How can I get over-the-air channels on TV2? (2 Viewers)

brgmgb

Thread Starter
SatelliteGuys Family
Jan 4, 2010
54
0
Indiana
I am trying to get over-the-air local HD (via antenna) programming combined with the Dish Network programming on TV2.

We have the Dish Network Model 625 DVR and receive local channels via Dish Network. I also have a rooftop antenna to receive over-the-air programming. I have not viewed the over-the-air programming on the TV's hooked to the DVR since we got Dish.

The DVR is physically located in the spare bedroom we call the Office. TV1 is in that room. TV2 is in the Living Room. When I ran coax to locate the DVR TV2 remote antenna, it took just over 60 feet to route it through the basement to get to the Living Room.

TV1 broadcasts on channel 3. TV2 is on channel 23.

At Christmas, we purchased an HDTV for the Living Room. While the TV has every jack known to man, it only has one coax jack. So I could watch football in HD, I purchased a Radio Shack Hybrid Splitter/Combiner to combine the housetop TV antenna coax and Dish TV2 coax together at the TV. All was well.

Because I seldom get to watch sports in the Living Room, I purchased another HDTV for the office. I also purchased another Radio Shack Hybrid Splitter/Combiner. This one caused static on the Dish programming on channel 3. When I put a 12 dB booster between the DVR and the hybrid box, it cleared up. After a few days, even that didn't help.

I then attached the rooftop antenna wire to the "antenna in" jack on the back of the DVR. Signal strength dropped, but I can watch the HD local channels in TV1 (at least most of the time -- the Fox station froze a few times during the game on Sunday).

At Radio Shack, the guys said I probably fried the resistor in the hybrid splitter. A previous thread at this site suggested using a diplexer rather than the hybrid splitter. Rather than buy another Radio Shack device that might be bad out of the package, I purchased the set of four diplexers from The Dish Store (sponsor of this site) (plus four and shipping were cheaper than one from Radio Shack).

I tried all four diplexers, and none of them give me a clearer signal.

In the mean time, the Hybrid Splitter on TV2 (Living Room) has gone bad. The DVR does not pass the local antenna channels to TV2. The Dish Network book that came with the DVR suggests additional equipment. The guys at Radio Shack did not know what this equipment was.

What equipment have any of you used to combine the over-the-air antenna programming and Dish programming on a single coax wire?
 

ScottwKelley

Member
Jan 19, 2010
11
0
Petoskey, Mi
You won't because the second tuner is not HD ready as #1 is. Your local broadcast is HD so you will need a converter box or another HD receiver for that tv location to get locals. And don't forget the antenna signal will have to be split and ran to those locations. Hope that helps.
 

Scherrman

SatelliteGuys Master
Supporting Founder
Mar 14, 2008
15,555
9,928
Eastern Iowa
Where is the 625 located. If I were you, I would upgrade to a 722k. Put the receiver next to one of the HDTVs so you have HD programming to it. Hook your antenna up to the receiver so the local channels show up on your program guide. Now you have all kinds of HD programming and with the OTA module in the 722k you can record 2 extra programs from the antenna. A much better set-up than coax run to both TV's, at least picture quality wise.
 

brgmgb

Thread Starter
SatelliteGuys Family
Jan 4, 2010
54
0
Indiana
I think you are missing what I was asking. I know the antenna signal does not pass through to TV2 on the DVR 625. The TV is too far from the DVR to use component/composite cables.

However, at the television, I have the coax from the DVR and the coax from the antenna. I want to combine both into one coax cable to hook up to the television.

The Hybrid Splitter/Combiner did not work. Using a diplexer gave a snowy picture on the Dish channel.

Upgrading my Dish service is not an option at this time.

Has anyone had success combining Dish and antenna signals at the TV?
 

STL

SatelliteGuys Pro
Jan 21, 2009
683
10
St. Louis, MO
I use a simple, cheap splitter backwards to combine my 722's coax output and my OTA antenna signals. That combined signal is then run to all the TVs in my home. I am using channel 60 for TV1 and channel 62 for TV2 -- I chose them because they aren't near any OTA channel values. I split my OTA antenna signal two ways and run one output to the antenna input on the 722 and the other to the backwards splitter; then the other input to that backwards splitter is the 722's coax output.

A diplexer is for combining an OTA signal and a satellite signal from a dish itself -- it is not what you should be using.
 

old corps

SatelliteGuys Pro
Pub Member / Supporter
Jan 13, 2005
1,707
21
Mid-Michigan
I use a simple, cheap splitter backwards to combine my 722's coax output and my OTA antenna signals. That combined signal is then run to all the TVs in my home. I am using channel 60 for TV1 and channel 62 for TV2 -- I chose them because they aren't near any OTA channel values. I split my OTA antenna signal two ways and run one output to the antenna input on the 722 and the other to the backwards splitter; then the other input to that backwards splitter is the 722's coax output.

A diplexer is for combining an OTA signal and a satellite signal from a dish itself -- it is not what you should be using.

+1!:up
 

brgmgb

Thread Starter
SatelliteGuys Family
Jan 4, 2010
54
0
Indiana
I tried the backward splitter. It works better than I expected, but the Dish programming is noticeably grainy. I will try a booster/amp to see if it improves.
 

STL

SatelliteGuys Pro
Jan 21, 2009
683
10
St. Louis, MO
Are you still using channels 3 and 23? If so, try higher channels because I think when I did that I got a better picture. Also, I'd return those hybrid splitters to RS and get your money back since they sold you the wrong (more expensive) product. Be aware those most boosters/amps are junk and might create problems rather than fix them.
 

randyj

Active SatelliteGuys Member
Feb 25, 2004
17
0
Dodge Center, MN
If your antenna and TV coax runs meet (or can meet) at your DVR, or at a place where you can run composite cables from your DVR (and I've had success with long composite cable runs), you might consider a Channel Plus 3015 or 3025. The 3015 will distribute the antenna signal (or any coax source) plus one video/audio signal (via RCA cables) to up to 4 TVs. The 3025 will support an additional RCA input and 1 more output and also can receive IR signals from your TV locations that can be emitted to the input devices.

See a description of the product (and user manual) here:

Channel Plus Multi-Room Video Distribution System - 3025 - Smarthome

You can find better prices elsewhere if you shop around (amazon for one).

I have been using a 3025 for several years now to distribute the RCA SD outputs from 2 receivers, and it works great. I especially like the IR distribution capability, although it requires some extra accessories (IR target and emitter).
 

old corps

SatelliteGuys Pro
Pub Member / Supporter
Jan 13, 2005
1,707
21
Mid-Michigan
I tried the backward splitter. It works better than I expected, but the Dish programming is noticeably grainy. I will try a booster/amp to see if it improves.

Try experimenting with different channels in Modulator Setup--MENU-6-1-5. Make sure you're using a channel that doesn't have an OTA channel next to it. For example, if there's a local channel at 22 or 24 you wouldn't wanna use 23. Also I had good results with a cheapo Walmart amplifier. If it doesn't help or makes matters worse just take it back. Good luck!

Ed
 

STL

SatelliteGuys Pro
Jan 21, 2009
683
10
St. Louis, MO
...you might consider a Channel Plus 3015 or 3025.
While I am sure the Channel Plus unit works fine, I do not see why anyone needs to spend $50-80 to get one. The 722 already has an agile modulator, so all one needs to do is pick a couple channels that are not around any OTA channels (and be aware that even though a channel might be showing as 5.1 in your guide it might really be on channel 35) and combine the 722's coax output with the OTA antenna signal. Also I might have read somewhere that using the higher range of the 722's agile modulator would get you a better/stronger picture, but don't quote me on that. I am doing that in my setup and running that combined output to 4 different televisions with both digital OTA and analog DISH channels looking great. I do not have any amp on the 722's coax output, but I do have a good preamp located in the attic with my antenna (but it was purchased back in the days analog OTA).
 

Duane

SatelliteGuys Family
Jan 14, 2006
35
0

randyj

Active SatelliteGuys Member
Feb 25, 2004
17
0
Dodge Center, MN
While I am sure the Channel Plus unit works fine, I do not see why anyone needs to spend $50-80 to get one.

Not sayin' it was the cheapest method. Just sayin' I know it provides clean output, and adds the IR distribution capability over the same COAX cable already in place. The IR is a big help if you ever want to share TV1 output between HDTVs (assuming you can also run a component or HDMI cable to the second HDTV).
 

larry55

SatelliteGuys Pro
Pub Member / Supporter
Jan 15, 2009
1,185
118
dothan al
call dish and see if you can get a free up grade to a 722k. you have to buy the ota tuner it about 35.00 that what i did i get the ota hd on tv1 and the ota sd on tv .
 

STL

SatelliteGuys Pro
Jan 21, 2009
683
10
St. Louis, MO
call dish and see if you can get a free up grade to a 722k. you have to buy the ota tuner it about 35.00 that what i did i get the ota hd on tv1 and the ota sd on tv .
:confused: First off, you will not get OTA HD with a 722k; TV1 output over coax is still modulated to an analog RF channel (and thus SD). Secondly, the coax output on my 722 outputs both TV1 and TV2 just fine -- so there is zero need to spend more $ and go to a 722k.
 

brgmgb

Thread Starter
SatelliteGuys Family
Jan 4, 2010
54
0
Indiana
Try experimenting with different channels in Modulator Setup--MENU-6-1-5. Make sure you're using a channel that doesn't have an OTA channel next to it. For example, if there's a local channel at 22 or 24 you wouldn't wanna use 23. Also I had good results with a cheapo Walmart amplifier. If it doesn't help or makes matters worse just take it back. Good luck!

Ed

I have not experimented with any booster/amps yet, but did find the RF Channels are actually 12, 18, 24, 31, 36, and 40. I didn't realize that any channels were close to 23. Channel 33 broadcasts on RF Channel 18.

I will experiment more over the next few days and report my results. If I can solve the problem for free, that is better than spending more on solutions that may or may not work.

Thanks!
 

old corps

SatelliteGuys Pro
Pub Member / Supporter
Jan 13, 2005
1,707
21
Mid-Michigan
I have not experimented with any booster/amps yet, but did find the RF Channels are actually 12, 18, 24, 31, 36, and 40. I didn't realize that any channels were close to 23. Channel 33 broadcasts on RF Channel 18.

I will experiment more over the next few days and report my results. If I can solve the problem for free, that is better than spending more on solutions that may or may not work.

Thanks!

Ahhhhh, betcha that channel 24 is causing your problem. Try channel 21. Contrary to what has been said, I've had the best luck with the LOWEST channel # that's not next to an OTA broadcast. 21 is the lowest you can go. Let us know how you make out.

Ed
 

brgmgb

Thread Starter
SatelliteGuys Family
Jan 4, 2010
54
0
Indiana
I'm pretty much in the same place I was a week ago. Here's what I have tried.

1. Tried different channel numbers. The lower numbers seemed to work best. I am using 29 right now. Channel 21 broadcasts on RF Channel 24. There was not really any difference between any of the channels in the 20's.

2. Tried the backward splitter with a 2 dB and a 12 dB amp. The amp was at the TV just before the splitter. Neither amp made a difference. I have not tried putting the amp at the DVR.

3. Replaced coax wires. The coax from the splitter to the TV was an old VCR wire (that just slips on rather than screws on). I replaced it with a 6-foot RG6. No difference.

4. A coworker said to check for voltage on the line. I used a digital multimeter and did not get detect any.

5. There are composite/component (Yellow, Red, White) jacks, but I was told that the signal will degrade over that long of a run.

I am still using the sliding A/B switch. The picture is good, but you have to get out of the chair to switch from satellite to antenna - just like we had to get out of the chair to turn the dial to change the channel.

I can live with the setup I have for now, but would like to eventually be able to do everything from the remote.

Thanks for all of the suggestions!
 

STL

SatelliteGuys Pro
Jan 21, 2009
683
10
St. Louis, MO
First, what kind of antenna are you using and where is it located? How long is the cable run from it to the DVR?

Just to be clear, you tried the following:
1) Split the OTA antenna signal and ran one of the two outputs into the DVR's antenna-in and the other to the backwards splitter's "output" side (that we're using as an input).
2) Then you took the TV2 coax output from the DVR and ran it to the backwards splitter's other "output" (again we're using as an input).
3) Then you took the backwards splitter's "input" (that we're using as an output) and ran it to the TVs in your office and living room (splitting it again to do so of course).

That is what do did correct? If so what are all problems are you seeing exactly?

I am doing the exact same thing with no issues; I am using channel 60 (for TV1) and 62 (for TV2). Actually I am splitting my OTA antenna signal three times before I run it to my 722. And I am splitting the combined signal (TV2 coax + OTA) four times since I am running it to more televisions. My antenna is a quad bowtie located in the attic with a preamp (also in the attic).

Your #5 statement is correct.
 
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