EV News

[Ronnie-]

Chevy and Cadillac scale back EV plans as GM shifts to gas

Chevrolet is the second most popular EV brand in the US behind Tesla, while Cadillac carved out a market in...

electrek.co

GM just setting themselves up to fall further behind foreign auto groups

And the problem isn't the vehicles. They have some excellent models. Ford does (or did) too.

It's like pulling teeth to get a salesman to sell you one. They will let customers walk away after an ice vehicle sales pitch when they came in specifically shopping for an EV in a lot of cases.

It took me two dealerships to get my Silverado. And the salesman I finally got to work the deal did so via another dealership he has a relationship with as his own isn't set up to sell them. We buy a lot of company vehicles from him so he was ready to help.

 

[EatMyVolts]

And the problem isn't the vehicles. They have some excellent models. Ford does (or did) too.

It's like pulling teeth to get a salesman to sell you one. They will let customers walk away after an ice vehicle sales pitch when they came in specifically shopping for an EV in a lot of cases.

It took me two dealerships to get my Silverado. And the salesman I finally got to work the deal did so via another dealership he has a relationship with as his own isn't set up to sell them. We buy a lot of company vehicles from him so he was ready to help.

One big problem dealers have with EVs is that the service department doesn't make much off of them. There are four profit centers in most dealerships: new sales, used sales, parts and service, and F&I. Parts and services and finance and insurance are big money makers and EVs take away one of them.

 

[telstar_1]

Chevy and Cadillac scale back EV plans as GM shifts to gas

Chevrolet is the second most popular EV brand in the US behind Tesla, while Cadillac carved out a market in...

electrek.co

GM just setting themselves up to fall further behind foreign auto groups

Whenever I see something start out with "overview" and "key takeaways" it registers to me as AI and I immediately reject it

 

[meStevo]

Whenever I see something start out with "overview" and "key takeaways" it registers to me as AI and I immediately reject it

Huh? Think you meant to quote my post.

You'd prefer just a video you'd have to watch to get any of that information rather than a summary that lets you know if the content might be worth your time?

 

[osu1991]

Whenever I see something start out with "overview" and "key takeaways" it registers to me as AI and I immediately reject it

And where did you see those words in the article.

 

[Jimbo]

I would like to point out that cold weather impacts ICE vehicles efficiency as well (15-20% by most internet sources ive seen). Its just that most drivers are used to it, and likely dont give it a second thought as it really isnt all that damning on your day to day driving (much like an EV).

One perk of an EV, I can have my vehicle already warmed up using power from the grid rather than the batteries themselves. So you dont get that initial hit to get things comfortable versus idling to warmup with a combustion engine, which definitely uses the fuel on board with no way around that.

Really ?
My Truck is in the Garage, therefore never as cold as outside ... therefore Not wasting gas warming up.

What happens in your EV in the real cold temps when most of your power needs to go for Heat, doesn't that draw a lot from your batteries, thus making your distance shrink ?

I remember last year those EV's in Chicago didn't handle the Cold very well.
My truck handles the Cold fine.

 

[Foxbat]

When I had my Ford Escape, I counted on getting lower MPG due to a number of factors, mostly the increased rolling resistance caused by snow on the road, lower tire pressures due to lower air temperatures, higher drag due to increased air density and frozen precipitation on the car's body, and increased electrical power required by lighting and accessories like wipers. Since ICE are not as efficient as an EV, the energy they normally waste means these impacts are not as significant as when you drive an EV.

The Volvo PHEV I drive now will drop to its EPA range in the Winter (35 Miles Electric range) while I am seeing 50 miles of EV range in the summertime. I don't have a heat pump, but a resistive heater which uses a Watt of electricity to produce one watt of heat energy. It's better to heat the seats and steering wheel (still resistive, but targeting the contact points with less power). ICE is so bad at converting gasoline into forward motion that all that heat can be used to heat up the cabin. That's great when it's cold, but wasted when it's hot out.

Same thing with braking, ICE just heats up the air by rubbing friction material against steel disks (or drums). EV captures the kinetic energy and puts most of it back into the battery.

 

[navychop]

What happens in your EV in the real cold temps when most of your power needs to go for Heat, doesn't that draw a lot from your batteries,

Norway. Very happily converting to EVs.

Teslas, and others, use heat pumps. No way heating is taking "most of your power."

 

[Jimbo]

Norway. Very happily converting to EVs.

Teslas, and others, use heat pumps. No way heating is taking "most of your power."

Ok ... just asked ...

Maybe that was early generations of EV's ...

 

[Jimbo]

When I had my Ford Escape, I counted on getting lower MPG due to a number of factors, mostly the increased rolling resistance caused by snow on the road, lower tire pressures due to lower air temperatures, higher drag due to increased air density and frozen precipitation on the car's body, and increased electrical power required by lighting and accessories like wipers. Since ICE are not as efficient as an EV, the energy they normally waste means these impacts are not as significant as when you drive an EV.

The Volvo PHEV I drive now will drop to its EPA range in the Winter (35 Miles Electric range) while I am seeing 50 miles of EV range in the summertime. I don't have a heat pump, but a resistive heater which uses a Watt of electricity to produce one watt of heat energy. It's better to heat the seats and steering wheel (still resistive, but targeting the contact points with less power). ICE is so bad at converting gasoline into forward motion that all that heat can be used to heat up the cabin. That's great when it's cold, but wasted when it's hot out.

Same thing with braking, ICE just heats up the air by rubbing friction material against steel disks (or drums). EV captures the kinetic energy and puts most of it back into the battery.

Wait a minute ....
I dis agree with your 1st paragraph. In a Gas vehicle running the Wipers is Not making less Miles Per Gallon (or per Volt in your case) running things on electric isn't effecting the MPG

2nd paragraph ...
You just pointed out that you lose travel distance in the Winter (Cold) 35 -50 ...

3rd Paragraph
You mentioned that Ice rubs your disks to stop , which it does ....
However, are you trying to say that the EV doesn't rub its disc together to stop ?
Yes it does, your comparing 2 different things, yes the EV kinetic energy, but that kinetic energy is doing what, its making the brakes work.

Both vehicles stop using Brake system, but when you break it down, its still using pads and Drum or rotors to Stop.
They just do it a different way.

 

[meStevo]

Wait a minute ....
I dis agree with your 1st paragraph. In a Gas vehicle running the Wipers is Not making less Miles Per Gallon (or per Volt in your case) running things on electric isn't effecting the MPG

It does, actually - everything has a cost, some things more than others. I'd argue that cost is just more tangible in an EV. In an ICE vehicle the alternator that powers wipers, headlights and other accessories is belt-driven off the engine - so drawing more electrical load does add a real (if modest) parasitic drag on the engine and does cost some fuel economy. As Foxbat said, this effect is proportionally smaller in an ICE vehicle in part because they waste so much energy operating the engine.

3rd Paragraph
You mentioned that Ice rubs your disks to stop , which it does ....
However, are you trying to say that the EV doesn't rub its disc together to stop ?
Yes it does, your comparing 2 different things, yes the EV kinetic energy, but that kinetic energy is doing what, its making the brakes work.

Both vehicles stop using Brake system, but when you break it down, its still using pads and Drum or rotors to Stop.
They just do it a different way.

You're not understanding the mechanisms here - When an EV brakes under normal conditions the electric motor is run in reverse as a generator - em resistance from the motor itself slows the car and pushes that energy back into the battery. The friction brake pads / rotors are largely uninvolved in this process; they mostly kick in for hard stops, low-speed stops (below the point regen is effective), or emergency braking. This is why many EV owners go many years (if ever) without ever needing service on anything related to braking.

 

[Ronnie-]

Both vehicles stop using Brake system, but when you break it down, its still using pads and Drum or rotors to Stop.
They just do it a different way.

Actually, EVs stop the majority of the time using regenerative braking via the electric motors. You can also use the friction brakes, but id say 80-90% of the time I do not, and most EV drivers would be the same.

This is one reason your regular brakes last so much longer on an EV.

 

[Jimbo]

Actually, EVs stop the majority of the time using regenerative braking via the electric motors. You can also use the friction brakes, but id say 80-90% of the time I do not, and most EV drivers would be the same.

This is one reason your regular brakes last so much longer on an EV.

Well, thats pretty damn scary ...

 

[Ronnie-]

Well, thats pretty damn scary ...

Actually, it works great. One peddle driving is one of the biggest benefits of an EV IMO.

 

[Ronnie-]

Well, thats pretty damn scary ...

Out of curiosity, what is scary about it?

 

[Jimbo]

Out of curiosity, what is scary about it?

Not Knowing your brakes are going to function.
With an Ice Car I Know when I use the brakes, they work .... you sound like they don't use them.

Then again when I had my 4 speed, i'd often times use the engine to slow as well, but never intentionally not use the brake.

Curious, do the EV's and Teslas have a Manual option when you buy them ?

 

[navychop]

It's called a brake pedal. Smash it hard and you're on friction brakes.

Regenerative braking, backed by friction braking, works well.

 

[Ronnie-]

Not Knowing your brakes are going to function.
With an Ice Car I Know when I use the brakes, they work .... you sound like they don't use them.

Then again when I had my 4 speed, i'd often times use the engine to slow as well, but never intentionally not use the brake.

Curious, do the EV's and Teslas have a Manual option when you buy them ?

Using one peddle driving does not mean there isnt a manual brake pedal in the vehicle (just like your truck). There is.

You just dont normally need to use it. Take pressure off the accelerator and you slow down. Just via the electric motors instead of the hydraulic braking system. You know its working as easily as you do in your truck. The vehicle slows. Same as it does in yours. The brake lights even come on.

If you want to drive it like a normal vehicle, at least in the GM models, you can even turn one pedal off, and use the accelerator and manual brakes just like you do in yours. Although I am not sure why one would given the option. It just adds more wear and tear on a system that doesnt necessarily need it.

 

[Ronnie-]

Then again when I had my 4 speed, i'd often times use the engine to slow as well, but never intentionally not use the brake.

I would not really equate it to engine braking like you are accustomed to.

Honestly, from the passenger seat you cant tell the driver isnt using the brake pedal.

For the driver it is a much smoother experience.

 

[Scott Greczkowski]

GM has problems with their EV's I hope since they are not announcing new models that they are working on making their EV's more solid and figure out the bugs many people (myself included) have had with their EV's.