Some real basic questions before I buy...

[Backwoods Montana]

OK , I'm new at this and I've tried to make sense out of all of the jargon and abbreviations, types and bands, azimuths and etc.

I'm disgusted with Dish Network, don't much care for most of the commercial network stuff anyway, so I want to get rid of it and get FTA. Since I watch Montana PBS most of the time, and it's available FTA, I guess this is a good way to go. Just in case my wife wants to watch something different, it's probably a good idea to get something to switch to a different satellite. We like the ability to record, skip back on live TV, and watch HDTV. For the record, I'm in rural western Montana, and have a pretty good view of the southern sky within 50 ft and a better view within 400 ft.

From what I can tell, everything we would want is on AMC 21, Galaxy 18 and maybe AMC 9.

Here's the package that I'm looking at. I don't know if its overkill or not enough, good or crummy, so I would appreciate ANY input anyone has.

(since the rules say that I can't post url's, I hope you can find it like this)
Its from GOSatellite, and its called "Viewsat Max HD STATIONARY FTA System #3"

All from GO Satellite.com, because their site seems to be the easiest to understand.

I still don't understand about dish sizes and LNB's. Are multiple LNB's used so you don't have to have something that physically moves the dish to another satellite?

Also, will any hard drive work, like the Western Digital that I use for my computer back-up?

Thanks in advance for any advice you can give.

 

[Sadoun]

Well, one dish will not be enough. You will need:

• A separate dish for each satellite.
• Each dish should have a dual output LNBF.
• If multiple rooms, you will need a receiver for each room.
• 4-Way DiSEqC switch for each receiver

 

[turbosat]

Sell him a motor already, lol!! Mr Montana, if you want to watch multiple satellites, you'll either need multiple dishes OR a motor for one dish and just move it around. Of course that limits a 2nd receiver to whatever sat the first dish is watching. AMC9 is a long way from G18 , so you couldn't stick a 2nd lnbf on one dish and pick it up. It may be possible to get both G18 and AMC21 from one dish, with some tinkering but it would be prob be my choice to put a fixed dish on 125, and another dish with a motor to watch the rest. There's lots of ways to do what you want to do. You can get lnbf with dual output that can feed more than one receiver. Wait for more input here on HD boxes, most of us may not rate the ViewsatHD box very well. Seems I read somewhere the PVR won't work on it yet.

 

[Anole]

In addition to other negative info on the Viewsat, and HD in general, that package says it comes with three circular LNBs.
For FTA, we need linear LNBs , not circular.
They are generally called: Standard.
(for very few international birds, you might need a Universal LNB instead)

I'm not anxious to recommend the smaller dish, either.

One more dirty little secret: none of these HD FTA receivers which record OTA, have a program guide for the OTA.
(...and there is no guide for satellite reception, either...)
If that is a priority for your local reception, then you might consider this product from Dish.
It will record in both SD and HD, whatever it is tuned to.
Once you buy it, it has a zero monthly impact (free to operate).

 

[AcWxRadar]

OK , I'm new at this and I've tried to make sense out of all of the jargon and abbreviations, types and bands, azimuths and etc.

I'm disgusted with Dish Network, don't much care for most of the commercial network stuff anyway, so I want to get rid of it and get FTA. Since I watch Montana PBS most of the time, and it's available FTA, I guess this is a good way to go. Just in case my wife wants to watch something different, it's probably a good idea to get something to switch to a different satellite. We like the ability to record, skip back on live TV, and watch HDTV. For the record, I'm in rural western Montana, and have a pretty good view of the southern sky within 50 ft and a better view within 400 ft.

From what I can tell, everything we would want is on AMC 21, Galaxy 18 and maybe AMC 9.

Here's the package that I'm looking at. I don't know if its overkill or not enough, good or crummy, so I would appreciate ANY input anyone has.

(since the rules say that I can't post url's, I hope you can find it like this)
Its from GOSatellite, and its called "Viewsat Max HD STATIONARY FTA System #3"

All from GO Satellite.com, because their site seems to be the easiest to understand.

I still don't understand about dish sizes and LNB's. Are multiple LNB's used so you don't have to have something that physically moves the dish to another satellite?

Also, will any hard drive work, like the Western Digital that I use for my computer back-up?

Thanks in advance for any advice you can give.

Montana,

I don't blame you for being discouraged with DN. They seem to raise our rates and take away more programming all the time.

If you want to try FTA, I do have some suggestions for you. If you don't like it, it is only a one time investment so you are not committed to any contract. Just don't cancel your DN subscription until you have checked it out fully.

You are used to some sort of a PVR with DN, so you will not have that perk if you go towards FTA. You can make up for that with some additional equipment, but it won't be as convenient to use.

In your situation, I would recommend the same equipment that I am using here. I am just a tad bit NW of Omaha, NE.

I use the following equipment:

RECEIVER: Coolsat 5000*
DISH: Winegard DS-2076
LNBF: Invacom QPH-031
CABLE: CommScope Brightwire quad sheild RG6
SWITCH: SW21 from DN (or a Chieta HD 4X1 DiSEqC switch)

The HD for the Chieta switch means Heavy Duty, not High Definition.

The Coolsat 5000 receiver is no longer manufactured, it is a discontinued model, but you can find it and the Coolsat 6000 receivers on Ebay fairly cheap.

You will want one of these two models for certain. You can buy many other brands and models that you like, but you want to have at least one of these early Coolsat models to get started with.

They are inexpensive right now and they make setting up your equipment much easier. $50 to $100 on ebay, but be wary. You might get a crap one, so question the seller with great scrutiny as to the operation of the box (electrically). Most users and owners may not know anything about the box, they probably bought it for piracy purposes, and now they want to unload them. This is a great bonus to us, because we can buy them dirt cheap now.

The majority of Coolsat receievers on Ebay will probably have 3rd party software installed . That means pirating materials (software). Don't worry about that, it doesn't hinder the operation of the unit for true FTA and you can wipe that stuff out of the unit by simply reloading the factory file and you will have a clean slate.

Some of the pirate software versions have some nice amenities and you might want to retain the software in that regard. If you get a box like this, I would keep my mouth shut and just use it for FTA as is. I bought a couple of these receivers dirt cheap because the previous owner tried to load 3rd party software and screwed it up. They dumped it on Ebay and there was nothing wrong with the box at all. They just weren't able or knowedgable to make it work.


I don't know how legal it is to own a box that used to have pirate software installed, but a long as you never use it, or if you delete it entirely, I don't see that anyone could give you a challenge on the issue.

These are awesome receivers for FTA Ku and C band. Don't pass them by!

The DS-2076 76cm dish is a great choice, expecially for a newbie. It actually functions as if it were a 90cm dish in regards to the gain. Winegard acutally manufactured this dish very well and it shows!

I also use an Invacom QPH-031 LNBF on this dish antenna. They are an excellent match. The QPH-031 is an excellent LNBF!

The cable and switches you use are up to you. I recommend Commscoipe Brightwire RG6 cable, the DN SW21 switch and the Chieta HD 4X1 DiSEqC switches, but you may use anything that you already have or anything that is inexpensive.

A lot of folks will tell you that you need a huge dish. I don't believe this as my 76 cm dish can out-perform my 1M dish. So, when shopping for your dish, don't buy it according to the overall size, look at the affective apperature and overall gain characteristics instead.

For buying new equipment off the shelf, I think I have the best system overall for general Ku band use.

You can scrounge around and check the sat shops for PrimeStar and Channel Master dishes that are outdated and maybe you will pick them up for a song! I got several of them from a sat guy in my hometown for next to nothing. After I started chatting with him, like we do here, he was quite interested and sold me dishes and LNBFs and switches at salvage prices.

A couple of times he even gave me a copy of "On Sat" That was great!

You gotta be a scrounger sometimes, but if you buy the new equipment that I recommended above, you will be pleased.

I would match my equipment (Ku) up to anyone else's. It performs extremely well. The only thing I am missing is C band, and I can get some of that on my 76cm dish with the aid of Walrus.

I truly hope that this information helps you decide upon what stuff to buy and how to buy. You have to do more research on this as this is just one person's opinion (mine) but at least you have my recommendations.

I do hope you do well!

Gordy (AcWxRadar)

AcWxRadar

 

[Mr Tony]

You are used to some sort of a PVR with DN, so you will not have that perk if you go towards FTA. You can make up for that with some additional equipment, but it won't be as convenient to use.

true. Visionsat makes a unit that can record and playback programming with an additonal hard drive attached. But to get to a PVR type option like Dish or DIrect has on FTA....well that's not an option right now.

I don't know how legal it is to own a box that used to have pirate software installed, but a long as you never use it, or if you delete it entirely, I don't see that anyone could give you a challenge on the issue.

I personally would go back to factory software unless it is not an option (digiwave diamond for example)

The DS-2076 76cm dish is a great choice, expecially for a newbie. It actually functions as if it were a 90cm dish in regards to the gain. Winegard acutally manufactured this dish very well and it shows!

very true. I have one also and it works very well

I also use an Invacom QPH-031 LNBF on this dish antenna. They are an excellent match. The QPH-031 is an excellent LNBF!

Here is where I would have to disagree. I had one of the Invacom's and sure it was nice, it was too heavy and due to my northern location the dish was at such an angle that the weight of the LNB actually HINDERED reception because it was pulling on the bracket. Now the OP is pretty far north (as am I) so it may not be a good idea. If you have a dish with support arms, then it probably would work fine. I use a Sadoun dual .4 KU LNB and it works great. Gets all the channels it should and at good signal quality.

A lot of folks will tell you that you need a huge dish. I don't believe this as my 76 cm dish can out-perform my 1M dish. So, when shopping for your dish, don't buy it according to the overall size, look at the affective apperature and overall gain characteristics instead.

If you can get a 90cm I would recommend that (again with the northern latitude). Just dont get a el-cheapo 90cm dish. They can flex pretty good in the wind and can kill reception pretty quickly. Winegard makes a good unit (have had mine for 5 years now) and havent had any flexing issues

You can scrounge around and check the sat shops for PrimeStar and Channel Master dishes that are outdated and maybe you will pick them up for a song! I got several of them from a sat guy in my hometown for next to nothing. After I started chatting with him, like we do here, he was quite interested and sold me dishes and LNBFs and switches at salvage prices.

free is always good

For a receiver I would recommend the Coolsat, Visionsat (has a PVR option), or Fortec. You really can't go wrong with any of those. If you want HD, then the receiver price did just jump up then as there are fewer options. Pansat 9200 is pretty good and has blind scan. Blind scan finds the new and temporary news/sports feeds. Coolsat 8000/8100 are other options. 8100 has a PVR option but neither of these have blind scan. If you are content with a few channels or what is published out there, then blind scan really is not needed. But to get the full FTA effect, blind scan is a must

Good luck and let us know if you have any other questions

 

[AcWxRadar]

Here is where I would have to disagree. I had one of the Invacom's and sure it was nice, it was too heavy and due to my northern location the dish was at such an angle that the weight of the LNB actually HINDERED reception because it was pulling on the bracket. Now the OP is pretty far north (as am I) so it may not be a good idea. If you have a dish with support arms, then it probably would work fine. I use a Sadoun dual .4 KU LNB and it works great. Gets all the channels it should and at good signal quality.

I removed the support brackets from my 1M Winegard and attached them to my 76cm dish to add support for the Invacom. However, there are LNBFs like the one Ice mentioned that are just as good, and much less expensive.

If you can get a 90cm I would recommend that (again with the northern latitude). Just dont get a el-cheapo 90cm dish. They can flex pretty good in the wind and can kill reception pretty quickly. Winegard makes a good unit (have had mine for 5 years now) and havent had any flexing issues.

I do agree, especially for northern latitudes, and Canada in particular. The EIRP maps often present a sharp drop in the satellites effective power when you go north across the border. A 90 cm dish may become a necessity in these cases.

If you are content with a few channels or what is published out there, then blind scan really is not needed. But to get the full FTA effect, blind scan is a must .

Absolutely! Blind scan option and TP editing options are a must if you are truly serious about FTA. The Coolsat early models (5K ad 6K) do very well in this department, but there are some which are better and some that do not even offer the option, so shop with scrutiny.

Radar

 

[Mr Tony]

I do agree, especially for northern latitudes, and Canada in particular. The EIRP maps often present a sharp drop in the satellites effective power when you go north across the border. A 90 cm dish may become a necessity in these cases.

even when you're close to the border they can drop off. Couple examples
-when PBS was on AMC3 the northern states had a bugger of a time with good quality readings
-Satmex 5 is almost non existant on a 76cm dish....I can barely lock anything on S5 KU Band (116.8)

 

[AcWxRadar]

even when you're close to the border they can drop off. Couple examples
-when PBS was on AMC3 the northern states had a bugger of a time with good quality readings
-Satmex 5 is almost non existant on a 76cm dish....I can barely lock anything on S5 KU Band (116.8)

I am near Omaha, NE and I don't get SatMex 5 very well. There are four channels that come in with Q around 88-90%, but they are scrambled so they don't do me any good. Once in a geat while I can pick up a feed that is strong, but not often. I pretty much ignore this satellite with my 76cm dish.

RADAR

 

[Backwoods Montana]

Thanks for the information. You've given me a lot more here than I was able to get with hours of hunting around on different sites. I'll start digging around and hit the shop in town for some used equipment. Maybe I'll get lucky.
-Doug

 

[Mr Tony]

good luck and if you have any other questions let us know

 

[Zorak]

Also, two of our sponsors have great deals via Ebay currently. SatelliteAV has its 90cm dish bullet LNB combo at a good price with fixed shipping. Sadoun also has some deals. Good luck and enjoy shopping and making your choices!

 

[Backwoods Montana]

I'm looking at this dish and LNB combo on eBay. The price seems good. Does anybody know anything either good or bad?
http://cgi.ebay.com/36%22-GEOSATpro-90cm-Satellite-Dish-with-.4-LNBF---FTA_W0QQitemZ140308030572QQcmdZViewItem
Thx
-Doug

 

[phlatwound]

As Zorak mentioned, that is sold by SatelliteAv (link to their site is at the top of the page), they are a sponsor here. It IS a good deal.

 

[Mr Tony]

I have the same dish and love it. Its set up to motorized system

 

[agrolingua]

What about a motor?

I am new into this as well. You all make some pretty good recommendations for the pieces to the system. Nobody recommended a motor. What would be a good motor to buy in a basic or starter system?

 

[Mr Tony]

SG2100 hands down. Have had one for 5 years (this april) and it has survived MN winters with no issues. Runs that Winegard dish across the arc all the time

 

[brentb636]

I have 3 motorized dishes, with 3 different motors,
a STAB hh-90, Moteck SG-2100, DG-380 . The SG-2100 has been heavily counterfeited, so I would rule that out. I love the STAB hh-90 for 90cm and smaller dishes. I love the DG-380 for my 1.2m dish. If you can afford the little extra money, get the DG-380 . It's pretty fast moving, excellent USALS performance, and rated for a large Ku band dish, if you ever need it.

 

[lownote2]

I'm looking at this dish and LNB combo on eBay. The price seems good. Does anybody know anything either good or bad?
36" GEOSATpro 90cm Satellite Dish with .4 LNBF - FTA - eBay (item 140308030572 end time Mar-25-09 15:15:11 PDT)
Thx
-Doug

Not a bad deal at all and good shipping price. One of these days I'm gonna upgrade my dish. Got a free primestar dish which actually works great, but really limits me with motor options because it's so heavy and it's around 2 3/8 or more fit for a pole. I don't mind going out and re-aiming the dish from time to time, but a motor would be much simpler in the long run since I don't want a yard full of dishes. er..... should I say the wife doesn't.

 

[Tron]

I am new into this as well. You all make some pretty good recommendations for the pieces to the system. Nobody recommended a motor. What would be a good motor to buy in a basic or starter system?

I would recommend an SG-2100 IF you can find the real deal. Sponsor Sadoun had a few left on clearance for $50, and they were the original Moteck single button product. Not sure if he has any left though...