DVB-S2 8PSK Jerkiness?

[CFreak]

I am using Pansat 9000HD. It seems like ever DVB-S2 8PSk channel I tune to has some mild to moderate jerkiness. THe signal strength is good when this happens. It happens on both ku and C band. I haven't seen anyone discussion this so I decided to start this discussion. Is there anything that can be done such as getting a better LNB? Better satellite reciever? Or using a DVD-S2 computer card with a powerful video card?

 

[brentb636]

I suspect a bigger dish would help. I frequently see things like that on the DVB-S2 channels, too, and I attribute it to lost data. Depending upon the FEC ratio, it can be very hard to capture and correct the datastream with smaller dishes. I haven't done any research, so this is just a guess.

 

[Kb Cool]

I suspect a bigger dish would help. I frequently see things like that on the DVB-S2 channels, too, and I attribute it to lost data. Depending upon the FEC ratio, it can be very hard to capture and correct the datastream with smaller dishes. I haven't done any research, so this is just a guess.

I get that also on my CS 8000 when viewing the High bit rate S2 channels. It could be signal quality. But, i'm leaning more toward "lack of" processing power of the box. I don't know?

 

[CFreak]

I am using a soild 10ft dish and the singal quality is in the 80's to 90's which is good. Also I forgot to mention it seem the channels have a symbol rate of 30000 and are either 9/10 or 5/6 FEC HD channels.

 

[brentb636]

9/10 FEC can be tough to acquire and maybe you could touch up your aim. I can't explain why the 5/6 FEC channels would be a problem. There's always the possibility , already mentioned , of cpu power . Sometimes , though, there are problems with the uplink, that we can't control at all.

 

[CFreak]

9/10 FEC can be tough to acquire and maybe you could touch up your aim. I can't explain why the 5/6 FEC channels would be a problem. There's always the possibility , already mentioned , of cpu power . Sometimes , though, there are problems with the uplink, that we can't control at all.

My aim is good. The signal is more than strong enough. I believe its the lack of cpu processing power on the pansat 9000HD. I wonder if this could be upgraded? The jerkiness is mild but can be a little annoying at times.

 

[brentb636]

I doubt that upgrading the cpu, or changing the clock rate is an option. Do you know anyone locally with a Coolsat 8000? Trying one out on the same feeds might be informative. I use one of my CS8000's behind my Sathawk , for a similar reason, hi bitrate feed problems.

 

[CFreak]

I doubt that upgrading the cpu, or changing the clock rate is an option. Do you know anyone locally with a Coolsat 8000? Trying one out on the same feeds might be informative. I use one of my CS8000's behind my Sathawk , for a similar reason, hi bitrate feed problems.

Does the Sathawk help?

 

[brentb636]

No, the Sathawk sometimes gives me glitches, etc on Hi bit feeds, but the CS8000 plays them smoothly. That's my major complaint , at the moment, with the Sathawk, but I'm glad I got it. The hi bit feeds are still viewable, but with occasional glitches. If they were'nt so regular , it wouldn't be obvious. The Sathawk , with it's fast blindscan, is a very useable receiver.

 

[CFreak]

Ok, I understand what you mean about using the CS8000 as a back up to you sathawk. Another poster said that their CS8000 was having this problem with high bit rate DVB-S2 feeds with high fec's. But you report they play smooth on your CS8000 It could be with my setup. Or I may look into getting a CS8000.

 

[brentb636]

If you can find a cheap cs8000, you could at least compare the results with each receiver, and have some more evidence.

 

[FaT Air]

My 9200 does this occasionally also. Can't tell what the FEC is, usually SR's above 10000 will it do it. SR of 30000 will almost always do it. Sometimes just a bit, other times very annoying. Sometimes I also get audio out of sync with the video. But that can usually be cured by cycling the power. I also think it is processor power, heck they're only running around 300Mhz. Just like watching some videos on my old Pentium 2 equipped laptop running at 333Mhz.

 

[CFreak]

My 9200 does this occasionally also. Can't tell what the FEC is, usually SR's above 10000 will it do it. SR of 30000 will almost always do it. Sometimes just a bit, other times very annoying. Sometimes I also get audio out of sync with the video. But that can usually be cured by cycling the power. I also think it is processor power, heck they're only running around 300Mhz. Just like watching some videos on my old Pentium 2 equipped laptop running at 333Mhz.

Do you think these PansatHD boxs could be upgraded to a faster cpu or more powerful video processor?

 

[gdavisloop]

THIS IS A KNOWN ISSUE of the Pansat 9200HD receiver, so I wouldn't be surprised if you have the same problem with the 9000HD. If by "jerkiness," you mean: the picture doesn't update 30 times a second (or 29.94 or 59.88 or whatever), but rather it seems that frames repeat. I call this "stuttering" because I think it describes the problem more precisely.This was really bad on NBC/E for months, but just this week, NBC/E is much better. (I still see problems while they're showing graphics (moving stills), and for a few seconds after they disolve from graphics back to moving video). I didn't see any stuttering on Coachella a few months ago (the only -S2 "wildfeed" I've watched), but I see it regularly on high-bitrate networks (NBC & ABC).Signal quality doesn't seem to affect the problem much. The problem seems to be: the Pansat can't process the information fast enough to update the frame.The solution, as you suggested, is "better receiver." But which one? None of the -S2 receivers on the market work 100%. If they're missing the one feature you need (eg, analog stereo output on AZbox), then they work 0% for you!I will mention that I've been testing the Dreambox DM800 and DM500HD for the last few months. They are a mixed bag. They don't have any of the output problems of the AZbox, and the video is usually smoother than the Pansat. BUT, the video is not perfect - when NBC was stuttering, it was just much less stuttering on the Dreambox. And overall, the picture isn't as 'snappy' as the Pansat (I'm referring to the much derided analog video output - HDMI could be fine). And the audio often strikes me as just a frame or two out-of-sync. Needs more study. On the bright side, the Dreamboxes lock onto the -S2 signals quickly and reliably the first time... that is, if you can even figure out how to change the channel (an in-joke for Dreambox owners).--Gary

 

[1captain]

I also use a Pan-9000, and have for many years. mine here I bought it new and it has only seen Panerax firm ware not like some of these receivers that folks get off fea-bay. now about the stuttering issue, have not seen that happen with mine in years, but have seen it before when I had a dish with a lnbf's on it, then would switch to another dish with stable lnbs on a ortho and the stuttering went away. the stuttering issue is a signal an noise problem comming from you're dish. you may see fine signals but what is the cnr factor? I got a friend that also has a Pan-9000 he complained about the stuttering on the RTV mux on AMC-3, so he brought his receiver here an we hook it up to 1 of my dishes, all channels played fine and steady and locked quick and fast verse waiting a second or 2 for the picture to pop in like on his dish.

now I have ran several different S2 receivers, and got to hand it to the Pan-9000 (that is why I still use it) it has the best tunner for a weak feeds that you will ever use. I have lock and played steady video, wile the AZ, Coolie, an Diamond would not, the only receiver that I have use that beats the Pan-9000 tuner or runs real close to it, is a Vantage.

 

[CFreak]

THIS IS A KNOWN ISSUE of the Pansat 9200HD receiver, so I wouldn't be surprised if you have the same problem with the 9000HD. If by "jerkiness," you mean: the picture doesn't update 30 times a second (or 29.94 or 59.88 or whatever), but rather it seems that frames repeat. I call this "stuttering" because I think it describes the problem more precisely.This was really bad on NBC/E for months, but just this week, NBC/E is much better. (I still see problems while they're showing graphics (moving stills), and for a few seconds after they disolve from graphics back to moving video). I didn't see any stuttering on Coachella a few months ago (the only -S2 "wildfeed" I've watched), but I see it regularly on high-bitrate networks (NBC & ABC).Signal quality doesn't seem to affect the problem much. The problem seems to be: the Pansat can't process the information fast enough to update the frame.The solution, as you suggested, is "better receiver." But which one? None of the -S2 receivers on the market work 100%. If they're missing the one feature you need (eg, analog stereo output on AZbox), then they work 0% for you!I will mention that I've been testing the Dreambox DM800 and DM500HD for the last few months. They are a mixed bag. They don't have any of the output problems of the AZbox, and the video is usually smoother than the Pansat. BUT, the video is not perfect - when NBC was stuttering, it was just much less stuttering on the Dreambox. And overall, the picture isn't as 'snappy' as the Pansat (I'm referring to the much derided analog video output - HDMI could be fine). And the audio often strikes me as just a frame or two out-of-sync. Needs more study. On the bright side, the Dreamboxes lock onto the -S2 signals quickly and reliably the first time... that is, if you can even figure out how to change the channel (an in-joke for Dreambox owners).--Gary

What you describe with your pansat is the same problem I have. I was wondering if a DVB-S2 computer card with a beefy video card would perform better than an STB HD reciever?

 

[CFreak]

1caption, What kind of lnb do you use? I am using an BSC C/ku lnbf. I have chaparral feed that I don't use with 35k noise lnb. Would using that help? The reason I don't use it is that I have to manually change the polar rotor on it. I am not sure what an ortho feed looks like. I don't think I have that.

 

[FaT Air]

I think it's a Cost vs. features and performance thing. Each different STB has it's own quirks, as determined by the STB designers and engineers(software & hardware). If I absolutely couldn't stand any video stuttering, I'd be looking at purchasing a commercial receiver. But I'd have to use the 9200 to blind scan. Quirks, the reason many have a few different brands of STB's.

 

[hd fan]

I have seen the same issue with the S2 Azteca HD high SR above 29000 but , low FEC 2/3 only, on 113W in my coolsat 8100/6 ft/ c/ku gospell set up. you acctually hardly ever noticed it but it is there sometimes. I have a good lock on it now that is properly aimed but the birdog does not lock it so I can not read a C/N ratio level just see it on its SA.

Stuttering is also an issue that I see with the HDTV OTA signals fed through the TV tuner so it could also be related to your particular TV video processing capabilities, not necesarilly to your satellite set up.

 

[1captain]

1caption, What kind of lnb do you use? I am using an BSC C/ku lnbf. I have chaparral feed that I don't use with 35k noise lnb. Would using that help? The reason I don't use it is that I have to manually change the polar rotor on it. I am not sure what an ortho feed looks like. I don't think I have that.

as far as lnb's I use a few different models Cal Amp Extended Professionals, Galat, Japan Radio, and Norsat, like the cal amps the best, even though a pair of my Norsats are PLL. as far as a noise level (or Kelvin) it does not matter much, what people should be more concerned about is stability of a lnb that is used, an you're 35K old lnb I would say that it may be more stable than the BSC that you are using now. I use no servo motors here on my feeds all ortho's, due to that they will deliver the best signal of any kind of feed out their today. now what a ortho is, it is a feed with seperate lnb's for each polarity an band that is used for.
here is a picture of one of my ortho set ups.