AT&T disappointed with offers for struggling DirecTV

[slice1900]

Where are you reading that twisted pair copper lines can support 5 or 10 gig speeds? Most I'm aware of is 2 gig on a very short run using G.fast. And that introduces additional complications into the network versus a simple passive optical network that's all fiber from end to end.

In the post you quoted I was talking about the twisted pair (cat5) from your service entrance through your walls to your router, using ethernet.

For telco twisted pair (cat3-ish) there's G.fast, but there is already a faster version of G.fast that hits 10 gigabits at 100 meters, and research into using the wires as waveguides that can hit a terabit at that distance (and 10 gig at a half kilometer, which would make it a drop in upgrade to VDSL2 deployments which are generally within a half kilometer of the fiber cabinet)

 

[TheTechGuru]

Anyhow, I agree with you that relatively few homes have much use for even gigabit speeds. Really only those folks who download and upload huge files regularly, which mainly seems to be avid gamers who download entire game files to temporarily store on the drives in the PS and Xbox consoles. (Why aren't video games still sold on physical media?) I guess there are also some video and graphics professionals who work from home and appreciate the much faster speeds too.

But honestly, most of us just stream content, surf the web, and the only downloading and uploading we do tends to be small files like mobile apps or photos and short video clips posted to social media. On the rare occasion that I download a seriously large file (like an OS update), it's just something that I start and then do something else while the download happens in the background. I don't care if it takes a half hour or whatever.

You forgot doctors (mainly radiologists) that need to download XRAY/CT/MRI data quickly, many read them and write up their narratives from home...

In my experience, most sites won't exceed 100mbps, most top out at 45mbps especially anywhere beyond 300 miles or so. You have to use multi-threading to get faster speeds. Speedtests tend to use 20+ connections to get those high speeds. Try using a single stream speed test and try using local vs across the country servers, you'll get a much better idea of the real world speeds.

Once my promo expires I'll probably drop down to the 300/300 or 100/100.

Oh, the main reason I got gig in the first place was at the time the gig plan was the only unlimited plan with AT&T and the 100 and 300 had a 1TB/mo cap. AT&T has since removed the caps for the 100 and 300 plans.

 

[Jimbo]

In the post you quoted I was talking about the twisted pair (cat5) from your service entrance through your walls to your router, using ethernet.

For telco twisted pair (cat3-ish) there's G.fast, but there is already a faster version of G.fast that hits 10 gigabits at 100 meters, and research into using the wires as waveguides that can hit a terabit at that distance (and 10 gig at a half kilometer, which would make it a drop in upgrade to VDSL2 deployments which are generally within a half kilometer of the fiber cabinet)

Telephone company hasn't used Cat 3 in 25 years ...
We've been running Cat5 or 6 (at least Cat5) since 2000 ish.

Currently, the Vrad distances are from 3000 to 5500 feet.

Thats not Fiber though.

 

[slice1900]

Telephone company hasn't used Cat 3 in 25 years ...
We've been running Cat5 or 6 (at least Cat5) since 2000 ish.

Currently, the Vrad distances are from 3000 to 5500 feet.

Thats not Fiber though.

I live in a much older area than 2000s so unless they had to replace the copper it isn't cat5. Centurylink was deploying their VRADs so customers being served from them were within either a half mile or half kilometer wire distance, can't remember for sure which now.

Going longer distances if you have better wiring makes sense, the numbers listed for g.fast etc. are 'worst case' assuming older copper wiring, presence of bridge taps etc.

Though the latter aren't a problem anymore since newer DSL standard 'training' can identify and mask out frequencies that are impaired by bridge taps. When I was an early DSL tester for a friend who owned an ISP in town (using bare wire alarm circuits) in 1996 bridge taps were a problem at my house, when he saw the oscilliscope pattern showing the impairment he climbed the pole and clipped it lol!

 

[Jimbo]

I live in a much older area than 2000s so unless they had to replace the copper it isn't cat5. Centurylink was deploying their VRADs so customers being served from them were within either a half mile or half kilometer wire distance, can't remember for sure which now.

Going longer distances if you have better wiring makes sense, the numbers listed for g.fast etc. are 'worst case' assuming older copper wiring, presence of bridge taps etc.

Though the latter aren't a problem anymore since newer DSL standard 'training' can identify and mask out frequencies that are impaired by bridge taps. When I was an early DSL tester for a friend who owned an ISP in town (using bare wire alarm circuits) in 1996 bridge taps were a problem at my house, when he saw the oscilliscope pattern showing the impairment he climbed the pole and clipped it lol!

Exactly ...
Every New Order is using Cat5, we are not allowed to use old existing wiring in homes (unless its already been replaced) the only exception is in apartments where you really cannot run a new Home Run to them .

Every order (or repair, if one slipped thru) if it has a Bridge tap, it has to be removed before closing the job ... it is possible to have BT's that do not require being removed. If its a LONG BT's typically it isn't an issue.

Each job had to pass multiple tests to allow it to be closed, BT being just a small part of the things being tested for.

If I came to your home to put in or repair the Internet, it will get a new home run of Cat 5 provided it is possible to do.
We were in tons of homes older than 2000, I was referring to that being when we were placing Cat 5, not the age of the home.

 

[TheTechGuru]

I think a lot depends on the company. Last time I got ADSL2+ from AT&T they gave me CAT5 to run from the NID to my modem. When I got ADSL2+ from CenturyLink they gave me CAT3 and when I got bonded two line ADSL2+ from Windstream they gave me CAT3.

 

[Tampa8]

The real competitor for DISH and DIRECT was (is) not each other as much as the Cable industry and now I guess streaming to some extent. That doesn't mean they were not watching each other, competed and they had ads over the years proving that. DISH would answer Directv ads about Sports they had that DISH did not directly for many years. (By talking about some College Sports and some soccer) compared their prices to Directv including package prices and no first receiver fee on their site.
Because of the two different methods of delivery that does put a damper on them becoming one company. It does not however rule out a third entity teaming up with DISH and both of them taking Directv. That isn't a prediction btw.

Competing (in same market) Cable companies certainly do take note and react at what the other is doing happens all the time here especially with Frontier taking over and Spectrum in the same markets. For Data Frontier came in with lower pricing and Spectrum is MICH lower here than in Ct now - they were the same price before. Frontier (before Covid) offered same day service in most instances, Spectrum then had to when they could. They don't in Ct unless it just happens to work out that they can.
Spectrum here (FL) constantly has mailings - no exaggeration at least once a week, prior once in awhile. And they just had a promotion if you showed you actively have Frontier you got an extra $5 off even specials for any bundle package if you switched.

 

[ncted]

DirecTV lost 620k subs in the last quarter:

AT&T’s Revenue Rises as Wireless Unit, HBO Add Customers

AT&T added cellphone users, fiber-optic internet customers and HBO viewers during the first quarter, as the economy starts to come back after a year of coronavirus-related pressure.

www.wsj.com

 

[slice1900]

We were in tons of homes older than 2000, I was referring to that being when we were placing Cat 5, not the age of the home.

I'm not talking about the age of a particular house, but the age of the area and how it impacts the copper on the poles in the neighborhood. The type of wire in the house is irrelevant, that's easier to replace to than all that wire on the poles, and even if you had cat3 in your house running DSL over that last 50 feet or whatever is not a problem.

Heck, you can run gigabit ethernet over cat3 over lengths common in a home and it'll work fine, I even saw old school 10Mb ethernet run over three foot sections of uninsulated barbed wire once by some marketing guy making a point (about what I'm not sure lol)

 

[Juan]

I'm not talking about the age of a particular house, but the age of the area and how it impacts the copper on the poles in the neighborhood. The type of wire in the house is irrelevant, that's easier to replace to than all that wire on the poles, and even if you had cat3 in your house running DSL over that last 50 feet or whatever is not a problem.

Heck, you can run gigabit ethernet over cat3 over lengths common in a home and it'll work fine, I even saw old school 10Mb ethernet run over three foot sections of uninsulated barbed wire once by some marketing guy making a point (about what I'm not sure lol)

100 year old copper works fine....for voice

 

[Jimbo]

I'm not talking about the age of a particular house, but the age of the area and how it impacts the copper on the poles in the neighborhood. The type of wire in the house is irrelevant, that's easier to replace to than all that wire on the poles, and even if you had cat3 in your house running DSL over that last 50 feet or whatever is not a problem.

Heck, you can run gigabit ethernet over cat3 over lengths common in a home and it'll work fine, I even saw old school 10Mb ethernet run over three foot sections of uninsulated barbed wire once by some marketing guy making a point (about what I'm not sure lol)

Hell, we still have tons of LEAD in the city .... much of it is from 1927.

 

[Jimbo]

100 year old copper works fine....for voice

Till you OPEN it ... even then, Voice gets static when its been opened and the weather gets to it.

 

[Juan]

Till you OPEN it ... even then, Voice gets static when its been opened and the weather gets to it.

You have to seal it

 

[Jimbo]

You have to seal it

No ... really ?

And if it doesn't get sealed perfectly ....

 

[Juan]

No ... really ?

And if it doesn't get sealed perfectly ....

Exactly

 

[Bruce]

Yes, something that many are forgetting, Subs were leaving D* before ATT took over ....

ATT in my opinion never tried to Improve the company as a whole at all, they just wanted it for the buying power of the current subs, which I think did not end up working as well as they had hoped.

Just noticed this, DirecTV did not start losing subs until after AT&T took over (2015), they actually gained some ( about 1.5 million) until the wheels came off-

 

[Juan]

Just noticed this, DirecTV did not start losing subs until after AT&T took over (2015), they actually gained some ( about 1.5 million) until the wheels came off-

View attachment 151476

Then why did Fox get rid of them?

 

[Bruce]

Then why did Fox get rid of them?

Fox did not own them then, Fox sold off it's 38% share to Liberty (who already owned 19%), then it was spun off from Liberty.

from wiki-

In December 2006, News Corporation announced its intention to transfer its 38.5% controlling interest in The DirecTV Group, four regional Fox Sports Net stations and $550 million cash to Liberty Media in exchange for Liberty's 19% interest in News Corp., giving the Murdoch family tighter control of the latter firm.[41] The deal, valued at $11 billion, was approved by News Corp. shareholders in April 2007.[42] Following revisions that increased the cash offer to $625 million in exchange for a reduction of Liberty's divested interest in News Corp. to 16%, the swap was completed on February 27, 2008 following Federal Communications Commission (FCC) approval.[43] One condition placed by the FCC on the deal was that Liberty divest either its DirecTV operations or Liberty Global's cable operations in Puerto Rico, which Liberty fulfilled by placing DirecTV's Puerto Rican operations in a trust.[44]

On May 4, 2009, Liberty announced that it would split off Liberty Entertainment, Inc., a subsidiary of Liberty owning the four FSN channels acquired under the swap with News Corp. and Liberty's 65% interest in Game Show Network, into a separate company to be merged with The DirecTV Group, reducing Liberty owner John Malone's stake in DirecTV to 24%.[45] The merger was completed on November 19, 2009, with The DirecTV Group and Liberty Entertainment becoming subsidiaries of a new company named DirecTV.[46] On June 16, 2010, Malone exchanged his preferred stock in DirecTV with equivalent amounts of common stock, reducing his voting interest in the company from 24% to 3%, with Malone resigning as Chairman and ending his managerial role at DirecTV.[47]

 

[Juan]

Fox did not own them then, Fox sold off it's 38% share to Liberty (who already owned 19%), then it was spun off from Liberty.

from wiki-

In December 2006, News Corporation announced its intention to transfer its 38.5% controlling interest in The DirecTV Group, four regional Fox Sports Net stations and $550 million cash to Liberty Media in exchange for Liberty's 19% interest in News Corp., giving the Murdoch family tighter control of the latter firm.[41] The deal, valued at $11 billion, was approved by News Corp. shareholders in April 2007.[42] Following revisions that increased the cash offer to $625 million in exchange for a reduction of Liberty's divested interest in News Corp. to 16%, the swap was completed on February 27, 2008 following Federal Communications Commission (FCC) approval.[43] One condition placed by the FCC on the deal was that Liberty divest either its DirecTV operations or Liberty Global's cable operations in Puerto Rico, which Liberty fulfilled by placing DirecTV's Puerto Rican operations in a trust.[44]

On May 4, 2009, Liberty announced that it would split off Liberty Entertainment, Inc., a subsidiary of Liberty owning the four FSN channels acquired under the swap with News Corp. and Liberty's 65% interest in Game Show Network, into a separate company to be merged with The DirecTV Group, reducing Liberty owner John Malone's stake in DirecTV to 24%.[45] The merger was completed on November 19, 2009, with The DirecTV Group and Liberty Entertainment becoming subsidiaries of a new company named DirecTV.[46] On June 16, 2010, Malone exchanged his preferred stock in DirecTV with equivalent amounts of common stock, reducing his voting interest in the company from 24% to 3%, with Malone resigning as Chairman and ending his managerial role at DirecTV.[47]

I guess you dont remember the rupert. Charlie war.....charlie screwed rupert first...then rupert did a counter attack using directv....the details are foggy at best

 

[Bruce]

I guess you dont remember the rupert. Charlie war.....charlie screwed rupert first...then rupert did a counter attack using directv....the details are foggy at best

What does that have to do with you claiming AT&T bought DirecTV from Fox?