Dish Faces April 30 Deadline In TiVo Case

[Kheldar]

MultiChannel News article:

Dish Network has until April 30 to settle its years-long patent litigation with TiVo, or -- barring an unlikely rehearing of an appeals court's ruling -- the satellite operator will be forced to disable millions of customer DVRs.
...
On Thursday, U.S. District Court Judge David Folsom of the Eastern District of Texas granted Dish an extension until April 30 on a previous stay of his injunction ordering the satellite operator to shut off DVRs that infringe TiVo's "Time Warp" patent.

 

[navychop]

If you can't get a good business model, get a good lawyer.

 

[whatchel1]

Both

If you can't get a good business model, get a good lawyer.

Do both is best. Charlie believes in that.

 

[rocatman]

The report is a bit misleading because it fails to mention that Dish has submitted a proposal to modify its software to no longer be infringing on TIVO's patent and based on the wording of the last injunction, Judge Folsom is suppose to review this modification proposal. So Judge Folsom could extend this deadline to review this proposal or in fact review and approve this modification without Dish settling with TIVO.

 

[navychop]

Higher court in the offing?

 

[Kheldar]

Higher court in the offing?

According to the quoted article, it seems unlikely. DishNet has appealed to the full court (instead of the 3-judge panel that recently ruled), but the article states:

Dish's hopes now rest on its motion for an en banc rehearing of the appeals court decision, Moffett wrote -- a motion he calculated has less than a 3% chance of being granted based on historical averages.

My understanding is that, next above this court is the Supreme Court, which has already declined to hear this case earlier. I do give Charlie credit for creative ways to drag this case on, though, so don't count them out yet.

 

[rocatman]

According to the quoted article, it seems unlikely. DishNet has appealed to the full court (instead of the 3-judge panel that recently ruled), but the article states:


My understanding is that, next above this court is the Supreme Court, which has already declined to hear this case earlier. I do give Charlie credit for creative ways to drag this case on, though, so don't count them out yet.

When an article leaves out important information that I provide above then you really have to question if what they are saying is true. In additon, to what I posted above, the Appeals Court has stayed the injunction as well so both Judge Folsom and the Appeals Court would have to lift their stays for Dish to have to diable its DVRs without a settlement with TIVO.

 

[Claude Greiner]

If anyone actually thinks that Dish will shut down all their DVR's and comply with this court order is crazy.

 

[Jhon69]

It may make good sense to Charlie now, to take the money he would have to pay in fines and put it to better use and use it to help buy Tivo?.

 

[cjwct]

Didn't someone predict here that this would play out to the bitter end and if push came to shove, Dish would just buy Tivo?

 

[TheForce]

Didn't someone predict here that this would play out to the bitter end and if push came to shove, Dish would just buy Tivo?

I predicted that last year. But today, I would worry also about DirecTV buying TIVO.

 

[Kheldar]

The report is a bit misleading because it fails to mention that Dish has submitted a proposal to modify its software to no longer be infringing on TIVO's patent and based on the wording of the last injunction, Judge Folsom is suppose to review this modification proposal. So Judge Folsom could extend this deadline to review this proposal or in fact review and approve this modification without Dish settling with TIVO.

Here's a new article that addresses your point.

DISH Network: DVR Shutdown Danger Looms Ahead:

As Bernstein Research analyst Craig Moffett noted this morning, U.S. District Court Judge David Folsom yesterday extended a stay of the DVR injunction issued against the company in connection with the TiVo (TIVO) patent infringement case until April 30. The extension, he notes, was in response to a March 9 emergency motion for an expedited evaluation of the latest DISH software workaround of the TiVo patents. Moffett says the judge effectively declined to review the software, claiming he was simply too busy with other cases.

Moffett says DISH is “now negotiating with a gun to its head.” He says it would now appear to be impossible for the company to have a non-infringing workaround approved by April 30, Dish’s hopes rest on a motion for a rehearing of the Appeals Court decision which went against DISH.
...
If DISH fails to reach a settlement with TiVo by April 30, Moffett says, they would have two options. One, disable the offending boxes, which would not go over well with the company’s subscribers. Or two, it could continue to willfully infringe; in that scenario, there is a rish the judge could impost additional sanctions and/or disgorgement of profits.

 

[navychop]

Thank you, Kheldar. Is that a fat lady I hear warming up?

 

[mike123abc]

I wonder if customer phones will start ringing soon with offers of free DVR upgrades to VIP?

 

[Jhon69]

I wonder if customer phones will start ringing soon with offers of free DVR upgrades to VIP?

I will let you know as of today my 625 is purring like a kitten.

 

[Thomas22]

I wonder if customer phones will start ringing soon with offers of free DVR upgrades to VIP?

The ViP models use the same infringing software processes and would have to be disabled too.

 

[JohnL]

The ViP models use the same infringing software processes and would have to be disabled too.

Thomas,

Whether you believe that or not is immaterial. The current litigation does NOT include any of the Dish VIP DVR's. Even if TIVO believes this, new litigation would have to be started by TIVO with regard to Dish's VIP DVR's.

In the end Dish will do one of two things; 1) License TIVO's software, 2) Purchase TIVO outright.

Many companies are quietly in support of Echostar in this fight, why you ask. Simple if in the end TIVO forces Echostar into compliance more companies will be targeted by TIVO. Personally, I don't think you can patent an idea and not an actual product.

Echostar's original DVR Dishplayer Model 7100 and Replay were the first DVR's. TIVO came later and patented the idea of recording to a Hard Drive. TIVO is being very heavy handed, if their product is so superior, I have to ask why are they bleeding subscribers. TIVO's days as a separate entity are nearly done. If they can't find a suitor or another host of companies to partner with they are going to slowly die.

John

 

[Thomas22]

Whether you believe that or not is immaterial. The current litigation does NOT include any of the Dish VIP DVR's.

Yes it does. The injunction requires disablement of DVRs that are only colorably different from the named models. Ergen said in SEC filings that if they lose the appeal they would have to disable all their DVRs.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

Thomas, the ViP's are not included, as much as you would want to believe so its not the case.

The ViP's would require an entrely different trial.

 

[Slamminc11]

The ViP models use the same infringing software processes and would have to be disabled too.

WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG WRONG and WRONG! But hell of a try there sparky!