The HD-lite war is over
- Thread starter Tom Bombadil
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It wouldn't be a start. It has been discussed several times on this board. But usually not in Dish specific threads.
I hope that all of you that support HD-Lite get even MORE Echostar stock rewards. You worked hard for it.
abricko said:
You will always have HD Lite posts all over the Dish Network Forum. Is the nature of the beast because every HD channel is plagued by the same problem so there is a 95% chance that the HD Lite conversation will come up. This is not an invention of subs it is an invention of Dish Network. If Dish Networks stops delivering HD Lite, I can assure 100% that the HD Lite topic will never surfer again and you will not see any thread on the topic.
To simply stop talking about it is to be in denial and basically shut down an information forum from being an information forum and more like a Dish Network Apologists Forum or even worse a Dish Network forum run by Dish Network and only allowing topics or post that it is in their best interests.
Unless someone has a special interest in Dish Network, we all would like to hear the negative(s) and the positive(s). Unfortunately, HD Lite has become the black sheep of Dish Network. We have been hearing for months that it was a technical problem and that Dish was working hard to get it right or to fix (since January 2006). It is now August 2006 and not only have they not fixed the problem with the previous channels (being HD Lite) but have escalated the problem themselves by taking channels like HDnet and HDnet movies and making them HD Lite as well. They also add Food HD and even though it is at the correct resolution 1920x1080i, the channel is starving to death for bitrates. The macroblocking on Food HD is so bad that it is unwatchable. Keep in mind that Food HD is not a sports channels (in which there are lots of action and more bitrates are in demand). Food HD is just a simple channel that have no decent bitrates at all and therefore is called HD Lite.
Dish Network is the only one to blame here for their escalation of HD Lite. We were all deceived in believing that we were all safe from the plague that DirecTv had become. Lots of us who cared about HD came to Dish as a safe house but Dish just became another infested manifestation of the HD Lite legacy that DirecTv had become. As long as Dish Network keeps HD Lite alive it will be a topic of discussion. Dish created this mess and it is up to them to resolve it (if there is any hope which at this point I seriously doubt).
P.S. as a friend of mine says, "It is what it is". HD Lite discussion cannot be put to sleep at this point since the majority of the channels on Dish Network are HD Lite.
I was surprized to find that this article was not referred to in this thread since Mark Cubans name was brought up.
http://www.tvpredictions.com/mark083106.htm
Interesting how he refers to HD carriers and how they squeeze the bandwidth. He seems to; in this article, to say that eventually as people become more educated about HD that better quality will be demanded and completion for the HD dollar will force carriers to meet those demands.
Thoughts?
http://www.tvpredictions.com/mark083106.htm
Interesting how he refers to HD carriers and how they squeeze the bandwidth. He seems to; in this article, to say that eventually as people become more educated about HD that better quality will be demanded and completion for the HD dollar will force carriers to meet those demands.
Thoughts?
And to add to my post and 2nd Sean's points; if people find their way to this forum as they start subscribing to HD programming, they will know that there was once a difference and that it was (and can be) much better. The more people that bring attention to this issue, the more people will voice their dissatisfaction, and hopefully someday the result will be change. Isn't that how democracy is SUPPOSE to work?
Mark Cuban also wants the merger of DISH and DIRECTV so they can provide more hd . I wouldn't mind this if it would be with Charlie running it and we know that won't happen with Rupert running Directv.
We are all hopeful that as more satellites are launched and as people see real HD, that it will result in high quality HD being delivered.
What tempers that are the following factors:
A) We thought the same thing with SD, as DVD became popular. But instead both E* and D* maximized on channels and not quality.
B) A lot of channels will be going HD in coming years. Many transponders will be needed.
C) Over the past year neither E* or D* has shown any indication that they put a priority on picture quality. E* could easily drop a few VOOM channels or not rush more HD channels into production if they wanted to preserve high quality.
Perhaps eventually we will get better HD quality, but will this eventually be in 2 years? 4 years? 6 years? I agree that at some point, there should be a lot of bandwidth. Heck in 100 years, who knows how much bandwidth will be available?
What tempers that are the following factors:
A) We thought the same thing with SD, as DVD became popular. But instead both E* and D* maximized on channels and not quality.
B) A lot of channels will be going HD in coming years. Many transponders will be needed.
C) Over the past year neither E* or D* has shown any indication that they put a priority on picture quality. E* could easily drop a few VOOM channels or not rush more HD channels into production if they wanted to preserve high quality.
Perhaps eventually we will get better HD quality, but will this eventually be in 2 years? 4 years? 6 years? I agree that at some point, there should be a lot of bandwidth. Heck in 100 years, who knows how much bandwidth will be available?
What about mpeg 4 ? Isn't that supposed to allow more channels so the picture can stay as good as it is today? IF they ever get any bandwith gaines with these mpeg 4 encoders, I would think that they will be able to provide both picture quality and more hd channels. Of course that is if they get more out of it than present day encoders get. By next summer all mpeg 2 hd is supposed to go away, so maybe the picture quality will improve by next summer.
I was hopeful that the masses would see HD and expect that as the standard, but alas true HD is now gone and most may never know what they are missing. I went to visit my brother who had invested in an HD TV and had gotten a HD cable box and was very happy with his great picture. I proceeded to tell him that it wasn't HD, and of course the argument proceeded that he had an HD TV and HD Cable box. but still I insisted it wasn't HD. It was obvious to me, but to the group of friends who had gathered to watch the football game it looked great.
When I looked into it further I discovered that he had his HD cable box connected to his HD T V with a S-video cable. When I connected things up with a component cable , the room was filled with a 'wow' from all there. It just goes to show, that the masses don't even know what HD looks like and are satisfied with less.
After seeing mine, he installed a front projector in another part of his house and was really happy at the great quality of the HD programming on his projector, but when I went to visit him this summer I instantly realized it wasn 't HD, the cable company had apparantly given him the wrong cable box.
What really surprised me is he didnt' notice the difference between his HD in his basement on the HD TV and the SD upstairs on his projector. It really made me realize that some people just don't notice the difference or they don't care. My wife and kids don't really seem to care whether the watch a program on our 27 inch SD TV or in HD on the 8 ft screen. I dont' understand that mentality. I won't even watch SD anymore and I won't watch anything on the 27 inch TV, but then again maybe I'm obsessive.
This in my mind is why we are doomed to HD lite, because the average person really has no idea what HD should look like.
I guess that our last hope is that people see HD DVD and demand better. But then i think of DVD and how great that looked compared to TV. Well actually there was a day when satelite looked close to DVD, but that didn't last. And here we are again, deja vu, HD looked incredible at first but now they are downrezzing and HD DVD will be superior. Alas I'm afraid we are headed to the same paradigm with HD. HD lite on TV, and true HD on DVD. So I'm afraid we may never see true HD on TV again. Our memory of those days may be all we have. It is a very sad thought.
Until Super HD comes along.
When I looked into it further I discovered that he had his HD cable box connected to his HD T V with a S-video cable. When I connected things up with a component cable , the room was filled with a 'wow' from all there. It just goes to show, that the masses don't even know what HD looks like and are satisfied with less.
After seeing mine, he installed a front projector in another part of his house and was really happy at the great quality of the HD programming on his projector, but when I went to visit him this summer I instantly realized it wasn 't HD, the cable company had apparantly given him the wrong cable box.
What really surprised me is he didnt' notice the difference between his HD in his basement on the HD TV and the SD upstairs on his projector. It really made me realize that some people just don't notice the difference or they don't care. My wife and kids don't really seem to care whether the watch a program on our 27 inch SD TV or in HD on the 8 ft screen. I dont' understand that mentality. I won't even watch SD anymore and I won't watch anything on the 27 inch TV, but then again maybe I'm obsessive.
This in my mind is why we are doomed to HD lite, because the average person really has no idea what HD should look like.
I guess that our last hope is that people see HD DVD and demand better. But then i think of DVD and how great that looked compared to TV. Well actually there was a day when satelite looked close to DVD, but that didn't last. And here we are again, deja vu, HD looked incredible at first but now they are downrezzing and HD DVD will be superior. Alas I'm afraid we are headed to the same paradigm with HD. HD lite on TV, and true HD on DVD. So I'm afraid we may never see true HD on TV again. Our memory of those days may be all we have. It is a very sad thought.
Until Super HD comes along.
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Yes, it is possible. We can hope that E* uses better MPEG4 encoding to improve PQ. And chooses not to use it to squeeze in more HD channels.
I'm not going to hold my breath.
I'm not going to hold my breath.
Echostar cheats those of us that invest in buying the better quality, high performance video equipment. We will move-on to 1080p and Blu-Ray as Echostar downgrades its picture quality to a standard not defined by any US or international standard. HD-Lite is a result of Echostar wanting to offer more channels than DirectTV, but not having enough bandwidth to meet broadcast standards prescribed by the broadcast industry.
Seemingly, the array of HD channels that Echostar provides its customers indicates that management’s idea of “compelling content” is very far-off from its customer’s desire for content. The resent survey confirms that many HD channels are of low public interest. I imagine there’s lots of profit generated by some of those HD channels, but realize those channels do not come close to making me as happy as TMC-HD, CineMAX-HD or the HD broadcast of my local PBS-HD station.
New technologies come along all the time! Higher resolution TV broadcast seems to be an evolving market. Looks like Echostar is not going to participate in the High Definition broadcast arena. Many of us will be compelled to find a new source for high resolution TV broadcast in order to enjoy the benefits from the investments we made buying new equipment. If you do not provide it, someone else will.
I guest Echostar will “continue to pick the low hanging fruit” until someone comes along and puts them out of business.
In the meantime, I am still going to complain about HD-Lite, because it is my money!
Seemingly, the array of HD channels that Echostar provides its customers indicates that management’s idea of “compelling content” is very far-off from its customer’s desire for content. The resent survey confirms that many HD channels are of low public interest. I imagine there’s lots of profit generated by some of those HD channels, but realize those channels do not come close to making me as happy as TMC-HD, CineMAX-HD or the HD broadcast of my local PBS-HD station.
New technologies come along all the time! Higher resolution TV broadcast seems to be an evolving market. Looks like Echostar is not going to participate in the High Definition broadcast arena. Many of us will be compelled to find a new source for high resolution TV broadcast in order to enjoy the benefits from the investments we made buying new equipment. If you do not provide it, someone else will.
I guest Echostar will “continue to pick the low hanging fruit” until someone comes along and puts them out of business.
In the meantime, I am still going to complain about HD-Lite, because it is my money!
