Uplink Activity Report - 9/24/2008 6:02pm - 87 changes

All those programs were photographed using HD cameras at 1440x1080 and then upscaled by Discovery to 1920x1080.

I really need to see proof of that claim.

Much of what Discovery Channel shows (as well as its HD Theater, Animal Planet and other channels) is photographed on FILM. Not videotape. And it is typically scanned and mastered in 1920 X 1080 progressive for HDTV programming. The anamorphic HDV 1440 X 1080 thing is really not a professional video standard.
 
References to "1440 X 1080i" as well as "HD-Lite" with regards to satellite transmission represent misunderstandings of the digital video systems.

Right now, if all 1440 x 1080i channels on Dish Network were changed to 1920 x 1080i, they would look worse.

Why ? 1920 is 33% larger than 1440 - it means that the effective bitrate is 33% less.

Those who understand digital video know that bitrate is actually more important for visual quality than resolution. By reducing the bitrate by 33%, the picture would deteriorate significantly, and look worse than it does now.

Lastly, many people bought HD TVs and turned on Discovery HD Theater, and talk about the "wow factor" " things jumping out at you " and " the 3 dimensionality ". All those programs were photographed using HD cameras at 1440x1080 and then upscaled by Discovery to 1920x1080. So, those people were actually watching a 1440x1080 source.

Also, the TV show that has been most praised for how great it looks in HD is "Lost". That show is broadcast in 1280x720 and looks better than a lot of the 1080i programming...
If the resolution is not high enough (1920 in the horizontal), no amount of bit rate can make it look like it is.
 
If the resolution is not high enough (1920 in the horizontal), no amount of bit rate can make it look like it is.

That sounds good, but is actually not true as stated.

A high bitrate 1280x720 can look far better than a 1920x1080 with the same bitrate.
 
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I really need to see proof of that claim.

Much of what Discovery Channel shows (as well as its HD Theater, Animal Planet and other channels) is photographed on FILM. Not videotape. And it is typically scanned and mastered in 1920 X 1080 progressive for HDTV programming. The anamorphic HDV 1440 X 1080 thing is really not a professional video standard.

I'm referring to the period when Discovery's only HD channel was "Discovery HD Theater". Back then, people said " it looked terrific until Dish and DirecTV lowered the resolution ". Those programs were filmed with HDV and HD-CAM, both of which are 1440x1080. Documentaries of that sort are rarely filmed.

The lowering of HD PQ was due to lowering the bitrate. Changing to 1440x1080 only makes the picture look better at that bitrate.

Again, HD programming at 1280x720 can looking stunning, and 95%+ of viewers do not sit close enough to be able to perceive a difference between 720p and 1080p (a scientific fact, although the percentage is an estimate).
 
kstuart said:
Those programs were filmed with HDV and HD-CAM, both of which are 1440x1080. Documentaries of that sort are rarely filmed.

Specifically which documentaries are you talking about? HDV is not a professional video standard. I need to know which shows were truly originated on HDV in fake-HD 1440 X 1080. Most professional level video cameras (not $3000 "pro-sumer" cameras) shoot in either 720p or 1080i, or even both. Some of the most expensive video cameras shoot true 1080p video at a variety of frame rates. Of course, film-based photography also offers high definition too. Very few "affordable" video cameras can actually shoot 1080p (they're often limited to 1080i). New cameras are on the way. One of the most interesting is the Canon 5D Mark II digital-SLR still camera. It also has a video mode that will allow true 1080p recording in MPEG-4 AVC format.
 
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Nevertheless, HDV is a consumer video format, not a professional one. Professional HD video cameras do not normally record in any sort of anamorphic 1440 X 1080 mode and they use higher bandwidth digital tape formats.
 
Nevertheless, HDV is a consumer video format, not a professional one.

From Broadcast Engineering magazine (btw, in case readers are not aware, David Lynch is a major filmmaker - Twin Peaks, Mulholland Drive, etc):

HD Technology Update: When you look at developing a product like this, you must have a pretty good handle on the size of the HDV market. How would you characterize the HDV market?
Ali Ahmadi: It is very difficult to say because that category of cameras has various applications and various users. If you go into Best Buy as a dad who wants to shoot his son’s baseball practice, you are going to come across an HDV camera. They’re used for everything from that all the way up to cinematographers like David Lynch who decided to go with these kinds of formats because they will allow him a totally different kind of workflow. That opens up a whole new way of moviemaking to him.
That’s two people from opposite sides of the spectrum in the HDV market, and as a result, it is very hard to gauge that market. And, all the camera manufacturers are now pushing for solid-state memory to store the video. This offers great advantages in terms of workflow, so these cameras and the new workflows are getting more attractive by the hour.
HD Technology Update: In particular, what impact do you see HDV having on the broadcast and motion picture markets?
Ali Ahmadi: I think it’s having a huge impact because of two reasons. These cameras now are so closely tied to computers — the optical chips — and you take that in combination with the advances computers have made and the advances of chips in the last couple of years; just three years ago, it was inconceivable that anybody other than the highest professional photographer could have an 8-megapixel still camera.

and this:

HDTU: There are objective and subjective measures of picture quality. You will be shooting in HDV 1080i 24F, which Canon says is 1440 pixels x 1080 pixels (16:9) images. There is an objective difference between HD and HDV, like bandwidth and pixel counts. How about subjectively? How do you compare the performance of the XL H1 with HDTV originated material?
Rick Shaw — audio engineer, video editor and film producer: Well obviously we can’t compete with a $150,000 camera. But I think in the final delivery stage, the average viewer — unless we are talking about transferring what we shoot to Super 35 for use in theaters — the picture quality is more than adequate for what we are doing.

I saw dozens more, but I have run out of time, and won't bore everyone with endless professional HDV use.
 
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HI, I live in Ames and have a 722. I just had an install of a Dish 1000.? in August. Would I have a 1000.2 then? Last night I thought I was looking at HD on Fox 17!!! Do we really need a dish upgrade to get the other locals, or just wait awhile for the to come on?

Thanks,
Kathy in Ames
 
When Des Moines HD locals are turned on, they will be at 61.5° so you will need a second dish pointed there, or a Dish1000.4 to point at 61.5°/72.7°/77°. You probably have a dish 1000.2 pointed at 110°/119°/129° now.

The local channels in YELLOW on your guide are being picked up by your TV antenna. So it is very possible you saw Fox 17 in HD, but only if you have your antenna hooked up to your receiver.

BTW, the best possible HD picture from local channels will come from an antenna, not Dish, DirecTV or cable!

See ya
Tony
 
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