benifits from the current setup is the company owner. Typically how much is an installer paid for a job? I figured out the other day that DirecTV has made over 9,000 off of me in the last ten years. Surely they can afford to treat their people better than what they do.
I think you have it backwards, the piece rate techs get paid by the job and would not get paid anything for their time and expense driving too and from the customer's house unless he does some work, so he would be more likely to do the job. If anything he would try to align the dish as best as possible, get the workorder signed and then leave. If he declared it a NLOS he gets nothing. The hourly tech on the other hand gets paid low hourly rates and usually has a quota of installs or upgrades to do in a 8 hour day. If he sees the job is going to cut into him being able to complete his daily quota he is going to bail on the job. That's not to say a piece rate tech would do the same, they sometimes will bail on a difficult service call to move on to a higher paying install, but any tech worth his weight would do the job regardless.
The problem here could have been the "up to code" requirment some companies are putting on the techs. If the customer didn't do his upgrade to DTV's specs then the tech (if required by his company) would have had to bring it up to code, which could have entailed a lot more than just relocating the dish but possibly reinstalling nearly the entire system.
My question is why did the customer do the dish upgrade himself instead of calling DTV and have them send someone out to do the upgrade in the first place? Does it make sense to tear down your engine because it is running rough when your only experience with auto mechanics is changing the oil? And then what do you do when you can't find the problem or put the engine back together, throw all the parts in a box and tow the car to a professional and ask him to fix your mess? The dish the customer was installing is a lot more complicated to align than the basic and PhaseIII dishes. Buying a $10 sat meter off ebay and using a Boy Scout compass isn't going to get you the best signal from that dish. I use and AccuTrac22 and even with it alignment can sometimes be a pain.
 
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