Genpix Skywalker 1 (3 Viewers)

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brentb636

SatelliteGuys Pro
Jun 24, 2006
4,278
6
5 miles N of Saugatuck, Mi
Well,
Dish Network stuff that is ITC , for one reason or another, all the regular DVB-S channels ( SD. HD, 4:2:0, 4:2:2 ) and Zero Key DCII stuff ( mostly on C-band, since that's where the best DCII stuff exists ) . There is no blindscan, so you have to be looking at existing tp's, but sometimes, they open up, and something worthwhile is available.
:)
 

wildbill47

SatelliteGuys Pro
Jan 3, 2008
290
18
northern California
Genpix

Do you get Music choice G14 as an example on genpix ? i have a DSR-4200 and open 5 music choice bet none of the rest as though they are encrypted ? :confused:

I just received this email and still do not understand totally what he is trying to say ? That is why need to get feedback directly from skywalker owners.

////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

so far, the only software which supports DCII (with genpix devices) is TSReader.
And it's running under windows.

TSReader LITE (free version) can tune and analyze the stream, but playback time is limited to 1 minute or so.
You need a Full version (commercial version) to be able to do unlimited (and scheduled) playback and record.

But keep in mind: there are very few unencrypted channels which are sent via DCII.
You can watch only those channels which are encrypted with so called zero-key.
You may see many free DCII channels in the list (lyngsat, for instance), but it does NOT mean yet that you may watch them without stb DCII receiver.
Every stb DCII receiver has default encryption key built-in, and it uses it to decrypt free channels, you don't need to have a subscription or receiver activation for that.
But you still need a receiver to do that, cause decryption mechanism is unknown (non-public), and you can not decrypt these channels on a PC.
On a PC, you can watch only those channel which use zero-key for encryption (that is, no encryption).

thus, you may need to do some additional research before investing into that.

The easiest/cheapest way:
buy SkyWalker-1 (or -2) and test it for few weeks (to find the amount of channels you actually can watch).
If you decide that this tool is not for you, you may return SkyWalker for a full refund (except shipping cost) within a month.
Please don't put scratches or scuffs on SkyWalker though :)

Regards,
Genpix
 

wildbill47

SatelliteGuys Pro
Jan 3, 2008
290
18
northern California
I have 2 "C" band dishes and the ones that have "KU" only are missing out. The channels that Dish etc are selling such as NASA, CSPAN etc are free on the "C" band and a few still analog. There is testing using smaller dishes for "C" band and one of my dishes is a 6' and works. The new LNB/ feed horns are making it happen. :D

If you have C-band , it might be worth it. I only rarely catch anything on DCII on ku band . Playing with the circular turbo stuff is a little more likely to be useful.
:)
 

B.J.

SatelliteGuys Pro
Oct 15, 2008
2,029
1
Western Maine
Do you get Music choice G14 as an example on genpix ? i have a DSR-4200 and open 5 music choice bet none of the rest as though they are encrypted ? :confused:
I'm not sure what you're saying here re your 4200 (I was waiting to hear your response relative to my questions in the other thread). Are you saying you're getting only some of the music choice channels?
Re the G14 music channels with the Genpix, YES, it plays them. There are several other music channels it will play too, on other sats.

I just received this email and still do not understand totally what he is trying to say ? That is why need to get feedback directly from skywalker owners.

////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

so far, the only software which supports DCII (with genpix devices) is TSReader.
And it's running under windows.
TSREADER is what I'm using to receive the DCII channels. It streams them to VLC, which is a free program running on the same computer. I think there are versions of VLC for other OSs, but TSREADER only runs on Windows. So I think he's saying that you need a windows computer to play DCII with the Genpix. I didn't know that only TSREADER could understand the DCII format, but that makes sense. TSREADER costs $99, but it is well worth the investment.

TSReader LITE (free version) can tune and analyze the stream, but playback time is limited to 1 minute or so.
You need a Full version (commercial version) to be able to do unlimited (and scheduled) playback and record.

But keep in mind: there are very few unencrypted channels which are sent via DCII.
There is a free version of TSREADER that you can use to get an idea of what it can do, but it is rather limited. He is right that most DCII channels are encrypted, however there are quite a few that aren't. Particularly recently. Just like DVB channels, the free DCII channels come and go.

You can watch only those channels which are encrypted with so called zero-key.
You may see many free DCII channels in the list (lyngsat, for instance), but it does NOT mean yet that you may watch them without stb DCII receiver.
Every stb DCII receiver has default encryption key built-in, and it uses it to decrypt free channels, you don't need to have a subscription or receiver activation for that.
But you still need a receiver to do that, cause decryption mechanism is unknown (non-public), and you can not decrypt these channels on a PC.
On a PC, you can watch only those channel which use zero-key for encryption (that is, no encryption).

thus, you may need to do some additional research before investing into that.
THis is true. The "FREE" DCII channels can be in 3 different modes, one mode is only for people that are subscribed to a service, I'm not sure what this mode is called. The most common mode is FP, whichas he describes above, is a fixed key known by all GI/MOT receivers. The Genpix can't do FP. Most of the "free" music channels, and some of the free video channels are ZK. however. ZK is basically not encrypted at all, so any DCII receiver can play it. The Genpix can play any channel that is ZK, and can actually play many channels that the 4DTV and/or the 4200V cannot play, since it can do 29270-combo mode. There aren't as many ZK channels as there are FP channels, however when you do find FREE DCII channels, they are usually more valuable cable type channels, rather than 3rd tier channels most people wouldn't watch, which is often the case with DVB FTA.

One BIG advantage of the Genpix/TSREADER combination, is that it can play and record HD DCII channels. My 4200 can play SD channels (and I can record on my TIVO), but it can't play or record the HD channels. The 4DTV needs an HD module to do HD. This Genpix capability has also come in handy recently. Recorded some nice HD movies in DCII mode recently.

Even though the Genpix doesn't do FP, and doesn't do DVB-S2, it (and TSREADER) is a receiver I wouldn't be without. I love it. Besides the DCII and DVB, it also does the Dishnet turbo fec modes, and that has also come in very handy at times. The Genpix also does the DirecTV DSS mode. There isn't much FTA video on DSS, but the audio is all FTA. Ie lots more music channels to choose from. The Genpix is very powerful.
 
Last edited:

B.J.

SatelliteGuys Pro
Oct 15, 2008
2,029
1
Western Maine
What do you mean with zerokey?
This is answered in the other reply, but to repeat;
DCII channels can be encrypted for subscription, or they can be FP, which is fixed process or fixed key, ie it's encrypted with a semi-public key that all GI/Motorola DCII receiver are at least capable of receiving although some need to have been authorized. The ZK or zero-key is not encrypted, ie basically the same as FTA.

The Genpix will play ZK channels. To play FP channels, you pretty much need a GI/MOT receiver.

Most music channels that are "free" are ZK, so most any DCII receiver will play them. Video channels that are "free" can be either FP or ZK, so some can be played by non-GI/MOT receivers like the Genpix, but more often than not, the free video is typically FP, meaning it needs a GI/MOT receiver. The Genpix, however has the advantage that it does 29270-combo mode, which the 4DTV, and many commercial DCII receivers can't do. This comes in very handy at times, such as right now.
 
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enb141

SatelliteGuys Pro
Aug 5, 2009
267
6
Central America
Ok, thanks for the explanation so the genpix can't play FP just ZK and now I'm wondering that Canadian satellite service that uses Digicipher is possible to use genpix or something to watch those channels?
 

brentb636

SatelliteGuys Pro
Jun 24, 2006
4,278
6
5 miles N of Saugatuck, Mi
Not as long as they are scrambled. The skywalker-1 will tune them ( I just looked at the Ku stuff on 111 W , the listed 8psk tp's), but there is no video decode because of the scrambling. However, just as Dish Net occasionally runs tp's in the clear, so too, might Shaw Direct. Question is how long you want to wait, and how often do you want to check it out. I personally wouldn't buy a skywalker-1 just hoping for those elusive ITC channels, but I WOULD and DID buy a skywalker as an educational tool . Every now and then , I get to watch some TV on it that I can't get otherwise.
:)
 

B.J.

SatelliteGuys Pro
Oct 15, 2008
2,029
1
Western Maine
Not as long as they are scrambled. The skywalker-1 will tune them ( I just looked at the Ku stuff on 111 W , the listed 8psk tp's), but there is no video decode because of the scrambling. However, just as Dish Net occasionally runs tp's in the clear, so too, might Shaw Direct. Question is how long you want to wait, and how often do you want to check it out. I personally wouldn't buy a skywalker-1 just hoping for those elusive ITC channels, but I WOULD and DID buy a skywalker as an educational tool . Every now and then , I get to watch some TV on it that I can't get otherwise.
:)
Right. I agree completely relative to the educational tool thing. Even when I find things, I seldom actually watch programs, I just enjoy viewing the muxes in TSREADER learning how the things are put together.
Like you say, I haven't found much on the Anik sats with the Genpix. There is a BC legislature slate, and I seem to remember some weather stuff. About the most interesting thing is a mozaic with about 6 little windows from a variety of networks, and you can choose the audio from whichever one looks interesting.

The thing that disappoints me is that I had HOPED that even though I knew the Genpix couldn't PLAY FP channels, I was at least hoping that it would tell me if a channel WAS FP, so that I could then go to my 4200 and play it. The darn 4200 takes about 50+ keystrokes plus several minutes of waiting to change from one VCT to another, so it would take me several hours to check out all the Anik DCII transponders (I used to do this), and I was hoping that I could spend a few minutes going through the transponders with the Genpix, and only tune things on the 4200 if I had identified some channels as FP. However I can't seem to figure out ANY way of telling whether a channel is FP or subscription only from the TSREADER display using the Genpix.
The TSREADER display does indicate a number that's called the CA System ID, and I was hoping that this might indicate the FP channels somehow, but that doesn't seem to be the case. I've looked all over the TSREADER display, and I can't find any entry that differentiates between an FP channel and a subscription channel. I'm not even positive where this information might be. It's possible that it might be part of the PMT info, since TSREADER indicates that the CA PID is the same as the PMT PID. I've recorded some examples of FP and ZK PMT data, hoping to see an indication of the FP/ZK/subscription differentiation, but so far I haven't figured out much. Even if I did, then the task would be to create some plugin to quickly spit out that info, rather than having to save a stream and analyze it separately, which would be very slow.

Anyway, if anyone knows how to get TSREADER to differentiate between an FP channel and a regular subscription encrypted channel, I'd really appreciate a hint.
 

wildbill47

SatelliteGuys Pro
Jan 3, 2008
290
18
northern California
Skywalker

You guys have really educated me on DCII. THANKS. It is too bad that 4Play has lost popularity as this would be a way to remotely program the 4200 and other 4DTV receivers. I find DVB easier to work probably because I have spent more time on it. In till now VCII has been a mystery and can see why it has stayed secure. Watching the evolution over the years have seen the whole picture. Can see why now the software hackers moved to DSS services to break because it was easier.
If you want DVB buy a USB or PCI card. I have the USB model they sell for a low price. My next investment is a skywalker that will hopefully complete the system. I have the TSREADER registered.

Off the subject love PBS feeds create and world we do not get locally. :D
 
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