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Stuart Sweet
Staff member HERE TO HELP YOU! Pub Member / Supporter Cutting Edge
Last reply · posted in The Solid Signal Blog
Remember Blockbuster Video? I don't mean its sad final days. I mean the days, nearly 30 years ago, when Blockbuster was a real destination by itself. You could find friends their, scouting for new releases. There were big events when high-profile movies were finally available. It was the place to be back in the days when MC Hammer told you not to touch this.

We all know what happened. Blockbuster died, and most folks believe it's because they couldn't keep up with technology. The lure of having DVDs sent to you and keeping them as long as you wanted overshadowed the idea of going to the video store. And then of course streaming changed the model forever. But is that what really happened?

Why Blockbuster really died


Blockbuster really died because they got so bad that you were actually willing to pay more money for less convenience. You were willing to wait for stuff to show up even though you could go down to the video store, get the movie today, and pay less to rent it than you paid for Netflix.

Why? Because Blockbuster became a mess. Chances are you couldn't find that new movie, or anything you wanted. The in-store experience was a mess. Blockbuster was too involved in trying to get you to watch what they had to sell you instead of getting the content you wanted to watch. Their tech stunk too. Paper cards with faded bar codes? Yes that's where we were at. They largely ignored every improvement in tech as it happened, and eventually they paid the price.

Emblematic of all of Blockbuster's failures at the same time was its "new releases" wall. Here you would find movies from the last two years, but never the movie you actually wanted to see from last month. That movie was held back for months while the studios tried to sell you copies instead of renting them.

Here's why I'm talking about this on Streaming Saturday.


So, I've told you why Blockbuster died. Now let's talk about Max. Yes, I'm trashing them again.

Let's run this down point by point, shall we?

"Chances are you couldn't find that new movie, or anything you wanted."


Max is a bewildering mess of content without any real understanding of what the Max brand stands for. There are about seven ways to filter things, all in different places, and you still can't find what you're looking for.

"Their tech stunk too."


After months, I still have issues with Dolby Vision and frame rates in the Max app. They're a lot better, but they're still there. The biggest problem I have is that as I scroll down a long list, the list will randomly scroll back to the top for no reason. It makes going through that long list incredibly painful.

"…its new releases wall"


Have you noticed that Max has completely given up on the idea that a "new release" is something that's actually new? OK, so, writer's strike and the like. There's not as much new content out there. But Max's new releases are often movies and shows that have been out for a year, were hawked to the highest bidder instead of staying on Max, and have just come back.

There's also the more modestly named "Just added" which can have content from anytime in the last 100 years, to be honest. But at least they're not calling it new.

Max isn't the only app with this problem…


Yes, I would say that Netflix and Hulu suffer from some of this as well. But Max stands as the worst of the incredibly high-priced tier of streaming services. And their prices stand to go up even higher, I'm sure.

Here's the funny thing. Not that I'm so bullish on Netflix, but they do seem to do things "just better enough." Yes, Netflix is a bewildering mess of content without any real attempt at creating a brand. But in that regard it's kind of like Costco. You go in there knowing that there's a lot of stuff and you will probably find something you didn't know you wanted.

In contrast, Max is more like Costco after a hurricane hits it. (Personal experience here: I've actually seen one of these in real life, back in the 1990s.) You walk in, and there's stuff everywhere. Some of it's broken, some of it's in the wrong place. If you're lucky you can find something but you feel a little sense of misery for what the place used to look like before calamity (aka David Zaslav) came around.

In a very real way, I hope Max gets its act together. I hope it returns to being a premier destination for 100 years of Warner and Turner content. For my money, the Discovery stuff can all go away if it helps keep costs down. I hope that the company brings in a team of top programmers to fix the rest of the bugs and stops trying to reinvent things that worked perfectly last year. Maybe then, I'd feel a tiny bit more comfortable with a price increase. Keep things the way they are, though, and my Max password will probably get as much use as my old Blockbuster video card.

The post STREAMING SATURDAY: The Blockbuster Syndrome appeared first on The Solid Signal Blog.

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1 Replies · 449 views
Bruce
A few things-

Have you noticed that Max has completely given up on the idea that a "new release" is something that's actually new? OK, so, writer's strike and the like. There's not as much new content out there. But Max's new releases are often movies and shows that have been out for a year, were hawked to the highest bidder instead of staying on Max, and have just come back.
The average time for a Warner movie to go from theater to MAX is about 4-6 months, if it is a hit, if a flop, a lot sooner, see The Flash and Shazam2 for example.

In the pre-streaming services day, it used to be a year.

But others do it differently, Disney+ has been about 3-4 months, hit or not, Paramount+ is all over, used to be 3 month in the post covid lockdown world, now varies depending on the Box Office, for example, Top Gun 2 was on P+ 7 months after opening at the theaters.
There's also the more modestly named "Just added" which can have content from anytime in the last 100 years, to be honest. But at least they're not calling it new.
There is not much to add, specially since HBOMAX lost the contracts to air new Universal, Fox and certain Sony movies ( Columbia).
Yes, I would say that Netflix and Hulu suffer from some of this as well. But Max stands as the worst of the incredibly high-priced tier of streaming services. And their prices stand to go up even higher, I'm sure.
Netflix stands above them all, same price as MAX, hands tons of content ( more then I can keep up with) and makes a profit.

Hulu I am starting to wonder why it exists, no brand identity at all, but it bought back new episodes of Futurama, so happy to have it right now.
Here's the funny thing. Not that I'm so bullish on Netflix, but they do seem to do things "just better enough." Yes, Netflix is a bewildering mess of content without any real attempt at creating a brand. But in that regard it's kind of like Costco. You go in there knowing that there's a lot of stuff and you will probably find something you didn't know you wanted.
Great comparison.
In contrast, Max is more like Costco after a hurricane hits it. (Personal experience here: I've actually seen one of these in real life, back in the 1990s.) You walk in, and there's stuff everywhere. Some of it's broken, some of it's in the wrong place. If you're lucky you can find something but you feel a little sense of misery for what the place used to look like before calamity (aka David Zaslav) came around.
Also great.
In a very real way, I hope Max gets its act together.
Not while Zaslav is there, there was someone working in my old department, he worked at Discovery well before the merger, said it was the cheapest place in the world to work for, the type of place that makes you collect paper clips and reuse them.
I hope it returns to being a premier destination for 100 years of Warner and Turner content.
Now that Warner is again selling their content, this time to a competitor , Netflix, shows the only goal is make money fast and hopefully sell the company before bankruptcy.

For my money, the Discovery stuff can all go away if it helps keep costs down.
There is two main reasons why the Discovery content is there, the first, give the illusion of adding new content while cutting HBO type content.

The second, the Discovery content is already paid for by airing on the cable channels, so that helps the bottom line and helps keep them from making more expensive HBO type content.

Maybe then, I'd feel a tiny bit more comfortable with a price increase.
If they raise the price, during a time where there will hardly be any new HBO type content for 2 years due to the strikes, my yearly when up will become a month to where I binge on everything then drop the service until 12 months later, rinse and repeat.
Keep things the way they are, though, and my Max password will probably get as much use as my old Blockbuster video card.
I have not used the service for a month ( really regrettIng that year sign up), the only thing I need/want to catch up on is Succession , all seasons, after that slim pickings.
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Scott Greczkowski
Staff member HERE TO HELP YOU! Cutting Edge
Last reply · posted in The Chit Chat Club
Sometimes a thread gets so many posts in it that is can cause issues for the server so that why today we introduce The Song Name Game Part 3!

So let the game continue!

The last song was added by Bobby who posted...

One Meat Ball - Andrews Sisters

CONTINUE ON AND HAVE FUN! WELCOME HOME TO SATELLITEGUYS.US!

Here are the original rules for the game as posted by WebbyDude back in 2006. http://www.satelliteguys.us/threads/68645-Song-Name-Game

Just name a song title and the band who performed it. The next person does the same thing, but needs to list a song title or band name which includes a word from the previous entry. Pick songs from any genre.

Example:

Long Live Rock and Roll -- Rainbow

Rainbow in the Dark -- Dio

Another example:

Ride the Lightning -- Metallica

Lightning Strikes -- Ozzy Osbourne


Get it?


An additional note: we all know that song titles, sometimes, use profane words. Because this is a family friendly website it is advised that you clean up that title up a bit. This is accomplished by using something like sh!t instead of the real word. Thanks....
68506 Replies · 2671308 views
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gms49ers
High Water - Rush
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long_time_Dish
Smoke On The Water - Deep Purple
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EatMyVolts
Smoke! Smoke! Smoke! (That Cigarette) -- Tex Williams
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long_time_Dish
Don't Do Me Like That - Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers
H
I LIKE It LIKE THAT-The Dave Clark Five
Anony55
Last reply · posted in DISH Network Support Forum
For quite a while now, people with a VIP211k have been losing their recordings on their activated external HDDs... even when there's nothing physically wrong with HDD. I believe this is an intentional and underhanded tactic that Dish is pulling in an attempt to force users away from the VIP211k.

They are obviously regretting that they ever let users have a "non-dvr" dvr in the first place. You would think they would be happy charging you a $40 one time fee... and then be happy letting the customer be the one responsible for HDD failures.

Dish clearly hates the 211k bitter-clingers. This recording deletion problem is intentional (IMO), and I think it is just one more tool that they are using. Hopper and a 2-year agreement... that's what they want you to have. Think about that... a 2-year agreement... with a company $30 Billion in debt (that's with a B). What happens when all that debt causes them to drop the channel that may have been your whole reason for having Dish in the first place? Guess who's stuck with a service that no longer suits their needs... for the remainder of the 2-year agreement.

On top of that, they don't want you to install it yourself. I purchased and installed all my equipment myself. That used to be common. Now, they lie to me and tell me that my dish must be updated to use a Hopper. Funny thing is... they don't even know what dish I have because they didn't install it, and I didn't tell them. If you ask what type of dish/LNBs the hopper needs... good luck getting an answer. All they know is that whatever you have needs to be upgraded by an installer.

It is quite apparent to me that they care much more about staying in their box, than they do working with the customer. That's too bad, because it hasn't always been that way. It's like they are totally unaware of the current business environment that they are trying to compete in.

I have been a customer since 2010. I will be cancelling my service before the next period. Yeah, I know, my $1,200 a year won't make a difference to them. It just seems like they have forgotten who needs who, especially when you consider the competition in today's streaming world. But hey, they will have succeed in forcing me off the 211k.
168 Replies · 7496 views
Nebugeater
Got a 211k that works fine, and I no longer need it if someone wants to throw me a few bucks and pay shipping. Not tied to my account as of last week. Used with a tailgater and got a wally
T
Got a 211k that works fine, and I no longer need it if someone wants to throw me a few bucks and pay shipping. Not tied to my account as of last week. Used with a tailgater and got a wally
Is the 211k still available? If so, I'm interested.
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Nebugeater
Is the 211k still available? If so, I'm interested.


Actually, it is. A couple of people PMed me when I posted this, and when I asked for an address, they never responded. Then I just sort of let it go. Send me a PM to continue the discussion
Anony55
Well, after nine months of being on pause, I finally figured out that I was wasting $5 a month. So I cancelled. For the first time since 2010, I no longer have a Dish account.

I do have to say that I did appreciate the account pause option. That just gives a person some time to see what the fallout of cancelling will be... without having to go all the way over the cliff first.

Since I never once had an "oh shoot, I need Dish Network for..." moment, the decision was a lot easier.

Funny enough, when I called to cancel (for real, not playing the pricing game), all of a sudden, they were offering me deals that I was told before that I couldn't get without changing out my VIP211k. Now, I could have had those specials with them just sending me a new card for the receiver. LOL!

Of course, my mind was already made up because of having not missed the service while on pause. That, and the fact that I bet the 211k still kills recordings.

All in all, I'm glad that I had Dish for all those years. I just outgrew the need, and they pressed the issue by deleting recordings. I would have eventually went this route without the deleted recordings issue. But, for sure, that did hasten the outcome.

I'll still pop in at this site from time to time. Believe it or not, I still have a C/Ku BUD that I intend on playing with again if life ever slows down.
dishstaller
Actually, it is. A couple of people PMed me when I posted this, and when I asked for an address, they never responded. Then I just sort of let it go. Send me a PM to continue the discussion
Unless things have changed at Dish, which is entirely possible, they won't activate the 211, even as a replacement. I gave one to a customer a while back....which when I turned it off I made sure to tell the CSR I wanted it freed up so another customer could use it, I was assured it was.....and when they called to swap out there's they were told it couldn't be done. Now like I said, things MIGHT HAVE CHANGED.
Anony55
Unless things have changed at Dish, which is entirely possible, they won't activate the 211, even as a replacement. I gave one to a customer a while back....which when I turned it off I made sure to tell the CSR I wanted it freed up so another customer could use it, I was assured it was.....and when they called to swap out there's they were told it couldn't be done. Now like I said, things MIGHT HAVE CHANGED.
It hasn't changed. When I cancelled my service the other day, they told me I didn't need to return the receiver (which I already knew because I purchased it).

But in addition to that, the young man told me not to sell it, but to take it to a recycling place. The reason he gave for the advice was because 211Ks can no longer be activated.

So as far as the VIP211k goes... once grandpa dies, he's dead.
T
They tell you to trash it and not to sell simply because they're phasing them out, not particularly because someone might be "confused" into buying it and not be able to activate. They tell people that in every case where they're not acting to get a box back, either from a replacement or service cancel.
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Corrado
Although my VIP211K hasn't been subscribed or connected to a dish in probably 5 years since canceling service, my 1 TB HDD full of programming still works fine.

Upon occasion I power it up to watch something I recorded as far back as 2010. The last time I had it going in September it even let me rescan the local OTA channels which I think it refused at some earlier time. I will use it until the day it fails but this topic makes me think some software download is responsible for current subscribers.
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zippyfrog
Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter
Last reply · posted in DISH Network Support Forum
Has anyone subscribed to NBA League Pass for 2026-27 and try to link their account to NBA.com to stream League Pass? I purchased it for 2026-27, and when I linked, I got a message saying success, but then I receive an error that my linked subscription does not include the preseason games for NBA League Pass. Is that how it has always been? I know satellite doesn't have the preseason games on the NBA League Pass channels, but I thought that I was able to stream the preseason once I linked my account on NBA.com?
2 Replies · 87 views
zippyfrog
I found my answer...when I log into the NBA app on my phone and try to watch, it gives me a more clear answer that it acknowledges I have paid for NBA League Pass from Dish and it is linked, but I need an "upgraded" subscription to League Pass for the preseason games. So I guess it is by design that Dish does not show the preseason games on League pass and that the contract Dish has signed for league pass is explicitly for the regular season games. (I know the description for League Pass says regular season games, but I thought that was only by satellite and the preseason would have worked)
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Darrell S
I plan on doing what I did last season. I ordered the more expensive arena feed version from the NBA website. It's worth it because you get to watch what's going on in the arena instead of just staring at the ad break slide on the Dish version. The main advantage to ordering from the website is you can go on a month by month basis and cancel if you get tired of it.
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Ramy
Supporting Founder
Last reply · posted in The Sports Section
Really excited for this season with Kentucky having a new coach and some really exciting recruits. Probably won't last long, but here's hoping this season is great.
143 Replies · 1468 views
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Y
24 team playoff seems to be real close.

Are we really that far from a 64-team tournament?

The benefit of the 24 team playoff:
  • All the cartel teams that cartels want in playoff are in playoff
    • Independent of record too! Bonus.
  • MONEY!!!!! for the cartels.
  • I'm out of ideas.
Cons
  • Regular season really doesn't matter now other than the rivalry games
    • Top cartel teams can lose three games and still make the playoff
  • Going to start resting players?
    • The playoff is going to be *checks notes* several games!
    • Resting players could make games dumb.
    • Maybe even restrict NIL players from games played.
  • How much are streaming sub costs going up a month to pay for this?!
AZ.
AZ.
24 team playoff seems to be real close.

Are we really that far from a 64-team tournament?

The benefit of the 24 team playoff:
  • All the cartel teams that cartels want in playoff are in playoff
    • Independent of record too! Bonus.
  • MONEY!!!!! for the cartels.
  • I'm out of ideas.
Cons
  • Regular season really doesn't matter now other than the rivalry games
    • Top cartel teams can lose three games and still make the playoff
  • Going to start resting players?
    • The playoff is going to be *checks notes* several games!
    • Resting players could make games dumb.
    • Maybe even restrict NIL players from games played.
  • How much are streaming sub costs going up a month to pay for this?!
One of the pro's I see is in a year with so many undefeated teams they have a good chance of an opening. Few years back you had lower divisions that didnt get a shot. I love collage football and I have no problem with that addition.

We are in what week 5 now? Been two real good ranked games to watch.....Other than that top 25 teams are playing nothing.
Jimbo
One of the pro's I see is in a year with so many undefeated teams they have a good chance of an opening. Few years back you had lower divisions that didnt get a shot. I love collage football and I have no problem with that addition.

We are in what week 5 now? Been two real good ranked games to watch.....Other than that top 25 teams are playing nothing.
There are 68 Power 4 teams, so eventually they will get there I wouldn't imagine ...
AZ.
AZ.
There are 68 Power 4 teams, so eventually they will get there I wouldn't imagine ...
Far from it but you know that....You dont like the larger playoff.....Its ok.....
Jimbo
Far from it but you know that....You dont like the larger playoff.....Its ok.....
Oh, I Hate the idea ...

It would be different if it was a game that you could play 2 or games each week, but when you only play 1 game a week, the larger playoff is Not a good thing ...

The season has how many games now, is it 14 ... then you want to play another 5 (with more to come) against Top 12 (eventually 24 teams) ... remember, the 5 games in the playoffs will be the hardest games all year and back to back.

For example, IF Ohio State should win it all this year ... they play 5 teams in the Top 25, plus they would play 5 more to win it all, depending on how the ranking shake out and if Bye weeks are given.

Thats 10 Ranked teams ... in one year ...
I don't see that happening very often ...
Edit, Bama plays 4, Georgia plays 3, But Ole Miss plays 5 (didn't expect to see that)

That said, I don't see the Buckeyes winning it all this year.
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AZ.
AZ.
Oh, I Hate the idea ...

It would be different if it was a game that you could play 2 or games each week, but when you only play 1 game a week, the larger playoff is Not a good thing ...

The season has how many games now, is it 14 ... then you want to play another 5 (with more to come) against Top 12 (eventually 24 teams) ... remember, the 5 games in the playoffs will be the hardest games all year and back to back.

For example, IF Ohio State should win it all this year ... they play 5 teams in the Top 25, plus they would play 5 more to win it all, depending on how the ranking shake out and if Bye weeks are given.

Thats 10 Ranked teams ... in one year ...
I don't see that happening very often ...

That said, I don't see the Buckeyes winning it all this year.
Yes anyone here knows you 100%....Astros failed no posting...Ohio state loses we hear it.....Its ok....Its called an opinion....I have one so do you.....Problem is?
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Jimbo
Yes anyone here knows you 100%....Astros failed no posting...Ohio state loses we hear it.....Its ok....Its called an opinion....I have one so do you.....Problem is?
Seeing theres very little activity in the MLB threads, it wouldn't matter if I posted that the Astros didn't make the Playoffs ...

Theres more NFL info in the Pub section than in the Sports/NFL thread.
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Jimbo
IF they go to 24 teams, and it looks like they will soon ....
Do we Really want Teams with 3 and 4 losses in the Playoffs ?
Is a 3-4 Loss team one thats able to win 4-5 more games against Top teams ?
Y
One of the pro's I see is in a year with so many undefeated teams they have a good chance of an opening. Few years back you had lower divisions that didnt get a shot. I love collage football and I have no problem with that addition.
A 12 team playoff net should catch any undefeated team. The 12 team playoff also exposed that rankings suck. I mean, we kind of knew already that the rankings weren't particularly reproducible, but we now have the empirical evidence that the rankings suck because judging who is the best among a mickey mouse scheduled football season isn't a rational endeavor. So the 12 team playoff ensures most teams that should make it, do, including the mid-major undefeated team. 8 teams should be able to work as well, but puts greater risk at OSU and Alabama missing the playoff... can't have that.

Which is the run up to my main problem with the 24 team set up is that it is designed to keep the OSU's and Alabama's from missing the playoff. The cartels are ensuring widespread participation for their own cartels to increase the monetary reward to themselves. It is fixing the system while not fixing the outcomes, merely making the regular season game outcomes virtually irrelevant. Sure, a bye for winning the conference would be nice, but we've already seen that byes aren't that influential.
We are in what week 5 now? Been two real good ranked games to watch.....Other than that top 25 teams are playing nothing.
That is college football in a nutshell. Again, college football isn't about competition, it is about revenue. The entire setup is about making money, from regular season squash games against local jobbers like the WWF days to tax exempt bowl games.

And to add to the first world woes, the college football cartels have made being a College Football fan even more expensive... so they can get paid more.
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meStevo
Theres more NFL info in the Pub section than in the Sports/NFL thread.

Nah, you just don't understand how ignore works, which is why you made your own NFL thread thinking there wasn't one 🤣
Former member 209992
Last reply · posted in SatelliteGuys Support Center
For some reason, the satelliteguys.us site is loading a lot slower than usual on both Chrome on my Asus laptop and Safari on my iPhone.
I'm also seeing longer appearances of the blue bar at the top and the "3 blue bars" loading symbol.
Is anyone else also having the same problem? Thanks in advance.
530 Replies · 18125 views
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Scott Greczkowski
Remember folks... just like DNS... its always Foxbat. :D
Foxbat
Remember folks... just like DNS... its always Foxbat. :D
WTF… …What the Foxbat!😱
S
WTF… …What the Foxbat!😱
wow what a kick in the balls!!! the wife blames you when things don't work now scott's blaming you :biggrin
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Foxbat
wow what a kick in the balls!!! the wife blames you when things don't work now scott's blaming you :biggrin
I know. Here's what Scott has in store for me if I get out of line:
IMG_1990.webp
IMG_1989.webp
S
I know. Here's what Scott has in store for me if I get out of line:
OMG to freaking funny :biggrin
comfortably_numb
I know. Here's what Scott has in store for me if I get out of line:

Not likely since that place closed down.
Foxbat
Not likely since that place closed down.
You're no fun.😑
T
Last reply · posted in DISH Network Support Forum
I thought I would come here and find lots of complaints about the update to the dish anywhere mobile app, but am not seeing any. It used to look just like the desktop webpage. Now you can no longer filter by sports channels or movie channels. Plus that they made it look like a big button telephone and you see fewer channels in the screen which requires more scrolling. Yes I realize you can look at sports then select which sport you want to look at, I just liked being able to see all sporting events in the guide with all other channels being filtered out. Am I alone in the wilderness on this?
7 Replies · 158 views
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dishstaller
I really dislike change for the sake of change
dishdude
I like the new look, it's a lot cleaner. I'm using it on one of those Onn streaming devices when I travel.
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T
I like the new look, it's a lot cleaner. I'm using it on one of those Onn streaming devices when I travel.
Yes a lot cleaner, glossier, and less functional. Someone trying to justify why they are making a big salary. "See look shiny"
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navychop
"Big salary." Charlie. "?Big?"
Tampa8
Seems in some ways better. Nicer layout, as others said maybe cleaner. Moving ahead in the guide is better.
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Foxbat
Supporting Founder Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter
Last reply · posted in Internet Television (IPTV) Discussion Forum
Apple has finally released their Apple TV 4K with built-in Siri and a microphone so it can respond to your queries even if you don't have the remote. It also increases in price, to $299. I had been planning on updating my current Apple TV 4K streamers, but that's $600 for the two of them, and that's a pass at this point.

At $299, it had better come with 256 GB of Storage, Gigabit (or better) Ethernet, the latest HDMI tech and standards, and one year of free Apple One. But it probably won't…
20 Replies · 333 views
Ronnie-
Meh. The 4Ks I have will do everything that these do that I need them to do.


Which that's most tech these days for anything released the last four to five years.


It's honestly a testament to how good the previous gen Apple TVs were and are.
navychop
It's honestly a testament to how good the previous gen Apple TVs were and are.

Don't tell them that. They'll adopt planned obsolescence.
navychop
Outside of gaming, would Joe Sixpack notice any difference?
KAB
KAB
Outside of gaming, would Joe Sixpack notice any difference?
Not a bit. IMO, Apple's are slow to boot up. Time is about the same with 1st gen and 3rd. Roku runs rings around them in that department. I only reason I stuck, is the Apple infrastructure, which has it's definite advantages. But $300 is a deal breaker. Later, Apple!
S
Don't tell them that. They'll adopt planned obsolescence.
they all do that anyways.. ever notice your cell phone slows down when you come up for an upgrade.. :what. apple's been making money off of software and not hardware for a while
ncted
Not a bit. IMO, Apple's are slow to boot up. Time is about the same with 1st gen and 3rd. Roku runs rings around them in that department. I only reason I stuck, is the Apple infrastructure, which has it's definite advantages. But $300 is a deal breaker. Later, Apple!
Yeah, they boot up a bit slower than Roku, but the OS does a lot more, so it makes sense. How often are you booting them up that is a differentiator? Aside from OS updates, mine are on all the time. I will say the ATV4K is generally quicker than the Roku Ultras I have, when it comes to launching apps and responsiveness, not that the Roku is sluggish.
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navychop
apple's been making money off of software and not hardware for a while

What software? For iPhones? I tried to buy some image s/w IN THE APPLE STORE! They had none, and could not offer ANY s/w for iPhones
ncted
apple's been making money off of software and not hardware for a while
I assume you mean services, like iCloud and Apple Music, and not actual software sales. Services have been growing quickly for Apple, but hardware still brings home the bacon. As for where Apple's revenue comes from, the iPhone is still king with 49.58% of revenue as of June 2026. Services comes in second with 28%. iPad, Mac, and Wearables/Home makes up the rest. So, that is 72% coming from hardware. Their profit margin is around 25%, FWIW.

I am skeptical the AppleTV 4k makes them much money on the hardware though, which I suspect is what you were getting at.
ncted
What software? For iPhones? I tried to buy some image s/w IN THE APPLE STORE! They had none, and could not offer ANY s/w for iPhones
You should have looked in the APP STORE instead. ;)
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navychop
Will do!