What's your experience for where you CAN'T put a dish

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gpetrowich

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Dec 23, 2007
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Installer came by today. He was very helpful and ultimately we came to some resolution on where to install, but I was surprised to learn the following:

1. Can't install anywhere on the roof if it is ABOVE a living area. Extended from an overhang is fine or over the garage, etc.
2. Can't install on a TV tower or tripod even if it is already secured to my house.
3. Can't install on a poll more than 3 feet tall.
4. All receivers must be within 100 feet of the dish
5. Can't activate unless signal strength is 90+ and can see ALL 5 sats

When we talked through all these I can see how they evolved, but I'm curious if these guidelines are consistent across the country or locally at the discretion of the contracted installers?

What's your experience?
 

raoul5788

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Installer came by today. He was very helpful and ultimately we came to some resolution on where to install, but I was surprised to learn the following:

1. Can't install anywhere on the roof if it is ABOVE a living area. Extended from an overhang is fine or over the garage, etc.
2. Can't install on a TV tower or tripod even if it is already secured to my house.
3. Can't install on a poll more than 3 feet tall.
4. All receivers must be within 100 feet of the dish
5. Can't activate unless signal strength is 90+ and can see ALL 5 sats

When we talked through all these I can see how they evolved, but I'm curious if these guidelines are consistent across the country or locally at the discretion of the contracted installers?

What's your experience?
1. Maybe true for some install companies, and certainly a good idea if possible.
2. Makes no sense to me if it is well secured.
3. Bull. Mine is on a pole 9' tall and I have had no issues in over 2 years.
4. I thought it was 150', but maybe 100.
5. SS should be in the 90's but that can't always happen. All 5 sats should be
visible so that the installer doesn't get charged a call back for a failed installation
in areas where the sd locals are on 119. In other areas, only 99, 101, and 103 need to be seen.
 
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Liquidforce88

SatelliteGuys Pro
Feb 3, 2005
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The Land Of OZ
Installer came by today. He was very helpful and ultimately we came to some resolution on where to install, but I was surprised to learn the following:

1. Can't install anywhere on the roof if it is ABOVE a living area. Extended from an overhang is fine or over the garage, etc.
2. Can't install on a TV tower or tripod even if it is already secured to my house.
3. Can't install on a poll more than 3 feet tall.
4. All receivers must be within 100 feet of the dish
5. Can't activate unless signal strength is 90+ and can see ALL 5 sats

When we talked through all these I can see how they evolved, but I'm curious if these guidelines are consistent across the country or locally at the discretion of the contracted installers?

What's your experience?
1. That is what we want. We will install it where ever we need to get a Line Of Site. If that is at the peak of the roof in the middle of the house, they want it installed.

2. Will put on a tripod for an appartment if it can be secured. Tv towers although not something I do alot, but it's not a problem.

3. Yeah ok :cool:

4. 200' is the max allowed, and you really can run into trouble if you try to go more than that. Up to 125' of cable is included in the install.

5. Not so much of a set number, as it has to pass verification.

Sounds like you got a guy that will find any little reason to get out of an install that is not a wam bam thank you mam. Any kind of work involved and he finds a way to bolt. These are always the guys that hide behind the rules.
 

yorktown

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Nov 10, 2009
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General Location
1. Can't install anywhere on the roof if it is ABOVE a living area. Extended from an overhang is fine or over the garage, etc.
2. Can't install on a TV tower or tripod even if it is already secured to my house.
3. Can't install on a poll more than 3 feet tall.
4. All receivers must be within 100 feet of the dish
5. Can't activate unless signal strength is 90+ and can see ALL 5 sats

When we talked through all these I can see how they evolved, but I'm curious if these guidelines are consistent across the country or locally at the discretion of the contracted installers?

What's your experience?
I'm not a "pro" installer or anything close to it, but most of this sounds like BS to me.

1. In most cases the roof is ABOVE the attic, not directly above a living area.
What's the deal? Are they afraid one day the dish will fall thru the roof and kill someone in their sleep ?
2. As long as they can securely attach the dish to it I don't see a problem.
3. Nothing can be installed on a poll.
4. 100 feet is the max. cable length the spec. calls out, but the signal strength doesn't drop to zero once the cable length reaches 101 feet.
5. 90+ is a great signal strength to shoot for but it's just not possible most of the time.
 

PATECO

SatelliteGuys Pro
Directv has standards for their installers for liability reasons. Indepndent retailers are not held to those standards since they cary their own insurance. I will install almost anywhere if it is a safe and secure mount. Distance from thw reciever is dependant on cable quality. 100-125' is for standard rg6. You can go up to 300' with solid copper rg11. And almost no limit with proper amplification and distribution. A lot of high rise buildings 30 stories plus using one dish on the roof.
 

Joe Diamond

SatelliteGuys Pro
May 3, 2004
2,596
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What may be going on is the following: New hires are called contractors and offered piece work. Then they are give a list like the one you posted. Eventually the new guys discover they can't do the list every time and they compromise it to get anything done at all.

Then the installation company follows behind them and in the name of quality control (QC) finds some reason for not paying anything for he installation. When the new guy discovers a back charge on every installation he has attempted he quits.

Then the cycle repeats itself with a new new guy. The customer is happy. The installation company is happy. Directv is getting their money. And the list of competent workers who will not consider satellite installations gets another name.

Happens all the time.

Joe
 
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Jimbo

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Jul 14, 2005
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1. Maybe true for some install companies, and certainly a good idea if possible.
2. Makes no sense to me if it is well secured.
3. Bull. Mine is on a pole 9' tall and I have had no issues in over 2 years.
4. I thought it was 150', but maybe 100.
5. SS should be in the 90's but that can't always happen. All 5 sats should be
visible so that the installer doesn't get charged a call back for a failed installation
in areas where the sd locals are on 119. In other areas, only 99, 101, and 103 need to be seen.
I agree with everything Raoul said here.

3. Mine is on a 16' pole
 

Joe Diamond

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May 3, 2004
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What may be going on is the following: New hires are called contractors and offered piece work. Then they are given a list like the one you posted. Eventually the new guys discover they can't do everything on the list every time and compromise it to get anything done at all.

The installation company follows behind them and, in the name of quality control (QC), finds some reason for not paying anything for the installation. When the new guy discovers back charges on every installation he has attempted he quits.

Then the cycle repeats itself with the next new guy. The customer is happy; his system always worked. The installation company is happy; they have all the money for the installation. Directv is getting their money.

And the list of competent workers who will not consider satellite installations gets another name.

Happens all the time.

Joe
(again)
 

raoul5788

Studebaker driver
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I'm not a "pro" installer or anything close to it, but most of this sounds like BS to me.

1. In most cases the roof is ABOVE the attic, not directly above a living area.
What's the deal? Are they afraid one day the dish will fall thru the roof and kill someone in their sleep ?
I thought the question was obvious. The best place if on a roof is not over the living area, but over the eave of the roof. Of course the attic is over a living area. They are worried about leaks, not dishes crashing through the roofs.
 

Joe Diamond

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May 3, 2004
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I thought the question was obvious. The best place if on a roof is not over the living area, but over the eave of the roof. Of course the attic is over a living area. They are worried about leaks, not dishes crashing through the roofs.
Yeah,

With all this...the spot I go to first is the rafter tail at the end of the building and nearest the electric meter. If there is LOS there that is where the dish goes without discussion. Anyplace else is an extra cost or declined. There is enough wood to attach even a Ka/Ku, it is not over a living area and makes grounding possible.

As noted by others the dish often ends up elsewhere byt the installation company or installer here is screwing around for some reason.

Joe


And above I edited my first post but now there are two...don't know why?
 

gpetrowich

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Dec 23, 2007
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I think Joe Diamond's version is probably closest to what is happening with my original post. The guy seemed intent to make it work. We walked all over the property and he stayed for 90 minutes. It did not seem like he wanted to leave without success, but he knew they would follow up and "ding" him if he stretched too far. Once we finally found a spot, we discussed some "alternatives" to how to get the receivers activated and then I could move them after the fact. He did say they would not even activate without receiving all five sats.

I presume he won't have rg-11 on the truck. Can I buy that and extend after he leaves if it won't work with RG-6? or is there something about the install only HE can do with regard to the multi-switch?
 

Joe Diamond

SatelliteGuys Pro
May 3, 2004
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gpetro,

I almost always start by saying this is not rocket science....but it is....a little. Most of what you will encounter is "garden hose science.' What you put in the cable experiences drag...(resistance or impedance),,,,,,,,that limits how far the signal will go AND arrive with a meaningful message.

So you rig what you want with rg6...feel free to exceed the posted limits...and measure what you get. As others have mentioned....your project is possible. Putting the best spin on what you experienced:
1. The tech only knew what he had been told about a week ago.
2. The list you published is about as far as the installation company will trust an untrained tech.
3. The tech knew exactly what he was doing and did not want your job for some reason he did not feel like sharing.
4. Directv pays only so much for installations and ...the tech..the installation company (s).....the Home Service Provider......have sliced up the money into so many pieces that no one entity in the system is willing to do anything above a minimum effort because of the low money available.
4.a People who have done this work (Hi there!) will not continue in it because
it is almost impossible to get paid.
b. There is no reason to change the system.

So you need to find a competent local source to take a look at your work and present a price. The folks who used to do Directv may be found among Home Theater Providers, telecommunications companies and satellite system (and or antenna) resellers.

You are asking the correct questions!

People who do this work every day will not work for the money offered in the HSP (Home Service Provider) system. The complexity has been going up as the fees have descended. Competent folks know what their services are worth and bypass, without consideration, both satellite companies.

Joe
 
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sddtvtech

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Sep 17, 2009
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in a van down by the river
I'm not a "pro" installer or anything close to it, but most of this sounds like BS to me.

1. In most cases the roof is ABOVE the attic, not directly above a living area.
What's the deal? Are they afraid one day the dish will fall thru the roof and kill someone in their sleep ?
2. As long as they can securely attach the dish to it I don't see a problem.
3. Nothing can be installed on a poll.
4. 100 feet is the max. cable length the spec. calls out, but the signal strength doesn't drop to zero once the cable length reaches 101 feet.
5. 90+ is a great signal strength to shoot for but it's just not possible most of the time.

for your number one.... we dont try to install a dish over living area due to water could leak in bc not every tech puts enuf bishop tape or none at all.

are you dumb? a dish fall through a roof and kill someone in their sleep? did you even think realistic why perhaps? I always try to mount my dish at the EVE of the roof. theres more wood and studs in those areas, if it does leak in 20 years, at least it wont leak into the living room. ONLY reason id mount a dish on the peak of a dish is the LOS issue and to clear it is at the peak. id note on the account where the dish is gonna be located.. along with customer signing a site survey before i mount the dish and inform them of the cons of having it there.

150 is MAX.. not 100. some office will rather be safe and say 100.

I'm not a "pro" installer or anything close to it, but most of this sounds like BS to me.
then id keep your opinion to yourself. we "PROS" will handle this question to the OP.

thanks...
 

Joe Diamond

SatelliteGuys Pro
May 3, 2004
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for your number one.... Blah, Blah, Blah!

then id keep your opinion to yourself. we "PROS" will handle this question to the OP.

thanks...
SDDTVTECH!

Dude, this is a forum! Folks come on here to ask questions and share experiences. A little look at your background = you know what the HSP told you. It is a big world out there!

So......PRO.........back the f**k off!

You are working for crooks!
Now is your turn to say the Home Service Provider deal is competent, honest and a shining example of the best service Directv can offer.

What?

Joe
 
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Jimbo

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SDDTVTECH!

Dude, this is a forum! Folks come on here to ask questions and share experiences. A little look at your background = you know what the HSP told you. It is a big world out there!

So......PRO.........back the f**k off!

You are working for crooks!
Now is your turn to say the Home Service Provider deal is competent, honest and a shining example of the best service Directv can offer.

What?

Joe
Easy there Joe !

Both could have been in the installers forum ..... or not.
 

yorktown

SatelliteGuys Pro
Nov 10, 2009
513
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General Location
for your number one.... we dont try to install a dish over living area due to water could leak in bc not every tech puts enuf bishop tape or none at all.

are you dumb? a dish fall through a roof and kill someone in their sleep? did you even think realistic why perhaps? I always try to mount my dish at the EVE of the roof. theres more wood and studs in those areas, if it does leak in 20 years, at least it wont leak into the living room. ONLY reason id mount a dish on the peak of a dish is the LOS issue and to clear it is at the peak. id note on the account where the dish is gonna be located.. along with customer signing a site survey before i mount the dish and inform them of the cons of having it there.

150 is MAX.. not 100. some office will rather be safe and say 100.



then id keep your opinion to yourself. we "PROS" will handle this question to the OP.

thanks...
Lighten up dude.
:rolleyes:
 

Joe Diamond

SatelliteGuys Pro
May 3, 2004
2,596
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Easy there Joe !

Both could have been in the installers forum ..... or not.
Well, I'll be sorry if he will.....I am trying to think of an appropriate metaphor that will express our mutual circling-the-bowel-ed-ness without suggesting that continual time on the job is is superior to competent instruction and guided practice.

For myself, I can't tell the difference between technological advances and scams by someone in the installation "industry.'

Grrrrrrrr!

Joe
 
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