4K Joey

[JM42]

Um, I don't know about that. I see two very good looking images on my 70" Sharp, side by side.

It is physically impossible to output two full resolution 1920x1080 images side by side when the maximum output is only 1920x1080. You are looking at two images scaled to 960x540 on a 1920x1080 screen.

 

[Hall]

Um, I don't know about that. I see two very good looking images on my 70" Sharp, side by side.

Do the math

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

The 4K Joey has PIP/Swap but I suspect that to be functional, it may require the new Hopper with the MoCA 2.0 chip.

Nope.

 

[patmurphey]

Read this on several different electronic websites reviews about 4k a year or so ago and what satellite picture from both sat services looked like upconverted to 4k. But regardless , you have actually seen the sat picture upconverted to 4k in person? If so the receiver puts out the picture in 4k so all sat and ota channels are upconverted to 4k right?

This is what has made me not want anything to do with 4k in the past. If the sat picture looks worse using 4k ,then I am not for upgrading, till they actually verify that the picture looks noticeably better or at least as good as 1080p HD. In my past, an sd picture over a sd sat receiver never looked that good upconverted over the early hd models of the last decade. So I am thinking that the same might be true with an hd receiver upconverted to 4k. Especially since was put out in early reviews that I have read. That is why I am asking if you have personally seen the satellite picture upconverted to 4k?

I think you misunderstand. I am saying that the Dish Network Hopper1080i content sent to my 40" 4k TV (up-converted by the TV) is sharper than on a 1080p TV. It also looks better than any 1080p content that I saw on my previous 40" TV. I have also streamed 4k content from Netflix, Amazon Prime and Youtube with 25mbps DSL with no problem. I'm sure that the native output from a 4k Joey with be at least as good as the streaming.

I make no claim about Dish's SD, up-converted, except to say that it is better on my 4k TV than on my previous TV.

If their are claims that a 4k TV is not noticeably better than a 1080p TV in showing regular satellite 1080i output, that information is out of date or in error.

 

[darrengs]

yes, folks with 4K TV's or any larger sized tv, probably have that as their main tv..............and most likely want the main focus of the dish system....the hopper, connected to that tv
just seems like Dish is going about the process in reverse

I don't agree, I have the Hopper & EHD in the Master Bedroom and a Joey on the main TV in the Family room because I do not want to see all that hardware compared to a small box mounted behind the TV. And the new 4K Joey does picture in picture as well, is even thinner and is designed to be mounted behind the TV. So the only "downside" at this time would be the inability to transfer to and from the EHD from the Hopper.

 

[MikeD-C05]

I think you misunderstand. I am saying that the Dish Network Hopper1080i content sent to my 40" 4k TV (up-converted by the TV) is sharper than on a 1080p TV. It also looks better than any 1080p content that I saw on my previous 40" TV. I have also streamed 4k content from Netflix, Amazon Prime and Youtube with 25mbps DSL with no problem. I'm sure that the native output from a 4k Joey with be at least as good as the streaming.

I make no claim about Dish's SD, up-converted, except to say that it is better on my 4k TV than on my previous TV.

If their are claims that a 4k TV is not noticeably better than a 1080p TV in showing regular satellite 1080i output, that information is out of date or in error.

Thanks for the clarification. Then the tv is upconverting all content,including your hopper to 4k content and it looks better to you than the 1080i picture. So then we should be able to hook up our hoppers to a 4k tv -as long as it upconverts the picture to 4k- and it will look great then.

 

[Hall]

All LCD/LED/plasma type TVs upconvert to their native resolution unless the signal they're receiving is already at that resolution.

 

[patmurphey]

Thanks for the clarification. Then the tv is upconverting all content,including your hopper to 4k content and it looks better to you than the 1080i picture. So then we should be able to hook up our hoppers to a 4k tv -as long as it upconverts the picture to 4k- and it will look great then.

Yes! Both a Hopper and a Joey do that now in my family room.

 

[AngryStamen]

I'm not surprised in the least that the first 4k box is a Joey and not a Hopper. Think of it this way: The only thing that is needed in a hopper system is a hopper… No Joey is required in a one TV household. Joey's are only added for households that have additional televisions. Being that there is currently no (or very little) 4K content, it makes perfect sense that the first box released that can handle 4K content would be an add-on box (like a Joey), instead of the main box. The small percentage of people that have or buy a 4k TV can opt to get a 4k Joey. The rest can stick with a hopper and standard joeys and Dish doesn't have to dump extra cost in a new 4k hopper that a majority of people won't need/want. Besides, if the new 4k Joey can do PIP and has Bluetooth, what else do you need?

 

[Ilya]

I'm not surprised in the least that the first 4k box is a Joey and not a Hopper. Think of it this way: The only thing that is needed in a hopper system is a hopper… No Joey is required in a one TV household. Joey's are only added for households that have additional televisions. Being that there is currently no (or very little) 4K content, it makes perfect sense that the first box released that can handle 4K content would be an add-on box (like a Joey), instead of the main box. The small percentage of people that have or buy a 4k TV can opt to get a 4k Joey. The rest can stick with a hopper and standard joeys and Dish doesn't have to dump extra cost in a new 4k hopper that a majority of people won't need/want. Besides, if the new 4k Joey can do PIP and has Bluetooth, what else do you need?

I think it was just easier to start with a 4K Joey. I am sure Dish will come out with a 4K Hopper very soon. Perhaps by next CES if not sooner. They certainly need both.

In my case, the Hopper is located in my main TV/Home Theater room and that's where I will put my first 4K TV when I get one.

 

[harshness]

Sure hope it isn't that long..........
Isn't direct supposed to be coming out with a 4k receiver?

Such a box hasn't been announced.

 

[harshness]

yes, folks with 4K TV's or any larger sized tv, probably have that as their main tv..............and most likely want the main focus of the dish system....the hopper, connected to that tv
just seems like Dish is going about the process in reverse

They're going about it in the way that doesn't put an expensive 4K hopper in millions of homes that don't have 4K TVs.

Delegating 4K downstream as far as possible makes sense; especially if you don't have to forfeit features.

 

[bnewt]

They're going about it in the way that doesn't put an expensive 4K hopper in millions of homes that don't have 4K TVs.

Delegating 4K downstream as far as possible makes sense; especially if you don't have to forfeit features.

I understand what everyone is saying, but wouldn't Dish want their most important product........the hopper to be the main part of the 4K population. I would think that they would want the exposure

 

[Hall]

but wouldn't Dish want their most important product........the hopper to be the main part of the 4K population. I would think that they would want the exposure

Depends on the "crowd" they're marketing to. The majority of their customers aren't worried about 4K (yet).

 

[ggw2000]

There doesn't seem to be alot of Tech details around on this 4K Joey that I have found. As far as content it seems that "partners" will be announced later at time of availability. But in my mind if it doesn't have incorporated into it the apps for: Netflix 4K, Amazon 4K, and also maybe Ultraflix 4K streaming then I think it will be quite useless. Dish just doesn't have the bandwidth for anything 4K except maybe one PPV channel that they will want an arm/leg to rent...
Gerry

 

[harshness]

I understand what everyone is saying, but wouldn't Dish want their most important product........the hopper to be the main part of the 4K population. I would think that they would want the exposure

Henceforth, the Hopper will be part of all of their future experiences. That it doesn't do 4K acknowledges that DISH doesn't offer 4K and that the chipset that the Hopper uses can't render 4K. Broadcom only recently started shipping the chipset that can form the basis of a 4K DVR in quantity. The 4K TVs have much of what is needed outside of the DISH specific authentication and decryption hardware.

To give everyone 4K equipment when only a tiny percentage of homes have it is not economically justified. If someone wants to add a 4K TV, they simply add a 4K Joey to their existing system and they're down the road (unless they heavily use PIP in which case they'll want another Hopper).

 

[JM42]

There doesn't seem to be alot of Tech details around on this 4K Joey that I have found. As far as content it seems that "partners" will be announced later at time of availability. But in my mind if it doesn't have incorporated into it the apps for: Netflix 4K, Amazon 4K, and also maybe Ultraflix 4K streaming then I think it will be quite useless. Dish just doesn't have the bandwidth for anything 4K except maybe one PPV channel that they will want an arm/leg to rent...

Don't be short sighted.

Unofficial reports are there will be 4K linear content. Odds are pretty good we'll see at least Netflix 4K support considering the recent HWS Netflix app, Dish can provide pretty much any 4K PPV content via streaming, and 4K channel 1/501 VOD content is easily doable.

I don't really expect linear 4K to ever be more than a niche/premium offering. A premium movie channel or two, probably an ESPN 4K, etc.

 

[JM42]

Henceforth, the Hopper will be part of all of their future experiences. That it doesn't do 4K acknowledges that DISH doesn't offer 4K and that the chipset that the Hopper uses can't render 4K. Broadcom only recently started shipping the chipset that can form the basis of a 4K DVR in quantity. The 4K TVs have much of what is needed outside of the DISH specific authentication and decryption hardware.

To give everyone 4K equipment when only a tiny percentage of homes have it is not economically justified. If someone wants to add a 4K TV, they simply add a 4K Joey to their existing system and they're down the road (unless they heavily use PIP in which case they'll want another Hopper).

Too much is being made about no 4K Hopper yet. I'd make a pretty hefty wager the next Hopper will be 4K.

Dish has learned their lesson and are not announcing products before their time.

Despite all the SOON grief they get, Dish has pretty much kept to their announced hardware dates since the Hopper was first revealed as the XIP813 at Team Summit a few years back. Biggest exception was the OTA adapter.

 

[Hall]

Biggest exception was the OTA adapter.

...and that was supposedly / apparently a supplier problem. Or was it an FCC approval one ? Either case, to some degree out of Dish's control.

 

[bnewt]

Henceforth, the Hopper will be part of all of their future experiences. That it doesn't do 4K acknowledges that DISH doesn't offer 4K and that the chipset that the Hopper uses can't render 4K. Broadcom only recently started shipping the chipset that can form the basis of a 4K DVR in quantity. The 4K TVs have much of what is needed outside of the DISH specific authentication and decryption hardware.

To give everyone 4K equipment when only a tiny percentage of homes have it is not economically justified. If someone wants to add a 4K TV, they simply add a 4K Joey to their existing system and they're down the road (unless they heavily use PIP in which case they'll want another Hopper).

not everyone will want 4K, just like everyone doesn't have HD, but those that do, like my self will not appreciate having to run additional cable to accommodate the 4K set up. I have 2 hoppers & 1 wireless joey......to accommodate 4K, I would have to start from scratch.......which is something that I would not want to do.