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schneid

Last reply Jan 31, 2018 · posted in Internet Television (IPTV) Discussion Forum

PlayOn is Pretty Cool

In the Stream+ Thread, Scott mentioned PlayOn as a DVR solution. I looked, was impressed, got a pop-up $29.99 "lifetime" offer and bit. Using my PC as a Server for now and my disliked FireTV that has an app for it that runs. So far I have recorded from Netflix, Hulu, and Amazon. Most impressive is that it seems to bring the original format along. I mean, DD+ recordings from Netflix are pushed from my AVR as DD+. My LG OLED isn't coming til Thursday so I don't know yet how HDR or whatever they cal 4K will do. Ordered a new 2TB HD today too for PC. I think I'll just let it spin four drives, 24/7

PlayOn may be the missing piece for me. Still hanging in there for the Stream+ to appear to do OTA recording for the few things there worth having.

Right now PlayOn is pretty compelling. At least I have yet to hit the delete button as I have almost immediately with Sling, DirecTV Now, and PSVue. I have quit Hulu a lot but it keeps sneaking back.

Anyway, I think PlayOn is worth a look if not a keeper.

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Zookster

Jan 29, 2018

My conscience is clear. I'm not doing anything more with PlayOn than I would be with a TiVo, cable TV DVR, or OTA DVR. I really don't see the difference.

Source for the following: PlayOn Cloud lets you record and download videos from streaming services to your iPhone

"The way the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) puts it, breaking or circumventing copy protection mechanisms is what's illegal. And PlayOn hasn't been circumventing DRM or accessing the encrypted stream – it uses screen capturing technology instead. This keeps it on the legal side by following the letter of the law, if not the spirit."

Source for the following: What Is the PlayOn Streaming DVR and Is It Legal?

"Is PlayOn Legal?
The burning question regarding PlayOn is whether any of this is legal. How can a company allow you to access paid services and record them? Aren't individuals getting into trouble for this? After all, the RIAA recently shut down a YouTube to MP3 conversion website.

On the surface, what it looks like PlayOn is engaging in is a form of what's known as "stream-ripping."

Given the legal minefield that exists when it comes to stream ripping, PlayOn provides a somewhat brief, although case-law heavy explanation regarding why their service is legal. The company cites several legal cases to prove their main point: because PlayOn is a DVR (Digital Video Recorder) and DVR services have been deemed legal, their service is also fully legal.

PlayOn is similar to TiVo
In their blog, PlayOn compares themselves to the well-known DVR service TiVo. They cite several cases in which recordings of broadcast television made for "personal, non-commercial use" have been rendered legal under the Fair Use doctrine. Additionally, PlayOn notes that "[r]ecording programs for viewing at a more convenient time is permitted by United States copyright law as fair use."

PlayOn emphasizes the fact that its business is essentially "place-shifting." Place-shifting the process of accessing content you have a right to access from another device or another location.

Because you have to secure the legal right to content before you download it with PlayOn, PlayOn is technically not a stream-ripper. Although it does allow users to record the shows, PlayOn embeds user information into the downloaded MP4 files to help keep the user honest and to help easily identify videos a user might try to reshare illegally.

....

Is PlayOn's AdSkip service legal?
PlayOn also offers an ad-skipping service for paid subscribers to their PlayOn Desktop. While this service is fully legal, it may not make streaming services very happy. Both Hulu and CBS All Access have ads. PlayOn allows users to skip these ads.

The courts concluded that ad skipping services are legal back in 2013, when ABC lost a bidto stop Dish Network from deploying the ad-skipping service that the company uses for its DVR service.

...
PlayOn makes a compelling case for its legality on its blog. It is true that well-known DVR services like TiVo offer similar services compared to PlayOn. Plus, "place-shifting" has been ruled legal for some time now. Although PlayOn lets users skip advertisements, ad-skipping is considered legal as well and does not infringe on any copyrights or other laws currently on the books."

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harshness

Jan 29, 2018

Zookster said:
My conscience is clear. I'm not doing anything more with PlayOn than I would be with a TiVo, cable TV DVR, or OTA DVR.

That you're doing it in violation of the terms of use of the pay TV service and the DMCA is the main difference.

We need to agree to leave OTA sourced content out of this discussion as it doesn't apply to PlayOn.

I really don't see the difference.

You would if you looked at it from the standpoint of the fact that you can't make copies of flagged TiVo or Pay TV DVR content. TiVos will store a copy of an HBO movie on the TiVo but your options are keeping it or deleting it when it bears a no-copy flag. You can't move it to your computer or a media player or any number of storage devices.

"The way the Digital Millennium Copyright Act (DMCA) puts it, breaking or circumventing copy protection mechanisms is what's illegal. And PlayOn hasn't been circumventing DRM or accessing the encrypted stream – it uses screen capturing technology instead. This keeps it on the legal side by following the letter of the law, if not the spirit."

That's like claiming that you set a trip wire to pull the trigger rather than using your finger in executing a murder.

Either way, you've made a copy of copy protected content that is in violation of your agreement with the video source and the DMCA.

Just because you pay for one level of service doesn't allow you to annex any of the other levels of service through black hat methods. To put whipped cream on top of it all, PlayOn suggests that you use free previews to obtain the content you want to support some of their claims of getting content for free.

raoul5788

Jan 30, 2018

harshness said:
That you're doing it in violation of the terms of use of the pay TV service and the DMCA is the main difference.

We need to agree to leave OTA sourced content out of this discussion as it doesn't apply to PlayOn.You would if you looked at it from the standpoint of the fact that you can't make copies of flagged TiVo or Pay TV DVR content. TiVos will store a copy of an HBO movie on the TiVo but your options are keeping it or deleting it when it bears a no-copy flag. You can't move it to your computer or a media player or any number of storage devices.That's like claiming that you set a trip wire to pull the trigger rather than using your finger in executing a murder.

Either way, you've made a copy of copy protected content that is in violation of your agreement with the video source and the DMCA.

Just because you pay for one level of service doesn't allow you to annex any of the other levels of service through black hat methods. To put whipped cream on top of it all, PlayOn suggests that you use free previews to obtain the content you want to support some of their claims of getting content for free.

Why leave it out? If Aereo was shut down for not paying copyright fees, then ota digital signals are copyright protected. So says the Supreme Court. You just said they aren't.

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harshness

Jan 31, 2018

raoul5788 said:
Why leave it out? If Aereo was shut down for not paying copyright fees, then ota digital signals are copyright protected.

The beef about Aereo was settled (but shutting down the service) on the issue of unauthorized re-transmission, not DMCA.

raoul5788

Jan 31, 2018

harshness said:
The beef about Aereo was settled (but shutting down the service) on the issue of unauthorized re-transmission, not DMCA.

Yes, but according to the SC, ota signals are copyright protected.

harshness

Jan 31, 2018

raoul5788 said:
Yes, but according to the SC, ota signals are copyright protected.

Don't confuse copyright with copy protection.

Zookster

Jan 31, 2018

I do now see how it could be interpreted that PlayOn is in violation of the DMCA with its recording technology. However, the company has been around since 2008, and the recording capability was introduced in 2011, and they have yet to be sued, even though big players like Netflix are aware of what PlayOn does and aren't happy about it.

Last year, Netflix director of corporate communications Cliff Edwards told Tom's Guide that downloading videos was a "clear violation of the terms of service," and that Netflix's "licensing agreements don't allow companies [such as PlayOn] to facilitate these types of uses."

Still, violating a terms of service agreement isn't the same as breaking the law, and PlayOn has long maintained that users are just exercising the same rights they had with VCRs. The fact that PlayOn wasn't sued into oblivion after launching its first recording features four years ago seems to bear out that claim.

Source: Catching up with PlayOn, the DVR for streaming video

The linked article in the above quote offers a very balanced analysis of the issue. Here are the TL;DR take-aways (note "PlayLater" is the name of PlayOn's DVR function)

Until the Supreme Court determines exactly what constitutes fair use for time-shifting and device-shifting, consumers have a lot of leeway with how they consume content online.

My ultimate goal was to answer one simple question: Can you record licensed content with PlayLater for personal use? Netflix says no. PlayLater says yes. The legal experts say maybe.

Source: Legal? PlayLater Lets You Record All of Netflix for $20

In other words, until a major court decision specifically addresses the issue of whether or not recording streaming online video content for personal use constitutes fair-use (like recording with a set-top box DVR), the legality of PlayOn's recording technology remains a gray area of the law.

I personally see no reason to feel any more guilty of some ethical violation for using PlayOn to record from network TV websites than I do for using Playstation Vue's cloud-based DVR, which allows me to watch any show it streams on any device at my leisure, with the ability to fast-forward past commercials.

Pete K

Jan 31, 2018

I purchased a lifetime subscription to PlayOn 5 years ago. It's not perfect. I've dealt with a few glitches but it is ideal for recording.

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harshness

Jan 31, 2018

Zookster said:
I do now see how it could be interpreted that PlayOn is in violation of the DMCA with its recording technology.

PlayOn is a tool that can be used (and arguably is used primarily) to circumvent digital content protection. PlayOn is like drilling a hole in a wall and setting up a video camera.

Still, violating a terms of service agreement isn't the same as breaking the law, and PlayOn has long maintained that users are just exercising the same rights they had with VCRs. The fact that PlayOn wasn't sued into oblivion after launching its first recording features four years ago seems to bear out that claim.

This is a completely failed argument as the Betamax case doesn't apply to digital content. Further (and this is where the Betamax case breaks down entirely as applied to PlayOn), Betamax happened because there were a significant number of non-violating uses. This is not the case with PlayOn that features most prominently its use with content with which it is in both declared and implied violation. Many (if not most) of PlayOn's other arguments are similarly fallacious.

Until the Supreme Court determines exactly what constitutes fair use for time-shifting and device-shifting, consumers have a lot of leeway with how they consume content online.

You could try to apply this same logic to most any law. Until the Supreme Court decides that the law is indeed flawed, you can be tried and convicted of a violation. Who wants to find out what the Supreme Court decides some years down the road after multiple lower court losses and appeals?

In other words, until a major court decision specifically addresses the issue of whether or not recording streaming online video content for personal use constitutes fair-use (like recording with a set-top box DVR), the legality of PlayOn's recording technology remains a gray area of the law.

It is black and white until the Supreme Court says otherwise. Laws don't have to be tried before they're enforced -- quite the opposite!

Claiming that everyone else wants/does/needs it won't go far either as the law remains the law until one of the branches of the federal gubmint changes it or repeals it.

I personally see no reason to feel any more guilty of some ethical violation for using PlayOn to record from network TV websites than I do for using Playstation Vue's cloud-based DVR, which allows me to watch any show it streams on any device at my leisure, with the ability to fast-forward past commercials.

You're entitled to your opinion and that's okay as long as it is understood that it is your opinion and not anything that should be construed as fact or law. Just know that it isn't in accordance with the letter of the law including its subsequent amendments (there have been at least three) and until the courts decide otherwise, it remains the law. Whatever reasoning you or anyone else might apply will not change the law and assuming that nothing will happen because nothing has happened is a notion that I'm pretty sure that Netflix, Amazon, the MPAA, et al are going to dispel with impunity.

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TWiT Tech Podcast Network

Today at 3:02 AM · posted in TWiT Tech Podcast Network

SpaceX Seeks to Conduct 450 Starship Launches a Year in Texas!

Time for another AWESOME video from the TWIT Network!

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n43A0sNukCg

Direct YouTube Link - SpaceX Seeks to Conduct 450 Starship Launches a Year in Texas!
TWIT's Website
TWIT Live Feed

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Scott Greczkowski

Staff member HERE TO HELP YOU! Cutting Edge

Last reply Today at 2:44 AM · posted in The Chit Chat Club

Song Name Game Part 3!

Sometimes a thread gets so many posts in it that is can cause issues for the server so that why today we introduce The Song Name Game Part 3!

So let the game continue!

The last song was added by Bobby who posted...

One Meat Ball - Andrews Sisters

CONTINUE ON AND HAVE FUN! WELCOME HOME TO SATELLITEGUYS.US!

Here are the original rules for the game as posted by WebbyDude back in 2006. http://www.satelliteguys.us/threads/68645-Song-Name-Game

Just name a song title and the band who performed it. The next person does the same thing, but needs to list a song title or band name which includes a word from the previous entry. Pick songs from any genre.

Example:

Long Live Rock and Roll -- Rainbow

Rainbow in the Dark -- Dio

Another example:

Ride the Lightning -- Metallica

Lightning Strikes -- Ozzy Osbourne

Get it?

An additional note: we all know that song titles, sometimes, use profane words. Because this is a family friendly website it is advised that you clean up that title up a bit. This is accomplished by using something like sh!t instead of the real word. Thanks....

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gms49ers

Yesterday at 7:28 PM

High Water - Rush

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long_time_Dish

Yesterday at 8:13 PM

Smoke On The Water - Deep Purple

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EatMyVolts

Yesterday at 11:18 PM

Smoke! Smoke! Smoke! (That Cigarette) -- Tex Williams

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long_time_Dish

Today at 12:24 AM

Don't Do Me Like That - Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers

hwkn

Today at 2:44 AM

I LIKE It LIKE THAT-The Dave Clark Five

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Marques Brownlee

Yesterday at 10:52 PM · posted in Marques Brownlee

The NEW Tesla Roadster: My Honest Reaction

Time for another AWESOME video from Marques Brownlee!

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=scwlR0QHGOk

Direct YouTube Link - The NEW Tesla Roadster: My Honest Reaction
The official MKBHD Website!
The MKBHD Store

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iJustine

Yesterday at 10:52 PM · posted in iJustine

NVIDIA RTX Spark launch party!!!

Time for another AWESOME video from iJustine!

View: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/m44iKsdN1-Q

Direct YouTube Link - NVIDIA RTX Spark launch party!!!
The official iJustine Website's Website
Buy her book!

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Anony55

Last reply Yesterday at 7:40 PM · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

DISH Has Made it Impossible to be a VIP211k Owner

For quite a while now, people with a VIP211k have been losing their recordings on their activated external HDDs... even when there's nothing physically wrong with HDD. I believe this is an intentional and underhanded tactic that Dish is pulling in an attempt to force users away from the VIP211k.

They are obviously regretting that they ever let users have a "non-dvr" dvr in the first place. You would think they would be happy charging you a $40 one time fee... and then be happy letting the customer be the one responsible for HDD failures.

Dish clearly hates the 211k bitter-clingers. This recording deletion problem is intentional (IMO), and I think it is just one more tool that they are using. Hopper and a 2-year agreement... that's what they want you to have. Think about that... a 2-year agreement... with a company $30 Billion in debt (that's with a B). What happens when all that debt causes them to drop the channel that may have been your whole reason for having Dish in the first place? Guess who's stuck with a service that no longer suits their needs... for the remainder of the 2-year agreement.

On top of that, they don't want you to install it yourself. I purchased and installed all my equipment myself. That used to be common. Now, they lie to me and tell me that my dish must be updated to use a Hopper. Funny thing is... they don't even know what dish I have because they didn't install it, and I didn't tell them. If you ask what type of dish/LNBs the hopper needs... good luck getting an answer. All they know is that whatever you have needs to be upgraded by an installer.

It is quite apparent to me that they care much more about staying in their box, than they do working with the customer. That's too bad, because it hasn't always been that way. It's like they are totally unaware of the current business environment that they are trying to compete in.

I have been a customer since 2010. I will be cancelling my service before the next period. Yeah, I know, my $1,200 a year won't make a difference to them. It just seems like they have forgotten who needs who, especially when you consider the competition in today's streaming world. But hey, they will have succeed in forcing me off the 211k.

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Nebugeater

Dec 22, 2025

Got a 211k that works fine, and I no longer need it if someone wants to throw me a few bucks and pay shipping. Not tied to my account as of last week. Used with a tailgater and got a wally

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tparker

Sep 30, 2026

Nebugeater said:
Got a 211k that works fine, and I no longer need it if someone wants to throw me a few bucks and pay shipping. Not tied to my account as of last week. Used with a tailgater and got a wally

Is the 211k still available? If so, I'm interested.

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Nebugeater

Oct 2, 2026

tparker said:
Is the 211k still available? If so, I'm interested.

Actually, it is. A couple of people PMed me when I posted this, and when I asked for an address, they never responded. Then I just sort of let it go. Send me a PM to continue the discussion

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Anony55

Thursday at 6:18 PM

Well, after nine months of being on pause, I finally figured out that I was wasting $5 a month. So I cancelled. For the first time since 2010, I no longer have a Dish account.

I do have to say that I did appreciate the account pause option. That just gives a person some time to see what the fallout of cancelling will be... without having to go all the way over the cliff first.

Since I never once had an "oh shoot, I need Dish Network for..." moment, the decision was a lot easier.

Funny enough, when I called to cancel (for real, not playing the pricing game), all of a sudden, they were offering me deals that I was told before that I couldn't get without changing out my VIP211k. Now, I could have had those specials with them just sending me a new card for the receiver. LOL!

Of course, my mind was already made up because of having not missed the service while on pause. That, and the fact that I bet the 211k still kills recordings.

All in all, I'm glad that I had Dish for all those years. I just outgrew the need, and they pressed the issue by deleting recordings. I would have eventually went this route without the deleted recordings issue. But, for sure, that did hasten the outcome.

I'll still pop in at this site from time to time. Believe it or not, I still have a C/Ku BUD that I intend on playing with again if life ever slows down.

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dishstaller

Yesterday at 11:31 AM

Nebugeater said:
Actually, it is. A couple of people PMed me when I posted this, and when I asked for an address, they never responded. Then I just sort of let it go. Send me a PM to continue the discussion

Unless things have changed at Dish, which is entirely possible, they won't activate the 211, even as a replacement. I gave one to a customer a while back....which when I turned it off I made sure to tell the CSR I wanted it freed up so another customer could use it, I was assured it was.....and when they called to swap out there's they were told it couldn't be done. Now like I said, things MIGHT HAVE CHANGED.

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Anony55

Yesterday at 4:19 PM

dishstaller said:
Unless things have changed at Dish, which is entirely possible, they won't activate the 211, even as a replacement. I gave one to a customer a while back....which when I turned it off I made sure to tell the CSR I wanted it freed up so another customer could use it, I was assured it was.....and when they called to swap out there's they were told it couldn't be done. Now like I said, things MIGHT HAVE CHANGED.

It hasn't changed. When I cancelled my service the other day, they told me I didn't need to return the receiver (which I already knew because I purchased it).

But in addition to that, the young man told me not to sell it, but to take it to a recycling place. The reason he gave for the advice was because 211Ks can no longer be activated.

So as far as the VIP211k goes... once grandpa dies, he's dead.

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telstar_1

Yesterday at 5:37 PM

They tell you to trash it and not to sell simply because they're phasing them out, not particularly because someone might be "confused" into buying it and not be able to activate. They tell people that in every case where they're not acting to get a box back, either from a replacement or service cancel.

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Corrado

Yesterday at 7:40 PM

Although my VIP211K hasn't been subscribed or connected to a dish in probably 5 years since canceling service, my 1 TB HDD full of programming still works fine.

Upon occasion I power it up to watch something I recorded as far back as 2010. The last time I had it going in September it even let me rescan the local OTA channels which I think it refused at some earlier time. I will use it until the day it fails but this topic makes me think some software download is responsible for current subscribers.

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zippyfrog

Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter

Last reply Yesterday at 7:37 PM · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

NBA League Pass

Has anyone subscribed to NBA League Pass for 2026-27 and try to link their account to NBA.com to stream League Pass? I purchased it for 2026-27, and when I linked, I got a message saying success, but then I receive an error that my linked subscription does not include the preseason games for NBA League Pass. Is that how it has always been? I know satellite doesn't have the preseason games on the NBA League Pass channels, but I thought that I was able to stream the preseason once I linked my account on NBA.com?

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zippyfrog

Wednesday at 4:54 AM

I found my answer...when I log into the NBA app on my phone and try to watch, it gives me a more clear answer that it acknowledges I have paid for NBA League Pass from Dish and it is linked, but I need an "upgraded" subscription to League Pass for the preseason games. So I guess it is by design that Dish does not show the preseason games on League pass and that the contract Dish has signed for league pass is explicitly for the regular season games. (I know the description for League Pass says regular season games, but I thought that was only by satellite and the preseason would have worked)

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Darrell S

Yesterday at 7:37 PM

I plan on doing what I did last season. I ordered the more expensive arena feed version from the NBA website. It's worth it because you get to watch what's going on in the arena instead of just staring at the ad break slide on the Dish version. The main advantage to ordering from the website is you can go on a month by month basis and cancel if you get tired of it.

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Ramy

Supporting Founder

Last reply Yesterday at 6:20 PM · posted in The Sports Section

2026-27 NCAA College Football

Really excited for this season with Kentucky having a new coach and some really exciting recruits. Probably won't last long, but here's hoping this season is great.

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Yespage

Thursday at 4:57 PM

24 team playoff seems to be real close.

Are we really that far from a 64-team tournament?

The benefit of the 24 team playoff:

All the cartel teams that cartels want in playoff are in playoff
- Independent of record too! Bonus.
MONEY!!!!! for the cartels.
I'm out of ideas.

Cons

Regular season really doesn't matter now other than the rivalry games
- Top cartel teams can lose three games and still make the playoff
Going to start resting players?
- The playoff is going to be *checks notes* several games!
- Resting players could make games dumb.
- Maybe even restrict NIL players from games played.
How much are streaming sub costs going up a month to pay for this?!

AZ.

Thursday at 5:30 PM

Yespage said:
24 team playoff seems to be real close.

Are we really that far from a 64-team tournament?

The benefit of the 24 team playoff:

All the cartel teams that cartels want in playoff are in playoff

Independent of record too! Bonus.

MONEY!!!!! for the cartels.

I'm out of ideas.

Cons

Regular season really doesn't matter now other than the rivalry games

Top cartel teams can lose three games and still make the playoff

Going to start resting players?

The playoff is going to be *checks notes* several games!

Resting players could make games dumb.

Maybe even restrict NIL players from games played.

How much are streaming sub costs going up a month to pay for this?!

One of the pro's I see is in a year with so many undefeated teams they have a good chance of an opening. Few years back you had lower divisions that didnt get a shot. I love collage football and I have no problem with that addition.

We are in what week 5 now? Been two real good ranked games to watch.....Other than that top 25 teams are playing nothing.

Jimbo

Thursday at 5:47 PM

AZ. said:
One of the pro's I see is in a year with so many undefeated teams they have a good chance of an opening. Few years back you had lower divisions that didnt get a shot. I love collage football and I have no problem with that addition.

We are in what week 5 now? Been two real good ranked games to watch.....Other than that top 25 teams are playing nothing.

There are 68 Power 4 teams, so eventually they will get there I wouldn't imagine ...

AZ.

Thursday at 9:12 PM

Jimbo said:
There are 68 Power 4 teams, so eventually they will get there I wouldn't imagine ...

Far from it but you know that....You dont like the larger playoff.....Its ok.....

Jimbo

Thursday at 9:24 PM

AZ. said:
Far from it but you know that....You dont like the larger playoff.....Its ok.....

Oh, I Hate the idea ...

It would be different if it was a game that you could play 2 or games each week, but when you only play 1 game a week, the larger playoff is Not a good thing ...

The season has how many games now, is it 14 ... then you want to play another 5 (with more to come) against Top 12 (eventually 24 teams) ... remember, the 5 games in the playoffs will be the hardest games all year and back to back.

For example, IF Ohio State should win it all this year ... they play 5 teams in the Top 25, plus they would play 5 more to win it all, depending on how the ranking shake out and if Bye weeks are given.

Thats 10 Ranked teams ... in one year ...
I don't see that happening very often ...
Edit, Bama plays 4, Georgia plays 3, But Ole Miss plays 5 (didn't expect to see that)

That said, I don't see the Buckeyes winning it all this year.

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AZ.

Thursday at 9:27 PM

Jimbo said:
Oh, I Hate the idea ...

It would be different if it was a game that you could play 2 or games each week, but when you only play 1 game a week, the larger playoff is Not a good thing ...

The season has how many games now, is it 14 ... then you want to play another 5 (with more to come) against Top 12 (eventually 24 teams) ... remember, the 5 games in the playoffs will be the hardest games all year and back to back.

For example, IF Ohio State should win it all this year ... they play 5 teams in the Top 25, plus they would play 5 more to win it all, depending on how the ranking shake out and if Bye weeks are given.

Thats 10 Ranked teams ... in one year ...
I don't see that happening very often ...

That said, I don't see the Buckeyes winning it all this year.

Yes anyone here knows you 100%....Astros failed no posting...Ohio state loses we hear it.....Its ok....Its called an opinion....I have one so do you.....Problem is?

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Jimbo

Thursday at 10:07 PM

AZ. said:
Yes anyone here knows you 100%....Astros failed no posting...Ohio state loses we hear it.....Its ok....Its called an opinion....I have one so do you.....Problem is?

Seeing theres very little activity in the MLB threads, it wouldn't matter if I posted that the Astros didn't make the Playoffs ...

Theres more NFL info in the Pub section than in the Sports/NFL thread.

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Jimbo

Thursday at 10:54 PM

IF they go to 24 teams, and it looks like they will soon ....
Do we Really want Teams with 3 and 4 losses in the Playoffs ?
Is a 3-4 Loss team one thats able to win 4-5 more games against Top teams ?

Yespage

Yesterday at 10:04 AM

AZ. said:
One of the pro's I see is in a year with so many undefeated teams they have a good chance of an opening. Few years back you had lower divisions that didnt get a shot. I love collage football and I have no problem with that addition.

A 12 team playoff net should catch any undefeated team. The 12 team playoff also exposed that rankings suck. I mean, we kind of knew already that the rankings weren't particularly reproducible, but we now have the empirical evidence that the rankings suck because judging who is the best among a mickey mouse scheduled football season isn't a rational endeavor. So the 12 team playoff ensures most teams that should make it, do, including the mid-major undefeated team. 8 teams should be able to work as well, but puts greater risk at OSU and Alabama missing the playoff... can't have that.

Which is the run up to my main problem with the 24 team set up is that it is designed to keep the OSU's and Alabama's from missing the playoff. The cartels are ensuring widespread participation for their own cartels to increase the monetary reward to themselves. It is fixing the system while not fixing the outcomes, merely making the regular season game outcomes virtually irrelevant. Sure, a bye for winning the conference would be nice, but we've already seen that byes aren't that influential.

AZ. said:
We are in what week 5 now? Been two real good ranked games to watch.....Other than that top 25 teams are playing nothing.

That is college football in a nutshell. Again, college football isn't about competition, it is about revenue. The entire setup is about making money, from regular season squash games against local jobbers like the WWF days to tax exempt bowl games.

And to add to the first world woes, the college football cartels have made being a College Football fan even more expensive... so they can get paid more.

Reactions: osu1991 and AZ.

meStevo

Yesterday at 6:20 PM

Jimbo said:
Theres more NFL info in the Pub section than in the Sports/NFL thread.

Nah, you just don't understand how ignore works, which is why you made your own NFL thread thinking there wasn't one

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Former member 209992

Last reply Yesterday at 5:37 PM · posted in SatelliteGuys Support Center

Site is slooooow

For some reason, the satelliteguys.us site is loading a lot slower than usual on both Chrome on my Asus laptop and Safari on my iPhone.
I'm also seeing longer appearances of the blue bar at the top and the "3 blue bars" loading symbol.
Is anyone else also having the same problem? Thanks in advance.

530 Replies · 18131 views

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Scott Greczkowski

Thursday at 3:39 PM

Remember folks... just like DNS... its always Foxbat.

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Foxbat

Thursday at 3:42 PM

Scott Greczkowski said:
Remember folks... just like DNS... its always Foxbat.

WTF… …What the Foxbat!

Reactions: slow_poke_pete, HIFI, navychop and 5 others

slow_poke_pete

Yesterday at 12:29 AM

Foxbat said:
WTF… …What the Foxbat!

wow what a kick in the balls!!! the wife blames you when things don't work now scott's blaming you :biggrin

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Foxbat

Yesterday at 12:38 AM

slow_poke_pete said:
wow what a kick in the balls!!! the wife blames you when things don't work now scott's blaming you

I know. Here's what Scott has in store for me if I get out of line:

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slow_poke_pete

Yesterday at 6:03 AM

Foxbat said:
I know. Here's what Scott has in store for me if I get out of line:

View attachment 194814
View attachment 194815

OMG to freaking funny :biggrin

Reactions: long_time_Dish, Foxbat and charlesrshell

comfortably_numb

Yesterday at 11:31 AM

Foxbat said:
I know. Here's what Scott has in store for me if I get out of line:

View attachment 194814
View attachment 194815

Not likely since that place closed down.

Reactions: Foxbat and charlesrshell

Foxbat

Yesterday at 5:37 PM

comfortably_numb said:
Not likely since that place closed down.

You're no fun.

Reactions: long_time_Dish, FTA4PA, comfortably_numb and 2 others

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Therm

Last reply Yesterday at 4:01 PM · posted in DISH Network Support Forum

Am I the only one that hates what Dish did to their mobile app?

I thought I would come here and find lots of complaints about the update to the dish anywhere mobile app, but am not seeing any. It used to look just like the desktop webpage. Now you can no longer filter by sports channels or movie channels. Plus that they made it look like a big button telephone and you see fewer channels in the screen which requires more scrolling. Yes I realize you can look at sports then select which sport you want to look at, I just liked being able to see all sporting events in the guide with all other channels being filtered out. Am I alone in the wilderness on this?

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dishstaller

Yesterday at 12:56 PM

I really dislike change for the sake of change

Reactions: Therm, AZ. and charlesrshell

dishdude

Yesterday at 2:51 PM

I like the new look, it's a lot cleaner. I'm using it on one of those Onn streaming devices when I travel.

Reactions: charlesrshell

Therm

Yesterday at 3:39 PM

dishdude said:
I like the new look, it's a lot cleaner. I'm using it on one of those Onn streaming devices when I travel.

Yes a lot cleaner, glossier, and less functional. Someone trying to justify why they are making a big salary. "See look shiny"

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navychop

Yesterday at 3:53 PM

"Big salary." Charlie. "?Big?"

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Tampa8

Yesterday at 4:01 PM

Seems in some ways better. Nicer layout, as others said maybe cleaner. Moving ahead in the guide is better.

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Foxbat

Supporting Founder Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter

Last reply Yesterday at 3:48 PM · posted in Internet Television (IPTV) Discussion Forum

New Apple TV 4K released, plus other Apple Home devices.

Apple has finally released their Apple TV 4K with built-in Siri and a microphone so it can respond to your queries even if you don't have the remote. It also increases in price, to $299. I had been planning on updating my current Apple TV 4K streamers, but that's $600 for the two of them, and that's a pass at this point.

At $299, it had better come with 256 GB of Storage, Gigabit (or better) Ethernet, the latest HDMI tech and standards, and one year of free Apple One. But it probably won't…

Apple TV 4K

Apple TV 4K. New Siri AI and hands-free control. Stunning picture and immersive HomePod surround sound. Works with your Apple and smart home devices.

www.apple.com

20 Replies · 341 views

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Ronnie-

Tuesday at 9:19 PM

Meh. The 4Ks I have will do everything that these do that I need them to do.

Which that's most tech these days for anything released the last four to five years.

It's honestly a testament to how good the previous gen Apple TVs were and are.

Reactions: meStevo, comfortably_numb, b4pjoe and 1 other person

navychop

Tuesday at 9:31 PM

Ronnie- said:
It's honestly a testament to how good the previous gen Apple TVs were and are.

Don't tell them that. They'll adopt planned obsolescence.

navychop

Thursday at 12:55 PM

Outside of gaming, would Joe Sixpack notice any difference?

KAB

Thursday at 7:46 PM

navychop said:
Outside of gaming, would Joe Sixpack notice any difference?

Not a bit. IMO, Apple's are slow to boot up. Time is about the same with 1st gen and 3rd. Roku runs rings around them in that department. I only reason I stuck, is the Apple infrastructure, which has it's definite advantages. But $300 is a deal breaker. Later, Apple!

Reactions: Foxbat, slow_poke_pete and comfortably_numb

slow_poke_pete

Yesterday at 12:08 AM

navychop said:
Don't tell them that. They'll adopt planned obsolescence.

they all do that anyways.. ever notice your cell phone slows down when you come up for an upgrade.. :what

. apple's been making money off of software and not hardware for a while

ncted

Yesterday at 9:00 AM

KAB said:
Not a bit. IMO, Apple's are slow to boot up. Time is about the same with 1st gen and 3rd. Roku runs rings around them in that department. I only reason I stuck, is the Apple infrastructure, which has it's definite advantages. But $300 is a deal breaker. Later, Apple!

Yeah, they boot up a bit slower than Roku, but the OS does a lot more, so it makes sense. How often are you booting them up that is a differentiator? Aside from OS updates, mine are on all the time. I will say the ATV4K is generally quicker than the Roku Ultras I have, when it comes to launching apps and responsiveness, not that the Roku is sluggish.

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navychop

Yesterday at 2:31 PM

slow_poke_pete said:
apple's been making money off of software and not hardware for a while

What software? For iPhones? I tried to buy some image s/w IN THE APPLE STORE! They had none, and could not offer ANY s/w for iPhones

ncted

Yesterday at 3:45 PM

slow_poke_pete said:
apple's been making money off of software and not hardware for a while

I assume you mean services, like iCloud and Apple Music, and not actual software sales. Services have been growing quickly for Apple, but hardware still brings home the bacon. As for where Apple's revenue comes from, the iPhone is still king with 49.58% of revenue as of June 2026. Services comes in second with 28%. iPad, Mac, and Wearables/Home makes up the rest. So, that is 72% coming from hardware. Their profit margin is around 25%, FWIW.

I am skeptical the AppleTV 4k makes them much money on the hardware though, which I suspect is what you were getting at.

Reactions: slow_poke_pete

ncted

Yesterday at 3:46 PM

navychop said:
What software? For iPhones? I tried to buy some image s/w IN THE APPLE STORE! They had none, and could not offer ANY s/w for iPhones

You should have looked in the APP STORE instead.

Reactions: navychop

navychop

Yesterday at 3:48 PM

Will do!

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New Apple TV 4K released, plus other Apple Home devices.

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