720p Decision

[T2k]

Still shots on 1080i blow 720p away. And if your provider gives 1080i enough bandwidth it really negates the so called 720p advantage despite T2k's rantings.

Hahaha, it is really funny.
Answer this question: how many times you watch STILL shot on your TV?

Exactly, close to zero.

And when you hold or slow-skip frames of a movie, it looks like crap on 1080i, thanks to its interlaced nature.

PS: and remember, even still shot flickers on 1080i. Everything flickers on 1080i, no matter what, especially noticeable when it's an oldschool CRT display (the one that kills your eyes slowly).

 

[T2k]

What is the absolute best NFL presentation youve ever seen??? CBS in HD 1080i at 18-19 mbps , hands down theres just no arguement.

You must be really high on drugs if you want to convince anybody that a 1080i60 sport event looked better than a 720p60...

Also given that 720p set must convert 1080i signals and vica versa, you are better off with a 1080i set since 90 of all broadcasters are 1080i. ESPNHD1,2,ABC and FOX are the only 720p that comes to my mind.

Perhaps because they ARE SPORT CHANNELS? FYI: you've just completely contradicted your claims about CBS 1080i NFL...

 

[deno24]

Yeah, and your missing every second lines...

there you go again, the interlaceing happens so fast you cant tell it, your brain percieves 1080 scan lines. There would be a real problem if you only see every other line. Im thinkin youve bought one to many 5000k VCR's

Once again 115000 more pixals at any given time, period. Thats all you need to know-------------^

 

[T2k]

there you go again, the interlaceing happens so fast you cant tell it, your brain percieves 1080 scan lines. There would be a real problem if you only see every other line. Im thinkin youve bought one to many 5000k VCR's
Once again 115000 more pixals at any given time, period. Thats all you need to know-------------^

115000 pixels... you can't tell it... man, you're so clueless...

Stop spamming this board with your uneducated crap. You might will confuse laymen with your clueless crap.

 

[deno24]

im thinkin your the one thats clueless. The only thing you have proven is that you dont like interlacing. Then you want someone to do the math, well i did themath
and when one format has 115000 more pixals that than the other that pretty much lays the whole argument to rest.
Only because im tired of this crap will i meet you half way and say that both formats are far supperior to standard TV and they both have drawbacks, 720's being that
it doesnt have the resolution of 1080 and 1080 suffers motion artifacts.
I really dont want to post again so dont say im clueless or dont know im talking about. Show me one thing I said that doesnt hold up. Do the math man. the math does not lie:up

 

[T2k]

im thinkin your the one thats clueless. The only thing you have proven is that you dont like interlacing. Then you want someone to do the math, well i did themath
and when one format has 115000 more pixals that than the other that pretty much lays the whole argument to rest.
Only because im tired of this crap will i meet you half way and say that both formats are far supperior to standard TV and they both have drawbacks, 720's being that
it doesnt have the resolution of 1080 and 1080 suffers motion artifacts.
I really dont want to post again so dont say im clueless or dont know im talking about. Show me one thing I said that doesnt hold up. Do the math man. the math does not lie:up

It's not me but you who couldn't grasp such basic euqation like 720 > 540...

I'm out, I absolutely don't feel necessary to debate with a totally thickheaded person with little or zero knowledge, sorry.
Just keep telling the same crap to yourself, buddy...

 

[deno24]

you are absalutley correct in saying 720 is greater than 540.
but 1280x720 is not greater than 1920x540.
And we are not dealing with 540 we are dealing with a final
displayed image of 1920x1080
either way you slice it 1920x540 and 1920x1080 offer more pixals than 1280x720
As you said, do the math you cant dispute the results with your " oh but its interlaced" whinning!

 

[KenSoren]

I am wanting to get into HD. Making a decision on a HD television. I want to go some where between 37" and 50". This is due to room size and budget. Seems like all I have found so far are 720p and anything 1080i/p costs a fortune.
The set I am currently looking at most strongly due to price features and size.
http://www.samsung.com/Products/TV/DLPTV/HLR5067WAXXAA.asp?page=size_contents
What I mainly want to see in HD is discovery. Also my DVD's and I am sure some day HD DVD's. By going with a 720p set instead of a 1080p/i am I going to be short changing my self quite a bit on quality? If the signal coming from the satellite is in 1080i and must be converted by the set or receiver to 720p I imagine there is going to be some quality lost in the transition not?
This is a chunk of money and a big decision. Wish Dish would transmit 720p and 1080i both so everyone was happy.
Also, what do you guys think of the Samsung TV?
Matthew

Looks like you started a good debate on HD formats. Here is my endorsment for the Samsung DLP TV.

I bought a Samsung 50 inch DLP - HLM507W - close to three years ago and I am VERY happy with it. The set is lightweight - about 80 lbs - and the picture is really bright with extra good quality. The 720p format that the set converts to works well with everything including the built in tuner. I just replaced the lamp assembly and that has been the extent of the repairs so far. The lamp did not go out but started making sounds so I ordered the part and installed it myself - cost a little over $200 for the part.

I have a Dish 921 DVR that gets OTA HD from a Channel Master fringe antenna and signal booster. The DVR uses the DVI input on the Samsung so the Dish SD and HD and the OTA HD input and picture quality is, in my judgement, excellent.

Hope this helps!

 

[Stargazer]

Also, make sure you check out the quality of non-HD (SD TV and DVD) on the set as well, since the vast majority of content out there is still not in high definition. I think a lot of people tend to be disappointed when seeing SD on a big screen, particularly LCD and DLP, since the poor quality of SD video is magnified on big sets with a far different 'character' than our old cathode-ray sets.

Would it still show the poor quality if the HDTV upconverts the SD to HD?

 

[rthomp03]

I will compare the numbers.... 1920x1080=2073600
1920x540 =1036800- also known as 1920x1080i
1280x720 = 921600
There you go buddy numbers dont lie... That should lay the argument over PQ
between 780p and 1080i to rest . Not only does 1080i have more horizontal lines
of resolution than 720p its has more pixals as well. Do the math!
I dont know how you judge PQ but it ultimatley boils down to resolution. Which
if you go by the numbers ( as you sugested ) proves 1080i has better PQ than 720p.
:up

" For the benefit of the readers that wish to learn, Deno is WRONG."

This argument has gone on since the inseption of 1080i and 720p all of the sudden someone is wrong? cmon

Thank you Deno! I just got back from a week long vacation and have been trying to catch up and was hoping someone would show T2k the math. 720p is missing at least 100k pixels.

 

[rthomp03]

It's not me but you who couldn't grasp such basic euqation like 720 > 540...
I'm out, I absolutely don't feel necessary to debate with a totally thickheaded person with little or zero knowledge, sorry.
Just keep telling the same crap to yourself, buddy...

You are obviously mathematically challenged.

 

[deno24]

Thank you Deno! I just got back from a week long vacation and have been trying to catch up and was hoping someone would show T2k the math. 720p is missing at least 100k pixels.

yea the poor fella evan asked for the math to be done, and there it is in black and white. He Obviously owns a 720p native set so he is biased. Wonder how well his set converts 1080i to 720 from his 5000 dollar VCR?

 

[gutter]

I have seen the same picture on a 720P and a 1080I and honestly couldn't tell the difference until it came to fast action. I think they are equal. In my opinion Progressive is always preferred. I can't wait until the day 1080p becomes more affordable and there is actual content available to take advantage of it.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

I suspect that 1080p content will be limited to some kind of HD DVD format, but it will still be a great thing.

Just like right now, if you want top quality 480i, you buy a DVD. Same will be true for 1080p, and perhaps even 1080i and 720p.

 

[T2k]

Thank you Deno! I just got back from a week long vacation and have been trying to catch up and was hoping someone would show T2k the math. 720p is missing at least 100k pixels.

And has almost 200 lines extra, yes.

 

[T2k]

You are obviously mathematically challenged.

You are obviously generally challenged, even by such basic thiings like a comparison.

I fully understand that some people are less fortunate than others when it comes to brain capacity but I thought 720 vs 540 + full frame vs flickering interlaced weren't so challenging questions...
I guess I was wrong. But hey, don't give up - everybody has a place under the sun! Sure, you can't take job in any related industry, not even a TV technician but hey, you can still be many other things... maybe even a helper of a TV technician? :devil:

 

[T2k]

I have seen the same picture on a 720P and a 1080I and honestly couldn't tell the difference until it came to fast action. I think they are equal. In my opinion Progressive is always preferred. I can't wait until the day 1080p becomes more affordable and there is actual content available to take advantage of it.

My point exactly. 1080i doesn't offer anything over 720p but sports a horrible picture for sports or any action stuff and that disgusting interlace flickering.
Thanks but no.

The problem with 1080p is that p30 maximum as of today - which means it'll still stutter at fast paced footages... 1080p60 would be cool but that's awful lot of bandwidth.

 

[n0qcu]

And has almost 200 lines extra, yes.

WRONG it's 360 LESS lines.

If you have flickering you need a different TV.

And FORGET the 540 BS, There is NO 540 it's 1080 per FRAME.

 

[T2k]

WRONG it's 360 LESS lines.
If you have flickering you need a different TV.
And FORGET the 540 BS,

OMG, another completely clueless young padawan...

There is NO 540 it's 1080 per FRAME.

Sure, sure... isn't it late a bit for you? I know ski break is in effect, so no school tomorrow but still... look what kind of uber silly post you just made - you really need some sleep...

 

[rdinkel]

My point exactly. 1080i doesn't offer anything over 720p but sports a horrible picture for sports or any action stuff and that disgusting interlace flickering.
Thanks but no.
The problem with 1080p is that p30 maximum as of today - which means it'll still stutter at fast paced footages... 1080p60 would be cool but that's awful lot of bandwidth.

That is why my Loewe Aconda set employs a digital progressive scan. The entire picture is processed and displayed in one pass, 60 times per second--twice the speed of interlaced scanning and without flickering of static images, such as on-screen text or the lines on a sports field. The result is a picture that has the an appearance similar in sharpness and clarity to a high-quality film image. This essentially moves 1080i closer to 1080p.