Then why did me rerunning solid copper from the demarc back to my modem improve my rf numbers close to 25%... To me it stupid to comcast to run Solid copper from the pole but then to run ccs from the demarc.
solid copper wire
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Then why did me rerunning solid copper from the demarc back to my modem improve my rf numbers close to 25%... To me it stupid to comcast to run Solid copper from the pole but then to run ccs from the demarc.
How many fittings were recut? How many cable staples were bypassed? Was the new line much shorter? Were all fittings tight before the new line was run?
And it could be the solid copper works 25% better. Did picture quality or some other observable feature go up?
You could be correct about Comcast doing stupid things. They were a Primestar Partner and sold their creation to Directv.
Joe
Maybe your old wire was bad.
25% is a huge improvement. An improvement I don't see by switching to Solid copper. Sorry !
I am sorry but changing from CC to Solid Copper will not make a 25% gain in signal. The only reason Direct wants Soild Copper is because it carries current better, and copper is better so that's what we want. The only time that current becomes an issue is in very long cable runs, or with the SWM LNBs. If CC was so bad, I am sure my SIN7 and Sin90 reports would be much worse than the 0% they have been running.
I have yet to see CC wire that does not pass the SWM meter test. I have tested old C-band cable that has been buried for years and it still passed that test. I did not use it but was intresting to see if it would pass.
Personally I think it boils down to the fact that the Sat-Co's want the best stuff used in thier systems. THat I can understand, the problems is they are not willing to pay for it. When an installer or an instalation company has to look at a 20% increase in wire cost "Just Because" we said so, makes it a tough pill to swallow when pay rates keep going down.
I have yet to see CC wire that does not pass the SWM meter test. I have tested old C-band cable that has been buried for years and it still passed that test. I did not use it but was intresting to see if it would pass.
Personally I think it boils down to the fact that the Sat-Co's want the best stuff used in thier systems. THat I can understand, the problems is they are not willing to pay for it. When an installer or an instalation company has to look at a 20% increase in wire cost "Just Because" we said so, makes it a tough pill to swallow when pay rates keep going down.
+1
And ya know if it was just the copper wire and it made a difference to improve service I bet most would eat the extra cost in the interest of on going business.
But it is not. This copper wire thing is just the next on on the list. The NLOS pay disappeared. Then the extra line for the receivers just became part of the installation. Then cutting pay for not having a certain percentage of phones connected. The hundred dollar charge back for any customer comment withing seven days of installation is clearly illegal but they attempt to do it.
If you really wanted experienced techs to walk off this would be the way to do it.
Joe
It does when it done right over the half ass job Comcast passes QA with.
Cable length about the same the Solid copper line i ran goes about an extra 5 feet. both go through the same exterior wall. both going to a wall plate. then the ccs has about extra 2 feet of cable inside vs the solid copper.
Honestly it brand new ccs but the tech at my local comcast just care that it passes QA it does not matter how much you call and complain about the modem loosing sync, and you getting anywhere close to your advertised speed.
there probably a bad kink or break in the ccs line causing the problems. But like I said in a previous post where I was forced to run CCS to my home office for my Tivo compared to the solid copper the tech for dtv installed, we are looking at about -4 on the meters on the same transponder.
I dont think that CCS is bad but if the person paying you says put in solid copper you damn well do it and dont skimp with ccs. they pay you so they get to boss you around.
Now with comcast I think it absurd that they say it policy to run solid copper from the node to the demarc yet wont run it from the demarc to the drops.
Joe,
I know installers get screwed over .... Just saying this. If the job requirement is that your replace all ccs with solid copper well you do it. Not saying you dont get screwed over but you dont have to keep the job either.
I know installers get screwed over .... Just saying this. If the job requirement is that your replace all ccs with solid copper well you do it. Not saying you dont get screwed over but you dont have to keep the job either.
Exactly,
Why would anyone work for less than cost? As an employee I would have no problem just going at it assuming the pay rate was acceptable. If Directv wants to pay me to rewire their customers' houses that is great. As a contractor.....everything has a cost and nothing is free.
I gotta wonder at what level this copper wire thing originated. Is there actually a Directv management wonk that proposed requiring the CC stuff without compensation?
I haven't been able to even find a specification for the $.25 compression fittings. I hear it verbally from HSP folks but have never seen a written specification. I like the $.09 F fitting with the gel & "O" ring.
You could do a good thing if you would publish an official Directv installation specification. I would look for it in installation contracts. Never seen it yet.
Joe
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In my office we dont have installer policies just the rates of common "custom work" rates, like pole mounts or wall fish, etc.
I know Joe that if you showed up with my house and tried to put anything other then a Compression fitting on my cable I have Employee accounts on the phones so fast your head would spin.
I buy Digicon compression fittings in a bag of 500 for about 17 cents a piece. That with o-ring....
Buttom line you come to my house with Hex crimps and ccs I just waste your time.
But I also learned if you want it done right do it your self. Dont ever trust an installer to do a job correctly as they dont get paid enough to care.
I know that I have a friend who works for Directv Home Services not using Compression connectors or not using solid copper is a write up. On the third it is there job.
Nothing is stoping any Directv Contractor from getting up and leaving. Again people can either work inside the system, or they can show them selves the door.
The first step is customer satification is not having to send a 2nd tech out there to fix the first tech job.
Again I feel like field techs should be paid per hour and not per job. But with a certian expectation to get x many jobs done a day.
Agree with everything you said,
Still, the HSP dudes are employees........if instructed to paint dishes pink...no problem if the money is correct.
Contractors are taking your advice. It is nice on the other side of the door.
Joe
Well what a heated discussion this is...lol. I am an installer, not PoV or CoV or contractor, I work directly for Corporate.
First of all the QA standards change weekly if not daily. I build every job be it an upgrade or New Install with RG6 solid copper cc, 60% braid swept to 3ghz period. all for $12 an hour. Thats ok with me cause if I do it the way they want me to do it in a neat and timely fashion, while keeping my SIN #s down they will give me more money per hour next year. Thats why I do it.. and I like the satisfaction I get from seeing the look on the customers face when they see what HD looks like running down the right cable and not 59. " Oh thats how HD is supposed to look.. thats beautiful"
Second "NEWSFLASH" Stonecold If I come to your house and you hand me a bag if Digicon compression fittings Im gonna throw them away... Then go about replacing all of the fittings you put on your cable because you thought you were doing the right thing... we cant use Digicon... If you want to use the right connectors get a bag of PPC F connectors.. its all we use.
Third.. "Once its built right it wont have to be done again". Well at least until they change the specs to 4ghz or something different.
Finally I agree with what Joe and Stonecold says except I say it differently... "If the wimp cant hang , then the wimp shouldnt of came." go flip burgers. Look at the bright side Its not S.E.A.L. training.
P.S. Ive lost 63 pounds since they made these changes.. My wife loves it and she shows me she loves it quite often.. If you get my drift.
First of all the QA standards change weekly if not daily. I build every job be it an upgrade or New Install with RG6 solid copper cc, 60% braid swept to 3ghz period. all for $12 an hour. Thats ok with me cause if I do it the way they want me to do it in a neat and timely fashion, while keeping my SIN #s down they will give me more money per hour next year. Thats why I do it.. and I like the satisfaction I get from seeing the look on the customers face when they see what HD looks like running down the right cable and not 59. " Oh thats how HD is supposed to look.. thats beautiful"
Second "NEWSFLASH" Stonecold If I come to your house and you hand me a bag if Digicon compression fittings Im gonna throw them away... Then go about replacing all of the fittings you put on your cable because you thought you were doing the right thing... we cant use Digicon... If you want to use the right connectors get a bag of PPC F connectors.. its all we use.
Third.. "Once its built right it wont have to be done again". Well at least until they change the specs to 4ghz or something different.
Finally I agree with what Joe and Stonecold says except I say it differently... "If the wimp cant hang , then the wimp shouldnt of came." go flip burgers. Look at the bright side Its not S.E.A.L. training.
P.S. Ive lost 63 pounds since they made these changes.. My wife loves it and she shows me she loves it quite often.. If you get my drift.
Binil,
I always wondered how much would be left after deducting for the truck, insurance & materials. So twelve dollars is it?
I always knew I couldn't do the work at all except for constant bitching for tight routes close to home, expecting to use existing cable on most jobs and looking for all opportunities for custom charges.
So twelve dollars is it? And you believe them when they say more will be added after a year? Watch for subcontractors dumping your chances for overtime.
Good luck,
Joe
Tell you what Digicons are still better then hex crimps which is what I mentioned in the scenario.
Personally I still just going through a big bag i had.
Hope it works out for you. Do a search of the Directv MSP program. See what you think.
Joe
Let see, a single receiver, required 100 ft of solid copper wire, 6 digicom connector, one wall plate and ground block. Required one hour of work time. How much cost for the materials and How much the pay from DTV if not an employee.
If you think its not worth the hassel to do the job, better look for something else. Thats why lots good techs look for other job.
If you think its not worth the hassel to do the job, better look for something else. Thats why lots good techs look for other job.
My suspicion is that when correctly used all fittings are about the same. "F" fittings are more prone to error.....ever seen fittings cut with a box knief and crimped with pliers?
So Directv picked one brand and gets a big economy of scale. And the compression fittings are a little more idiot proof.
I did repair a professional FREE installation by compressing several uncompressed fittings.......no other action needed. The HSP was three weeks out on service calls.
It seems the one thing that will do in any fitting is water and freezing and thawing. Each time the cycle happens the center wire gets pushed away just a little until you get a spark plug effect that burns the wire away.
Second most common defect is the little bit of wire debris shorting the cable. Unless you look for it while cutting the fitting you will never find it. Jobs done in the dark suffer from this defect; good fittings used under poor conditions.
I still like $9.00 / hundred instead of $25.00.....$17.00 ain't too shabby.
Joe
$12/hr is not even a wage you can live on. That is a second income wage or a person living at home with their parents. $12/hr to risk your life getting up on roofs, crawl thru nasty crawl spaces, go in to filthy rat infested homes.
People wonder why they get crappy installs, service people that have no clue or can't speak english. Well here is your awnswer, you get what you pay for.
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