E* advertising

[gadgtfreek]

Awhile back I asked about E*'s advertising or lack their of. I understand why some companies do not, but with D*'s recent claims about Fall HD, the uninformed customer is going to look in their direction. It seems that E* might want to start sharing some plans more openly to compete a little more.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

DirecTV has been advertising their new HD channels for 2 years now yet have to deliver.

Dish has outpaced DirecTV for the last 5 quarters. That tells me that DirecTV's advertisments are not working as well as they should be.

I feel that it is better to advertise what you have then what is coming, to tell people for 2 years that HD is coming is like telling us that wet paint on a wall will dry after awhile.

If I were DirecTV I would be pushing their sports packages.

 

[gadgtfreek]

Yeah, I did not think about the fact that E* has been adding more subs than D* lately. It's strange, most consumers are uninformed, but you are right in saying E* current plan is working.

I just wonder if it will last. If I am a new HDTV owner and I dont know anything about the subject, these D* ads and announcements are looking pretty good to me.

I also agree it is better to advertise what you have, but it wouldn't be bad to also advertise what you ARE working on, not just claims as D* does.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

Personally I got to admit I don't like Dish's advertising (in fact I have not liked most of it over the years) but it DOES appear to be working, so I guess who am I to say.

 

[gadgtfreek]

Yeah. I guess when I hear something that says HistHD/ChillerHD/WeathHD is coming and D* has an agreement, Id like to see E* talk about whether they were or were not working on something with these particular channels.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

I met with all of them, and yes they are all in talks with Dish. I do know that Chiller HD will appear on DirecTV first due to an agreement with DirecTV. But History HD and Weather HD could be made available to both at the same time.

 

[DishSubLA]

Awhile back I asked about E*'s advertising or lack their of. I understand why some companies do not, but with D*'s recent claims about Fall HD, the uninformed customer is going to look in their direction. It seems that E* might want to start sharing some plans more openly to compete a little more.

Direct TV is a much larger company with tons of $$$ to blow on tons of advertising that still gets them fewer subs than Dish. Dish is still a relatively small company, and they really don't have the $$$ for the huge advertising budget that Direct has. Ergen knows that at some point (and he has stated so publically), he is gonna have to sell, or buy or bring in a really big company to do something to take Dish to the next level if he hopes to keep competitive for the future, for it will require a lot more money than Dish or Echostar have now.

 

[gadgtfreek]

I met with all of them, and yes they are all in talks with Dish. I do know that Chiller HD will appear on DirecTV first due to an agreement with DirecTV. But History HD and Weather HD could be made available to both at the same time.

Thanks for the update. I guess tracking the websites is the best way to get E* scoop.

Is the lack of MLBEI because they dont have the money or did not agree with the shakedown. I personally love football but do not buy the NFL or College plans. There is usually enough on tv for me every week and I do not agree with the either the expense or the sports pay per view route we are heading. I love boxing but did not feel that $55 was justified for the fight this weekend, especially when I can watch it later for free.

 

[Slamminc11]

Direct TV is a much larger company with tons of $$$ to blow on tons of advertising that still gets them fewer subs than Dish. Dish is still a relatively small company, and they really don't have the $$$ for the huge advertising budget that Direct has. Ergen knows that at some point (and he has stated so publically), he is gonna have to sell, or buy or bring in a really big company to do something to take Dish to the next level if he hopes to keep competitive for the future, for it will require a lot more money than Dish or Echostar have now.

13.? million customers (we should know the new sub number on Thursday), 21,000+ employees, mulit-billion dollars is a small company? Interesting!
I believe it is more they chose not to spend the don't have the money to spend. Take a look at the profitablity of both companies over the last five years.

 

[gadgtfreek]

Yeah, I looked at 4th QTR 2006 on both.

D*-16mil subs, 4.?bil revenue, 350mil net
E*-13mil subs, 2.5bil revenue, 150mil net

These are not exact, but close to what I remember.

 

[FitzAusTex]

I dont know how people would even be aware of E*'s existence if examined from a TV advertising perspective. I see TV ads daily from D* I see nothing at all from E* I guess going to Radio Shack, Sears, and those Thursday pizza/satellite junk mail fliers keeps E* in new subs. (I know they have other methods of obtaining subs, but focusing my response on TV ads).

I know TV advertising is expensive, but it works, or no company would advertise on TV at all. Would love to see a basic slate of ads on TV from E* simply stating their current HD offerings. Even better would be a steady stream (even if small stream) of ads comparing E*'s 30+ HD channels to D*'s 9.5 HD channels (NATGHD is only part-time on D*). E* could hype up Voom's educational value to parents (no commercials, many family friendly Voom channels).

I'd hate to see 'DIRECTV' become the vernacular for 'satellite TV', much in the same way that 'Jacuzzi' became the vernacular for 'hot tub'.

 

[gadgtfreek]

Yeah, it amazes me that E* is only 3mil behind with no advertising. I guess many who see a D* ad do like I do and compare both and see that many times E* has a better price. Plus the main reason I signed with E* the first time long ago was NO contract required. I do not like contracts for services so Im sure that helps em. I guess their current advertising strategy (name on vans and dishes) works ok

 

[Hall]

D*-16mil subs, 4.?bil revenue, 350mil net
E*-13mil subs, 2.5bil revenue, 150mil net

D* gets ~$281/yr per customer whereas ~$192/yr per customer that E* gets ?? Seems D* does do things more efficiently..... Actually, those numbers don't make sense on a per-customer basis. In E*'s case, $192/yr only works out to $16/mo.

Either way, E* isn't a small company. They just choose to spend their money (or save it) differently than D*.

 

[Hall]

I dont know how people would even be aware of E*'s existence if examined from a TV advertising perspective. I see TV ads daily from D* I see nothing at all from E* I guess going to Radio Shack, Sears, and those Thursday pizza/satellite junk mail fliers keeps E* in new subs.

I don't think I've ever seen an ad from E* on the major network (ABC, CBS, etc) channels, only on the national network channels like Discovery, HGTV, etc and even then, I suspect they're inserted only on satellite by E*. When I had cable, I'm positive I never saw an E* ad.

With D* though, they do prime-time programming (big $$$), sponsor sporting events, and even sponsor prime-time shows like HOUSE ("House, brought to you by DirecTV...").

 

[BigTimMN]

Those numbers I beleive were 4th quarter 2006 results.. so if I understand that correctly... using some of your math...

Dish 192/qtr = $64/month
Direct 281/qtr= 127/month, but that is inflated by the Sunday Ticket that would be increasing revenue during that quarter...

 

[gadgtfreek]

D* gets ~$281/yr per customer whereas ~$192/yr per customer that E* gets ?? Seems D* does do things more efficiently..... Actually, those numbers don't make sense on a per-customer basis. In E*'s case, $192/yr only works out to $16/mo.

Either way, E* isn't a small company. They just choose to spend their money (or save it) differently than D*.

Yeah, it also stood out to me their there is a gap between number of subscribers and actual revenue.

Here's the exacts:

Dish-$2.58bil tot rev-$153mil net-
for 2006-$9.82bil to rev-$608mil net
Added 350,000 subs in 4th qtr, added 1.065mil for 2006 to total of 13.105mil

Directv-$4.18bil tot rev-$356mil net
for 2006-$14.75bil-$1.4bil net
Added 275000 subs in 4th qtr, added 820000 subs for year to total 15.953mil

Funny that E* adds more subs. Also, E*'s tot rev for 2005 was over 1 billion so they were close to D* in 2005 for tot rev, must have spent some money in 2006.

 

[Hall]

Those numbers I beleive were 4th quarter 2006 results.. so if I understand that correctly... using some of your math...

D'oh !! Yeah, multiply those $$$ by (4) and it looks much better !

Regarding Sunday Ticket, don't D* customers have to pay for that in one lump payment ?? I thought they did. What does D*'s 1st, 2nd, and 3rd quarter numbers look like ??

 

[gadgtfreek]

D'oh !! Yeah, multiply those $$$ by (4) and it looks much better !

Regarding Sunday Ticket, don't D* customers have to pay for that in one lump payment ?? I thought they did. What does D*'s 1st, 2nd, and 3rd quarter numbers look like ??

If you look above and take out 4th qtr, youll see 10.57bil for 3 qtrs which comes to $3.52bil per qtr for the first 3. Ill be curious to see what the 1st qtr earnings look like between the two with all of D* advertising.

 

[Tampa8]

Scott hit it on the head. Other than the Pig commercials aimed at Cable, I have never really liked Dish commercials, and now there are few if any of them around. Yet, Dish is doing ok in getting new subscribers. It is very possible they have studied it and found the cost to gain ratio at this time is not worth advertising - meaning the cost of advertising will not bring in enough new business that they are not already getting.

A very similiar discussion has taken place at the Mazda Miata forums. Advertising for the MX-5 (Miata) is almost non existant on TV. Yet, they are outselling the Solstice in the U.S. So they too must have determined the cost of advertising will not significantly increase sales.