NAS vs CIFS File servers

[philhu]

Hi

I have an opportunity to buy either a Thecus NAS N7700SAS unit (2gb nics) or a Dell 1950/4gb/Perc-6/MD1000 15 disk addon system/W2k8 Server for work to be dedicated to file services


If it was not money, but performance I am looking for, what would you buy? It would be SMB/linux type access or real CIFS access.

I've tested the NAS on a gig network, and was able to sustain 38mB/s thruput (Thats Bytes)

What would you get?

 

[docpadds]

I have yet to see a NAS running linux able to keep up with a windows server, when used in a windows environment.

Fact is every file is stored in ext3 and then permissions etc have to be translated by samba on the way in and out. The NAS units don't always have the most powerful CPUs either.

That said, read performance itsnt normally an issue, even my old Linksys reads quick... but write is TERRIBLE when you compare just a little old SCSI server compared to a NAS.

The NAS is great as a disk based backup, or for stuff that reads but write isnt so important (I use them for my media portal at home) but when you start hammering them it does catch up with them.

 

[Ramy]

I have yet to see a NAS running linux able to keep up with a windows server, when used in a windows environment.

Fact is every file is stored in ext3 and then permissions etc have to be translated by samba on the way in and out. The NAS units don't always have the most powerful CPUs either.

That said, read performance itsnt normally an issue, even my old Linksys reads quick... but write is TERRIBLE when you compare just a little old SCSI server compared to a NAS.

The NAS is great as a disk based backup, or for stuff that reads but write isnt so important (I use them for my media portal at home) but when you start hammering them it does catch up with them.

:up I have to agree. We used to have linux and moved to Windows.

 

[Smith P.]

"15 disk addon system" - that should be helluva of throughput if it use a few channels ( SATA, SCSI, SAS ). I'll pick a server any time - proved config and plus upgradeable to anything what you want/need.

 

[philhu]

Not to mention, I just found out that the Linux NAS by Thecus does SOFTWARE Raid using the LV raid subsystem.

The pluses for the N7700SAS is it now has a dual core processor, 2 G memory, dual DOM and power supplies for redundancy.
So it is supposed to be much faster than the first N7700, but it still is linux and still is a software raid.

Perc-6 is a hardware raid, so should be alot nicer. Most of our servers have a Perc-6 in them.

I will put W2k8 server on the Dell 1950 with multi-channel MD1000 addon and use it that way.

The Perc-6 is supposed to do 88MB/s thruput on gig cards to gig cards.

So I'll bite the bullet with it

 

[diogen]

The DELL MD1000 is sold as an add-on (up to two of them) to an iSCSI MD3000i.
Those two are connected using a SAS cable. Both can use SAS and SATA drives.

Are you trying to connect the MD1000 directly to a PC?

If you are using it in tandem with MD3000i, its performance is comparable with a 10K SAS drive in the server.

Remember that you can't populate the system with third-party drives - the MDs' firmware will reject them.
Only hard drives from Dell work. Haven't heard about a workaround for this.

Diogen.

 

[JAG72]

:up I have to agree. We used to have linux and moved to Windows.

I will put any Linux server up against Windows any day of the week. Linux will run circles around any windows device if you have a like for like setup. Only real reason that most companies move the direction that you did is that it is easier to train a Windows admin than a Linux one.

 

[jliehr]

The DELL MD1000 is sold as an add-on (up to two of them) to an iSCSI MD3000i.
Those two are connected using a SAS cable. Both can use SAS and SATA drives.

Are you trying to connect the MD1000 directly to a PC?

If you are using it in tandem with MD3000i, its performance is comparable with a 10K SAS drive in the server.

Remember that you can't populate the system with third-party drives - the MDs' firmware will reject them.
Only hard drives from Dell work. Haven't heard about a workaround for this.

Diogen.

The MD1000 is a SAS drive cage, you can by all means hook it up to a server directly.

It can ALSO daisy chain off of the MD3000/MD3000i, but it does not need to.

The performance is determined by the drives that you install, there is no performance hit from the SAS connectors with the correct controllers, it's a 12 Gbps per link. If you want you can like 6 MD1000's together for 90 direct attached spindles.

I think the biggest question is, what type of work load will you be expecting and what will be accessing it?

We are migrating from old NetApp filers mounted to IBM DS4500's to the new EMC Celerra/Clarion line and have been very happy.

 

[philhu]

I bought the MD1000 to connect directly to a Perc6/e in a poweredge 1950

It came with 6 Dell 250G drives and little adapters to connect the drives SATA ports to the md1000 bays called Interposers. What are they?

I was told by Dell that the latest firmware WILL allow both foreign drives and up to 2TB drives, but it is not supported

 

[diogen]

Interposers make SATA drives look like SAS ones to the MD box.
Don't need them if using SAS drives.

That's good news about third party drives allowed.
Hopefully the same applies to the 3000i box.

Diogen.

 

[philhu]

Yep

Third party drives work fine plugged into a Perc/6E in a 1950 directly. I plugged in various 80-500g drives from HP desktop boxes and a usb external drive i pulled

Update:
I plugged in 2 WD RE4 2TB drives.

Recognized just fine, I built a test raid-0 and then raid-1. Copied about 280gig to it, no problems.

So the MD1000/Perc-6E combination WITH LATEST FIRMWARE works with drives up to 2tb and foriegn drives.

Next week, I will plug 8 of these babies in. Make a Raid-6 with 7 of them and use the 8th as a hot spare.

 

[diogen]

Third party drives work fine plugged into a Perc/6E in a 1950 directly.

Always did. Since Dell switched from SCSI (2800) to SAS (1900/1950, 2900/2950).
But I have never seen them working on MD3000i/MD1000. Haven't checked the latest firmware.
And frankly not in a rush to do so - will wait til a new box is purchased.

Diogen.

 

[philhu]

I misspoke

The 2tb WD drives work perfectly plugged into the MD1000! (Not the 1950)

The Perc/6e card connects the MD1000 to the 1950

All that is slightly wierd is the error log lists the drive as 'uncertified'

 

[diogen]

I havent tried any but the Caviar Blacks 1TB.
Both the 19xx and 29xx had no problem with them.

I share Google approach and use generic hardware where possible.
As a tradeoff I always use them in RAID1.

Diogen.

 

[diogen]

A naked MD3000i with latest firmware 7.35.22.61 does NOT accept 1TB WD Caviar Black drives.
Verified 5 minutes ago.

Diogen.