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moto1xxx

Last reply Nov 4, 2009 · posted in DIRECTV General Forum

solid copper wire

How many of you guys work in a mpg 4 only market ? Are you required to run only solid copper wire? Right now we can not run copper clad and if you get caught using ccl its your job. are pay has been cut in half. it doesnt matter if its a upgrade service or new install the house must be re-wired and the great part about it is we dont get paid for it. we role to a one box swap replace and the customer has 3 other existing rcvrs well we have to re do the whole system for a 12 dollar pay so a job that should take 45 mins now takes 3 hours and theres now compensation. its getting really bad and on top of that are cancellation have gone through the roof because they refuse the rewire. so media panels ect. we cant use. oh ya I work for directv home services and its a joke after they bought us out they took are custom labor away they have made it to were you cant make money people are losing there houses and cars its bad. if it dont get better theres soon to be a strike. any thoughts?

solid copper vs copper clad

is there a difference copper clad

2 votes total

48 Replies · 8247 views

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binil

Oct 27, 2009

Well what a heated discussion this is...lol. I am an installer, not PoV or CoV or contractor, I work directly for Corporate.
First of all the QA standards change weekly if not daily. I build every job be it an upgrade or New Install with RG6 solid copper cc, 60% braid swept to 3ghz period. all for $12 an hour. Thats ok with me cause if I do it the way they want me to do it in a neat and timely fashion, while keeping my SIN #s down they will give me more money per hour next year. Thats why I do it.. and I like the satisfaction I get from seeing the look on the customers face when they see what HD looks like running down the right cable and not 59. " Oh thats how HD is supposed to look.. thats beautiful"

Second "NEWSFLASH" Stonecold If I come to your house and you hand me a bag if Digicon compression fittings Im gonna throw them away... Then go about replacing all of the fittings you put on your cable because you thought you were doing the right thing... we cant use Digicon... If you want to use the right connectors get a bag of PPC F connectors.. its all we use.

Third.. "Once its built right it wont have to be done again". Well at least until they change the specs to 4ghz or something different.

Finally I agree with what Joe and Stonecold says except I say it differently... "If the wimp cant hang , then the wimp shouldnt of came." go flip burgers. Look at the bright side Its not S.E.A.L. training.

P.S. Ive lost 63 pounds since they made these changes.. My wife loves it and she shows me she loves it quite often.. If you get my drift.

stonecold

Oct 27, 2009

binil said:
Well what a heated discussion this is...lol. I am an installer, not PoV or CoV or contractor, I work directly for Corporate.
First of all the QA standards change weekly if not daily. I build every job be it an upgrade or New Install with RG6 solid copper cc, 60% braid swept to 3ghz period. all for $12 an hour. Thats ok with me cause if I do it the way they want me to do it in a neat and timely fashion, while keeping my SIN #s down they will give me more money per hour next year. Thats why I do it.. and I like the satisfaction I get from seeing the look on the customers face when they see what HD looks like running down the right cable and not 59. " Oh thats how HD is supposed to look.. thats beautiful"

Second "NEWSFLASH" Stonecold If I come to your house and you hand me a bag if Digicon compression fittings Im gonna throw them away... Then go about replacing all of the fittings you put on your cable because you thought you were doing the right thing... we cant use Digicon... If you want to use the right connectors get a bag of PPC F connectors.. its all we use.

Third.. "Once its built right it wont have to be done again". Well at least until they change the specs to 4ghz or something different.

Finally I agree with what Joe and Stonecold says except I say it differently... "If the wimp cant hang , then the wimp shouldnt of came." go flip burgers. Look at the bright side Its not S.E.A.L. training.

P.S. Ive lost 63 pounds since they made these changes.. My wife loves it and she shows me she loves it quite often.. If you get my drift.

Tell you what Digicons are still better then hex crimps which is what I mentioned in the scenario.

Personally I still just going through a big bag i had.

Joe Diamond

Oct 27, 2009

stonecold said:
Tell you what Digicons are still better then hex crimps which is what I mentioned in the scenario.

Personally I still just going through a big bag i had.

My suspicion is that when correctly used all fittings are about the same. "F" fittings are more prone to error.....ever seen fittings cut with a box knief and crimped with pliers?

So Directv picked one brand and gets a big economy of scale. And the compression fittings are a little more idiot proof.

I did repair a professional FREE installation by compressing several uncompressed fittings.......no other action needed. The HSP was three weeks out on service calls.

It seems the one thing that will do in any fitting is water and freezing and thawing. Each time the cycle happens the center wire gets pushed away just a little until you get a spark plug effect that burns the wire away.

Second most common defect is the little bit of wire debris shorting the cable. Unless you look for it while cutting the fitting you will never find it. Jobs done in the dark suffer from this defect; good fittings used under poor conditions.

I still like $9.00 / hundred instead of $25.00.....$17.00 ain't too shabby.

Joe

nydiver

Nov 3, 2009

Joe Diamond said:
It seems the one thing that will do in any fitting is water and freezing and thawing. Each time the cycle happens the center wire gets pushed away just a little until you get a spark plug effect that burns the wire away.

Second most common defect is the little bit of wire debris shorting the cable. Unless you look for it while cutting the fitting you will never find it. Jobs done in the dark suffer from this defect; good fittings used under poor conditions.

I still like $9.00 / hundred instead of $25.00.....$17.00 ain't too shabby.

Joe

A few comments quickly.
1. CCS has better propagation than solid copper, i.e. for high frequency rf, ccs is a better cable. For power passing CCS sucks and is high resistance as you raise the current flow, hence why DirecTV is lowering the amount of power passed over the wire. Reality going forward is CCS wire is going to take over, cheaper, easier to get, higher quality. No high end cable manufacturer is making SC cable, NONE. SC cable is hard pressed to pass insertion loss specs at 3GHz. Also return loss stinks, not even close to -30 db, where as a POS CCS with no splices in the reel passes with flying colors.

On a side note, Comcast, Cox, TW, Charter, Bresnan, and any other CC doesn't carry on the truck "special" cable to get to the demarc, Times, Comscope, and now PPC do not supply SC aerial messangered or even regular cable. That's simply ridiculous.

2. DirecTV picked PPC for HSP due to quality, ease of stocking only 1 connector, and tech feedback as to ease of use. They were not even close to being the best priced in a reverse auction. So say what you want, DirecTV picked a connector based on what they saw as the most important demographics, not because someone was in bed with them.

nydiver

Nov 3, 2009

Joe Diamond said:
It seems the one thing that will do in any fitting is water and freezing and thawing. Each time the cycle happens the center wire gets pushed away just a little until you get a spark plug effect that burns the wire away.

Second most common defect is the little bit of wire debris shorting the cable. Unless you look for it while cutting the fitting you will never find it. Jobs done in the dark suffer from this defect; good fittings used under poor conditions.Joe

This is the issue we have pointed out for years to DirecTV, lack of proper port seals equals GUARANTEED trouble calls. You have it correct to some degree, water penetrating thru the threads is BAD!!! it corrodes the threads isolating ground, creates shorts from the CC (battery) to post (ground), migrates thru the cable into the customer equipment destroying that. frozen in the cable it collapses the dielectric lowering the impedence, I can go on and on about moisture migration being the #1 issue facing DirecTV, even larger than Craft Error! Bottom line, DirecTV should be using port seals, PERIOD.

Joe Diamond

Nov 3, 2009

nydiver said:
This is the issue we have pointed out for years to DirecTV, lack of proper port seals equals GUARANTEED trouble calls. You have it correct to some degree, water penetrating thru the threads is BAD!!! it corrodes the threads isolating ground, creates shorts from the CC (battery) to post (ground), migrates thru the cable into the customer equipment destroying that. frozen in the cable it collapses the dielectric lowering the impedence, I can go on and on about moisture migration being the #1 issue facing DirecTV, even larger than Craft Error! Bottom line, DirecTV should be using port seals, PERIOD.

That is another one that gets kicked around.

I like cable grease (dielectric lube) and anything else to the keep the stuff from migrating out.

I like drop boxes and sell them as an upgrade.....customers like there appearance!

The copper wire thing is just a way to allow HSPs to demonstrate their worth and take a little cash from their techs. I have not noticed Directv paying for the SC for contractors.

Joe

Liquidforce88

Nov 3, 2009

I gotta say that the Perfect Vision SC wire is some of the worst junk I have ever used. It is thinner than any other wire so I have to have a Special setup stripper just to strip it. The white part of the cable always sticks to the center conductor so I have to take a pair of cutters and pull it off. The outer jacket is too soft in the summer and way to brittle in the winter. Christ I had the stuff cracking at 15 degrees last winter.

nydiver

Nov 3, 2009

perfect vision from a lab standpoint is some hard to deal with stuff, their manufacturer WAY over uses adhesive on the dielectric, thats due to a high coefficent of expansion in the copper core vs a low coefficent in their chosen dielectric foam, by gluing the heck out of the dielectric to the CC they lessen the differental. it makes the insertion loss high and propogation speed stink, but hey, who cares, its all about price, and cheap is good right? Also their PVC jacket is, as you found out, not forgiving in temp extremes. We have gotten the jacket to actually sag on the cable at the 140 degree exterior extreme, with 1/4 amp load across the span. at -40 after a few cycles it will split, especially if at high temp moisture is present and absorbed into the jacket, but again, that never occurs...

Joe Diamond

Nov 3, 2009

nydiver said:
perfect vision from a lab standpoint is some hard to deal with stuff, their manufacturer WAY over uses adhesive on the dielectric, thats due to a high coefficent of expansion in the copper core vs a low coefficent in their chosen dielectric foam, by gluing the heck out of the dielectric to the CC they lessen the differental. it makes the insertion loss high and propogation speed stink, but hey, who cares, its all about price, and cheap is good right? Also their PVC jacket is, as you found out, not forgiving in temp extremes. We have gotten the jacket to actually sag on the cable at the 140 degree exterior extreme, with 1/4 amp load across the span. at -40 after a few cycles it will split, especially if at high temp moisture is present and absorbed into the jacket, but again, that never occurs...

NYDIVER,

You have mentioned the most important part of this question. There is no one quality!
The operative word is acceptable!

Materials are subjected to a specification......all..........ALL ! ... parties are aware of the specifications!

So there is no "best" or "superior"....item......there are just items acceptable to the specification. The customer sets what is wanted...the engineers write a specification to get what the (Directv) customer wants.

Engineers write (compose) what is wanted..............why is it so hard?

Joe

stonecold

Nov 4, 2009

nydiver said:
A few comments quickly.
1. CCS has better propagation than solid copper, i.e. for high frequency rf, ccs is a better cable. For power passing CCS sucks and is high resistance as you raise the current flow, hence why DirecTV is lowering the amount of power passed over the wire. Reality going forward is CCS wire is going to take over, cheaper, easier to get, higher quality. No high end cable manufacturer is making SC cable, NONE. SC cable is hard pressed to pass insertion loss specs at 3GHz. Also return loss stinks, not even close to -30 db, where as a POS CCS with no splices in the reel passes with flying colors.

On a side note, Comcast, Cox, TW, Charter, Bresnan, and any other CC doesn't carry on the truck "special" cable to get to the demarc, Times, Comscope, and now PPC do not supply SC aerial messangered or even regular cable. That's simply ridiculous.

2. DirecTV picked PPC for HSP due to quality, ease of stocking only 1 connector, and tech feedback as to ease of use. They were not even close to being the best priced in a reverse auction. So say what you want, DirecTV picked a connector based on what they saw as the most important demographics, not because someone was in bed with them.

Comcast in my area does. I have pictures as proof two box reels ofcable marked.

Also labled on the wire it self. I have Solid copper from the pole and then ccs in to the house from the demarc. It was a new cable run as I did not have comcast in my house for almost 15 years. so all the comcast lines running to my house were cliped an all exisiting jacks being used for Dish, OTA, FTA and direct.

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dishstaller

Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter

3 minutes ago · posted in The Chit Chat Club

Country singer John Anderson died today

He was 71 yrs old. One of my favorite songs is Seminole Wind....the violin is killer.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W8sh9P3X33w

0 Replies · 1 views

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MartyDe

Last reply 10 minutes ago · posted in Over the Air Television By RabbitEars.Info

ATSC 3 converter boxes

Interesting article about the work being done to develope an ATSC 3 converter box. Yes it does mention affordable.

Pearl TV Issues Progress Report on Low-Cost 3.0 Converters in Advance of NAB Show New York

Group has secured lower pricing from key tech players to make less costly boxes available

www.tvtechnology.com

6 Replies · 188 views

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navychop

Yesterday at 12:03 PM

DEATH TO NEXGEN!

Reactions: primestar31, RaVo68, gms49ers and 1 other person

TRG

Yesterday at 12:12 PM

17 years ago the US turned off analog OTA signals in favor of digital broadcasting. Now the push is ATSC 3 "Nextgen TV". But nobody seems to be able to agree on DRM implementation protocols. People don't want to hook their TV up to the internet in order to watch over the air TV. At least I don't. With all the data they collect about your viewing habits the box should be given away at no cost.

Reactions: N5XZS, osu1991, slow_poke_pete and 1 other person

navychop

Yesterday at 12:27 PM

Comb your hair.

primestar31

Today at 7:29 PM

navychop said:
DEATH TO NEXGEN!

It's dead, they just don't know it yet. They killed it by forcing DRM on it, and that TOTALLY botched implementing it.

There is absolutely NO compelling reason for anybody to switch to ATSC3.0. They only want it as a total and complete money grab.

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navychop

10 minutes ago

I truly hope you are right.

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TWiT Tech Podcast Network

15 minutes ago · posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

Club TWiT: Mikah's Crafting Corner

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bRMaZHVPGg

Direct YouTube Link - Club TWiT: Mikah's Crafting Corner
TWIT's Website
TWIT Live Feed

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TWiT Tech Podcast Network

15 minutes ago · posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

Security vs. Features: The Windows Update Problem

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OHxdmb3SE2E

Direct YouTube Link - Security vs. Features: The Windows Update Problem
TWIT's Website
TWIT Live Feed

0 Replies · 1 views

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reubenray

Last reply 34 minutes ago · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

Dish vs Streaming Apps?

Every time my Dish contract comes up I weigh the options of keeping Dish or switch to streaming. Right now I can watch/record the OTA channels vis my HDHomerun. I also can stream CBS and NBC via the Paramount+ and Peacock apps. What I would need to find is how to watch the Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark channels, Great American Family, Lifetime channels plus a few more with an app or two. My current Dish bill is $118, so I should be able to get a few apps for a lot less.

Any suggestions? I would want the best picture quality and audio quality I could get.

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Bruce

Today at 1:17 PM

reubenray said:
Every time my Dish contract comes up I weigh the options of keeping Dish or switch to streaming. Right now I can watch/record the OTA channels vis my HDHomerun. I also can stream CBS and NBC via the Paramount+ and Peacock apps. What I would need to find is how to watch the Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark channels, Great American Family, Lifetime channels plus a few more with an app or two. My current Dish bill is $118, so I should be able to get a few apps for a lot less.

Any suggestions? I would want the best picture quality and audio quality I could get.

USA and SyFy content is on Peacock, you can receive the rest of those channels via Philo, only $25 a month.

Philo - Stream Live and On-Demand TV

Why pay more for TV? Start your Philo free trial and enjoy live TV plus on-demand content starting at just $25/month. Stream hit shows, movies, and more.

www.philo.com

Reactions: Bobby, osu1991, reubenray and 1 other person

Almighty1

Today at 6:55 PM

reubenray said:
Every time my Dish contract comes up I weigh the options of keeping Dish or switch to streaming. Right now I can watch/record the OTA channels vis my HDHomerun. I also can stream CBS and NBC via the Paramount+ and Peacock apps. What I would need to find is how to watch the Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark channels, Great American Family, Lifetime channels plus a few more with an app or two. My current Dish bill is $118, so I should be able to get a few apps for a lot less.

Any suggestions? I would want the best picture quality and audio quality I could get.

This is what Google Search AI says, let's see how good AI can really solve problems.

To perfectly cover your specific channel checklist while saving significantly on your $118 Dish Network bill, you can leverage your existing HDHomerun setup alongside a live TV streaming service or app combination.
Since you require USA and Syfy, budget entertainment-only streaming apps like Philo ($28/mo) or Frndly TV ($7–$11/mo) will not work as standalone solutions because they exclude NBCUniversal networks. [1, 2]
Here are the best ways to get all your channels, optimized for high picture and audio quality:

Option 1: Hulu + Live TV (The All-In-One Match)
Hulu + Live TV ($89.99–$99.99/mo) is the most seamless replacement because its base tier natively carries every single channel on your list: [1, 2, 3]

Channel Checklist: Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark Channel, Hallmark Mystery, Great American Family, Lifetime, and Lifetime Movies. [1]
Quality & Audio: Hulu + Live TV is widely praised by cord-cutters for its excellent high-bitrate 1080p video quality at 60 frames per second (fps) on compatible streaming hardware. It supports 5.1 Dolby Digital surround sound on most live channels and compatible home theater systems.
Bonus Value: The price automatically bundles the entire on-demand libraries of Hulu, Disney+, and ESPN+, which gives you a massive amount of additional content. [1, 2]

Option 2: YouTube TV (The Premium Interface Alternative)
YouTube TV ($82.99/mo) is highly regarded for its robust streaming stability, unlimited DVR, and highly polished user interface. [1, 2, 3]

Channel Checklist: It includes Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark channels, and Lifetime.
The Catch: Great American Family is not in the base lineup and requires the Sports Plus or Entertainment Plus add-on package, which increases the monthly cost.
Quality & Audio: It streams in 1080p/60fps with an advanced compression codec that minimizes buffering. It features native 5.1 surround sound audio across major streaming hardware platforms.

Option 3: The Maximum Savings "App Stack" Combination
If you want to maximize your financial savings by skipping a massive live TV guide, you can split your checklist across a few dedicated streaming apps. Because you already pay for Peacock, you can cross USA and Syfy content off your list, as Peacock hosts most of those networks' premium shows next-day or live.
By adding the following, you can build a highly customized tier:

Frndly TV ($6.99–$10.99/mo): This affordable live app brings you all 3 Hallmark channels, Great American Family, and the Lifetime networks with a classic cloud DVR.
Discovery+ ($4.99–$8.99/mo): This gives you the full, deep on-demand libraries and live feeds for Food Network and HGTV. [1]

Total Estimated Stack Cost: Around $12 to $20/mo combined on top of what you already pay.

Quality Note: Frndly TV maxes out at 720p/1080p high-definition with stereo audio, while Discovery+ supports highly optimized crisp 1080p and selective 4K video playback with strong digital audio depth on high-end streaming sticks. [1]

Cord-Cutting Tips for Peak Quality

Streaming Hardware Matters: To get the best possible image processing and audio passthrough, use dedicated streaming hardware like an Apple TV 4K or a high-end Roku Ultra rather than relying on the built-in smart TV operating systems.
Check Your Bandwidth: Ensure your home network has a stable downstream speed of at least 25–50 Mbps dedicated to your main television device to ensure the streaming apps auto-negotiate to their highest available bitrate and frame rates without dropping down to lower resolutions.

Reactions: dishstaller and charlesrshell

reubenray

Today at 7:54 PM

Almighty1 said:
This is what Google Search AI says, let's see how good AI can really solve problems.

To perfectly cover your specific channel checklist while saving significantly on your $118 Dish Network bill, you can leverage your existing HDHomerun setup alongside a live TV streaming service or app combination.
Since you require USA and Syfy, budget entertainment-only streaming apps like Philo ($28/mo) or Frndly TV ($7–$11/mo) will not work as standalone solutions because they exclude NBCUniversal networks. [1, 2]
Here are the best ways to get all your channels, optimized for high picture and audio quality:

Option 1: Hulu + Live TV (The All-In-One Match)
Hulu + Live TV ($89.99–$99.99/mo) is the most seamless replacement because its base tier natively carries every single channel on your list: [1, 2, 3]

Channel Checklist: Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark Channel, Hallmark Mystery, Great American Family, Lifetime, and Lifetime Movies. [1]

Quality & Audio: Hulu + Live TV is widely praised by cord-cutters for its excellent high-bitrate 1080p video quality at 60 frames per second (fps) on compatible streaming hardware. It supports 5.1 Dolby Digital surround sound on most live channels and compatible home theater systems.

Bonus Value: The price automatically bundles the entire on-demand libraries of Hulu, Disney+, and ESPN+, which gives you a massive amount of additional content. [1, 2]

Option 2: YouTube TV (The Premium Interface Alternative)
YouTube TV ($82.99/mo) is highly regarded for its robust streaming stability, unlimited DVR, and highly polished user interface. [1, 2, 3]

Channel Checklist: It includes Food Network, HGTV, Syfy, USA, Hallmark channels, and Lifetime.

The Catch: Great American Family is not in the base lineup and requires the Sports Plus or Entertainment Plus add-on package, which increases the monthly cost.

Quality & Audio: It streams in 1080p/60fps with an advanced compression codec that minimizes buffering. It features native 5.1 surround sound audio across major streaming hardware platforms.

Option 3: The Maximum Savings "App Stack" Combination
If you want to maximize your financial savings by skipping a massive live TV guide, you can split your checklist across a few dedicated streaming apps. Because you already pay for Peacock, you can cross USA and Syfy content off your list, as Peacock hosts most of those networks' premium shows next-day or live.
By adding the following, you can build a highly customized tier:

Frndly TV ($6.99–$10.99/mo): This affordable live app brings you all 3 Hallmark channels, Great American Family, and the Lifetime networks with a classic cloud DVR.

Discovery+ ($4.99–$8.99/mo): This gives you the full, deep on-demand libraries and live feeds for Food Network and HGTV. [1]

Total Estimated Stack Cost: Around $12 to $20/mo combined on top of what you already pay.

Quality Note: Frndly TV maxes out at 720p/1080p high-definition with stereo audio, while Discovery+ supports highly optimized crisp 1080p and selective 4K video playback with strong digital audio depth on high-end streaming sticks. [1]

Cord-Cutting Tips for Peak Quality

Streaming Hardware Matters: To get the best possible image processing and audio passthrough, use dedicated streaming hardware like an Apple TV 4K or a high-end Roku Ultra rather than relying on the built-in smart TV operating systems.

Check Your Bandwidth: Ensure your home network has a stable downstream speed of at least 25–50 Mbps dedicated to your main television device to ensure the streaming apps auto-negotiate to their highest available bitrate and frame rates without dropping down to lower resolutions.

WOW! Thanks for this info. I have Roku Ultra and I have a 300mbps internet plan.

Reactions: Foxbat, Almighty1 and charlesrshell

dishstaller

34 minutes ago

reubenray said:
WOW! Thanks for this info. I have Roku Ultra and I have a 300mbps internet plan.

You'll see the Friendly TV app on your Roku....it's preloaded. If you pay by the year it is under $100 for the entire year. Nice mix of channels.

Reactions: charlesrshell

dishstaller

Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter

Last reply 39 minutes ago · posted in The Chit Chat Club

You can't even trust the cost per ounce info in grocery stores anymore

I'm surprised Walmart hasn't banned this guy from all of their stores. He has been on their CASE the past few months.

View: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/f3zr37ekgKM?feature=share

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Juan

Today at 11:17 AM

dishstaller said:
I'm surprised Walmart hasn't banned this guy from all of their stores. He has been on their CASE the past few months.

View: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/f3zr37ekgKM?feature=share

When walmart set a price...they weigh the container and the product...the product label only shows the weight of the product...I am sure if you brought your own plastic baggies to bring the product home you could get the cheaper price

dishstaller

Today at 11:47 AM

Juan said:
When walmart set a price...they weigh the container and the product...

Then they are stupid. Everyone knows that the price per ounce should be the price per ounce of actual product.

Reactions: Jimbo

Juan

Today at 1:38 PM

dishstaller said:
Then they are stupid. Everyone knows that the price per ounce should be the price per ounce of actual product.

You are paying for the whole thing

telstar_1

Today at 2:22 PM

Juan said:
You are paying for the whole thing

Well, the bag can't weigh that much, right? But by law food product packaging must display the actual net weight of the product, i.e., the contents of the container, so by any logic, if not law, a store's stated per-ounce cost should reflect that figure. But since there's not any law regulating shelf statements, a store can say whatever it wants without violating any rules. So I guess the answer is more consumer legislation. Or simply caveat emptor.

Jimbo

Today at 6:26 PM

telstar_1 said:
Well, the bag can't weigh that much, right? But by law food product packaging must display the actual net weight of the product, i.e., the contents of the container, so by any logic, if not law, a store's stated per-ounce cost should reflect that figure. But since there's not any law regulating shelf statements, a store can say whatever it wants without violating any rules. So I guess the answer is more consumer legislation. Or simply caveat emptor.

I would think that the Vendor/Maker of the product would have a say in it, showing the Correct weight ...
You would think it would be in the contract.

I do look at the ounces of items, but unless its way off, I don't check the math, may have to start now.

Remember when you use to get a 13.5 oz bag of Chips .... Thats a PARTY Size now.

Reactions: AZ.

TRG

Today at 6:41 PM

Jimbo said:
I would think that the Vendor/Maker of the product would have a say in it, showing the Correct weight ...
You would think it would be in the contract.

I do look at the ounces of items, but unless its way off, I don't check the math, may have to start now.

Remember when you use to get a 13.5 oz bag of Chips .... Thats a PARTY Size now.

I remember when a pound of coffee was 16oz. Now its 12oz, they don't call it a pound anymore and its three times the cost of the 16oz pound.

Reactions: dishstaller, slow_poke_pete and Bobby

Jimbo

Today at 7:05 PM

TRG said:
I remember when a pound of coffee was 16oz. Now its 12oz, they don't call it a pound anymore and its three times the cost of the 16oz pound.

Well, they don't call it a pound anymore ....

Ice cream is that way too, use to be a half gallon, now its 1.5 quart or some say 48 oz

Reactions: Bobby

NYDutch

Today at 7:39 PM

Jimbo said:
Well, they don't call it a pound anymore ....

Ice cream is that way too, use to be a half gallon, now its 1.5 quart or some say 48 oz

We have a regional ice cream company here that advertises that their ice cream containers are still a full half gallon.

Reactions: dishdude, Jimbo, Foxbat and 2 others

Jimbo

Today at 8:54 PM

NYDutch said:
We have a regional ice cream company here that advertises that their ice cream containers are still a full half gallon.

Now check and see if any of them (probably a few) are actual Ice Cream ...

Most Ice Creams are Not actual Ice Cream.
Bryers for example, call Most of thiers "Frozen Dairy Dessert"

NYDutch

Today at 9:05 PM

Jimbo said:
Now check and see if any of them (probably a few) are actual Ice Cream ...

Most Ice Creams are Not actual Ice Cream.
Bryers for example, call Most of thiers "Frozen Dairy Dessert"

All of their traditional flavors are ice cream, only some of the specialty mixes are are labeled frozen dairy. They also have frozen yogurt flavors that are labeled as such.

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dishstaller

39 minutes ago

TRG said:
I remember when a pound of coffee was 16oz. Now its 12oz, they don't call it a pound anymore and its three times the cost of the 16oz pound.

All through high school I worked at the local home-owned grocery store. I never cease to be amazed at how packing has shrunk through the years. I worked 1978-end of school 1982 so I worked right through all the inflation that was taking place then. Taught me life-lessons that still are with me. My primary job on Saturdays was doing all the price changes....back then you used a price gun, so I had a front row seat. Sugar REALLY went through the roof which is why we now have high fructose corn syrup in just about everything we eat nowadays .

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SuperDish_Fan23

Last reply 45 minutes ago · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

Its crazy how the ViP922 is so rare for no reason.

Why are ViP922s So rare? like its crazy how ebay has none, i checked everywhere, also, i got a ViP222k now, which is actually activated!

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Strega

Today at 2:34 PM

That's not really unusual. Cable companies like to the provide the box too. The phone company provided the phones in until the government forced them to allow third-party phones.

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Almighty1

Today at 7:02 PM

Strega said:
That's not really unusual. Cable companies like to the provide the box too. The phone company provided the phones in until the government forced them to allow third-party phones.

Yes, the Western Electric phones that says "Bell System Property, NOT FOR SALE, Western Electric".

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Bobby

Today at 8:30 PM

Almighty1 said:
Yes, the Western Electric phones that says "Bell System Property, NOT FOR SALE, Western Electric".

In my very early work life I installed and repaired those phones.

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AZ.

Today at 9:10 PM

Almighty1 said:
Yes, the Western Electric phones that says "Bell System Property, NOT FOR SALE, Western Electric".

someone is showing their age

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Almighty1

Today at 9:38 PM

AZ. said:
someone is showing their age

LOL. It depends if the person saw it during the years when they were actually still available which is 1968 to 1983 meaning the person could be 43-58 years old or they can even be a few years old if they learned to read and write at a young age and actually saw a telephone with that label somewhere recently just like even here in San Francisco, payphone still exist physically in public places but whether they can be used or not is a different issue. It still looks like this even today:

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dishstaller

45 minutes ago

I opened my Radio Shack in Sept 1984 and right about that time they did the whole deregulation thing with the phone companies. I bought TONS of those phones that had been refurbished with a new outer shell. You could throw one of those out of a 3 story high window and it would still work.
That was an interesting time in history. I would have older customers come in and ask about phones.....they were terrified that they were going to get into trouble hooking up a second phone without the phone company knowing about it. One of the funniest episodes of WKRP was the one where Johnny thought the cops were showing up because they had an unregistered phone. I guess younger folks can't conceive of a time when you were limited to the number of phones you could have in your house....and limited to the length of the cord

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niembre

Last reply 50 minutes ago · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

OTA no working after Update

My OTA is not working anymore. This started after the latest update. I have the OTA dongle with a OTA antenna that I've been using for years. My hopper does not recognize the dongle anymore and when I go to the OTA setting, it has a screen that says to plug a dongle into the USB. I tried unplugging and plugging back, in the same usb port and other ports. The Hopper does not recognize it. Anyone have same issue?

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Scott Greczkowski

Sep 24, 2026

Did you people having this issue contact Brittany yet? Shes trying to keep track of things and it would be good for you to contact her as maybe she can get this somewhere and get fixed.

Now while unofficial, I am hearing this issue wasn't caused by DISH's software team, but was caused by a chipset driver update that seemes to have hosed some older USB devices. If this is indeed the case I can see why DISH didn't know and why they are slow in fixing it as they need the chipset company to fix its drivers and release them to DISH so they can be pushed out to all.

DISH does not hate you guys nor do they want you to buy new USB dongles. I am rather sure they didn't even know this was an issue until they saw it posted.

Again contact Brittany if you are having this issue, so she has your info and hopefully she can do something for you to keep you happy.

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bookworm370

Sep 25, 2026

Scott Greczkowski said:
Did you people having this issue contact Brittany yet? Shes trying to keep track of things and it would be good for you to contact her as maybe she can get this somewhere and get fixed.

Now while unofficial, I am hearing this issue wasn't caused by DISH's software team, but was caused by a chipset driver update that seemes to have hosed some older USB devices. If this is indeed the case I can see why DISH didn't know and why they are slow in fixing it as they need the chipset company to fix its drivers and release them to DISH so they can be pushed out to all.

DISH does not hate you guys nor do they want you to buy new USB dongles. I am rather sure they didn't even know this was an issue until they saw it posted.

Again contact Brittany if you are having this issue, so she has your info and hopefully she can do something for you to keep you happy.

Thanks, but until they do, can't Dish just revert to the old driver that worked? Then test the new driver when delivered,d before pushing it again.

But then what does an old CIO know! I've only reamed quite a few buttholes from my people that didn't do that!

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slow_poke_pete

Sep 27, 2026

bookworm370 said:
Thanks, but until they do, can't Dish just revert to the old driver that worked? Then test the new driver when delivered,d before pushing it again.

But then what does an old CIO know! I've only reamed quite a few buttholes from my people that didn't do that!

dish can't revert back to older drivers or updates. although just one reason not to buy the ota dongle!!!

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ppappas

Sep 30, 2026

slow_poke_pete said:
dish can't revert back to older drivers or updates. although just one reason not to buy the ota dongle!!!

They can absolutely put the old driver back if they wanted. This is an embedded software environment in which they have total control. All they have to do if build a new version of firmware with the old OTA driver and test it of course. They just don't want to spend the resources doing so. If they are not going to continue supporting the single tuner adapter, then they have to say so.

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navychop

Sep 30, 2026

This Chipset s/w is not controlled by Dish.

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Almighty1

Oct 1, 2026

ppappas said:
They can absolutely put the old driver back if they wanted. This is an embedded software environment in which they have total control. All they have to do if build a new version of firmware with the old OTA driver and test it of course. They just don't want to spend the resources doing so. If they are not going to continue supporting the single tuner adapter, then they have to say so.

Unless of course they didn't keep a copy of the old drivers and can no longer get it. Then there is always the their support for the product is EOL after a x amount of time so it will make the consumer have to buy the current product offering.

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Briant73

Today at 9:19 PM

Anyone heard any updates on this, I'm still having the issue so thought I'd check in.

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Almighty1

59 minutes ago

Briant73 said:
Anyone heard any updates on this, I'm still having the issue so thought I'd check in.

No updates but if you can get DISH Technical Operations to roll you back to H710 or earlier even though H708 would be best because it also eliminates another problem like in this comment, you will also no longer have the problem as long as you don't update manually or forced to any new version until the problem is fixed as the problem started in H711 and still exist in H712 and H713.

https://www.satelliteguys.us/xen/th...ftware-version-713-is-out.423921/post-5108817

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dishstaller

50 minutes ago

Installed an off-air antenna a couple days ago for a customer who had just cancelled his Dish service. He had a dual off-air adapter and gave it to me. Cool. I'll keep it on the truck....might come in handy. Got to admit I don't watch anything as far as live tv goes anymore. Even if we have severe weather, our local channels will have a live feed on Youtube.

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Gary Toma

Staff member Pub Member / Supporter Cutting Edge

Last reply Today at 9:33 PM · posted in DIRECTV Technical Resources Forum

DIRECTV Transponder Map ~ Data 10/21/2026

The TPN Map Excel Presents all DIRECTV Channels:

National (50-States or wide/NAT+PR beams)
Local (Local-Into-Local or narrow/Spot beams)

Additional tabs provide:

OTA the (Over-The-Air) Database
VOD (Video On_Demand) Records
Offline Records
Engr Records
Net Decoder a graphic presentation of all satellites and transponders

Domestic Satellites
@99W...... D11, D14
@101W.... D16
@103W.... D12, D15
@110W.... D5
@119W.... D8

Understanding the TPN Map

Making Sense of the TPN Map Display Conventions

DIRECTV_TPN_Map_261021.xlsx 1,876 KB

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KyL416

Today at 7:25 AM

HAWKS, HORNETS, GRZZLIES, HEAT, MAGIC, CAVLIERS, TWOLVES, BUCKS, PACERS and SPURS channels have also been added, however they are pointing to a TV Promise slate, which says they are working with DAZN and others to strike a deal for those teams.

Some more TPN swaps

coolman302003

Today at 5:44 PM

KyL416 said:
HAWKS, HORNETS, GRZZLIES, HEAT, MAGIC, CAVLIERS, TWOLVES, BUCKS, PACERS and SPURS channels have also been added, however they are pointing to a TV Promise slate, which says they are working with DAZN and others to strike a deal for those teams.

Some more TPN swaps

It appears we are not getting both home & away feeds out of market on League Pass for these teams either…

I've been watching the Spurs home feed on channel 676-1 (was part time San Antonio specific feed) out of market with NBALP for YEARS on satellite (through the multiple iterations of Fox Sports SW, Bally Sports SW, FanDuel Sports SW) Looks like that will not happen unless a deal is reached with DAZN. I do see the placeholder channel on 680 if it happens.

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KyL416

Today at 5:58 PM

coolman302003 said:
It appears we are not getting both home & away feeds out of market on League Pass for these teams either…

Center Ice does have the non-carried feeds, including the Hurricanes, Wild, Blues and Blue Jackets and spotbeam local only teams like the Panthers, Mammoth and Golden Knights. So it probably depends on the available part time bandwidth each night as things they are able to provide to in market viewers in the 600s, PPV Events in the 100s and commercial events in the 9000s get priority first, along with games where neither team has a remappable feed.

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coolman302003

Today at 6:51 PM

League Pass tonight for example (it is almost a full slate tonight):
Hawks @ Magic (only Hawks feed which is easy to insert since its OTA this season and simulcast across multiple Gray Television markets, Magic signed a non- exclusive streaming deal with DAZN and also OTA)
Bucks @ Wizards (only Wizards feed easy to remap, Bucks are OTA & there own streaming service Bucks+)
Hornets @ Nets (only Nets feed which DirecTV already carries so simply YES remap, Hornets signed non-exclusive streaming deal with DAZN, also OTA)
Bulls @ Raptors (Bulls only feed via CHSN remap, its common that we don't get Raptors feeds that often)
Jazz @ Grizzlies (Jazz only feed OTA easy to insert, Grizzlies signed streaming deal with DAZN)
Pacers @ Pelicans (Pelicans only feed which is OTA easy to insert, Pacers signed streaming deal with DAZN)

Maybe it will change but it looks like DirecTV may only carry DAZN feeds on NBA LP when there is no other option, such as when two teams (either Cavaliers, Pacers, Grizzlies, Timberwolves, Spurs) that are both DAZN exclusive are playing each other, we shall see as the season goes on I guess.

This NBA season will be the first in a long time where many League Pass games are carried on feeds DirecTV doesn't normally carry or are only available through OTA spot beams. It'll be interesting to see how it plays out, especially whether we eventually get both home and away feeds for these teams out of market again.

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jamieh1

Today at 8:24 PM

Now in the Hornets and Hurricanes markets we just get the TV promise screen. But Directv still charges sports fee I am assuming.
Luckily my DTV stream package doesn't have a rsn fee. Figure DTV that always says is the leader in sports would have come to an agreement by now.

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KyL416

Today at 9:33 PM

jamieh1 said:
Now in the Hornets and Hurricanes markets we just get the TV promise screen. But Directv still charges sports fee I am assuming.

Greenville-New Bern is $11.99 for MASN (Orioles) and Nationals
Raleigh is $11.99 for MASN and Nationals
Charlotte is $12.99 for BravesVision, MASN, Nationals and Reds

The fee in NC also includes the higher in state rate they have to pay for ACCN. Down in SC the fee is $15.99 as they are also a SEC state.
I'm not sure if they're doing it with those teams, but in some markets they also use the fee to cover the additional cost they have to pay for independents and MyNet stations that picked up full season NHL and NBA rights.

If you go to the TVPromise site, you'll likely be able to get a credit for not getting the Hurricanes and additional Hornets games that air on WITN-D2

jamieh1 said:
Figure DTV that always says is the leader in sports would have come to an agreement by now.

Part of the hold out might be the packaging and price for outer areas like how the Thunder needs sports pack for other states. Hopefully they are also pushing for a guarantee from the teams that they would require whoever wins their local broadcasting rights in 2028 to negotiate with MVPDs as the DAZN, Prime and NBA.tv streaming deals are just for the current season. Commercial distribution rights are probably a factor too.

I'm guessing they got a deep discount for ClipperVision based on how long it took them to announce their TV deal after they were basically handed a multi-year draft death sentence.

The Predators and Pistons channels are using feeds supplied by Scripps Sports

The Heat likely depends on whoever they sign for the Fort Myers DMA, as there's no point in paying a high price for the Heat just for that DMA when WPLG is streaming it for free on their app and website for viewers in the Miami DMA, and they already carry the West Palm Beach station.

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Foxbat

Supporting Founder Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter

Last reply Today at 9:18 PM · posted in Computers and Gadgets

LFP Power Supplies for UPS

I've been using APC UPS units to protect my computer and Home Theater equipment for many years, but now there are a number of companies producing "Glamping" power accessories that can provide hours of 120 VAC power for off-grid use at a camp site or a few hours of power when severe weather knock out the power. I had mentioned elsewhere that I picked up a Jackery HomePower 3000 to use instead of a gasoline generator to provide emergency power for our refrigerator. The 3.0 kWh of Lithium Iron Phosphate battery cells can supply power for over 24 hours and is "light" enough that I can move it into the kitchen to allow it to power the fridge. However, it's not an automatic operation, as I need to move it from its home in the closet to the kitchen, in addition to rolling the refrigerator out from its alcove so I can plug it in.

The Jackery wasn't my first LFP Power Bank; I had purchased an EcoFlow River 2 unit with 512 Wh of capacity. I had purchased this to use on our Home LAN to give it a longer run time than the three hours that I had with the APC UPS I had been using. This isn't an odd use case, EcoFlow advertises this capability on its website and a transfer time of 16 mS. I used this River 2 to supply power to a 16-port Cisco gigabit switch, the AT&T router, Printer Server, MoCA adapter, and surveillance camera NAS. All told, about 35 W of load. With the EcoFlow River 2, it reported approximately 12-13 hours of run time. So far, so good.

After it had been in use for a month or so, I was down in the basement and heard a whirling sound. Turns out the State of Charge was 24% and it appeared the River 2 was off-grid even though it was still plugged in. Well, turns out that the firmware had a big bug in it for people that were using it like I was. I communicated with EcoFlow and eventually they sent a newer firmware that fixed this problem. But before they fixed it, I decided that I had such a good experience with the Jackery, that I bought their Explorer 1000 (1,070 Wh capacity) which should run our home network for over a day. It worked great right out of the box, and even when it was charging, the cooling fan was practically silent.

After the River 2 was patched, I put it to work, replacing the APC UPS powering the bedroom TV with Dish 4K Joey and Apple TV. The LG OLED uses quite a lot more power than I expected, depending on the scene, it can have a 120 Watt power draw. With the River 2, that might limit power-out watching to 4-5 hours. Also, the River 2 still had the issue with its cooling fan, I find it disturbing the quiet bedroom environment.

EcoFlow had one of the Spring sales and have a new EcoFlow Delta 3 1000 Air which was on sale for $299. That's a 960 Wh capacity power bank with a 10 ms power switching, so this seemed like a perfect solution. Well, except for two things: 1) It has one grounded NEMA 5-15 receptacle; 2) even though EcoFlow claims "35 dB @ 1m" quietness, it was even louder that the River 2 was. Not optimal!

So, I ended up swapping the Jackery Explorer 1000 with the EcoFlow Delta 3 1000 Air since the power demands for the Home LAN are less, and the loud fan noise won't bother anyone. The bedroom TV setup says it should be good for approximately 7 hours:

I realize that at some point the amount of money spent on these individual long-term Power Backup solutions will be more expensive than if we just bought a whole-house power solution. Those are coming down in price, but we're still looking at $16,000 at a minimum for a LFP solution, and $10,000 or so for a home LP generator solution. (With the LP generator solution, we would need to also pay the Gas utility to increase the size of our gas line, so that tilts me towards a the battery solution.)

Finally, I tried an Amazon 12 VDC LFP battery that replaces the Lead Acid Gel Cell in a normal UPS with an equivalent set of LFP cells. The price was roughly the same as a 12 VDC battery from Batteries+, and it's been running for about a year now with no difficulty. But these APC UPS units won't run for long, and are really intended to allow the powered equipment to be shut down in an orderly manner.

So, am I weird to use these Camping power banks for Home emergency power solutions? I haven't even touched the idea of Solar panels to supplement the run time in an Outage.

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navychop

May 14, 2026

I would not trust a UPS designed for lead acid to properly charge, discharge and maintain a LFP battery.

Sounds like it'd be cheaper to move where the power is more dependable. Like near me. Quite a few houses in this neighborhood go for less than $1M.

Are you weird? If you seriously consider moving for this - YES!

Foxbat

May 14, 2026

navychop said:
I would not trust a UPS designed for lead acid to properly charge, discharge and maintain a LFP battery.

As I understand the LFP replacement, it has its own BMS that is designed to mimic the Lead Acid battery characteristics. The UPS thinks it's a Lead Acid battery, and provides the appropriate voltage when charging.

Like I said, it was a one-off to test the product, but I prefer to look at the Jackery power products at this point. I'm unhappy with the EcoFlow misrepresenting their noise level. The Jackery is a much better choice for co-existing with people. The EcoFlow works (once the firmware is debugged) in uninhabited areas like garages or basements. I have used Anker cables and small battery packs, but they also have larger capacity power banks and whole-house solutions.

Moving to a different state to solve a power issue? I think you're more prone to hurricanes in Virginia than we are here in Indiana. Sure, you don't get the blizzards and snowfall like we do, but when you do, it's a much bigger deal than it is here.

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Foxbat

Today at 9:18 PM

Added an Anker Solix S2000 for the Internet / Home LAN power which should provide well over a day with the current load. Since I'm looking at replacing the AT&T 2Wire DSL setup with Starlink, the power requirements might increase, so I wanted something that would work for an extended power outage.

Picked it up from Amazon during the October Prime Days for $649. Slightly better $/kWh than the Jackery Home 3000 I got for the refrigerator.

The EcoFlow Air 1000 is now providing uninterrupted power to the Family Room TV and entertainment center (Hopper 3, Denon AVR, Apple TV, etc.) In use, it's reporting about 300 Watts, so it should be able to run for three hours in an outage. Anything longer and we won't be watching movies.