Dish and 1080i upscaling on 4K (1 Viewer)

Register Today to see less ads! It's Free!

primetimeguy

SatelliteGuys Pro
Oct 4, 2006
1,003
39
St. Paul, MN
All locals are worse on Dish for me, but yes, crappy OTA just means crappier Dish as they typically get the same signal.

I agree, it just sucks with bigger tvs being the norm that the quality is going down. Pretty much all providers suffer from it now so we don't have many options. Frustrating they are trying to add bandwidth for 4k, what a waste and just more watered down garbage. They could just up the bandwidth on 1080i back to normal levels and market it as 4k and most people wouldn't know.

Streaming has over taken from the quality side now as well, too bad the dvr portion of those offerings blow.
Compared to high-bandwidth OTA, sure Dish PQ is inferior. Compared to Over-stuffed sub-channel OTA, DirecTV, or my local cable company (Spectrum), Dish looks just as good.

Sent from my Pixel using Tapatalk
 
Register Today to see less ads! It's Free!

Jim5506

SatelliteGuys Master
Pub Member / Supporter
Lifetime Supporter
Oct 19, 2004
7,470
2,219
Lubbock, Texas
If Dish is using the OTA signal to uplink to satellite, then the Dish signal has a good chance of being degraded.

Some stations use a fiber link to send signal to dish.

In that case, if the OTA signal is bandwidth choked by sub-channels, the Dish signal could be better than the OTA signal.
 

sxmfan2018

SatelliteGuys Guru
Aug 30, 2018
123
66
los angeles
Im so confused. I just returned a new 65" Hisense do to a terrible picture. Then I bought a $1000 TCL 65" instead. Brought it home and the same thing, the picture is worse then on my plasma. I have the Hopper with Sling. Called Dish and said I needed to upgrade to a Hopper 3. I dont understand why my picture right now is worse on the 65" TCL then on my 51" plasma. Why is my 4K not upscaling. And how could the Hopper 3 make it any better at upscaling 1080 to close to 4K. Im so dissapointed. I dont want to have to take this one back too, but the picture I cant handle its like its SD instead of even HD. The entire picture just looks off, faces in the crowd during a baseball game looked like anything but faces. Are 4Ks wastes or would the Hopper 3 at least bring me back to my Plasma level. Also whats a good satellite signal strength. Mine is around 70. Is that a strong signal?
hmm i have a TCL 65 inch in my bedroom and i have no problems with it heck it rivals most sony's and samsungs. heres a link so you can see what i bought. and have you tried messing around with the settings on the set???

https://www.walmart.com/ip/TCL-65-Class-4K-2160P-HDR-Roku-Smart-LED-TV-65S401/598958531
hell with the HDR kicks in on a 4k blu ray the picture is amzing
 

sam_gordon

SatelliteGuys Pro
May 21, 2009
2,253
1,054
Lexington, ky
In that case, if the OTA signal is bandwidth choked by sub-channels, the Dish signal could be better than the OTA signal.
But PROBABLY even the fiber feed is coming after the station encoder (which is what sets the bandwidth). I think it's going to be a rare station that gives any MVPD a full HD-SDI bandwidth signal of their main channel. BTW, that would be almost a 1.5Gb signal.
 
  • Like
Reactions: primetimeguy
Aug 26, 2018
7
3
46148
Well I returned my TCL and got a Samsung NU8000. Hooked it up and no issues with the picture. HD is upscaled to near 4K. Its a awesome picture. I had alot of problems adjusting the colors and everything to how I thought it should be. I had no idea there were so many different adjustments that could be made. So I found a Youtube video of the Astros game and paused it at different spots and matched my screen with lines, dirt color etc then went to the US Open and verified it with how the court looks and held my phone with the court to the TV and matches. Color and contrast looks much better. I originaly been having way too much color and when I saw the lines of the Astros field mine were much darker and almost missing. So as for the Hisense and TCL if thats the best they can do upgrading I dont see how people are able stand watching them and say its a great picture when its 720p or below.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Tampa8

eddie willers

SatelliteGuys Pro
Sep 15, 2003
1,229
1,147
Braselton, Ga.
I had no idea there were so many different adjustments that could be made. So I found a Youtube video of the Astros game and paused it at different spots and matched my screen with lines, dirt color etc then went to the US Open and verified it with how the court looks and held my phone with the court to the TV and matches.
Don't do that...do it right.

Every film / TV show is adjusted and mixed to a STANDARD on calibrated monitors. Get a calibration disc (they're around twenty bucks at Amazon, etc.) and set your new TV to that standard using the video patterns provided. If you match those, you WILL be correct.

Now here's the hard part. After you have done that, do NOT touch those settings again! Some films may be washed out, somebody may be broadcasting incorrectly, but the instant you try to make that one channel/show look right, you have thrown yourself off the standard and everything else will be wrong.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ncted and HipKat

HipKat

SatelliteGuys Master
Pub Member / Supporter
Aug 25, 2017
9,321
14,977
Pekin, IL
Well I returned my TCL and got a Samsung NU8000. Hooked it up and no issues with the picture. HD is upscaled to near 4K. Its a awesome picture. I had alot of problems adjusting the colors and everything to how I thought it should be. I had no idea there were so many different adjustments that could be made. So I found a Youtube video of the Astros game and paused it at different spots and matched my screen with lines, dirt color etc then went to the US Open and verified it with how the court looks and held my phone with the court to the TV and matches. Color and contrast looks much better. I originaly been having way too much color and when I saw the lines of the Astros field mine were much darker and almost missing. So as for the Hisense and TCL if thats the best they can do upgrading I dont see how people are able stand watching them and say its a great picture when its 720p or below.
and then there's this Samsung NU8000 LED TV Calibration Settings
 

eddie willers

SatelliteGuys Pro
Sep 15, 2003
1,229
1,147
Braselton, Ga.
Well, I would use those settings to start and then check them against a calibration disc. They put up patterns and you use the supplied blue (and sometimes red) filters in front of your eyes to fine tune those suggestions. I have yet to see any TV (even those with an ISF setting) that are exactly set. I especially would use them for 'Contrast' and 'Brightness' and 'Color' and 'Hue". (Those settings interact with each other, so you usually have to go back and forth between them to get them close to 100% right)

You might say, "Well, I only had to move a few settings a few clicks, but the piece of mind I have knowing that, if they broadcast it properly, I will see what the director wants me to see is worth the $29.99 or so I pay.

And don't mess with it afterwards!
 

Tommyy2

SatelliteGuys Family
Aug 21, 2018
75
82
Texas
hmm i have a TCL 65 inch in my bedroom and i have no problems with it heck it rivals most sony's and samsungs. heres a link so you can see what i bought. and have you tried messing around with the settings on the set???

https://www.walmart.com/ip/TCL-65-Class-4K-2160P-HDR-Roku-Smart-LED-TV-65S401/598958531
hell with the HDR kicks in on a 4k blu ray the picture is amzing

Panel refresh of 60 HZ (forget about the other made up refresh rates) is not very good for any fast motion displayed. Their 6 series has a panel refresh of 120 HZ.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sxmfan2018

Tampa8

Supporting Founder - I'll stand up and say so
Pub Member / Supporter
Lifetime Supporter
Sep 8, 2003
18,040
7,550
Tampa/Eastern Ct
Well I returned my TCL and got a Samsung NU8000. Hooked it up and no issues with the picture. HD is upscaled to near 4K. Its a awesome picture. I had alot of problems adjusting the colors and everything to how I thought it should be. I had no idea there were so many different adjustments that could be made. So I found a Youtube video of the Astros game and paused it at different spots and matched my screen with lines, dirt color etc then went to the US Open and verified it with how the court looks and held my phone with the court to the TV and matches. Color and contrast looks much better. I originaly been having way too much color and when I saw the lines of the Astros field mine were much darker and almost missing. So as for the Hisense and TCL if thats the best they can do upgrading I dont see how people are able stand watching them and say its a great picture when its 720p or below.

There is a difference between both Sony and Samsung and most other makes when it comes to upscaling as I posted. Some may not see the difference and that's good, you will be happy spending less money. Those who can see the difference have to make a choice! The money you spent will be worth it for being happy with the picture.

Note that VIZIO is on the cusp. They have improved over the last couple of model years to compete with a very good picture. In fact strictly talking 4K they may be just as good. But the last time I looked they did still lag behind on upscaling and may not have some of the features of Sony and Samsung. They are priced lower however.
 

HipKat

SatelliteGuys Master
Pub Member / Supporter
Aug 25, 2017
9,321
14,977
Pekin, IL
Well, I would use those settings to start and then check them against a calibration disc. They put up patterns and you use the supplied blue (and sometimes red) filters in front of your eyes to fine tune those suggestions. I have yet to see any TV (even those with an ISF setting) that are exactly set. I especially would use them for 'Contrast' and 'Brightness' and 'Color' and 'Hue". (Those settings interact with each other, so you usually have to go back and forth between them to get them close to 100% right)

You might say, "Well, I only had to move a few settings a few clicks, but the piece of mind I have knowing that, if they broadcast it properly, I will see what the director wants me to see is worth the $29.99 or so I pay.

And don't mess with it afterwards!
I should have added that's a good starting point
 
Aug 26, 2018
7
3
46148
Don't do that...do it right.

Every film / TV show is adjusted and mixed to a STANDARD on calibrated monitors. Get a calibration disc (they're around twenty bucks at Amazon, etc.) and set your new TV to that standard using the video patterns provided. If you match those, you WILL be correct.

Now here's the hard part. After you have done that, do NOT touch those settings again! Some films may be washed out, somebody may be broadcasting incorrectly, but the instant you try to make that one channel/show look right, you have thrown yourself off the standard and everything else will be wrong.



I have noticed that today, Ive been tinkering to different channels and never seen to get it right. My plasma I felt like I got it to a point I never had to change it again. I guess I will get a calibration disc. Also as for using Rtings calibration I tried that and it was so dark I cant believe that was the settings they came up with.
 
Register Today to see less ads! It's Free!

navychop

Member of the Month - July 2014!
Pub Member / Supporter
Lifetime Supporter
Jul 20, 2005
52,482
17,490
Northern VA
IMG_0720.JPG



Sent from my iPhone using the SatelliteGuys app!
 
  • Like
Reactions: KaptainRandom

sxmfan2018

SatelliteGuys Guru
Aug 30, 2018
123
66
los angeles
Panel refresh of 60 HZ (forget about the other made up refresh rates) is not very good for any fast motion displayed. Their 6 series has a panel refresh of 120 HZ.
this t.v. does good as it has a 120 hz refresh rate on it it does take fast motion with no problems. though as far as a wireless streamer it sucks but then that could be the app to
 
Aug 26, 2018
7
3
46148
Ok thanks I found those on amazon im going order one. I did find settings on Consumer Reports as to whast the best setting on every tv. Mine were almost exactly the same except for a couple. I used CR settings except the backlight one took it from 25 to 40 because it was too dark and went channel to channel and pretty pleased with how channels look.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ncted

eddie willers

SatelliteGuys Pro
Sep 15, 2003
1,229
1,147
Braselton, Ga.
Ok thanks I found those on amazon im going order one. I did find settings on Consumer Reports as to whast the best setting on every tv. Mine were almost exactly the same except for a couple. I used CR settings except the backlight one took it from 25 to 40 because it was too dark and went channel to channel and pretty pleased with how channels look.
The Disney "WOW" disc is surprisingly good.

As to the darkness of the picture. Back when I first started installing Sat TV I had gone to an ISF seminar where I learned where we ALL had it wrong.

In CRT days almost everybody would see the names of the settings and think, "I want my TV to be very bright, so 'Brightness' goes to 100. Sharp? Heck yes I want it sharp...let's go 100%. Contrast?...of course 100%." Now you have a very crappy TV.

By far the worst offender was the 'Brightness' setting. If you crank it up, you lose contrast, the colors become washed out and you are seeing things in the shadows that you are not supposed to see! But that is also the setting that most people had the longest time getting comfortable with. After I set their TV, I'd tell them to 'live with it a few days'. After that, they would blanch if they ever went back to their old settings.

Now, like I said, there will be times that the TV (or broadcast) can't handle the signal and it will really get so dark you may have 'crushed' blacks. (So dark that no subtle detail is seen. The Game Of Thrones episode where the black dogs killed the bad guy wearing black in an unlit stable threw my OLED into a tailspin) But as I said before...live with it or the next time you change the channel, all is lost.

Now....daytime and nighttime settings will be different because room light, of course, makes a difference. My TV (and maybe yours) have settings 'memory'. I calibrated during the daytime under typical room light, goosed it a little bit, and saved it marked 'Day'. I then calibrated at night with almost no light in the room to the best match to the disc's patterns and set the memory as 'Night'. So it is very easy for me to get that extra backlight/brightness/contrast needed for daytime watching and the perfect setting for when the room is dark.

Whatever you do, take a pen and paper and notate where all your setting are for 'perfect'. Will save a lot of time when somebody decides they need to make your picture "better".
 

ncted

SatelliteGuys Master
Pub Member / Supporter
Jul 4, 2004
5,274
3,577
Durham, NC
Ok thanks I found those on amazon im going order one. I did find settings on Consumer Reports as to whast the best setting on every tv. Mine were almost exactly the same except for a couple. I used CR settings except the backlight one took it from 25 to 40 because it was too dark and went channel to channel and pretty pleased with how channels look.

Brightness totally depends on you specific room conditions. The rtings and CR settings are just a starting point. The calibration discs are a good way to "get it right."
 

eddie willers

SatelliteGuys Pro
Sep 15, 2003
1,229
1,147
Braselton, Ga.
Brightness totally depends on you specific room conditions.
Lets not get confused here. "Brightness" is not dependant on room conditions. It is crucial to set it right . A good rule of thumb if you don't have a disc, etc. is to play a 'letterboxed' movie. You want a black object in the picture section (a totally dark night sky, a black stovepipe hat etc.) to match the black of the letterbox borders. That is why I paid a premium for the OLED TV. If I play a letterboxed movie at night, it is impossible to tell where the picture ends and the letterbox begins. It looks like I bought a 2.35:1 sized TV.

It is the "Backlight" (a 'new' setting for LCD TVs, it didn't exist for CRTs) adjustment is where the room conditions really come into play. Just juicing the overall picture (let's face it, what good's a "perfect" picture if you can't see it with all the shades up and the gang is over watching the World Series?) is less damaging than upping the 'Brightness' so pump the Backlight up (and if you really have to, 'Contrast'/'Brightness', but if you have settings memories, do what I suggested. Set your 'perfect' in very low light and save it, then a pumped up version for bright room light.
 
  • Like
Reactions: ncted
Register Today to see less ads! It's Free!

Users who are viewing this thread

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Total: 0, Members: 0, Guests: 0)

Top