Will Proposed HDTV “Flag” Make 921 Obsolete in 2005? (1 Viewer)

Scott Greczkowski

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From AudioRevolution.COM

Recent reports say the FCC is considering flagging HDTV signals in order to protect against users recording them at their high-resolution native resolutions. This comes as the MPAA (Motion Picture Association of America) is lobbying the FCC aggressively so that Hollywood’s best movies and TV programs are not easily recorded and duplicated at HDTV resolutions.

While the FCC has not agreed to this flagging yet, fears of such a technological change have held up the much-anticipated launch of HDTV personal video recorders (PVRs). Over one year ago, Dish Network showed a PVR that could record HDTV at the CES trade show. They had the same black box at this year’s CES show just six weeks ago, yet none of the PVRs have been shipped to Dish Network consumers.

Read the rest at http://www.audiorevolution.com/news/0204/27.hdtvflag.html
 

AcuraCL

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Jan 7, 2004
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Hard to believe they will pull it off. MPAA is always playing Chicken Little ... I think it started with VCRs.

What they may do ... is disable any USB/ieee1394 outputs from any of these recording boxes.
 

markusian

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Sep 7, 2003
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Can this be done with a SW update?

What we should be worried about is that Dish will break couple working features when they deliver this one :)
 

red hazard

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HDTV Recording Portability

AcuraCL said:
Hard to believe they will pull it off. MPAA is always playing Chicken Little ... I think it started with VCRs.

What they may do ... is disable any USB/ieee1394 outputs from any of these recording boxes.

You're probably right. Without the ability to record on a DVD or PC that is easily portable or distributable, I doubt the FCC would agree to disable boxes like the 921. It would be equivalent in SD to disabling a VCR that does not have a removeable tape.
 

CKNA

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Dec 15, 2003
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They do not have to do anything. It is part of 5C copy protection which all recording devices support already. They can flag anything as copy freely, copy once or copy never. It is not used in US yet, but in Japan Wowow channel (It is like HBO here) uses copy once flag on new movies.
 

Tyralak

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Scott Greczkowski said:
From AudioRevolution.COM

Recent reports say the FCC is considering flagging HDTV signals in order to protect against users recording them at their high-resolution native resolutions. This comes as the MPAA (Motion Picture Association of America) is lobbying the FCC aggressively so that Hollywood’s best movies and TV programs are not easily recorded and duplicated at HDTV resolutions.

While the FCC has not agreed to this flagging yet, fears of such a technological change have held up the much-anticipated launch of HDTV personal video recorders (PVRs). Over one year ago, Dish Network showed a PVR that could record HDTV at the CES trade show. They had the same black box at this year’s CES show just six weeks ago, yet none of the PVRs have been shipped to Dish Network consumers.

Read the rest at http://www.audiorevolution.com/news/0204/27.hdtvflag.html

<RANT>
I hate these idiots with a passion bordering on insanity. !protest :mad:
They've always hated the fair use provisions in the law, and wanted to remove the consumer's right to time-shift and archive TV programs from day 1. They hide behind the "piracy" argument, knowing full well that most people who use VCRs, DVRs, etc. do NOT use them to "pirate" movies. In fact, one of the guys who was involved in the whole lawsuit against the VCR makers years ago, claimed that time-shifting TV programs was "stealing". What a crock. Now with the advent of the dispicable DMCA, which is nothing but a licence for media companies to sodomize consumers, they can finally realize their dream of snuffing out time-shifting. All they have to do is copy "protect" all digital signals, starting with this HDTV "flag" crap, and lo and behold, it becomes a felony to record "Enterprise" or "CSI" so that you can watch it when you get home from work. Because, to do so you would have to break their "protection", which is a crime under the DMCA. You miss an episode? Sorry, buddy. You have to wait until that season comes out on DVD and spend big bucks to buy it! The FCC is supposed to be the steward of the airwaves for the people, and to protect the consumer. Not to be the guy who holds Guido's coat while he beats the crap out of you. </RANT>
 

TheForce

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Dirk- If you want the power to be returned to the people, you better vote for Libertarian next election. All Rep.s and Democrats are working for special interest and large corporations. Republicans are only good at foreign policy and Democrats good at keeping poor people poor and convincing them they are their best friend. The FCC stopped working for the public since the Clinton Administration and worse since Bush took over.
But politics aside- I have to question the accuracy of the article Scott referenced with a statement like "None of the 921's have yet been shipped" I guess mine is just make believe. When such a huge blunder of inaccuracy is in any article, I have to assume the entire article is bunk and was not well researched. Most likely it is a result of one irresponsible conspiracy theorist.
 

HokieEngineer

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Im sure in a little while some kid from europe will crack whatever protection they are using and this will be a moot point :)
 

David_Levin

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As CKNA says - the 921 will not be obsoleted - it supports the flags. It already has an HDMI compatible output (DVI+HDCP). It will down rez the component outputs if required.

The risk is that the early adaptors may get stuck with a non-compliant TV. If your're buying a TV today and want to be future proofed, make sure it has HDMI or DVI+HDCP.

There's is really nothing new here (if you've been doing your research). I do feel sorry for the regular consumer expecting to get good advice from the Best Buy Salseman.

The are also a couple of blatent inaccuracies in the article. I wrote a longer reply here:

http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?t=24431
 

tnsprin

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Sep 27, 2003
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Scott Greczkowski said:
From AudioRevolution.COM

Recent reports say the FCC is considering flagging HDTV signals in order to protect against users recording them at their high-resolution native ...[/url]
Another attempt to scare users.

FCC has consistently said that they will allow basic recording. And there are special rules allowing DVR's to record even if the do not record is set, but not keep for a long time.

Various people keep trying to scare everyone needlessly.
 

Tyralak

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tnsprin said:
Another attempt to scare users.

FCC has consistently said that they will allow basic recording. And there are special rules allowing DVR's to record even if the do not record is set, but not keep for a long time.

Various people keep trying to scare everyone needlessly.

What is "basic recording"? Recording on the terms of the studios? That's crap. Likely low res, only able to keep for 24 hours type garbage. The fair use provisions from the early 80's also allowed for personal archiving of television programs. We don't need to have our tv viewing micromanaged by TV studios. I'm sick of being abused by media companies, and being told by people that we have to just bend over and take it. :mad:
 

tnsprin

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Tyralak said:
What is "basic recording"? Recording on the terms of the studios? That's crap. Likely low res, only able to keep for 24 hours type garbage. The fair use provisions from the early 80's also allowed for personal archiving of television programs. We don't need to have our tv viewing micromanaged by TV studios. I'm sick of being abused by media companies, and being told by people that we have to just bend over and take it. :mad:
Nope its High def. They have consistently agreed that the people have the right to record, single copies, of material that is offered free over the air. They do allow restrictions for PAY FOR VIEW type events, which regretably can include Premium channels. But even those restrictions allow PVR's to record and play back the material within a reasonable time, even though such recordings have a time limit.
 

Tyralak

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tnsprin said:
Nope its High def. They have consistently agreed that the people have the right to record, single copies, of material that is offered free over the air. They do allow restrictions for PAY FOR VIEW type events, which regretably can include Premium channels. But even those restrictions allow PVR's to record and play back the material within a reasonable time, even though such recordings have a time limit.

Excuse me if I'm not quite jumping up and down. I'll believe it when I see it. The studios have a history of trying to thwart the fair use rights of consumers.
 

dlsnyder

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Tyralak said:
What is "basic recording"? Recording on the terms of the studios? That's crap. Likely low res, only able to keep for 24 hours type garbage. The fair use provisions from the early 80's also allowed for personal archiving of television programs. We don't need to have our tv viewing micromanaged by TV studios. I'm sick of being abused by media companies, and being told by people that we have to just bend over and take it. :mad:

The original VCRs from the 70's and 80's are just hitting their limits now. Low res archival recordings on tapes that are now beginning to noticeably deteriorate. I guess the time limit was about 25 years. :no
 

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