digital sound

[joewho]

I have a 510 dvr and am having trouble getting digital sound. Using the supplied rca's and a stereo that auto detects digital sound, so far I've only heard analog. To compound the problem, it's just about impossible to know what movies/channels are broadcasting in 5.1.

Does anyone have a source that shows which broadcasts are in digital?
The stereo I have recognized the dvd player as digital, but the 510 is always analog (even for Deadwood?). Manually switching just mutes it.
Any advice appreciated.
Thanks

edit: Maybe the sound has to be run through a digital video device to get the sound? I'm trying to get directly to the stereo, but nothing works. Source direct produces 2 speaker stereo on known 5.1 cs broadcasts.

 

[StevenD]

You have to have a digital coax or optical connection from the Dish receiver to your HT receiver. RCA's (analog) will not work.

 

[SimpleSimon]

There's an output jack on the back of the box marked "Dolby Digital".

Find some cable that fits it and the corresponding jack on your A/V box.

 

[joewho]

Thanks for the replies. I have an optical cable running from the "output marked dolby.... but it doesn't work.

Stereo is a kenwood vr-509, is set up correctly and I've tried all the configurations to get the optical and s-video to work. I do have the manual and read it carefully again and again. It just won't go into digital mode.
It's been tested with a dvd player, and it works.
I've been told several different things, like the optical cable won't work unless used for video, etc. I called dish network and the young girl just said they don't support stereos, only tv's. Yes, since getting satellite, I realize I need a modern tv. Still working on it.

Any more ideas? Is it possible for a particular unit to fail to output digital sound?

Thanks

 

[mudder1310]

The optical ouput on the back of the receiver is the only source for digital audio. You may have to go to the menu and change the audio output options from PCM to PCM/dolby digital. This is how my 811 is hooked up to my AVR.

 

[joewho]

Did that a long time ago. Funny thing is, I can set it to any - dolby, dolby/pcm or pcm and i still get sound from the rca's, just not digital.

 

[Jahntassa]

You'll ALWAYS get sound from the RCA's. Maybe it won't go into digital because you still have the ANALOG RCA's hooked up. Unplug the White/Red RCAs completely and only use the optical cable from the Dish reciever to your stereo.

 

[Frank Jr.]

Not every channel is DD. My HK swithches over to DD when it is detected. I have found that only certain movies are.

 

[Pepper]

I have the same or similar Kenwood (I forget the exact model number on mine) and it works fine with optical from my 522 (and the 721 and 7200 that preceded it). Seems like I had to push the "sound mode" or "listen mode" button on the front panel but it is "always" digital sound on mine (usually ProLogic surround not DD).

If you stick your eyeball in the optical port on the back do you get irreparable retina damage from the light? That would tell you if the port is working or not.

Seriously though, the optical port might be defective or just disconnected from the board on the inside of the receiver. OR, if the DVD player you tested it with was using the coaxial, not optical input you might have a bad cable, or a bad optical input on the Kenwood.

 

[Slyster]

It must be bad. I use optical out.. and it works (as the RCA's too) for every single channel... not just certain "digital" channels etc... (although NO channels make much difference... they aren't in 5.1 sound.. maybe ppv are but I just watch the standard channels)

I have my unit set to digital/pcm both on.

 

[HulaHal]

I don't subscribe to any movies (just the 180) and with a 522 I was finally able to get it all working with an optical cable. I have my Kenwood set to "auto" and (unfortunately) nothing I get is DD...but most have 5.1. The local channels are iffy...or not at all, however. I miss Letterman in surround.

Funny..before I found these forums (and found the answers), I called Dish and inquired how to get 5.1 (and even stereo). Had to go through 2 CSRs before I found one that understood what monoraul was.

FYI..regarding the 521...I have had no problems thus far....no sound drops, screwy timers, etc. Work (crossing my fingers) like a charm thus far.

 

[haertig]

My experiences are the same as Slysters. The only audio out from my 522 to my receiver is the optical one. Audio works for all channels, although I have yet to notice one being transmitted in DD. I don't get the PPV's or the premium movie channels. So maybe it's just the standard channels aren't transmitted in DD very often (if at all). I may have missed some that were in DD, because I've come to not expect DD from Dish and often times just leave the sound system turned off and listen to the built-in TV speakers (the analog RCA outputs from my 522 go directly to the TV to allow no-sound-system viewing).

 

[haertig]

... and (unfortunately) nothing I get is DD...but most have 5.1 ...

I don't understand what you're saying here. 5.1 sound requires either DD or DTS, AFAIK. If you're getting 5.1, then that means you're either getting DD or DTS. I don't believe 5.1 exists outside of that context. ProLogic can be transmitted over analog however. ProLogic can be termed "surround", but it's not 5.1 Maybe I didn't read what you were trying to say correctly.

 

[joewho]

Again, thanks to everyone for their input. haertig, there is some confusion, but you are right, the stereo is producing it's own circle surround 5.1. Not digital.
Well, I've tried it with 2 dvd players and still nothing. The red light is coming from the box, and out the end of the cable.
I finally found a kenwood support number 1-800-kenwood duh. A knowledgeable tech worked with me and still nothing. My friend has the exact same model, and it works for him on dvd player. He doesn't have optical on his comcast box.
So there it is, the dang stereo is bad and long out of warranty.

I still don't believe it, there should be nothing wrong at all. But even knowing all the tricky settings and nuance's, it just doesn't work. At least I know which component is the culprit.
Thanks to everyone.
Tim

 

[haertig]

I'm really having trouble understanding what you're saying. In the first post, you said the receiver was recognizing a DVD player as digital, but not the DVR. Then your latest post said you tried two DVD players "and still nothing". So I'm quite confused. Is a DVD player successfully detected as Dolby Digital or not?

I will try to make some general suggestions, because I'm too confused to know exactly what's going wrong for you. Please don't take my specific step-by-steps below as a condescending type of thing. I'm really trying to help out here, but I think you might be confused on what you have (or I'm confused with what you're trying to describe). I looked up your Kenwood's manual on the manufacturer website, so I have some clue about what your receiver supports. I'm assuming your 510 DVR is similar to my 522 DVR.

First, scrap those RCA cables. Totally unplug them from both the DVR and the the receiver. I think you may just be confusing yourself with these. Next connect an S-Video cable from the DVR to "VIDEO 3" on your receiver. Not Video 1 or Video 2. These other inputs will NOT work for your setup (because Video 1 on your Kenwood does NOT have any digital audio input, and Video 2 only has a coax digital audio input, which your 510 does not support). So you MUST use Video 3. That is the ONLY input you have that supports both OPTICAL digital audio and S-Video. OK - truth be told - your Kenwood's DVD input also supports both S-Video and optical digital audio, but I assume you want to save that for your DVD player. But IF YOU WANT, you can steal the DVD inputs and hook up your 510 to them. Just remember that when you want to watch satellite you must switch your receiver to "DVD" if you do this.

So now you have two and only two cables going between your DVR and receiver. One optical digital audio, and one S-video. That's all you need, or want. They are both hooked up into the receiver's Video 3 inputs.

Now set up your receiver to "auto detect" digital audio signals. This should be in the manual somewhere. It is surely the default, and if you just turn off the receiver and then turn it back on again I'm willing to bet that it will come up in auto-detect mode on it's own accord. I am not sure if you have to do anything on your 510 DVR to enable digital audio out. On most other components I've run into, digital audio out is enabled for Dolby Digital by default. However, it is NOT enabled by default for DTS, since sending a DTS signal to a receiver that can't handle it will result in a hellish squeal that may fry your speakers. But we're not concerned about DTS here, your 510 does not have it AFAIK. I mention it only in case you wonder about DTS not working from a DVD player for example. You probably have to manually enable DTS on the DVD player. That's fine for your Kenwood receiver. It can handle DTS. So no hellish squeals for you! Now back to the topic at hand (DD)...

Tune your receiver to Video 3 where you plugged in your 510. Now find something on satellite that's being broadcast in DD. That may not be an easy task, since DD is rare on Dish from my experience. I assume there's some front panel display on your Kenwood that would indicate that it's receiving and decoding DD. Maybe is says "Dolby Digital" or maybe it has some little icon that looks like a group of 5 or six speakers. Maybe just an LED indicator light.

If you can't find anything on satellite being broadcast in DD, complete your testing with a DVD player instead. Most any recent DVD release you can rent will have DD. Unplug the two cables from the back of your 510 (leaving the other ends plugged in to the Video 3 on your Kenwood). Plug those cables into the back of a DVD player and fire up a movie. Note that most DVD's do not use DD on the startup menus. You have to actually get into the meat of the movie before you'll see DD decoding indicated on your Kenwood. Some DVDs require you to turn on DD. Usually in a Setup or Languages menu. But many (most) have DD enabled by default. Note that enabling DD on a particular DVD (disk) is seperate and distinct from enabling DD on your DVD player itself, which I touched on above. I would recommend playing "Saving Private Ryan" on the DVD player. When you watch that first beach assault scene, you'll KNOW you're hearing digital audio ... because you'll be ducking to avoid the bullets seemingly flying around you!

If all this still does not work for you, I'd start tending toward agreeing that your receiver might be hosed. But not until you've positively yanked those RCA cables out of the picture. You will NEVER get any digital signal over those analog RCA outputs. The best you can hope for with an analog connection is ProLogic (Left, Right, Center, Rear). You can only get 5.1 (LeftFront, RightFront, Center, LeftRear, RightRear, and Subwoofer) from a digial connection (optical or coax). Your receiver may take ProLogic and simulate some fancy sounding "surround sound" thing, but it's incorrect to call this "5.1" ... it is not 5.1 Unplug those RCA cables so you don't confuse yourself about this simulation.

Good luck!

 

[jbcheshire]

haertig,
Great explanation!!! I have had some similar questions on my setup and your answers have given me some insight on what to do!! I know if I ever have any questions with my system setup I hope you see my question.

 

[xccell]

The problem is not your equipment, thats the good news. Most programs that are broadcasted have analog sound. If you have not already, purchase a PPV movie that shows the "DD" symbol on the title. This is the easy way you can test to see if you equipment can really decode Dolby Digital.

 

[TuxCoder]

Or just tune to a DD PPV movie during the first few minutes when it is opened up to all for a preview... (to get you interested in the movie so you then pay for it when it shuts off 10-15 minutes into it).

And actually, I've seen times when I landed on a PPV channel that is blacked out (already was far enough into the movie) yet the DD 5.1 audio still came through.

 

[haertig]

One other thing to consider. Digital sound does not mean good sound necessarily. It depends on how the soundtrack was mixed. For example, they can take an old movie originally recorded in mono, remaster the soundtrack, and release a DVD that is "Digital Sound, 5.1 Dolby Digital". They might have only taken that original mono soundtrack and sent it to each of the digital channels, so you still are listening to mono basically, but technically you have all those seperate channels so it can be accurately called 5.1 (just each channel has the SAME content!) Or better yet, they could remaster it to only send sound to the center speaker. Nothing about 5.1 says you actually have to USE all those speaker channels to great effect. Bottom line: for testing, get a DD movie with a known "awesome" soundtrack if you want to really test out your system!

 

[TuxCoder]

All that is true, but... it should never be any worse than going through the analog connections. I prefer the digital connection for reasons of less D-A and A-D conversions, and immunity from external electrical interference hitting my cables.